# CarPlay is here :-)



## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Not one for the Luddites this :-/

Pioneer have released the long awaited update for their latest head units which now support Apples in-car AirPlay feature.






More reasons to consider a double DIN conversion ...
Alpine's units are still "coming soon" ...


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## Pugwash69 (Jun 12, 2012)

Too late. I have android wear on my wrist now. I can go Knightrider on you and talk to the hand!


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

HALLELUJAH ! A reply !

Not quite what I had in mind, but I'll take it ! At least its a bit techy ;-)


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

The more I see of CarPlay, the less I get what the point is. It doesn't seem to do anything fundamental that I can't already do on my Alpine double din (other than Siri perhaps, although I have that switched off on my iDevices as it's pretty much pointless).

Don't get me wrong, I like the UI and I wish standard head units were half as nice to use as that, but wouldn't it just be better to have the head unit manufacturer build a nice UI for once instead of using a cludge where you launch a UI generated by an external device when you want a usable interface?

CarPlay on Pioneer or Alpine just seems to be a bit of an apology... It's like them saying "our UIs are never that great, so if you plug in your phone you can do all the things we do already, but you'll find it much easier". So, I agree that it's better than what we have, but it feels like a compromise and a halfway house on the way to a decent head unit.


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Spandex said:


> ... it feels like a compromise and a halfway house on the way to a decent head unit.


My sentiments exactly. 
Apple are calling it CarPlay (like AirPlay) but it's not actually wireless (it might only be possible over USB as the host can't run iOS code natively). So it's unlikely that anything less than an iOS HU is ever going to be an decent interface.
To bring Android/Google into the mix, there's the opportunity there for an official car-based OS from them (running natively on 3rd party hardware). I know there are some Android units out there already, but the interface isn't car-specific - it's just the usual touch Android with very little driving focused customisation.

Unbelievable really, that in-car technology is so behind other tech. A bit like the living room - set top boxes are also clunky with awful user interfaces.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

I think the Parrot Asteroid Smart came very very close to doing it right. They used Android, which gave them an easy route to adding the required functionality and they limited the app store to applications which were designed for the device. If they'd made the UI more slick and given it physical volume buttons/knob then I think it would have been my perfect head unit.

At least with something like that you can get in your car and use it without having to connect your phone first... Not so easy if you suddenly decide you need a map and your phone is in your jacket pocket on the back seat. And you have a usable satnav that doesn't require a mobile signal when you want to search for a destination...


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## Pugwash69 (Jun 12, 2012)

The Pioneer AppRadio I bought lasted about 3 months. I got sick of connection problems and the requirement to attach my phone every time I used it. It sounded like a good idea but badly done. I even had to install a hacked app on my phone to unlease it, so expect Pioneer to cripple access to the good stuff on the headunit!


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Apparently people are already complaining that to use CarPlay on their pioneer unit they have to do without AppRadio functionality. Something to do with their "workaround" with proprietary cables (for AppRadio) not working when using a lightning cable.
I would have been interested in the Parrot offerings but a couple of things put me off :
First of all I've had an Asteroid for the last few years and that's been less than ideal.
Secondly Parrots fugly interface.
Finally it's not going to give me the option of AirPlay, which as an iPhone user - I at least want the option of using.

Hence me sticking to my single din until something more compelling comes along.


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## mstew (Mar 17, 2012)

Saw the car play video 'sound man' did on YouTube and carplay functionality looks w*nk, slow and pointless IMO. I get it but if a stereo doesn't play immediately I don't see the point. Bluetooth connectivity for phone calls, USB for music. It just works that way. As for maps just get a proper satnav if you need it that badly


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## pas_55 (May 9, 2002)

Goody I've got pioneer


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

mullum said:


> Finally it's not going to give me the option of AirPlay, which as an iPhone user - I at least want the option of using.


I don't really care much about AirPlay either. I have an old iPod nano that stays hidden in the car with my music on so I don't need to connect my phone for audio.

To be honest, my Alpine unit does everything I need and the UI is 'acceptable'. I have a steering wheel control interface so I rarely have to look at the head unit anyway.


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

That's one thing I really miss having - steering wheel controls. 
I could get a flat bottomed steering wheel with controls and fit this Parrot UNIKA device that works with the Asteroid (I'm presuming unika is compatible with Audi steering wheels) : http://www.parrot.com/uk/products/steer ... -controls/


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

mullum said:


> That's one thing I really miss having - steering wheel controls.
> I could get a flat bottomed steering wheel with controls and fit this Parrot UNIKA device that works with the Asteroid (I'm presuming unika is compatible with Audi steering wheels) : http://www.parrot.com/uk/products/steer ... -controls/


I think Unika is CAN bus only, so You might need more than just the wheel (steering wheel module and CAN controller, maybe?)

<Edit>Having read up on it some more it looks like it supports resistive signalling for switches, with a learning function. So it depends how the flat bottomed wheels work.


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Definitely more work than I'm prepared to take on right now :-/

Alpine launches $800 CarPlay-compatible iLX-007 in-dash receiver... 
http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/10/ ... h-receiver

Reading people's experiences with these CarPlay units, however, it doesn't look good :-/

iHeartRadio & Rdio are latest iOS apps to add support for Apple's CarPlay... http://goo.gl/zMKqWq


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Interesting. I'd like to be convinced by this unit, as it looks nice, has a large capacitive touch screen and would probably be a straight swap for my current H/U - but I have a feeling it won't have any built in navigation (Alpines Mirror Link head units have the connector on the back for an optional navi module, but nothing built in). That's a bit of a deal breaker for me,


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

I like the built-in time correction and EQ/crossovers - that's £300/400 saved on a processor (Bit Ten etc). 
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/tuneit/id588431217?mt=8


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

I love having all my music available all of the time. As an alternative to car play is anybody on here running a car wi-fi network with on board storage in their car? Something that can be left on for 24 hours and run as an AP independently from the vehicle battery?

I've built a in-car system based around the raspberry pi and am just about to add the 24/196 dac to it. I've linked it in to my home network and everything can be controlled from an android phone using Volumio and/or es explorer. It works a treat - I can get up in the morning, log onto dimeadozen, download some music, direct it to the car, have a shower, and get dressed, log into volumio, set play, and by the time I get in the car it's already playing!


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

So how do you control it when you're driving?


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

The last piece of the jigsaw is to fit a bluetooth adaptor to the resistive network behind the steering wheel controls. This will give track advance reverse pause folder advance and so on. I'm using an Asus memopad HD7 to drive the system which just sits on the passenger seat in the car (no wires connected to it) I don't mess about with it on the move, I usually set up the playlists beforehand I get in the car.

I'm running the system in my Mondeo which has a dedicated Denso sat nav/entertainment system with touchscreen. Using the aux in to play output from the raspberry. At the moment it is not possible to display the artist/track info on the screen but i'm looking into it. If I really want to know I can look on the asus. The complete system is in a case sitting in the boot. The only connections to it are a charger lead, the audio out from the raspberry, and a small wifi antenna on the roof of the car. If I'm driving the Monaro it can easily be swapped over into the Monaro boot.


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

What does AP stand for ?

I do like the raspberry pi projects, I've been running Xbmc on an ATV1 for donkeys (crystalbuntu). But these days days I like turnkey solutions - I just don't have the time to research and implement everything. 
For a full digital HD audio server I'm going to be running the Audison BitPlay HD. Truth is it's complete overkill and the same principle could be achieved for a lot less expenditure. 
Anyway HD audio is a whole different subject to CarPlay really. CarPlay is more about bringing the iOS interface to a bigger (and voice activated) HU. 
Saying that I welcome any discussion on this subject, there's a distinct lack of it on this forum ;-)


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

AP - wifi access point - i'm really just running another private wifi network (same as at home) in the car full time - which gives me a mirror image of my home data in the car, or within range of the wifi from the car. Many people will say that you don't need all of your music in the car all of the time. But the goals at the outset were to have all of my music in the car all of the time :roll: and at the same time be able to play it in HD format. You could use cloud streaming but you have to pay for the data downloads and I believe HD audio gets trans-coded when downloaded.

I did look for an out of the box solution but I could find nothing that matched my requirements. All I could find were some of those 4g/ap plug in the wall socket type devices which have limited battery backup running time and limitations on using the usb port for hd access.



mullum said:


> CarPlay is more about bringing the iOS interface to a bigger (and voice activated) HU.


Thanks for explaining - it's a fascinating subject and gets more complicated every day!

The raspberry pi thing is another fascinating subject. I work in electronics manufacturing so it's given me plenty of ideas for a turnkey solution. The case I have in the back of the car needs to be a lot smaller 

Anyway, I'll now just sit at the back of the class and learn about CarPlay


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Well to be honest CarPlay isn't exactly setting the forum alight ! :lol:

I understand exactly what you've accomplished and the benefits - and I appreciate that a customised solution is more fun than an off the shelf one.
One such product I came across uses the AirPlay protocol. So your phone connects over wifi to the device and streams the music - the box uses an optical output into a suitable amp/processor/DAC (or analog if necessary). £20 for wireless digital audio 
The only issue for HD music with AirPlay is that higher bit rates/sample rates are down sampled to 16/44.1Khz. Still good, but not HD :-(
The box itself has no storage, but does have a USB port.


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

I've heard about AirPlay although I first heard about it after I built my first lash up :roll:

Whilst we are on the subject, would you know if it is possible to stream HD audio (or FLAC) through a bluetooth link to a suitably equipped car HU? Is there enough bandwidth? To keep it completely wireless I need to make my system compatible with modern head units. It doesn't really matter if it can't (or transcodes it down) because you could argue that you're not going to notice the difference in a car, but it's nice to have the option (via the aux in port).


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

PaulS said:


> I've heard about AirPlay although I first heard about it after I built my first lash up :roll:
> 
> Whilst we are on the subject, would you know if it is possible to stream HD audio (or FLAC) through a bluetooth link to a suitably equipped car HU? Is there enough bandwidth?


no chance. You'd want wifi really. Although AirPlay for example - like I said earlier, down samples higher bit/sample rates to "CD quality". Mind you - airplay isn't the only audio streaming/server protocol on the block, but no head unit is going to support the alternatives. Not unless its a HU running Android with the appropriate "client" app installed.
My Bit Play HD unit streams HD audio from an iOS or Android app (as well as from its own on board storage, if fitted).

Where are you getting your HD audio from ? I'm struggling to find anything current and popular. Although I am producing my own ;-)



PaulS said:


> To keep it completely wireless I need to make my system compatible with modern head units. It doesn't really matter if it can't (or transcodes it down) because you could argue that you're not going to notice the difference in a car, but it's nice to have the option (via the aux in port).


"modern" head units are pretty behind the curve technologically. Its still early days I suppose.


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

mullum said:


> Where are you getting your HD audio from ? I'm struggling to find anything current and popular. Although I am producing my own ;-)


'HD Audio' comes from my CD collection that I've recently ripped to FLAC (having ripped it to MP3 many years ago...) My main resource now is dimeadozen. I'm a big lover of live music, I love going to concerts, there are some amazing recordings on dime that folk have recorded using edirol 24/96 recorders, as an example. Plus all the old analogue 'bootleg' stuff on there that has all been re-encoded properly and now seems to be public domain/freeware!

I never really got into SACD audio a few years back. Is it making a reappearance? (A bit like vinyl has lately) Are there any retailers that specialize in it?


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Yeah it's been a bit of a buzzword this year, HD audio. Rumours that iTunes will adopt higher bit and sample rates as well. Still very little out there at the moment though :-( 
I'm all for multi channel sound too, would love that to take off - especially on the electronic/dance music side.


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

Just finished getting the HiFiBerry Burr Brown dac enabled. I've plugged it into my home hi-fi and there is no doubt it sounds a lot better that the raspberry pi output 

Looking forward to trying it out in the car tomorrow. I've got some decent infinity component speakers hooked up to the denso and there's a sub woofer in the boot. Calibration tracks will be The Violence of truth by TheThe, and Murder On The Dancefloor by Sophie Ellis Bextor at the Cambridge junction  I reckon it's gonna rock! [smiley=dude.gif]


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

The The. Nice 

Not heard of that dac - I'll have to investigate ;-)


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

The dac upgrade sounds great in the car. I've been playing with it for most of the afternoon, and doing some comparisons with the pi and touchpad analogue outputs. The line level output is higher, straight away there is more bass, and it seems to have widened the image. That TheThe track is even punchier now 

Got to work on getting the steering wheel controls working via bluetooth next. And may be even controlling it via CarPlay


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Lots of interesting things at CES this year, but the new Parrot Asteroid HU looks particularly good. It looks like it's designed to be a great HU in its own right, rather than relying on CarPlay for all the useful functionality:

http://www.engadget.com/2015/01/04/parrot-rnb6-android-auto-apple-carplay/

Not sure how the OEM systems integration (parking sensors, climate, etc) will work. Perhaps a pumped up version of the Unika interface will talk to CANbus modules and translate the manufacturer-specific data.


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## mullum (Sep 16, 2011)

Looks good, but as an early adopter of their Asteroid Classic I wonder just how "finished" it'll be when released. As they haven't given a date (or a price) yet, perhaps they'll get it sorted before putting it out there.


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