# All leave cancelled for AA and RAC this Sunday



## b3ves (May 6, 2002)

The title is a lift from SELOC, but it made me chuckle :lol:

http://www.pistonheads.com/tvr/default. ... ryId=15463


----------



## omen666 (Oct 10, 2004)

ROFLMAO nice one Rob


----------



## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Very good. :lol:

IIRC, PH have around 400 TVR's confirmed for Sunday. That should be quite a show.


----------



## Kell (May 28, 2002)

I thought it was funny when someone said in the other thread too.


----------



## b3ves (May 6, 2002)

Kell said:


> I thought it was funny when someone said in the other thread too.


Yeah, that was for the Blackpool run, but apparently there are more AA & RAC vans covering the M25 area so they've changed destinations this time


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

b3ves said:


> The title is a lift from SELOC, but it made me chuckle :lol:
> 
> http://www.pistonheads.com/tvr/default. ... ryId=15463


Glad it made you chuckle Rob, but how easily people can forget......


























I think it's sad that people (not just you Rob) feel the need to make fun, rather than feel sad and upset that one of Englands greatest car makers is going to pot by a crooked Russian! People should get behind this sort of thing. Even the Top Gear website felt the need to put a jibe in its' report of the run, it's pathetic.

Sorry for the slight outburst, but having owned and lived with a TVR I think it's tragic the way things have unfolded for this company and more importantly this country. There is no other car like it in the world, and TVR is more a part of this country's car prodcution heritage than anything else.

There's a slideshow (with vid) doing the rounds at the moment that tells the story better than anything than can be said in words. A complete historic slideshow from start to finish:

http://pistonheads.tv/clip1069


----------



## b3ves (May 6, 2002)

Kev

2 out of 3 of those weren't breakdowns and the 3rd came after 15,000 trouble-free miles, so you're barking up the wrong tree mate.

I think you're the one with a short memory having lost considerably more than the price of my Clio in depreciation on a car that only covered 2000-odd miles & spent more time off the road than on in the <12 months that you owned it.

Lovely cars, but that doesn't stop them being objects of ridicule when it comes to reliability.

Rob


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

b3ves said:


> Kev
> 
> 2 out of 3 of those weren't breakdowns and the 3rd came after 15,000 trouble-free miles, so you're barking up the wrong tree mate.
> 
> ...


Don't get me wrong Rob, I know TVR's are hardly what you would call reliable, and I certainly bought mine with my heart instead of my head. I suffered my fair share of problems, but when it ran right, I don't think there is a car on earth I would rather have had. Unfortunately my depreciation co-insided with Mr Smolenski's starting reign at ruining the company, and if I still had the car now it would have been considerably worse! I have read stories this week of 12 month old T350's being valued at Â£17k  quite a drop from their Â£40k+ original price tag! Personally I lost Â£9k in 9-10 months,which I know isn't chicken feed, but in perspective it could have ben a hell of a lot worse, and I think I got off lightly given the state of TVR prices today.

SELOC always have stories of reliability/problems/ faults etc, so even though Lotus' aren't as bad, there are other cars out there that suffer from reliability issues too (even the mightyness of Audi with their coil packs and dashpods!)

It just saddens me that people choose to look past the good points of a TVR (and believe me there are good points!), just so they can have a 'chuckle'.

It's not just TVR that has passed on here, but another nail in 'Britain' as we know it's coffin.

Watch the vid above with your speakers on and tell me it doesn't sadden you even just a little bit. Years and years of British heritage thrown down the pisser in just 18 months.


----------



## Kell (May 28, 2002)

The fact that people make jibes is only because the cars live up to that unfortunate tag.

Yes it's sad to see the demise of TVR, but no more so than any of the other British brands. You (that's collective you, not you personally) feel more fondly for TVR because it only ever made sports cars.

We looked long and hard at a TVR before the TT, but even the guy selling it recommended we didn't buy it as it would be our only car and he could never count on it doing what it was supposed to.

Yes, you can argue that TTs have had their share of problems, but the reality is that most were fixed - or fixable - whereas most of the people I know that have run TVRs have had a string of problems one after another.

You wouldn't accept service like this in any other part of your life, so why anyone feels they should put up with it from a car is beyond me.

It's a fact of life that if a company consistently fails to be, well, consistent then it deserves to fail.


----------



## cuTTsy (Jan 31, 2003)

Well I am still looking into buying a TVR, my last three Audi's have had problems that have put them off the road for weeks within the first year of ownership and the service I have received from the dealers has at best been shoddy.

At least if I buy a TVR i know it is going to have problems its when you buy something you expect to be reliable and it lets you down it makes things worse.

It is sad when people make off the cuff remarks without knowing the whole story. TVR seemed to be getting its act together with the Sagaris the quality is so much better there is a three year warranty with all new cars and they can be used on a daily basis, there are quite a few high mileage cars out there and some very passionate owners.

I think the truth is that history has caught up with them and perceptions are very difficult to get shift regardless of reality.


----------



## TVR_Man (May 21, 2002)

I don't get riled by this but I do get tired of people thinking they're being funny - I don't laugh and make comments at people who fit 225 rear valances to 180s, V6 rear spolers/valances to 225s etc. Even that blue mini in the other Other Marques post looks interesting to me (seems to have something interesting mechanics-wise in the back).

Yes TVRs are less reliable than Audis and yes TVR deserves a good kicking for not doing better sooner. However, think of the employees up in Blackpool - no real reason to move to Italy and sack them other than spastic management. Peter Wheeler ran the company into the ground (making some nice cars while doing so), Now Moleskins is totally FUBARing it. I mean who wants to buy a Â£120k TVR? I think he has illusions of grandeur and thinks TVR will be another Pagani.

If those cars pictured hadn't broken down why were they on a towtruck? (or was it crashed at a track or sometihng? and there was me thinking both handled well).

I think Kev's financial loss was more due to not using the TVR enough, then selling at the worst point in the depreciation curve (i.e. too early).


----------



## b3ves (May 6, 2002)

TVR_Man said:


> If those cars pictured hadn't broken down why were they on a towtruck? (or was it crashed at a track or sometihng? and there was me thinking both handled well).


The Exige had to be towed after I went over a rumble strip on track and it caused the inertia switch to cut the fuel. Silly me didn't know there was one until I phoned the dealer after getting it towed off 

The BMW has an electronic dipstick with no manual option without dismantling the airbox. I didn't realise that going on track confuses the dipstick for 30 mins and when I saw ---- displayed, I mistakenly thought I needed to add oil. After adding a litre and not seeing it change, I called BMW Assist and they told me not to start the car, but wait for them to collect it. They then towed it to the garage and drained the extra oil. 



TVR_Man said:


> I think Kev's financial loss was more due to not using the TVR enough, then selling at the worst point in the depreciation curve (i.e. too early).


That doesn't explain the months it spent off the road. IIRC it took about a month just to carry out the first 1000 mile service!


----------



## TVR_Man (May 21, 2002)

Technology eh - annoying sometimes isn't it! Still, better to be safe than sorry. TVRs have been known to trip their fuel cutoff switches too.

I see Lotuses and TVRs as broadly similar 'niche' cars - the only difference is TVRs insistence on its own engines (I love the speed six, but still think a nice yank V8 would mkae more business sense).

I thought of replacing the TVR with a CSL at one point, but can't justify the extra cost for another straight six with similar power and performance. I also like manuals (I'd get an A6 4.2 or S6 to replace my current A6 if they did a manual version).


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

b3ves said:


> IIRC it took about a month just to carry out the first 1000 mile service!


The 1000 mile service is a service to iron out major niggles and problems (also an oil change). 3/4 of the time it took to do it was wating for parts from the piss poor TVR parts dept in Blackpool. It also went back to the dealer for a few days when small niggly things like a fan switch failed. Still, it only took Audi 3 years to refund my dashpod problems, so i was used to waiting.

The 'London Thunder' is going to be quite an event;

- 400 cars
- 114 ex TVR factory workers also travelling down from blackpool by arranged coaches
- 5000 names on the signed petition
- Shirts, windscreen vinyls, badges and stickers have all been made for the day
- Appointment to deliver the petition at Downing Street has been confirmed as 14:00. Six people will be allowed in to Downing Street to deliver it, and have been granted permission to park the three TVR's directly outside Downing Street gates. During that time, a plan to have all of the cars parading along Whitehall.
- Police assistance closing off roads and allowing the parade through has been agreed.

This alone proves to me that TVR isn't just just any old car maker, and I cannot think of another car maker (past or present) in this country that would evoke so much passion from it's owners. If I still had my car, I would be there.

TVR's have their faults and unfortunately a lot of the problems are percieved from slightly older cars, but they were starting to get their act together with a 3yr warranty etc and 2005> cars were miles better!. It's just a shame Smolenski has had grand dillusions and has pissed it all away destroying peoples livelyhoods in the process.


----------



## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

kmpowell said:


> b3ves said:
> 
> 
> > IIRC it took about a month just to carry out the first 1000 mile service!
> ...


TBH what do they really hope to prove, they will never change the minds of TVR owner.
Yes you have to feel sorry for the workers but looking through history you'll see these things never really have an effect.

Past Protests that spring to mind
Miners: pits still closed
HP sauce: still moving abraod
Rover: sold to the chinese
I'm sure there's 100's more

The thing is it's a small minority that really care and in TVR's case smaller than the above.

And who's to say moving the factory to Italy wont be for the good of the the car :?

face facts Business is business


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

jonah said:


> face facts Business is business


Yes, and there are also ways of conducting business with morals. Not lying and bullshit*ing your way through the past 18 months promising new factories, new premises, new models etc...... to the end where on monday of this week employees are told that an un-named company are looking to move into the Bristol Avenue (Blackpool) fctory and in good faith take on all the staff to build cars for them, so what did Smolenski do? Laid off 158 already dejected workforce without pay!

Workers are leaving every week and just want to get out of the place. Is this what you call an act off 'business'? It's disgraceful!

TVR's client base is on Pistonheads (fact) and there is now virtually nobody on there who would buy a 'NEW' TVR. So Jonah, providing you think that the above is an acceptable way of running a business and you would buy an Italian TVR, perhaps you can answer me these simple questions....

Who is going to buy these Â£120k (yes you read that right Â£120k!!!) supercars Smolenski is dreaming of, over a Ferrari or Lambo etc?
Who is going to build them?
Where are they going to be sold (TVR dealers are going under and closing in the UK at a rate of one every 2 months at the moment)?

Answers on a postcard please. The parade probably won't do much good in saving the compamy in the UK, but it at least highlights the above issues.

:?


----------



## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

Dont get me wrong I agree with most of what you say, but the decisions been made. 
Lets face it if an Italian TVR presses the right buttons and gets rave reviews they will sell, maybe not here but places where people arn't so sentimental.


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

jonah said:


> Lets face it if an Italian TVR presses the right buttons and gets rave reviews they will sell, maybe not here but places where people arn't so sentimental.


Sorry but I can't see it myself. TVR's are British and that is known across the world. What is also known (as proved by this thread) is their reputation for unreliability, so nobody is going to spend Â£120k on a unproven unreliable car.

To make a Â£120k supercar you also need to have customers, and a 'foreign' TVR would have absolutely no client base to start with because the countries it may be sold in would stay loyal to it's own brands.

It's all pipe dreams and lies IMO. My suspicions of Smolenski are that he will disolve the TVR name and sell the company under a different banner for maximum profit.

At the end of the day TVR, TVR's employees, and also this country, have been shafted and that is what the parade is all about.


----------



## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

kmpowell said:


> At the end of the day TVR, TVR's employees, and also this country, have been shafted and that is what the parade is all about.


Whats new there Kev :?

Has been going on in this country for the last 30 yrs in manufacturing With companies a lot bigger than TVR :?


----------



## tdk (Jul 22, 2003)

kmpowell said:


> I cannot think of another car maker (past or present) in this country that would evoke so much passion from it's owners.


What about...










:?:

Simon.


----------



## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

Simon, there is one BIG difference though. IMO the Mini wasn't killed, it just came to the end of it's lifecycle and bowed out gracefully. For TVR though it was still going strong. 3yr warranty's were now being given and the model range was exciting and fresh.


----------



## tdk (Jul 22, 2003)

kmpowell said:


> IMO the Mini wasn't killed, it just came to the end of it's lifecycle and bowed out gracefully. For TVR though it was still going strong. 3yr warranty's were now being given and the model range was exciting and fresh.


I wouldn't disagree with you on that.

Simon.


----------



## Nando (Feb 5, 2004)

tdk said:


> kmpowell said:
> 
> 
> > IMO the Mini wasn't killed, it just came to the end of it's lifecycle and bowed out gracefully. For TVR though it was still going strong. 3yr warranty's were now being given and the model range was exciting and fresh.
> ...


[off topic]
Simon - I thought you were getting a Z4M coupe? 
<- 997Cs?
[/off topic]


----------



## tdk (Jul 22, 2003)

Nando said:


> [off topic]
> Simon - I thought you were getting a Z4M coupe?
> <- 997Cs?
> [/off topic]


Yeah, I seem to have ended up with a 997...












Simon.


----------



## Nando (Feb 5, 2004)

Very nice - plus room for the dog


----------



## justtin (May 6, 2002)

TVR_Man said:


> Yes TVRs are less reliable than Audis


There were 2 TT's on the hard shoulder of the M4 yesterday between junctions 4b & 6.....


----------



## tdk (Jul 22, 2003)

Nando said:


> Very nice - plus room for the dog


Indeed - both of them! 

Simon.


----------

