# Brazil GP



## garyc (May 7, 2002)

So will the FAI allow the boy Hamilton to win the drivers title this weekend.

He has three other drivers, Ferrari politicians and the crowd willing him not to. Can he dig deep and go for the place (5th ir above if Massa wins); or will he see red mist and go for the win himself; of will his car get wound back for a few laps as it was last year?

I think he'll go for the win.


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## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

I think he'll go for the win but not off the line, if he's over taken assuming he gets pol I think he'll be content get round the first lap then start reeling them in.

I hope


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## ag (Sep 12, 2002)

The guy is a racer and that is why I think he's great. I may be in the minority but I think he is a breath of fresh air in comparison with the mopey, sour faced latins and inarticulate Finns (I know, I know, I can't speak Finnish either). He seems to enjoy driving, not just see it as a job. I really hope he wins and he doesn't become too mature in the process!

As a footnote, despite my respect for them as drivers, nothing would give me greater pleasure than seeing Alonso outbrake himself into the back of Massa at the first corner, gifting the lead to a Toro Rosso, eventually to be overtaken in the pits by Raikkonen, thereby winning the race with Kubica second and Hamilton Third.

Hamilton, World Champ, Alonso given a 25 second penalty for all F1 races in 2009.


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## pas_55 (May 9, 2002)

ag said:


> As a footnote, despite my respect for them as drivers, nothing would give me greater pleasure than seeing Alonso outbrake himself into the back of Massa at the first corner, gifting the lead to a Toro Rosso, eventually to be overtaken in the pits by Raikkonen, thereby winning the race with Kubica second and Hamilton Third.
> 
> Hamilton, World Champ, Alonso given a 25 second penalty for all F1 races in 2009.


Nice one.


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## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

9th in second practice :?


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## garvin (May 7, 2002)

garyc said:


> So will the FAI allow the boy Hamilton to win the drivers title this weekend.


No chance. They will wait to the end of the race and then give Hamilton a time penalty for speeding on the race track sufficient to drop him to sixth place and award Massa a special time bonus for most elegant driver of 2008 sufficient to gift him first place. If Massa crashes out then Hamilton will be deducted 8 points for driving whilst under the influence of excess talent :wink:


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## westty (Jan 3, 2004)

I hope he does as Shumacher did to Hill and takes Massa off big time. It would be funny as Fuc* :roll: :lol:


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## malstt (Apr 18, 2007)

i just hope he win's it in a fair race with no cheating , dodgy decision's or fowl play.


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## skiwhiz (Feb 17, 2008)

westty said:


> I hope he does as Shumacher did to Hill and takes Massa off big time. It would be funny as Fuc* :roll: :lol:


After Massa spun him in a previous race that would be real justice, :twisted: 
but somehow if he did you can see the FIA taking it away, I like Lewis and Massa but have to support the brit as he always races, only once has he gone walk about whilst it has happened to Massa a few times over the years.


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## John C (Jul 5, 2002)

<does rain dance>

Go Lewis!


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## cuTTsy (Jan 31, 2003)

John C said:


> <does rain dance>
> 
> Go Lewis!


...looks like it worked


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## Hallyfella (Mar 5, 2007)

If he finishes where hes starting from should be job done.
But knowing Lewis he will push on and try to beat Massa in front of his own fans!!
Lets hope hes sensible this time. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]


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## WozzaTT (Jan 15, 2006)

Heavy rain before the start so it's been delayed - should make it even more interesting. Quite nervous now!


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## WozzaTT (Jan 15, 2006)

Get in!!!!!! And Ferrari celebrating before they realised - quality!!!!!! :lol:


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## phodge (Sep 1, 2002)

Can I breath again now...??!!


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## WozzaTT (Jan 15, 2006)

Was Glock told to let Hamilton by though??? Can still see it going tits up :?

To be fair Massa seems like a nice bloke.


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## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

[smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif] [smiley=mexicanwave.gif]


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

WozzaTT said:


> Was Glock told to let Hamilton by though??? Can still see it going tits up :?
> 
> To be fair Massa seems like a nice bloke.


Who knows? Looks suss. German driver, Mercedes engine in McLaren. Is Glock on a promise for a drive next year?

I really, really hope not. It'll be so damaging for F1 at a time when so many accusations of fixing going on.

Well done Lewis anyway. I think he deserved some luck today! [smiley=mexicanwave.gif]

Cheers

Rich


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

WozzaTT said:


> Can still see it going tits up :?


With the iffy verdicts that have gone Ferrari's way this season... not even THEY would be that cheeky as to raise an appeal to this even iffier finish, would they?!?


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

rustyintegrale said:


> WozzaTT said:
> 
> 
> > Was Glock told to let Hamilton by though??? Can still see it going tits up :?
> ...


F1 is fixed, no way not in a billion dollars..... er i mean years :evil:


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## Naresh (Nov 22, 2004)

*WELL DONE LEWIS!!!*










What a way to shut up those nasty boo boys too!! Talk about leaving it late, you had us all on the edge of our seats on that last lap!!!  

With regards to Timo Glock slowing down on the last lap, I doubt his tyres had deteriorated that much to cause him trouble in that short rain shower but whatever the official explanations are Lewis deserved some luck today after all the abuse and decisions that have gone against him this year. Let's not forget the FIA and Ferrari, who have together, helped give Lewis driving penalties and points deductions all through the season, yet he still came out on top!! 8) The look on the Ferrari garage (who were at the time celebrating what they thought as Massa becoming champion), when the realised Hamilton had actually come in 5th was priceless!!! :lol: :lol:


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## jdn (Aug 26, 2002)

Wasn't Glock on dry tires - clearly raining more on last lap, and on that part of the circuit as predicted, so fairly simple explanation really.

Well done Lewis.

Gutted for Massa and his family in some way - you could see the crushing disappointment emerge as they were celebrating only to be told he hadn't quite made it.

Great finish.


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

jdn said:


> clearly raining more on last lap


Hmmmm, I'm certainly no Formula one driver and the TV pictures could be very deceptive, but I couldn't see _that_ much rain. As the rain predominantly fell on the pit straight Glock had already passed it and entered the dry sectors of the lap with an 18 second advantage! For him to lose 18 seconds on a mainly dry/damp lap would mean some seriosu f' ups and errors which the TV pictures didn't show.

I'd love to think it was a genuine finish, but I can't help but feel there was more to it and Glock was under orders from something/one...










:?


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## taylormade-tt (May 14, 2007)

As Kev said... orders from above for glock me thinks.. 18 seconds in one lap lost naaaa cant see that :roll:

I am not a fan of F1 so i dont know a lot about the subject, but from a sceptical point of view a fix :roll:

good luck to hamilton anyway, he's has had a few setbacks/dodgy decisions along the way, so he deserves the title. 

Tom.


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## Reaperman (Nov 3, 2006)

What a final race in Brazil.....Massa did everything but it came down to 2 final corners and 5th place snatched at the death..

Well Done....a fantastic effort by a truely superb F1 Team....

TV moment of the race was Massa and co celebrating in the Ferrari garage not looking at Glock going backwards...!

And the booing was a little obvious and not necessary....

PRICELESS......

No doubt the start of greater things...


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

Reaperman said:


> TV moment of the race was Massa and co celebrating in the Ferrari garage not looking at Glock going backwards...!


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## WozzaTT (Jan 15, 2006)

NickP said:


> Reaperman said:
> 
> 
> > TV moment of the race was Massa and co celebrating in the Ferrari garage not looking at Glock going backwards...!


Quality!! :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## CamV6 (Oct 26, 2003)

Dont get me wrong, I am delighted for Lewis, and was relieved to see hgim clinch the championship, but that finish was a disgraceful fix.

Hamilton's stragety to stay out of trouble and pootle round for a 4th or 5th was exposed as the wrong way to approach it. Ok, to go 'balls-out' for the win would have been dangerous but if you aim for mediocrity and miss by a hairs breadth you end up with bugger all which so nearly happened. There was no reason for him to be best part of 30s behind Massa, he was just trying to coast to the title, it went tits up, and Glock was knobbled in the last sector to save Hamilton's blushes.

IMO that was arranged at the end and it does F1 no favours whatsoever.


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## John C (Jul 5, 2002)

John C said:


> <does rain dance>
> 
> Go Lewis!


;-) :-D


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## jdn (Aug 26, 2002)

kmpowell said:


> jdn said:
> 
> 
> > clearly raining more on last lap
> ...


Total cock and bull.

No mystery or intrigue here - knackered dry tyres on a wet track.

Still, the rumour mill and fishwife gossip will no doubt continue.. :x


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## CamV6 (Oct 26, 2003)

Well I'd really love to be wrong and I genuinely hope it was a case of knackered dry tyre on a dampening track but he didnt seem to have too much trouble catching and taking Hamilton moments before :?


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## jdn (Aug 26, 2002)

CamV6 said:


> Well I'd really love to be wrong and I genuinely hope it was a case of knackered dry tyre on a dampening track but he didnt seem to have too much trouble catching and taking Hamilton moments before :?


?

Don't recall Glock getting past Hamilton moments before. Vettel did - clearly coping better on intermediate tyres with probably a lot more downforce than Hamilton - Mclaren were the quickest throught the speed traps all weekend.

Glock got ahed by virtue of not stopping for intermediates hence why still on slicks. Definitely raining towards the end and old slicks on an increasingly greasy track were his downfall.


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## CamV6 (Oct 26, 2003)

jdn said:


> CamV6 said:
> 
> 
> > Well I'd really love to be wrong and I genuinely hope it was a case of knackered dry tyre on a dampening track but he didnt seem to have too much trouble catching and taking Hamilton moments before :?
> ...


Yep, sorry ur absolutely right, i got confused


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## Sticks (Sep 3, 2008)

I don't know if it was a fix or not, I hope not. But if not then he's a very lucky chap and congrats to him.

What I'm not looking forward to is another year of the sort of coverage where every move he makes is 'outstanding' or 'fantastic' and you'd think no one esle was taking part. He's done well, in the best car, arguably. But he won less races than Massa this year and, like Massa, had 3 results placed 10th or below, but retired one less time. Not sure you'd call winning by half a lap comprehensive.

Well done to him for doing it, but I hope the media isn't going to hype him up too much - with the risk of his potentially great career being affected.


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## StuarTT (May 7, 2002)

Naresh said:


> *WELL DONE LEWIS!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Almost the best part of the week-end for me.

Almost, but only almost, felt sorry for them until I remembered how they cheered when Massa turned Lewis at the Japanese GP.

Well done Lewis.

As for it being fixed. Bollocks. Glock didn't have a chance on worn slicks in the rain. Look at how Lewis lost the car in China last year when his tyres were worn and the track was a little damp.


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## Reaperman (Nov 3, 2006)

WozzaTT said:


> NickP said:
> 
> 
> > Reaperman said:
> ...


Quality Indeed....

But how indicative of a season full of surprises and inexplicable rulings from the FIA......All this bollox of a race fix is just a consequence of how this season has evolved....

C'mon chaps we have a new World Champion....Lets embrace it not Knock it....


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## citrix20 (Aug 29, 2006)

Brilliant result, knife edge TV... was fantastic, if only all the races were as exciting.

As for a fix, deffinately not, the figures speak for themseleves.

according to James Allen on ITV F1:

Lap 71 - Glock loses 13 seconds in sectors one and two. Hamilton's final lap is 1m26s, Glock's is 1m 44.731s. Trulli, who also stayed on dry tyres, does a similar lap time.

So any suggestion Glock slowed down can be dismissed as he lapped at a similiar time to Trulli who was also out on dry tyres.


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

citrix20 said:


> Lap 71 - Glock loses 13 seconds in sectors one and two. Hamilton's final lap is 1m26s, Glock's is 1m 44.731s. Trulli, who also stayed on dry tyres, does a similar lap time.
> 
> So any suggestion Glock slowed down can be dismissed as he lapped at a similiar time to Trulli who was also out on dry tyres.


That's good to know... 8) 8) 8) but no doubt someone will have to resign over it... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Well done Lewis! [smiley=mexicanwave.gif]

Cheers

Rich


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

More fuel to the fire - this was pointed out on another forum, the last 3 lap times for the team mates. Consistent up until he very last lap where Glock slowed remarkably...

*Glock*
69 1:18.688
70 1:28.041
71 1:44.731

*Trulli*
69 1:22.428
70 1:33.539
71 1:44.800

...


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## NaughTTy (Jul 9, 2003)

kmpowell said:


> More fuel to the fire - this was pointed out on another forum, the last 3 lap times for the team mates. Consistent up until he very last lap where Glock slowed remarkably...
> 
> *Glock*
> 69 1:18.688
> ...


and so did Trulli...or am I missing something :?


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## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

jdn said:


> kmpowell said:
> 
> 
> > jdn said:
> ...


Have to agree!
Dry tyres with no tempriture in them on a damp/wet track = Useless


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

NaughTTy said:


> or am I missing something :?


Glock was lapping 4/5 seconds faster than Trulli up until the final lap when lost a massive amount of time and lapped a same time as Trulli?

I don't particular believe one side more than the other, but given this season shenanigans, the more I read the more I am inding this 'hollywood finish' harder to believe.


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## jonah (Aug 17, 2002)

NaughTTy said:


> kmpowell said:
> 
> 
> > More fuel to the fire - this was pointed out on another forum, the last 3 lap times for the team mates. Consistent up until he very last lap where Glock slowed remarkably...
> ...


If anything this proves it wasn't a fix :? and besides Ferrari would of lodged an apeal as all radio transcripts are available to everyone to hear, which is the only way Glock could of known or been given orders.


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## Hoggy (May 8, 2002)

[smiley=argue.gif] [smiley=gossip.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif]


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## allthewayfromspain (Sep 17, 2008)

Lewis finished 5ht, with more points than massa so he is champ. Brazil was one race, not the season.

Im not a lewis fan but i have seen images from other tv cameras not broadcast on tv in the uk or here and the move lewis put on glock was in an area where glock was on a pretty much dry track, and it was only slightly raining.

orders or not, it doeasnt matter as there have been a few dodgy decisions for ferrari this year.

roll on nxt year with all the new regs, and hopefull level the field out a bit.

surely jenson can finish a couple of races>>>???


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## SimonQS (Jul 21, 2008)

allthewayfromspain said:


> roll on nxt year with all the new regs, and hopefull level the field out a bit.


Level the field, if anything it will stretch it out - at the moment 4 to 16th on the grid have been seperated by only 1 second. Next year shows the most fundimental rule change for 20 years, some will get it right, some will get it wrong. I wouldnt be supprised if some teams fall into the "fail to qualify" bracket, not seen for many years - 108% of the pole position time.


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## Private Prozac (Jul 7, 2003)

Who won then? [smiley=zzz.gif]


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## R6B TT (Feb 25, 2003)

Well hopefully Jensen will have a decent car next year since Honda have spent most of this season developing it, having given up trying to fix this years crock of sh1t.

Well done Lewis anyway. And bollocks to the Brazilians who were booing.


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

I'm surprised that nobody has said what a close shave it was


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## pas_55 (May 9, 2002)

The boy done good!
Sorry but Massa is an average driver in a great car this was his best chance he will not get another.


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

pas_55 said:


> The boy done good!
> Sorry but Massa is an average driver in a great car this was his best chance he will not get another.


Considering the skill level required for F1 I'd hardly call any of them average - however alot does depend on the car.

There are very few good drivers in F1 - Alsonso currently is the best IMO, Hamilton (to give him some credit) is a decent driver but he's still alot to learn and certainly not of Alonso standard when he won his first F1 Champ. I do rate Massa but not as highly, his wet weather performances were truely awful (ok car was not best), Vettel is deffo one for the future!


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

R6B TT said:


> Well hopefully Jensen will have a decent car next year since Honda have spent most of this season developing it, having given up trying to fix this years crock of sh1t.


I really hope Ross Brawn sticks to his word and gives Jenson a decent car next season. A wasted talent IMO, through no fault of his own.


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

JB - has his team choices been his fault or just really unlucky?


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## rustyintegrale (Oct 1, 2006)

What's happened to JB's Dad? He was always a smiling face hanging around with Jenson...

Cheers

Rich


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## garvin (May 7, 2002)

kmpowell said:


> More fuel to the fire - this was pointed out on another forum, the last 3 lap times for the team mates. Consistent up until he very last lap where Glock slowed remarkably...
> 
> *Glock*
> 69 1:18.688
> ...


Much depends where you are on the track when the rain 'sweeps in'. The times show the track deteriorating fast until it is a constant so these times do not surprise me at all and, IMHO, in no way indicate that Glock 'slowed' deliberately ... otherwise Trulli must have been slowing deliberately as well - why would he do that? When Hamilton crossed the line to start his final lap they reported Glock as ~18 seconds ahead. But I bet turns 1, 2 and 3 in the wet were a complete nightmare on slicks. The twisty bit of the circuit where the rain didn't really get to was probably OK but with cooling slicks it would not have been too quick and the final few bends, again where the rain was prevalent, would have been pretty much impossible on rather cold slicks. I'd like to see when Hamilton and Vettel passed Glock again as I think they passed others not just Glock, so I think a number were really struggling on slicks and Glock would have been hard pushed to have overtaken them if he was, indeed, in traffic at some point during that final lap.


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## stephengreen (May 6, 2002)

CamV6 said:


> Dont get me wrong, I am delighted for Lewis, and was relieved to see hgim clinch the championship, but that finish was a disgraceful fix.
> 
> Hamilton's stragety to stay out of trouble and pootle round for a 4th or 5th was exposed as the wrong way to approach it. Ok, to go 'balls-out' for the win would have been dangerous but if you aim for mediocrity and miss by a hairs breadth you end up with bugger all which so nearly happened. There was no reason for him to be best part of 30s behind Massa, he was just trying to coast to the title, it went tits up, and Glock was knobbled in the last sector to save Hamilton's blushes.
> 
> IMO that was arranged at the end and it does F1 no favours whatsoever.


There was every reason for hamilton to be 30 sec behind Massa because he didn't need to win. Now don't get me wrong i love a good conspiracy theory as much as any one but this has one major flaw. The flaw is that Glock could have avoided getting in front of him in the first place ,if indeed an arrangement existed. All he had to do was come in for fresh tyres once hamilton pitted because as the rain started falling he was already behind Hamilton at that stage!


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