# Daylight savings/clocks going back. Why?



## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

Why do we have to put the clocks back and put up with darker evenings and darker mornings? :twisted:

Originally it was to help the farmers and that is perfectly reasonable. Now it is because our Scottish friends are moaning that they see less sunlight in winter. So why does that mean we down south have to see less too? :roll:

Why can't Scotland and Northern Ireland (if they want to) put their clocks back and leave the rest of us to stay where we are? I'm fed up with our government pandering to the needs of the Scots at cost to us. They get free this, free that, yet want independence. [smiley=argue.gif]

I tell you what - take it!!!! :wink:

Enjoy your last day of lighter evenings guys. You have a dark winter coming up!

Cheers

Rich


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## KammyTT (Jun 28, 2006)

Oh shut up you moaning sod!!

I didn't ask for the clocks to go back or for anything free so again shut up


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

KammyTT said:


> Oh shut up you moaning sod!!
> 
> I didn't ask for the clocks to go back or for anything free so again shut up


 :lol: :lol: :lol: I knew that would have you spanking your keyboard! :wink:

It still seems to me to be a sensible solution. It works in the US so why not here? :roll:


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

rustyintegrale said:


> Why do we have to put the clocks back and put up with darker evenings and darker mornings? :twisted:


The clocks going back doesn't affect both you know :lol:


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

ScoobyTT said:


> rustyintegrale said:
> 
> 
> > Why do we have to put the clocks back and put up with darker evenings and darker mornings? :twisted:
> ...


it does the deeper we get into winter... :?


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

So your hypothesis is that putting the clocks back results in darker evenings AND darker mornings?  You may wish to consider the tilt of the Earth's axis and its orbit around the sun.

In mid December, sunrise is in the 8:15 area and sunset not long after 4. Leaving the clocks as they are would make that sunrise after 9am and sunset just after 5.

Either way most people are going to work in the dark and returning when it's dark.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

rustyintegrale said:


> It works in the US so why not here? :roll:


Arizona and Hawaii (plus a few other random Southern islands) are the only states that haven't adopted DST. At least the US is big enough to benefit from being able to opt out. Having England and Scotland on different times is patently ridiculous - as is the idea that shifting the time by an hour could make it darker in the morning *and* the evening.


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

Okay just to clarify things, you don't get darker evenings or mornings - dark is dark! :lol: :lol:

This is about how much usable daylight you get, ie during the hours most people - particularly children - are going about their daily business... :wink:

And why is an hour's difference between Scotland and the UK 'patently ridiculous'? If the Scots want it and we don't then why not? :roll:


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

rustyintegrale said:


> And why is an hour's difference between Scotland and the UK 'patently ridiculous'? If the Scots want it and we don't then why not? :roll:


Because the UK is only 650 miles long. There is no need for two different times as the light level between the Northernmost and Southernmost points isn't that different. Also, *'we'* don't want to get rid of DST in England. *You* and a handful of other people do. Everyone else couldn't give a fuck, so why have the hassle of being different, just because the Scots actually care*?

*I'm willing to bet there are loads more reasons for the government keeping it than just keeping the Scots happy but I can't be arsed to read about it.


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## A3DFU (May 7, 2002)

rustyintegrale said:


> Why do we have put up with darker evenings and darker mornings? :twisted:
> 
> Rich


Of course you mean: darker evenings and lighter mornings :roll:

Anyway, just heard on German News that Russia will not put their clocks back but keep their summer time. Apparently the suicide rate increases by 60% in Russia when changing clocks because it upsets peoples' bio rythm. Well worth a thought me thinks ,,,,


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## Gazzer (Jun 12, 2010)

Can't we put clocks back three hours so I can have more install time on site


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## mighTy Tee (Jul 10, 2002)

We should be on Central European time. Fact

Being on CET would make the roads safer in winter, as school kids generally go straight to school, but meander home getting home in the dark. An extra hour of evening light would reduce accidents involving school kids. Facts

Most people get up at the same time in the morning regardless of of whether it is light or dark, but only go out on light evenings. Extended evening would boost the economy. Fact.

Lighter evenings means people participate in sports for more of the year, giving a healthier population. Fact

Being on the same time zone with most of Europe will help boost trade with some of our most important trading partners. Fact

but the most important FACT which everyone seems to forget is:
*
No matter how you play with the clocks this makes no difference to the number of daylight hours in any 24 hour period. It is how you use this daylight which matters*


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

Didn't Cameron support the idea of a three year trial of going to CET ?


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## bluush (Feb 24, 2010)

its a big enough PITA that we have different holiday dates between scotland and england at the moment. lost count of the number of times i have phoned up a supplier in england on a friday afternoon or a monday to find that england is shut due to a public holiday i know nothing about.

can you therefore imagine the problems with missed deliveries, meetings etc etc if we tried to run differnet timezones.

the DST stuff dont bother me either way BUT we either have it in the UK or we dont, not some in and some out.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

bluush said:


> its a big enough PITA that we have different holiday dates between scotland and england at the moment. lost count of the number of times i have phoned up a supplier in england on a friday afternoon or a monday to find that england is shut due to a public holiday i know nothing about.
> 
> can you therefore imagine the problems with missed deliveries, meetings etc etc if we tried to run differnet timezones.
> 
> the DST stuff dont bother me either way BUT we either have it in the UK or we dont, not some in and some out.


Exactly.. And imagine the chaos with train and bus timetables crossing the border. TV schedules would cause problems too. Lots of good reasons for having the same times as Scotland. Not many good reasons for being different.


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## A3DFU (May 7, 2002)

Spandex said:


> Lots of good reasons for having the same times as Scotland. Not many good reasons for being different.


But plenty of good reasons to keep BST as Richard has mentioned above. Main thing for me would be that no one incl. children want to go out in the dark so people are less active with BWT then they normally are anyway. 
Plus cattle gets confused and milk production is not as much when we turn the clocks back. Guess this will sort itself after a few weeks.


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

A few of you have mentioned the children going to school thing. It's bollocks. If the clocks don't go back for winter then it'll be dark in the mornings. At the winter solstice even in the south the sun won't rise until after 9am. Whichever way you do it, kids and adults go to or from their day's business in the dark. It's not a problem you can fix by changing clocks, so it's really a void argument for or against changing them.


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

ScoobyTT said:


> A few of you have mentioned the children going to school thing. It's bollocks. If the clocks don't go back for winter then it'll be dark in the mornings. At the winter solstice even in the south the sun won't rise until after 9am. Whichever way you do it, kids and adults go to or from their day's business in the dark. It's not a problem you can fix by changing clocks, so it's really a void argument for or against changing them.


So why change them? I'd rather have lighter evenings. It was fucking depressing tonight watching the rain fall in near darkness at five fucking pea fucking emm. [smiley=bigcry.gif]


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## audimad (Jan 7, 2008)

My clocks went back today too but the shop said there is nothing they can do as i no longer have the receipts. :lol:


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

:lol: Nice one audimad [smiley=thumbsup.gif]



rustyintegrale said:


> So why change them? I'd rather have lighter evenings. It was fucking depressing tonight watching the rain fall in near darkness at five fucking pea fucking emm. [smiley=bigcry.gif]


You should have forgotten about the clocks like I did and got up an hour earlier then :lol:


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

ScoobyTT said:


> You should have forgotten about the clocks like I did and got up an hour earlier then :lol:


I did. Got up to watch the Grand Prix and was an hour early. Bloody boring race too... :?


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

Perhaps you should have stayed in bed an hour longer and watched the "highlights" :lol:


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

ScoobyTT said:


> A few of you have mentioned the children going to school thing. It's bollocks. If the clocks don't go back for winter then it'll be dark in the mornings. At the winter solstice even in the south the sun won't rise until after 9am. Whichever way you do it, kids and adults go to or from their day's business in the dark. It's not a problem you can fix by changing clocks, so it's really a void argument for or against changing them.


That's on the darkest day of the year though. When you average across *all* the days, DST makes it lighter in the morning than it would be. I don't know why lighter mornings make more of a difference than lighter evenings, but the overall accident rate on the roads was reduced when DST was introduced.


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## mighTy Tee (Jul 10, 2002)

Spandex said:


> I don't know why lighter mornings make more of a difference than lighter evenings, but the overall accident rate on the roads was reduced when DST was introduced.


Simple - generally kids leave home and go pretty much straight to school (have to be there for 9am). When they leave school more kids mess about, go home via friends, the local shopping centres or sports centres. They may leave the school at 3:30 but against the 20 mins getting to school, their home journey can take several times that and if it is dark they are less visible and at risk for longer.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

mighTy Tee said:


> Spandex said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know why lighter mornings make more of a difference than lighter evenings, but the overall accident rate on the roads was reduced when DST was introduced.
> ...


If that were true, then DST would make the accident rate go up, not down...


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## mighTy Tee (Jul 10, 2002)

Spandex said:


> mighTy Tee said:
> 
> 
> > Spandex said:
> ...


If we go to CET you get the following effect (at the Greenwich Meridian), based on equinox where there is 12 hour daylight and the sun due south at midday, the clocks would move forward 2 hours in the summer time so daylight starts at 0800 ending at 2000hr and the sun due south at 1400hrs and during the winter time would be 1 hour forward so daylight starts at 0700 ending at 1900hrs

For me on the South Coast this means the winter sun (GMT/UT+1) would rise at latest 0905hrs and set 1650hrs. The summer sun (GMT/UT+2) would rise earliest 0550hrs setting 2220 hrs


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

mighTy Tee said:


> If we go to CET you get the following effect (at the Greenwich Meridian), based on equinox where there is 12 hour daylight and the sun due south at midday, the clocks would move forward 2 hours in the summer time so daylight starts at 0800 ending at 2000hr and the sun due south at 1400hrs and during the winter time would be 1 hour forward so daylight starts at 0700 ending at 1900hrs
> 
> For me on the South Coast this means the winter sun (GMT/UT+1) would rise at latest 0905hrs and set 1650hrs. The summer sun (GMT/UT+2) would rise earliest 0550hrs setting 2220 hrs


Well, quite... But I was replying to Scooby, who had said that it didn't matter (from a safety perspective) whether you made mornings or evenings lighter. I was pointing out that the statistics had shown that lighter mornings in the winter had produced less accidents.

That being said, CET / GMT+1 will produce darker winter mornings and the additional accidents which statistically seem to go with that.


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## Charlie (Dec 15, 2006)

I heard the other day that we were going to be abolishing the whole system and that this weekend was the last time we would ever adjust the clocks?????

Charlie


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## A3DFU (May 7, 2002)

Charlie said:


> I heard the other day that we were going to be abolishing the whole system and that this weekend was the last time we would ever adjust the clocks?????
> 
> Charlie


I should hope not!! As this would mean that we keep BWT all year round 

Anyway, welcome back Charllie, I trust your wedding went well


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

The summer's over and we're on that descent into long winter nights...yuk. It's more sunlight we need so if we can't tilt the axis of the earth, how about attaching a fleet of supertankers to the south coast to tow the whole island nearer the equator?


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## ScoobyTT (Aug 24, 2009)

As long as you leave "the north" where it is. :lol:


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

ScoobyTT said:


> As long as you leave "the north" where it is. :lol:


 :lol:


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## Charlie (Dec 15, 2006)

A3DFU said:


> Charlie said:
> 
> 
> > I heard the other day that we were going to be abolishing the whole system and that this weekend was the last time we would ever adjust the clocks?????
> ...


I thought it sounded like bow locks 

The wedding was amazing thanks for asking, we could not possibly have had a better day, the sun was out and we were on the beach for all the photos.

The caricaturist was amazing, the illusionist was frankly astonishing and the Chineses lanterns and fireworks were much better than I expected. The honeymoon to Mexico was absolutely brilliant too 

I will prob bung a thread up at some point with a load of photos 

Charlie


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

Charlie said:


> A3DFU said:
> 
> 
> > Charlie said:
> ...


Welcome back matey!


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## YoungOldUn (Apr 12, 2011)

Even the 'Forum' clock is screwed and confused.

When you look at the time any post was made after 11:00pm it is always marked as 'Yesterday' :? :?


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

YoungOldUn said:


> Even the 'Forum' clock is screwed and confused.
> 
> When you look at the time any post was made after 11:00pm it is always marked as 'Yesterday' :? :?


Don't tell me your profile is still on summertime ?? You have to adjust that as well as the TT.


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## YoungOldUn (Apr 12, 2011)

wallsendmag said:


> YoungOldUn said:
> 
> 
> > Even the 'Forum' clock is screwed and confused.
> ...


Nah - Mr Gate's and Mr Jobs devices both did it automatically without any manual intervention, suppose it was too much to expect the forum to work correctly after all it is an 'Audi' TT forum and as we all know now the TT has to be done manually


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## YoungOldUn (Apr 12, 2011)

I see it has gone to 'Yesterday' already again :?


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## YoungOldUn (Apr 12, 2011)

When you post a message the time stamp is still set at BST.

I posted a message this morning at 10:54 on the 'Help for heroes gang jailed' thread and it is time stamped at 11:54.


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

YoungOldUn said:


> When you post a message the time stamp is still set at BST.
> 
> I posted a message this morning at 10:54 on the 'Help for heroes gang jailed' thread and it is time stamped at 11:54.


Change it in your profile then :roll:

Summer Time/DST is in effect: yes no

I would select no


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## YoungOldUn (Apr 12, 2011)

wallsendmag said:


> Change it in your profile then :roll:
> 
> Summer Time/DST is in effect: yes no
> 
> I would select no


Ah I see - Cheers.

I was thinking profile on my laptop not the forum profile. Suppose I can be quite slow at times


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