# mk3 on track anyone?



## revulike (Jun 15, 2018)

Has anyone driven their mk3 on a track day?
I'm contemplating......


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## zooks (Sep 15, 2017)

revulike said:


> Has anyone driven their mk3 on a track day?
> I'm contemplating......


Yes. Did a track day in mine at Castle Combe Circuit. Good fun.


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## jackforgon (May 14, 2018)

I've done the snetterton circuit in the south of the UK.

Again like Zooks says, very good fun! I had Terrible weather - Visibility was shocking and standing water everywhere but the quattro system in the TT made RS6's look like BMW's! They were sliding all over whilst my TT never once got unsettled!

The major thing I realised though is stripped out clio 172's and mx5's were making me look slow, I was in my TT 2.0 quattro, with a map taking it to 320hp but just couldn't stop like they could, all my extra weight showed itself! It was cooking EBC Redstuff brakes very easily (2 hot laps in I was fading) I had ultimate grip and strong straight line performance but in the wet the stability control and diff were just melting the brakes.

I've also had my TTS (mapped to 380hp) on crail dragstrip, again it performed very very well - it was leaving V10 BMW M5's, impreza STI's, evo's etc etc. The Mk3 TT quattro system is a massive improvement over the old one I can confirm this.

TLR - The standard TT begs for better brakes on track, in stock weight it cooks them very easily. TTS Loves the dragstrip.


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## revulike (Jun 15, 2018)

Ah. I thought the brakes might be a concern?
Zooks, how did your brakes and tyres do?

My TT is a standard 2.0 stronic quattro on (quite old) Hankooks. I am a bit worried about not having any pads or tyres to drive home on.


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## jabiqq (Apr 24, 2016)

I would switch traction control off (when dry) or at least move it to sport. Otherwise torque vectoring will be braking individual wheels and adding to the problem.


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## captainhero17 (Apr 10, 2018)

I too am interested in taking it on the local track. I heard that after that,unless the car is new, you simply must replace the brake pads. Is that all that needs replacing? The discs are going to be ok?


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## zooks (Sep 15, 2017)

The tyre grip and handling was fantastic and the standard 230bhp TT had more than enough performance to have fun without chucking it at the scenery.

The limitation is the brakes. Their great on the road but mine were seriously overheating within half dozen laps and that's with stability control off. I'm pretty sure you could say that about most performance orientated street cars though.

Also bear in mind my car was only a few months old at the time so everything was pretty new. I'm looking at replacing my continentals soon at about 10k miles so they held up quite well considering.

There was no noticable wear or lasting effects to my pads or disks they just got too hot and the pedal travel became excessive.

Edit* I took optional track day insurance with Morris. Expensive at £180 but cheaper than bining the car.


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## kevin#34 (Jan 8, 2019)

with few exceptions (Ferrari, Porsche..) OEM brakes are the major limitation when a car is driven in track...
some improvements can be obtained by replacing rubber brake lines with steel ones, OEM pad with higher friction ones (Pagid yellow, Brembo HP 2000..) and a more performing brake fluid (Castrol SRF, Motul RB 660...), but even so, it's hard to do more than few consecutive laps before fading appears....


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## leopard (May 1, 2015)

The very reason why a road car doesn't do well on a track, 'tis for the road...


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## kevin#34 (Jan 8, 2019)

not exactly, its more depending on the "weight/brake system" ratio, with the addition of poor brakes cooling..
any middle naked-not sporty motorcycle can cope quite well with track even if equipped with just decent brakes, due to its low mass and discs exposed to wind...


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## leopard (May 1, 2015)

kevin#34 said:


> not exactly, its more depending on the "weight/brake system" ratio, with the addition of poor brakes cooling..
> any middle naked-not sporty motorcycle can cope quite well with track even if equipped with just decent brakes, due to its low mass and discs exposed to wind...


There is a massive difference in braking systems for those that are designed for the road compared to track use, cooling obviously but there are other factors involved including such variables as friction coefficients, caliper construction and budget. Relatively, even the tt RS has crap brakes.

As for motorcycles I learnt the hard way thinking that the Yamaha FZR1000 EXUP introduced way back when was the ultimate track tool only to find out that a factory bike was in a completely different league in every way possible.

Don't deceive yourself...


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## Mark Pred (Feb 1, 2017)

Yeah, not my car but a mk3 RS and it properly showed it up. Brakes quickly cooked up and it was unstable through the twisty stuff. Fine in a straight line though, but overall, it wasn't at all comfortable on the track and hence, not much fun either... the TT is a good road car, but it has a way to go if it wants to compete with some cars in the same class for handling, like the Cayman, which was another car I drove that day - a 718 S which had PCCB 's and it was night and day better in almost every department (as one would expect). I was posting lap times up to 5 seconds quicker with the Porsche over the TTS, which on a short track, was a massive amount.


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## kevin#34 (Jan 8, 2019)

I am talking based on real experiences, not deceiving my self.... my previous S3 full _Brembo GT_ kit equipped (discs, calipers, steel lines, Brembo HP 2000 pads, Castrol SRF oil) when taken in Mugello track (with 8C ambient temperature) was giving me no more than 4/5 hot laps with a proper braking effect, then brake pedal getting loose and front discs red gloving in F1 style, with a temperature in excess of 300 C (measured with infrared thermo)...
the main factor influencing a car braking performance is the mass of the vehicle itself and the capacity to dissipate heat from the brake system (thus, air cooling it), that's why OEM brakes performance level is acceptably good (in terms of stopping distance) when used normally and then a completely crap after few hot laps (not able to withstand the high temperature generated by the repeated decelerations) ... 
Take a look to a DTM car (highest level of tuning for a mass production car) braking system, they all have monstrous 400 mm carbo discs plus huge cooling vents at the front... and with a curb weight that is nearly 400 kg less than our TT's.... nevertheless, in high demanding tracks they still can suffer from brake fading issues, sometimes...



leopard said:


> kevin#34 said:
> 
> 
> > not exactly, its more depending on the "weight/brake system" ratio, with the addition of poor brakes cooling..
> ...


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## zooks (Sep 15, 2017)

Missing the point here guys.

Is the TT (in any guise) a track weapon - nope

Is it fun to give it a blast on a track not worrying about speed scameras, pedestrians etc - Yep

Thats what track days are for isn't it?

Oh nobodys mentioned fuel consumption. Mine averaged 11mpg. Keep an eye on those gauges


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## captainhero17 (Apr 10, 2018)

Well from what I understand. One of the factors contributing to car brake fading is the mass. To what extent it contributes I cant say.
However, the type of brakes you have (cooling system and material) is a determining factor.

There is a phenomenal video on this topic on Engineering Explained. Guy tests different types of brakes with different cooling designs: regular, perforated, diagonally perforated.
They behave and perform very differently.
I also urge you all to look up "RS3 brake fire". Amazing how just having different material can make a difference.


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## leopard (May 1, 2015)

kevin#34 said:


> I am talking based on real experiences, not deceiving my self.... my previous S3 full _Brembo GT_ kit equipped (discs, calipers, steel lines, Brembo HP 2000 pads, Castrol SRF oil) when taken in Mugello track (with 8C ambient temperature) was giving me no more than 4/5 hot laps with a proper braking effect, then brake pedal getting loose and front discs red gloving in F1 style, with a temperature in excess of 300 C (measured with infrared thermo)...
> the main factor influencing a car braking performance is the mass of the vehicle itself and the capacity to dissipate heat from the brake system (thus, air cooling it), that's why OEM brakes performance level is acceptably good (in terms of stopping distance) when used normally and then a completely crap after few hot laps (not able to withstand the high temperature generated by the repeated decelerations) ...
> Take a look to a DTM car (highest level of tuning for a mass production car) braking system, they all have monstrous 400 mm carbo discs plus huge cooling vents at the front... and with a curb weight that is nearly 400 kg less than our TT's.... nevertheless, in high demanding tracks they still can suffer from brake fading issues, sometimes...


LOL

This is what I intimated earlier that road cars are meant and built for the road...


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## kevin#34 (Jan 8, 2019)

never said that TT is a track weapon... at the contrary, a 488 Pista or 911 GT3 brakes withstand much better track abuse...



kevin#34 said:


> *with few exceptions (Ferrari, Porsche..) *OEM brakes are the major limitation when a car is driven in track...
> some improvements can be obtained by replacing rubber brake lines with steel ones, OEM pad with higher friction ones (Pagid yellow, Brembo HP 2000..) and a more performing brake fluid (Castrol SRF, Motul RB 660...), but even so, it's hard to do more than few consecutive laps before fading appears....


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## FJ1000 (Nov 21, 2015)

If you only do one thing for your brakes before trying your car on track - change the brake fluid for something that can cope with higher temps.

That brake fade you get on a road car after a couple of laps is most likely down to the fluid - NOT the friction material.










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