# Fractured rear brake pipe



## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

School boy error, I know, but forgot to support the rear caliper when I was doing a brake job. Way forward please and do I need to stem the leak? Thanks for all your help/support.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Stop the leak before you get air in the ABS module


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Sorry if i'm being thick but with what please?


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Whatever will do it. Cut the pipe and put some small bore tube on it (tube you use to bleed the brakes)
and plug it.
Squash the pipe flat and fold it back on its self


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## Delta4 (Jun 19, 2015)

Whatever you have to hand, a short piece of hose shoved over the broken pipe with a screw to cap the end and a cable tie or hose clamp to hold the thing in place ?


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## Hoggy (May 8, 2002)

Hi, reservoir must be empty by now. :? VCDS here we come.  
Hoggy


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Haven't got any hose or pipe. The only thing I can think of then is to bend the pipe back on its self. Another question please: I've removed the brake pipe from the caliper! Will that mean I will need to bleed the brakes once I've fixed the problem and reconnected the brake pipe back to the caliper?
Sorry for being a newby, first time I've had a go at the brakes!


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## Hoggy (May 8, 2002)

Hacksawcats said:


> Haven't got any hose or pipe. The only thing I can think of then is to bend the pipe back on its self. Another question please: I've removed the brake pipe from the caliper! Will that mean I will need to bleed the brakes once I've fixed the problem and reconnected the brake pipe back to the caliper?
> Sorry for being a newby, first time I've had a go at the brakes!


Hi, yes, have you checked the reservoir, is it MT.
Hoggy.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

You will need to bleed the caliper you have replaced the pipe to. IF you still have oil in the res, after fixing the pipe you can let it gravity bleed if alone or no bleeding kit (excuse the swearing) by undoing the bleed nipple, attaching some clear pipe and letting it seep through. You will see oil then air then back to oil come out, keeping the res topped up all the time.
Probably take about 15 mins to clear the air.
If the res has gone empty then thats another story.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Thanks for the help so far guys. So can I buy a replacement part for it and can I fit it myself or is it a specialist/garage job?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Thanks for the help so far guys. The reservoir still has brake fluid in it and I've managed to stem the leak. So can I buy a replacement part for it and can I fit it myself or is it a specialist/garage job?


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## outdoor stevie (Nov 24, 2013)

You can buy a pre bent piece from a motor factors, so you will need to undo the join further up the pipe and since the caliper is off already then attach the new pipe to the caliper with the caliper fitted to the hub then undo the pipe further up and quickly join in the new bit but I fear your system will already be full of air! Get plenty of brake fluid.

Stevie


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Ahh, I see, many thanks for your reply and advice. And many thanks for everyone else's reply's help.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Sorry to be a pain, but I'd this what I need? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FOR-AUDI-TT- ... 890.l49286


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Thats offside/drivers side (UK) if thats what you need


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## imartyn (Aug 31, 2015)

Hacksawcats said:


> Sorry to be a pain, but I'd this what I need? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FOR-AUDI-TT- ... 890.l49286


Just a heads up, but those brake pipes look like they're for the FWD cars.

It maybe just a generic photo but worth a double check.


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

imartyn said:


> Hacksawcats said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry to be a pain, but I'd this what I need? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FOR-AUDI-TT- ... 890.l49286
> ...


You're right , part number 1J0611764K so fwd.
quattro would be 1J0611764L for offside , 763L nearside


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## imartyn (Aug 31, 2015)

The seller also states they're not suitable for the 225, and then says "FITS APX & BAM" :roll:


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

imartyn said:


> The seller also states they're not suitable for the 225, and then says "FITS APX & BAM" :roll:


Yes , and listing says QUATTRO in the title :x .
As if anyone reads the listing smallprint :lol: .
Goes to show you should always order using part numbers rather than incorrect text/description.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Yes, that's the side that's broken. Many thanks for your reply.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Hacksawcats said:


> Yes, that's the side that's broken. Many thanks for your reply.


See the rest, it's not for a quattro


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Hacksawcats said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, that's the side that's broken. Many thanks for your reply.
> ...


Mines a quattro, so I'm good I think, but I'll check with the seller.
Thanks


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

Hacksawcats said:


> Sorry to be a pain, but I'd this what I need? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FOR-AUDI-TT- ... 890.l49286


As imartyn correctly said , the picture shows a fwd brake pipe and the part number backs this up .
The text and title is contradictory.
I'd buy from someone who knows what they're selling and give that eBayer a very wide berth :lol: .
The quattro brake pipe has a distinct shape where it bolts to the caliper, different to the fwd item.
Once you know what to look for , the quattro and fwd pipes are relatively easy to differentiate.


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## outdoor stevie (Nov 24, 2013)

Give the area where the pipe fits to the caliper a wee clean up before fitting as old crud may be sticking around to get in the way of a good fit for the union.

Stevie


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Ok, I'll heed everybody's advice and stay clear! Does anyone have any suggestions as to where the best place to buy one is? Audi for instance?


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## miTTzee (Dec 8, 2015)

Hi de Hi - have used these people and had no problems with
parts that they supplied for my rear brakes on the 225 quattro.

https://brakeparts.co.uk/shop/Audi/TT

Double check everything, but if you speak to them on the 
phone they are pretty helpful.
Hope that helps
Regards - miTTzee :wink:

...


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/193692976679 ... SwvChfbaXo

This is Genuine for a quattro .
For drivers side on a UK car.
Good price , a dealer would be a lot more .
LLL Parts on the 'net list it at approx £55 plus carriage and in my experience they are considerably cheaper than any VW or Audi main dealer that I have dealt with 
So the eBay one above is a bargain  .


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Thanks for all your help guys


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

One more thing!!  doI need any special spanners/tools? Many thanks


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Torque wrench would be handy, the calipers are aluminium.
Vacuum brake bleeding kit.
Did you still have oil in the res or had it gone empty?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Torque wrench would be handy, the calipers are aluminium.
> Vacuum brake bleeding kit.
> Did you still have oil in the res or had it gone empty?


I've got a torque wrench. I'll buy a brake bleeding kit and not sure about the reservoir, I'll check on my way home, (the cars parked at my sons home). Will I find the torque settings on the forum somewhere or in the manual?

Cheers


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Torque wrench would be handy, the calipers are aluminium.
> Vacuum brake bleeding kit.
> Did you still have oil in the res or had it gone empty?


Sorry for the late reply

Still has oil in the res. I'll buy some more tomorrow to top it up while a await the part. Will any brake fluid do, or is it special to audi's etc?

Cheers


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Any class 6 dot 4
I got some Comma dot 4 ESP from my local spares shop, covers class 3,4, and 6


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

So the plot thickens:I'm just replacing the disc and pads on the other rear side, but I think I've ended up winding the piston caliper the wrong way, tried to rewind it but it won't budge. Any thoughts or do I need to replace the calliper?? Thanks for any advice.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Cancel that, I've just double checked and I think I've done it the right way (clockwise). But I think it's wound back as far as it can go but still there doesn't seem to be enough of a gap for the new disc and pads (see photo). Am I doing something else wrong?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Cancel that, I've just double checked and I think I've done it the right way (clockwise). But I think it's wound back as far as it can go but still there doesn't seem to be enough of a gap for the new disc and pads (see photo). Am I doing something else wrong?


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

It's probably tight and might go some more, but also check the lever for the hand brake is in the released position.
Should screw all the way in.
Try turning the piston with some grips. i think some of them tools push more than turning the piston


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## classexa (Jun 7, 2020)

Should go all the way in. Might just be really tight


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

I use this type on a ratchet https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154363544851 ... SweeJcz~PG
With the disc removed and caliper reattached you can get some force on it.
Mine was really tight and was binding after fitting new pads even after winding in and out several times to try and free it up so i replaced both rear calipers with new pattern calipers for around £70 for the pair


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

As davebowk says , sometimes the tools exert too much pressure on the piston and not enough turning force.
The trick is to apply just enough pressure whilst turning the piston, if you're having to apply loads of force then something is usually wrong.
And yes , you need to get that piston totally retracted before new pads and discs will go in there.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Ok, Guys, thanks for the advice. The hand brake is definitely off. I'll keep trying. Fitted the brake hose BTW. It was a doddle and didn't really lose any BF.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Does this look right now? I've tried winding it further but it won't budge now. But still the pads won't fit. I've also included a photo of the old pads and the new. I know the old pads are worn but the new pads look way to thick compared to the old ones?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Is there anything I can spray on them to lubevthem up a bit?


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Needs to go back about another 8mm from that pic.
Really if they are that tight you should remove the piston and seal. Clean the seal groove by scraping out the corrosion and fit new seals.
You get ally oxide corrosion in the bottom of the seal groove that makes the seal really tight.
I fitted new calipers to save time then rebuilt the originals and sold them.
Got £150 for these


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

You could wind the piston back out using the handbrake lever being careful not to go too far. Lift the dust seal and spray some wd40 under it then try winding back in. Do this several times.
But you are probably going to have problems with binding brakes in the near future without rebuilding or replacing them.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Should wind back in to this.


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## LesRSV (Jul 5, 2017)

The piston should wind back in to sit about flush with the first step in the bellows, so it looks like you have a bit to go , ah, beaten to it.


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## silverbug (Jan 1, 2020)

I can't see what tool you're trying to use to wind that piston back in , but I use the type in the following picture (not the exact make etc) and it's never let me down.
As has been said , it might be worth using the handbrake lever to get the piston to go back out again and then try once more.
I've had the piston handbrake mechanism bind on me in the past , because I now realise I was applying too much force.
Sometimes though , this is the time when you realise that the caliper is naffed :? , though hopefully this isn't the case here.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

They look spot on. Anyway all done now, ended up using a breaker bar on the end of the rewinder tool! I know bit heavy handed but it did the job . Moving on to bleeding them now: anyone know the correct size spanner I need, I was using a 7/8ths but it doesn't fit exactly and don't want to round off the nut any more! Also any one know what pipes attach to the alliminium on the front passenger side wheel arch, took the pipes off and can't remember what goes where! Many thanks guy's.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

That bracket is just for the brake pad wear wire. Cable clips in the middle and the plug on the end
You can just see it here


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> That bracket is just for the brake pad wear wire. Cable clips in the middle and the plug on the end
> You can just see it here


Many thanks. Don't suppose you know the nut size of the rear brake nipple?


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Hacksawcats said:


> davebowk said:
> 
> 
> > That bracket is just for the brake pad wear wire. Cable clips in the middle and the plug on the end
> ...


Sure it's either 10 or 11mm use a ring spanner, 7/8 is 22mm so do you mean 7/16 as 7/16 is 11.13mm


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Hacksawcats said:
> 
> 
> > davebowk said:
> ...


Sorry yes, I mean 7/16. Many thanks fore the reply, I'll go and buy a metric set!


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

So everything's back together, I've bleed both rears and the pedal seems nice and firm, but when I switch the engine on, I'm getting an abs warning light and the pedal goes sloppy! Is it because a: I've not bled the brakes In the right order? Or b: I've got air in the abs system?

Many thanks


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Probably got air in the ABS system, unless it's a dodgy sensor. Need to get it scanned and if it is air in the ABS they can bleed the ABS module while they are at it.
Air in the calipers won't cause an ABS light


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Probably got air in the ABS system, unless it's a dodgy sensor. Need to get it scanned and if it is air in the ABS they can bleed the ABS module while they are at it.
> Air in the calipers won't cause an ABS light


Thanks for the advic, I'll get scanned in the next couple of days. So you don't think the way I bled them has anything to do with the spongeneses?


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

The rear calipers can trap air in the handbrake mechanism. You could try removing the calipers and tilting them to release the air out of the piston.
But with the ABS light not so sure it's that.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Dumb Question I know, but doe the wheels have to be on for the ABS to work correctly?

Don't laugh!!


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Hacksawcats said:


> Dumb Question I know, but doe the wheels have to be on for the ABS to work correctly?
> 
> Don't laugh!!


Well it aint going to stop you without skidding lol

No wheels off won't throw a code.
Check the sensor rings are not crusty with rust and none of the sensors have been knocked or have a bad connection as you have been working in that area.
Have you had it scanned yet?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Hacksawcats said:
> 
> 
> > Dumb Question I know, but doe the wheels have to be on for the ABS to work correctly?
> ...


LOL, I think the sensor rings will be crusty as I was wire brushing the wish bones etc, before I fitted the pads & discs. I'll check ASAP weather permitting!! No, not got a scanner yet, my mates lending me his tomorrow. Cant take it to the garage as it's off the road at the mo.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Hacksawcats said:


> davebowk said:
> 
> 
> > Hacksawcats said:
> ...


A generic obd scanner won't find the issue, you need a VAG specific one. VCDS or OBD eleven


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Scanned it now and it came up with 5 errors (see attachment), so going to take the pads and discs off and start again, While there off, I'l clean up up/check all the sensors. Anyone know what sort/size the hex hole is on the front sensors and I've been told that the rear hubs need to come off to access the rear sensors? If so, what type of socket do I need for the rear hubs??
Thanks


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

PS: And bleed the brakes in the right order?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

doesn't matter now. I've found relevant threads. Thanks for all the replies guys.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Me again! Thought I'd sussed this but apparently not! Is the front abs brake sensor held on by some sort screw/bolt (as per Photo) or is it 
just pushed into the holes on the TRE??
Any help very much appreciated.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Bolted in and it will also be rusted in. you will probably break it if you try and remove it.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Bolted in and it will also be rusted in. you will probably break it if you try and remove it.


Just found that out, much to my cost! . Thanks anyway.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Does the rear hub have to come off to remove the disc Shield? can't seem to them past the ring.

Cheers


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Unfortunately on the rear yes


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Screws/Bolts, I mean


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> Unfortunately on the rear yes


FFS!! Thanks anyway


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Hi Guys, Nearly there!! Just another question: Cleared all the faults, fitted to new sensors, discs & pads fitted, all seemed well except that the drivers rear disc doesn't move as freely as the other three! We had to remove the hand brake cable on that disc for some reason but we've put it back on without any problems. But because we've removed etc. Is it likely that we need to readjust the hand brake and is the removal/refitting of the HB cable likely to be causing the binding/stiffness of the rotation? Also am I correct in thinking that I read on another post that the adjustment for the cable is behind the rear speaker?

Many thanks


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## Hoggy (May 8, 2002)

Hi, Unlikely to be the HB cable if it's only one disc. If you disconnect the HB cable does the disc free up? 
Hoggy.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

FFS, Sorry another quick question:

Bought these to replace the original disc retaining screws:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/easyfix-coun ... lsrc=aw.ds

As far as I know there the same size/spec etc, but they don't have the tapered end on them like the old ones do and the pitch of the head on the new ones is slightly wider than the originals, but they do seem to fit flush etc. So my question is can anyone see that as being a problem?


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Hoggy said:


> Hi, Unlikely to be the HB cable if it's only one disc. If you disconnect the HB cable does the disc free up?
> Hoggy.


mmm, good question, didn't check that doh !! I'll take a look tomorrow.  Anything else it's likely to be? I was going to take out the pads and see if it freed the disc up (good idea?). I'm assuming the fact that we've replaced the sensor wont make any difference?

Many thanks


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

If the head sits below the surface then it will be fine.

I did say your brakes were probably going to bind if the piston was difficult to get back in. Either fit new seals or replace the caliper. You will trash your new discs otherwise.
I had the same issue with a tight piston so replaced both rear calipers.

Forgot to add if there is any air in the caliper the piston won't pull back, try bleeding it again.
Screw it back in first


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> If the head sits below the surface then it will be fine.
> 
> I did say your brakes were probably going to bind if the piston was difficult to get back in. Either fit new seals or replace the caliper. You will trash your new discs otherwise.
> I had the same issue with a tight piston so replaced both rear calipers.
> ...


You did indeed,my bad. Ok, I'll try your suggestions. Is it best practice to replace both rear calipers? And thanks for the reassurance for the DRS.


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

I got a pair of pattern calipers off ebay for £76 so was worth changing both. Cheap pair https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174282676541 ... SwZYdes9SO

But the new ones did bind a bit because of air trapped in them, i removed the calipers and tilted them to get the air out of the piston. Fine after doing that.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> I got a pair of pattern calipers off ebay for £76 so was worth changing both. Cheap pair https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174282676541 ... SwZYdes9SO
> 
> But the new ones did bind a bit because of air trapped in them, i removed the calipers and tilted them to get the air out of the piston. Fine after doing that.


Thanks for the help and the link to the replacements. Can I just mither your a bit more: When you say "tilt them" can you please explain the procedure, is it a case of just making sure the calipers are filled with fluid first but then I'm not sure which way to tilt them etc. (sorry to be thick, but we all have to start some where 

Many thanks


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

The piston is hollow and has the handbrake adjuster mechanism inside it. Air can get trapped in this gubbins.
Unbolt the caliper and just face the piston face down and give it a few taps, replace caliper, screw piston back in a bit and then bleed as normal. You should see a bit more air come out. If it's still binding then the cheap calipers are ok, had them on mine nearly 3 year now.


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## Delta4 (Jun 19, 2015)

Just a thought, has the brake caliper got it's return spring for the hand brake mechanism in place?, if that is missing you will have binding issue's.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Delta4 said:


> Just a thought, has the brake caliper got it's return spring for the hand brake mechanism in place?, if that is missing you will have binding issue's.


mmm. I think so, we just un-clipped the hand brake cable, while we were messing with the caliper. But I'll double check with the other side later. Thanks for the advice.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> The piston is hollow and has the handbrake adjuster mechanism inside it. Air can get trapped in this gubbins.
> Unbolt the caliper and just face the piston face down and give it a few taps, replace caliper, screw piston back in a bit and then bleed as normal. You should see a bit more air come out. If it's still binding then the cheap calipers are ok, had them on mine nearly 3 year now.


Thanks Dave, I'll give it a go a later


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

Tried everybody's suggestions, checks etc. and in the end the piston seal split. So I've bitten the bullet and I'm going to order 2 new ones. Found these on ebay with a 5 year warranty:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173328596096?ul_noapp=true

does anyone know if they are compatible or should I go with Daves original link/suggestion?

And so the chaos continues! In tonight's story!!!::

So the next problems are: 
hub thread: My son's got a bit giddy with the impact wrench and ended cross threading one of the wheel bolt holes on the hub!! Do I need a size m14 tap and then insert a helicoil?

Also he/we've sheered a disc retaining screw off. Can I just drill it out and fit another one or does this also need re tapped once the screw has been removed and a helicoil fitted? I know I'm being a bit fussy but I don't/didn't just want to leave bodged.

Final problem: Noticed that the rear passenger hub isn't rotating now for some reason! (was last night) No rotation from the drive shaft. Any suggestions?? Don't know if this is related and may possibly be a cause/reason: We did undo the rear drivers side hub nut whilst investigating the brake problem and then tightened it back up, would this throw the AWD out for some reason?

Thanks to everyone for the contributions and patience!!


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Need to check they are for a 225. I saw these but linked the others as was not sure with the details in the add. 225 calipers are for 22mm disc with 38mm piston


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

No they are the wrong ones, you can see the ribs on the top in the photo

cross threaded wheel bolt = new hub
Forget about the sheared disc retainer as you will be getting a new hub
Wheel bolts fitted without the wheel or without wheel spacer if using them and longer bolts will stop the hub turning.


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## Hacksawcats (Jan 16, 2020)

davebowk said:


> No they are the wrong ones, you can see the ribs on the top in the photo
> 
> cross threaded wheel bolt = new hub
> Forget about the sheared disc retainer as you will be getting a new hub
> Wheel bolts fitted without the wheel or without wheel spacer if using them and longer bolts will stop the hub turning.


Hi Dave, Many thanks for the reply, I'm a little confused, my calipers arr ribbed (see photo) and I doubt very much they have been changed since the car was new.

With regard to the replacement hub. Is it a big job or fairly straight forward? I was thinking of trying to get someone to fit something similiar to these: 
https://eshop.wurth.co.uk/is-bin/INTERS ... F5n3mogNFZ

But cant seem to find a garage to do it.

Many thanks for your help


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## LesRSV (Jul 5, 2017)

The ribbed calipers are for the 180bhp and the smooth ones are for the 225bhp models. If you are replacing the hub you will also have to replace the wheel bearing as pulling the hub destroys the bearing. [smiley=bigcry.gif]


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## davebowk (Aug 16, 2019)

Hacksawcats said:


> davebowk said:
> 
> 
> > No they are the wrong ones, you can see the ribs on the top in the photo
> ...


Sorry, thought yours was a 225. The ribbed calipers fit the solid 12mm disc and the smooth caliper fit the 22mm vented disc


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