# EFR 6758 build - I'm back, happy days



## nate42

Don't know exactly what I'm about to do though... but more power is the goal.

Plenty of Stage2 TT's here and I'm sure many of you are also thinking how to get more power. You want use your existing Stage2 (Referring to REVO's definition here) bits and not blow a huge amount of cash.

I was dreaming a complete engine rebuild a'la Frase and Steve, asked around, did my math and JESUS it's expensive . My pockets are not deep enough [smiley=bigcry.gif] So I've decided to have Phase1 Phase2 and Phase3. I'll leave stroking the engine, cams, custom engine management, valves, intake manifold and head work and all that stuff to phase3 (that I hope will happen some day...). So basically I'm trying to get more power with quality parts. Phase1 and Phase2 will happen with current engine and on Phase3 all new engine goes in. Also as this is a hobby I try to do as much as I can on my own.

*Phase1 shopping list, target ~350hp: (DONE!)*
_OK - EGT+A/F wideband gauge (http://www.vems.us)_
_OK - SCAT rods 144x20mm_
_OK - 550cc/min injectors (Bosch EV14)_
_OK - Stiffer engine mounts (Vibra Technics - Performance / Fast Road)_
_OK - Mocal oil cooler, 90 deg connectors to ID ½" hose and Spal fan_
_OK - EFR 6758 turbo_
_OK - Kevlar timing belt_
_OK - Vacuum line (ID 4mm) and t-piece to CRV (compressor recirculation valve), will leave Forge 007P in place too_
_OK - Fuel pump Bosch 044 (200 l/hour @ 5 bar) with AN6/Banjo hose fittings_
_OK - Revo SPS Select Plus to alter timing and boost_
_OK - LCD gauge for oil temp/pressure, fuel pressure and boost_
_OK - Fuel pump relay 191906383C, blade fuse holder and 15A fuse_
_OK - T-piece and hose to boost pressure sensor_
_OK - 3" V-band flange and clamp for turbo to DP adapter_
_OK - Oil cooler sandwich plate with thermostat, connectors to ID ½" hose_
_OK - Oil cooler hoses, ID ½", Teflon stainless steel braided, oil is hot normal rubber hose not suitable_
_OK - Silicone hoses for intake_
_OK - Fuel lines ID 8mm, basic +100C 16bar fuel/oil hose is OK here_
_OK - Connectors for fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temperature and boost sensors_
_OK - Motul 300V 5W-30 engine oil, oil filter and fuel filter_
_OK - Self sealing take off's needed for intake 8mm, 14mm and 16mm_
_OK - Hobbs pressure activated switch 76575 for fuel pump relay PDF LINK_
_OK - REVO Stage3 software (made for GT2860RS with A/R 0.64 turbine)_
_OK - Fuel pump and oil cooler fan wires_
_OK - New OEM Audi gaskets/bolts (part numbers on page 6)_
_OK - SACHS Race clutch 883089 000052_
_OK - SACHS Race steel flywheel_
_OK - SACHS Race pressure plate_
_OK - SACHS release bearing 3182997901_
_OK - Clutch aligning tool_
_OK - M10 XZN (tripple square), M10 Ribe and M10 Audi Ribe tools to remove the head (all 140mm long)_
_OK - Fuel pump and oil cooler fan "always ON" switches _
_OK - ARP head bolts part no. 204-3901 _
_OK - Custom manifold (http://www.kkdmotorsport.com)_
_OK - New set of piston rings_
_OK - Power steering fluid G 002000 / G 004000_
_OK - Mineral oil and filter for break in new piston rings_
_OK - G12 coolant, gearbox top up (Redline MT-90)_
_OK - ID 10mm Teflon stainless steel braided hose for rerouting power steering line _
_OK - Heat wrap to protect silicon hoses from the exhaust manifold heat_
_OK - NGK BKR7E spark plugs_
_OK - Downpipe with two lambda and exhaust temperature plugs (keeping the Pipewerx 200cel cat or decat section)_
_OK - BAM injector seats 4 pcs 06B 133 555 H_
_OK - M12 x 1.0 Banjo 1/4" braided PTFE hose for rerouting brake cylinder lines (create room for 3" intake)_
_OK - M12x1 Banjo to M12x1 female, 1/4" braided PTFE hose to relocate brake pressure sensor (on the way too)_
_OK - Fire extinguisher, just in case... :wink:_
_OK - Resonated center section to my Milltek catback_
_OK - Fluidampr pulley_
_OK - New OEM size Bosch MAF_
_OK - EFR 6758 High boost wastegate actuator_
_OK - Greddy Profec B Spec 2 Boost Controller_
_OK - Aircondition refill_
_OK - 2.0TFSI coilpacks and INA APX engine TFSI coilpack adapters_

*Phase2 shopping list, target ~400hp: (DONE!)*
_OK - E85 (85% ethanol) Flexfuel sensor to tell ECU ethanol percent in the tank_
_OK - Injectors Bosch EV 14 1300cc/min_
_OK - 3-5bar adjustable fuel regulator_
_OK - Vi-PEC Plug n Play ECU for 1.8T (i88 inside)_
_OK - RS4 MAF housing (Just for MOT show, MAF is not used with Vi-PEC ECU it's MAP or volumetric based_
_OK - 034 Motorsport Surge Tank_

*Phase3 shopping list, target ~500hp:*
_OK - Complete AGU big port cylinder head _
_OK - Supertech valve guides and gaskets_
_OK - SEM intake manifold_
_OK - Supertech valve springs (exhaust dual spring) and Titanium plates_
_OK - Supertech Inconel +1mm single groove exhaust valves_
_OK - Supertech coated +1mm single groove intake valves_
_OK - Non DIY valve guides/stem seals install. Needed machine work for +1mm over size and runner shaping for max flow_
_OK - S4 70mm throttle body_
_OK - IE Agressice street camshafts IECVA2_
_OK - IE cam gear + ARP bolt_
_OK - Febi / Bilstein camshaft chain and hydraulic tensioner_
_OK - Camshaft gaskets 2 pcs 32x47x10mm 038103085C _
_OK - Cylinder head valve cover gasket 058198025A_
_OK - 038105021K crank with 95,5mm stroke (stock is 86,4mm), bearings polished and balanced_
_OK - Second engine block 06A103021C_
_OK - ACL coated connecting rod bearings_
_OK - ARP main studs and nuts_
_OK - Forge baffled sump_
_OK - Febi / Bilstein oil pump_
_OK - Febi / Bilstein water pump_
_OK - Febi / Bilstein OEM oil cooler_
_OK - VHT paints for the block and valve cover_
_OK - SAI removal and needed resistors_
_OK - Gates Racing kevlar timing belt_
_OK - Fresh set of INA hydraulic lifters_
_OK - Direnza high capacity alloy radiator_
New OEM thrust washer bearings
Forge charge pipe from turbo to intercooler
NGK BKR8E spark plugs
IE stroker kit for 95.5mm crank
Riffle drilled rods 144x20mm
Tool steel writs pins with 20mm diameter
Stroker pistons CR ~9 and 83mm diameter
Block bore to 83mm
Custom exhaust: center pipe and back box
Coated main bearings
Tons of gaskets
Overbore head gasket
ARP damper bolt

I want to first try Revo Stage3 550cc file as it's cheap for me because I have the Revo Stage2 already in the car. If it doesn't work properly then a custom map. EFR6258 compressor map covers GT2860RS map, so I'm going to try to use that turbo. It would be boring to buy the million times tested "Disco Potato". I hoping for faster/similar spool and better top end compared to GT2860RS.

Oil cooler is a must (and blocking the gaps between FMIC and radiator) to get rid of the temperate issues on track. For that I ordered a Mocal oil cooler and found a nice fan to it too. Thought it could be useful when you come to pits and leave the engine running. So will be doint that too. Pics to follow...

The only part that has arrived is a stroker crank that I bought before I did my homework, that will be stored for phase3...








So not that good start for this project :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Adam-tt

Good luck  i would stick a big port inlet manifold/bigger throttle body down as phase 1 there easy to do and not as expensive plus you get good gains from the inlet


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## Gforce

I wish I was handy enough to do this sort of work myself I want big power gains but I cringe when I think of the labour costs involved


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## nate42

adam-tt said:


> Good luck  i would stick a big port inlet manifold/bigger throttle body down as phase 1 there easy to do and not as expensive plus you get good gains from the inlet


If the Revo map doesn't work and I need a custom one, then I'll look in to those too.

Spal pull type fan for oil cooler arrived, spec HERE








Vent mount that I bought awhile ago from a fellow forum member, I knew I will need it one day.


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## V6RUL

I have a set of Genesis 630 injectors up for grabs with very little mileage on them that could suit your application and will also be good for phase 2. Ask your tuner for clarification first as buying twice is horrible.
Steve


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## E3 YOB

Nate

Cool 8) Good luck with the build. I know with your attention to detail you skill you will produce something great on the track.

Another site that produces a pro street style manifold? - They look quite nicely made Nate 
Wish I had known about them before as it would have saved me some time
http://www.kkdmotorsport.com/kauppa.php?k=1270679050

I am getting hold of 10 AGU big Port heads which I will be selling shortly. Will post up details when I have photos and measurements to add and will give the option to have them ported.

It will be great having another build thread on the forum.

Frase


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## nate42

V6RUL said:


> I have a set of Genesis 630 injectors up for grabs with very little mileage on them that could suit your application and will also be good for phase 2. Ask your tuner for clarification first as buying twice is horrible.
> Steve


Has to be 550cc for now as the Revo Stage 3 file that I will try first is made for 550cc injectors.


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## nate42

frakay100 said:


> Nate
> 
> Cool 8) Good luck with the build. I know with your attention to detail you skill you will produce something great on the track.
> 
> Another site that produces a pro street style manifold - They look quite nicely made http://www.kkdmotorsport.com/kauppa.php?k=1270679050
> 
> I am getting hold of 10 AGU big Port heads which I will be selling shortly. Will post up details when I have photos and measurements to add and will give the option to have them ported.
> 
> It will be great having another build thread on the forum.
> 
> Frase


KKD has sold those manifolds all over the world and have good reputation. So that bit is well sorted.

Might be interested of those big port heads for future use. Are you stepping on Charlies toes as the official parts dealer of ******** :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## E3 YOB

Well Charlie can supply Sat Nav stands and gear knobs but I can supply you something that will give you more power :lol: :lol:

Having phoned half the world for my build I have been able to get a good deal on some items.

The engine builders and measuring things up at the moment and I will do a write up of fitting details. I will be selling brand new big (AGU exactly the same as the US AEB heads but euro version) port 1.8T heads for £495 + £10 p&p.
Anyway you'll see how my one performs when it is on the car soon :evil:

These are straight swaps and are the equivalent of porting your BAM head to an inch of its life.

Example cross section of ports:


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## Chris****

How did you find going from stage 1 to stage 2 ? And what sort of gains from stage 3? Just about to do a stage 2 revo map next week, so be nice to hear what I will be getting


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## nate42

Chris**** said:


> How did you find going from stage 1 to stage 2 ? And what sort of gains from stage 3? Just about to do a stage 2 revo map next week, so be nice to hear what I will be getting


I'd say the parts made a bigger difference than the map. When I put the DP, cat-back and FMIC (all at once) on, the top end opened up. Then went to change the software to Stage 2 and that just made things more smooth, didn't notice any extra power. Tried to measure the difference but got just 0,1s improvement on 60-160 km/h because of the map. Parts made a 1,0s difference and stage 1 map was not touched at that point! Stock to stage 1 difference was 1,5s for reference.

Tried to call a dyno shop on friday as I wan't to get the starting graph (mainly to compare spool later on).

What I've googled those stage 3 Revos with GT2860RS they have made between 300-350hp depending on the supporting mods. No idea what that EFR will do and that's what makes this interesting for me.


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## nate42

Turbo selection time...

*K04-020/023* - Stock turbo on our 225hp models
Compressor Size: 42 / 56mm
Turbine Size: 42 / 50mm

*GT2860RS* - Revo stage 3 software is designed for this
Compressor Size: 47,24 / 60mm 
Turbine Size: 42,36 / 53,85mm .62

From those EFR's I tought 6258 would be best but looking at the maps again and thinking of future use I think I go for 6758 that has a bit bigger compressor wheel.

*EFR 6258*
Compressor Size: 49,6 / 62mm
Turbine Size: ??/58mm .64

*EFR 6758*
Compressor Size: 54 / 67mm
Turbine Size: ??/58mm .64

Wheel sizes on 6258 is closer to GT2860RS but 6758 map covers GT2860RS map also pretty good...

Here GT2860RS over 6258








and GT2860RS over 6758








That 6258 would be a safe bet, but probaly too small for phase2... will 6758 boost fast enough and will the wastegate flow enough on the top end to avoid over boost...

What do you think? Should I get 6258 or 6758?


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## nate42

This is pretty interesting link
http://www.turbodriven.com/performanceturbos/matchbot/index.html
Tried that with 6758 so that I set the boost to 25PSI (1,7bar), wastegate should flow enough for that. Three wastegate canisters to choose from. Medium boost canister is max 19PSI so have to go for high boost (max 32PSI)? Let's hope those 550cc injectors and stock fuel pump can keep up on higher revs.


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## V6RUL

Go for the biggest WG possible for the fitment especially if your injectors are close to maxing out.
I have some 630s for sale.
Steve


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## jamman

V6RUL said:


> I have some 630s for sale.
> Steve


We know you've already told us twice in the same thread :roll:


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## jamman

frakay100 said:


> I will be selling brand new big (AGU exactly the same as the US AEB heads but euro version) port 1.8T heads for £495 + £10 p&p.


I want a serial number on mine Frase No.2 :wink:


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## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Go for the biggest WG possible for the fitment especially if your injectors are close to maxing out.
> I have some 630s for sale.
> Steve


Bought my injectors already, lets see how long those are enough  
Remember reading that EFR 36mm internal wastegate out-flowed 44m Tial external wastegate. These smaller EFR's come with internal 31mm wastegate (36mm valve head). It's pretty big thinking that T25 flange is 28,1 x 45mm.


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## Issam Abed

nate42 said:


> *Phase1 shopping list:*
> Clutch (looking at keeping original dual mass flywheel, Sachs has a 520nm rated kit, looking for other options...)
> EGT+A/F wideband gauge (http://www.wems.hu)
> Rods (SCAT, IE rods are out of stock)
> Custom manifold (http://www.kkdmotorsport.com)
> Turbo (EFR6258 T25-flange)
> REVO Stage3 software (made for GT2860RS with A/R 0.64 turbine) and SPS Select to alter timing and boost
> 550cc injectors (Bosch EV14)
> Stiffer engine mounts (034 mounts - track)


Maybe I can offer some assistance.

I would lose the Dual Mass flywheel (it is prone to failure anyway) and I would go with a south Bend steel flywheel + Fluidampr harmonic dampner. With that set up you hit 2 birds with 1 stone. You remove the dual mass flywheel and you remove any chance of flywheel chatter in the future with the fluidampr pulley.

Welded manifolds (regardless of where they come from) are also prone to failure. Stick with cast units.
Engine Mounts - 034 units will not last in your build unfortunately. Look into billet units.

We deal with a local company that produced an EFR6758 based T25 kit with a cast manifold. I think you will like the results:
http://www.clubseatleon.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=270


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## nate42

Issam Abed said:


> Maybe I can offer some assistance.
> 
> I would lose the Dual Mass flywheel (it is prone to failure anyway) and I would go with a south Bend steel flywheel + Fluidampr harmonic dampner. With that set up you hit 2 birds with 1 stone. You remove the dual mass flywheel and you remove any chance of flywheel chatter in the future with the fluidampr pulley.
> 
> Welded manifolds (regardless of where they come from) are also prone to failure. Stick with cast units.
> Engine Mounts - 034 units will not last in your build unfortunately. Look into billet units.
> 
> We deal with a local company that produced an EFR6758 based T25 kit with a cast manifold. I think you will like the results:
> http://www.clubseatleon.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=270


Thanks Issam your help is appreciated. The more I read about clutches the more I'm convinced in changing the dual mass flywheel to a solid steel one. Those Fluidampr pulleys are not cheap, they really make a difference?
Already ordered those 034 mounts, do you have any more info on how they brake? There might be away to avoid that. I saw that you used VF mounts on that SEAT build. I was checking those first but ordered bunch of stuff from 034 so took the mounts from there too.

We have strict MOT in Finland so I need keep the turbo hidden in the original location, I don't want to take the car apart once a year... so custom manifold is the only option. I think the bad reputation of custom made manifolds in because of cars that had way too high exhaust temps. When hot tube manifolds can't take as much stress as cast ones, so you have to make sure they can expand freely.

Tried to look that post but couldn't find any dyno graphs. Was it mapped using Motronic? *If you have some EFR 6758 dyno graphs I'd love to see those.*


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## nate42

Had a day off today so took the welded and straightened wheels to powder coating (sand blasting before that).








Picked up the Vems gauge from post








Sensors for the gauge








19 row oil cooler also arrived and the fan fits nicely


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## Grahamstt

Hi Nate 
What was it that made you go for a 19 row oil cooler, 
Are you going to fit it in the empty space where the smic was fitted

Cheers Graham


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## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Hi Nate
> What was it that made you go for a 19 row oil cooler,
> Are you going to fit it in the empty space where the smic was fitted
> 
> Cheers Graham


Went for 19 row as that was the smallest weather proof fan I could find. The plan is to take the power from radiator fans, so when they think extra cooling needed, the oil cooler fan will start too. Looking from the front the right side is used for cold air feed to air filter and this oil cooler should go to the left side. There is room where the smic was so it should fit...


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## Grahamstt

Thats where I was going to fit mine but havent removed anything yet to know for sure - I'm about to start stripping the front down as I have a lot of goodies to fit, along with a new Sachs clutch assembly

It's going to be a busy week as I have an event on Friday 9th Sept !!


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## Issam Abed

nate42 said:


> Those Fluidampr pulleys are not cheap, they really make a difference?
> Already ordered those 034 mounts, do you have any more info on how they brake? There might be away to avoid that. I saw that you used VF mounts on that SEAT build. I was checking those first but ordered bunch of stuff from 034 so took the mounts from there too.


The fluidampr pulley does make a huge difference and the only reason VF mounts were used was because the customer couldnt wait for our billet units to be completed.


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## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Thats where I was going to fit mine but havent removed anything yet to know for sure - I'm about to start stripping the front down as I have a lot of goodies to fit, along with a new Sachs clutch assembly
> 
> It's going to be a busy week as I have an event on Friday 9th Sept !!


Take some pics of the installation! Did you get the sandwich plate from Mocal too? I need to find one with thermostat and hoses also.

So you went for Sachs, keeping the OEM flywheel or the pricey full monty kit?


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## Grahamstt

I haven't bought the oil cooler yet but we have an account with think automotive who are the mocal distributors which is why I asked about your 19 row one
I will be getting the mocal sandwich plate with the thermostat tho

I've gone for the full Sachs smf kit

Will be stripping the car down tomorrow hopefully









It's ready and waiting


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## V6RUL

Here you Graham..this is my Mocal 25 row with hoses and sandwich plate..

















Steve


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## Matt B

your brakes look MASSIVE lol


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## V6RUL

Matt B said:


> your brakes look MASSIVE lol


oh, cheers..i think its more the width that looks big as the height is not as evident but i should imagine the tarox 16 pots are a little bigger again over the 10s.
Steve


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## nate42

Fired up the gauge and connected to VemsTune software. Still need to figure out how to get the RPM input to gauge, that will be useful for logging.


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## nate42

nate42 said:


> This is pretty interesting link
> http://www.turbodriven.com/performanceturbos/matchbot/index.html
> Tried that with 6758 so that I set the boost to 25PSI (1,7bar), wastegate should flow enough for that. Three wastegate canisters to choose from. Medium boost canister is max 19PSI so have to go for high boost (max 32PSI)?


This guy is wrong    
Because the N75 controls the boost I can also use the medium canister. Not all the pressure goes to the canister, it depends on N75's duty cycle, softer spring in the actuator gives smoother operation. With too hard spring in the actuator the boost hits every time you touch the gas, because N75 can't open the wastegate even with 100% duty cycle. So you could get boost even the ECU is not requesting any?

Am I getting this right?


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## nate42

Manifold flanges arrived.


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## Jurpo

6758 dyno
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...ompletes-a-1.8T-Borg-Warner-EFR-system-(PICS)


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## Issam Abed

http://www.clubseatleon.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=270

:wink:


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## nate42

We should soon get some dyno results from that Leon, nice!
Germans have their own kit in the development pipe, but I prefer DIY  
http://www.turbozentrum.de/efr-kit/

For those who don't know what this EFR hype is all about, read this:
http://www.full-race.com/articles/efrturbotechbrief.pdf
Garrett is so last season 8) 8)


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## Issam Abed

nate42 said:


> We should soon get some dyno results from that Leon, nice!
> Germans have their own kit in the development pipe, but I prefer DIY
> http://www.turbozentrum.de/efr-kit/
> 
> For those who don't know what this EFR hype is all about, read this:
> http://www.full-race.com/articles/efrturbotechbrief.pdf
> Garrett is so last season 8) 8)


who said it was there kit :wink:


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## nate42

Managed to get me a turbo, it's still in the US but in good hands


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## T3RBO

Looks nice


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## UR_TT

BW turbo.. 8)

If you need any help with the VEMS parts drop me a line, Swedish agent is a friend of mine. 
What are you aiming at tourqe and bhp?


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## Mici

Will keep an eye on this one. Nate, where in Finland are your located?

Mici


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## nate42

UR_TT said:


> BW turbo.. 8)
> 
> If you need any help with the VEMS parts drop me a line, Swedish agent is a friend of mine.
> What are you aiming at torque and bhp?


I'm not sure what kind of boost levels the software is asking from the turbo. I assume 1,4bar on the top end, that means ~350hp. Torque depends on the requested mid range boost level, should be around 450nm. Dyno day will be exciting, but a long way to go before that.

RPM input was something that I didn't understood right away where to connect it, but haven't looked into that much yet. Good to know that help is available if I get stuck with that gauge. Thanks!


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## R80RTT

UR_TT said:


> BW turbo.. 8)
> 
> If you need any help with the VEMS parts drop me a line, Swedish agent is a friend of mine.
> What are you aiming at tourqe and bhp?


Are you Andy Gray in disguise ?????


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## UR_TT

R80RTT said:


> UR_TT said:
> 
> 
> 
> BW turbo.. 8)
> 
> If you need any help with the VEMS parts drop me a line, Swedish agent is a friend of mine.
> What are you aiming at tourqe and bhp?
> 
> 
> 
> Are you Andy Gray in disguise ?????
Click to expand...

 :?:

Who is that? Don´t really know what you mean!?


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## nate42

Bosch 044 fuel pump and all the goodies needed to connect it to fuel line and car arrived.








All the bits








Everything assembled, touch of black spray to that pump and we are nice and stealth. Will install it in the engine bay, some where under charger pipe.








Flow chart

Turbo also arrived so more pictures of that.








T25, oil out and 2" boost out








2,5" intake and wastegate canister. DV and solenoid, will use N75 and Forge P007 so those will be removed.








Oil in and water cooling connectors.








T25 flange and wastegate port shaped for good flow.








DV dump gate and compressor wheel 67/54mm








Turbine wheel 58mm and wastegate 31mm


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## badger5

looks lovely..


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## nate42

I'm planning to fit 4 row LCD gauge to ash tray, yes you read right   Pics will follow 
I want to keep things stealth in the cabin and on normal driving I don't need to know my oil pressure, oil temperature, boost and fuel pressure... Found a gauge that supports 6 channels and logging, so I can add sensors if I need.

What is the best place to measure oil temperature and oil pressure? Sensors have 1/8 NPT threads and I have oil cooler if that makes any difference to measuring point.

Boost from intake manifold (t-piece to one of the connections?) and fuel pressure after additional inline fuel pump?








I take black screen with red letters that fits best to interior.


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## nate42

After some research looks like the best place to measure oil pressure and temperature is M10x1 hole in the block that is located next to dip stick. Bought an adapter that has one male M10x1 and three female 1/8 NPT connections. This way I can get both temperature and pressure from the same place. One 1/8 NPT entry needs to be blanked of course.

Boost pressure is easiest to measure from fuel pressure regulator with a t-piece.

For fuel pressure I bought a female AN6 - female 1/8 NPT - male AN6 t-piece that I can install right after the 044 pump.


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## nate42

More parts arrived:

550cc Bosch Injectors and adapters to fit stock harness:

































SCAT rods:

























Kevlar timing belt:









Engine mounts with track density rubber:









V-band stuff also arrived but it doesn't fit to that turbo, have to return those 
Have to find right type v-band flange for that turbo some where...


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## V6RUL

Looking good Nate, if your injectors are too small, give me a shout as i have some 630s going spare.
Pipewerx have some V band stuff on their shelves, i think.
Steve


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## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Looking good Nate, if your injectors are too small, give me a shout as i have some 630s going spare.
> Pipewerx have some V band stuff on their shelves, i think.
> Steve


That EFR v-band is some kind of rare v-band  034motorsport is just checking if they have the right kind. FullRace has them so will order from there if 034 comes out empty.

I keep those 630s in mind you might have already advertised them to me :lol: :lol:

Another eBay bargain for less than £100, with this I can fine tune the map: boost, timing and air fuel ratio.








New wheels are finally done, DAMN these were expensive to fix :x :x , but at least they came out looking good.


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## techfreak

love the oz's and the textured look, is looking nice! what are they 19s?


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## nate42

techfreak said:


> love the oz's and the textured look, is looking nice! what are they 19s?


I'm running pretty stiff suspension and tyres with hard side wall so went for 18x8". Actually I was trying to go 17" but couldn't fit those over my front brakes. I've learned that in racing they use as small wheels as they can fit over the brakes, in my dreams I'm a racer so I have to follow that philosophy :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I got now 18x8,5" ET32 and they are a bit too wide as I need to use 15mm spacer to clear the brakes.


----------



## nate42

V-band struggle continues got another one, wrong again.. [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif]
Borg Warner used special narrow v-band that looks to be quite hard to find, at least for me... Well I think I can make this one work. 

























Got the oil cooler sandwich plate at the same time. Does that 7mm hole flow enough to bypass the oil cooler when the engine is cold...? That thermostat is also quite simple design, just a rolled metal sheet. Is the Mocal sandwich plate any different?


----------



## nate42

All the parts for trial fitting (to define the turbo location for the manifold maker) have arrived. 3" intake hose will be a tight squeeze as LHD TT has the brake master cylinder in the way. By making the intake from many parts I can easily cut the pieces to suit and make adjustment piece by piece.

Last bend for the intake will probably be ID 76->90mm and for adjustment ring a piece from ID 80 mm - OD 90mm silicone hose. This way I can use bigger MAF housing later if I need. TT MAF is OD 80mm.










I'm starting to be in a hurry as I only got semislicks for the car and it can start snowing any day...


----------



## Jurpo

I would do that part past brake master from steel.
It's much thinner and since there is no rule that pipe must be round, can be made oval. Dent in right place might save a day.

You are not going to use EFR diverter.?
T connection Isn't ideal for diverter, will cause Maf blow back.


----------



## nate42

Jurpo said:


> I would do that part past brake master from steel.
> It's much thinner and since there is no rule that pipe must be round, can be made oval. Dent in right place might save a day.
> 
> You are not going to use EFR diverter.?
> T connection Isn't ideal for diverter, will cause Maf blow back.


No idea how's that EFR DV will perform so wanted to have that T-piece just in case. I'm thinking of starting with two DV's that EFR integrated and Forge 007p, that I have already. Forge has stiffer spring so the EFR will open first.

It will be interesting fitting the intake. I want to keep the engine bay looking as OEM as possible and keep the original filter box. Lot's of evidence around that too small intake restricts power, so wanted to go as big as possible.

Easiest thing would have been just to cut my Forge intake hose in half and fit it with a bigger tip at the turbo end. That would have been a half ass solution as that hose is quite narrow. Also I can make a few € selling it on.

What's up with your car, any projects planned?


----------



## Jurpo

nate42 said:


> Jurpo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would do that part past brake master from steel.
> It's much thinner and since there is no rule that pipe must be round, can be made oval. Dent in right place might save a day.
> 
> You are not going to use EFR diverter.?
> T connection Isn't ideal for diverter, will cause Maf blow back.
> 
> 
> 
> No idea how's that EFR DV will perform so wanted to have that T-piece just in case. I'm thinking of starting with two DV's that EFR integrated and Forge 007p, that I have already. Forge has stiffer spring so the EFR will open first.
> 
> It will be interesting fitting the intake. I want to keep the engine bay looking as OEM as possible and keep the original filter box. Lot's of evidence around that too small intake restricts power, so wanted to go as big as possible.
> 
> Easiest thing would have been just to cut my Forge intake hose in half and fit it with a bigger tip at the turbo end. That would have been a half ass solution as that hose is quite narrow. Also I can make a few € selling it on.
> 
> What's up with your car, any projects planned?
Click to expand...

Not much. I have a set of Boxter calipers and 325 discs for next summer.
H2sport needle/spherical bearing kit for wishbones is interesting.
I have one new freebie wishbone already, might make a set for summer use.
But i am not sure about harshness of those.


----------



## nate42

Car is now MOT'd and stored for winter. In March I'll rent a place for installation.









Figured out how I'm going to wire that fuel pump. I will write a post about that later and post pics.


----------



## nate42

Kazinak/Mondo was kind enough to tell me the measurements for intake take off's, so got those ordered.
For the record hole sizes for silicone intake hose:
MAF ID 80mm
N75 ID ~8mm
Exhaust gas recirculation ID ~14mm
Oil breather pipe ID ~16mm
DV ID ~25mm

Managed to found 8mm, 13mm and 16mm from http://www.viperperformance.co.uk, so ordered those.


----------



## Grahamstt

I would have thought that you wouldn't be fitting the egr and breather pipes so that the crankcase gases go through a catch tank and then vented to atmosphere.


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> I would have thought that you wouldn't be fitting the egr and breather pipes so that the crankcase gases go through a catch tank and then vented to atmosphere.


I was reading those catch tank solutions here, but I don't see myself emptying that catch tank regulary... Also I don't quite see what is wrong with Audi solution?

I'll keep the EGR for now, one less variable to think about. Might remove it later tought, not all at once as I need to have something to do with the car for the years to come :lol: :lol: :lol:

You got that Sasch Racing clutch and flywheel in the end if I remember right? I'm thinking of getting that kit too as it seems to be the only kit that is quite hard to find any bad reviews. How would you rate it? Do you have the ~7kg flywheel? Is it noisy at idle?


----------



## V6RUL

Provent will allow auto oil return back to the sump instead of the engine eating itself.
See my build thread for info.
Steve


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Provent will allow auto oil return back to the sump instead of the engine eating itself.
> See my build thread for info.
> Steve


Thanks Steve, that looks like smart product. It has built in safety and pressure regulator valve! Pretty big tough, if I find a good place in the engine bay I might throw one of those in. Check valve in the drain line could be a smart move to make sure that oil never goes from pan to filter. Where did you get yours? Do they have an online shop?


----------



## V6RUL

nate42 said:


> V6RUL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Provent will allow auto oil return back to the sump instead of the engine eating itself.
> See my build thread for info.
> Steve
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Steve, that looks like smart product. It has built in safety and pressure regulator valve! Pretty big tough, if I find a good place in the engine bay I might throw one of those in. Check valve in the drain line could be a smart move to make sure that oil never goes from pan to filter. Where did you get yours? Do they have an online shop?
Click to expand...

I got it from Filter serve in Walsall 01922 720561 ask for Scott Shambley and they have a trade counter to pick it up from or they will post it out.
I have a 200 series but i think the 1.8 will only need a 100 or 150 series which are smaller units and cheaper. The check valve has to be ordered as an option.
Steve


----------



## nate42

Here is my vision of the fuel pump installation. I believe that this is pretty common way to do this on TT, S3, Cupra and similar 1.8T cars with fuel return line. The benefit is that the additional pump starts and stops just when the ECU wants so all the safety features work also on the new pump.








Drawing of fuel line on the left and wiring on the right








Close up for OEM replacement fuel pump relay that I will use for additional fuel pump (doesn't have to be just this type relay).








Wiring diagram around J17 relay


----------



## Jurpo

You could fit hobbs switch for 044 activation.
Saves ears and amps.


----------



## nate42

Jurpo said:


> You could fit hobbs switch for 044 activation.
> Saves ears and amps.


So you mean I could activate the inline fuel pump based on boost pressure? In this case a line around the secondary fuel pump with one way valve is needed am I right? I'm just wondering how much delay there is , going on and off the throttle on lower gears it should be pretty fast. Maybe additional hobbs bypass switch would be a smart thing to do to keep the pump always on for track days.

Thanks for the tip!! Have to do some reading on this subject [smiley=book2.gif] Any good links? I'm guessing the activation pressure should be quite low, something like 0,5 bar to make sure the pump is there when you need it?


----------



## Jurpo

044 passes fuel off state. Continous running for track sounds like a good idea.
Pretty low boost activation is right thing to do.


----------



## nate42

Ordered some Hobbs switches, had to buy three but the price was good, so in case someone needs one send me PM!
Chose type 76575 , more info here http://content.honeywell.com/sensing/hss/hobbscorp/P3_6.pdf
Normal state is open and it will close when the boost rises to 0,3 bar or above. This should keep the additional fuel pump in rest when on traffic lights and cruising. 








And the changes to wiring picture









*NOTE: Bosch 044 pump broke down later. I think the so many start stop cycles were too much for it picture later in the thread. So Hobbs switch not recommended otherwise this connection works nicely*


----------



## Matt B

http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?ma ... cts_id=412


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=412


Thanks. I saw that earlier but couldn't figure out how it does the job (is the pump ECU or ignition switch position controlled). So decided to rather do it the way I like   Also where is the challenge, that is too easy :wink:


----------



## Matt B

nate42 said:


> Matt B said:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=412
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I saw that earlier but couldn't figure out how it does the job (is the pump ECU or ignition switch position controlled). So decided to rather do it the way I like   Also where is the challenge, that is too easy :wink:
Click to expand...

I have this harness. Mine was originally wired to take the trigger for the relay from the redundant N75 power supply, though a dry joint managed to completely fry half part of the car's harness. I have rewired the trigger for the new fuel pump relay directly by splicing from the back of fuse 34 and it runs fine. The power to the pump is then directly from the battery and the relay is mounted next to the front near side headlight.


----------



## Jurpo

If secondary air pump is not used..


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Matt B said:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=412
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I saw that earlier but couldn't figure out how it does the job (is the pump ECU or ignition switch position controlled). So decided to rather do it the way I like   Also where is the challenge, that is too easy :wink:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have this harness. Mine was originally wired to take the trigger for the relay from the redundant N75 power supply, though a dry joint managed to completely fry half part of the car's harness. I have rewired the trigger for the new fuel pump relay directly by splicing from the back of fuse 34 and it runs fine. The power to the pump is then directly from the battery and the relay is mounted next to the front near side headlight.
Click to expand...

I was also thinking that you have to take the power straight from the battery as that pump can eat a lot of amps. Fuse is added to keep things safe and not to fry the wires or the pump. I'm pretty confident with my solution, will see how it goes


----------



## nate42

Last bits for the intake arrived
















Making the intake from so many pieces helps to adjust it to a right shape. You can adjust the angles from every connection.









Last bend is ID 90mm. OD 90mm ID 80mm silicone ring is used to fit the stock MAF. Decided to put a bigger bend in case I need to later go for a bigger MAF.

Hose joiners look really nice and are well made. Only down side on those is the price... a bit expensive. I can understand that as they are machined in small series.


----------



## E3 YOB

Like the TIP matey, looks good.

You guys are thinking a lot about the fuel pump. I just selected a fused ignition circuit and wired it on and uprated the fuse to handle.


----------



## nate42

frakay100 said:


> Like the TIP matey, looks good.
> 
> You guys are thinking a lot about the fuel pump. I just selected a fused ignition circuit and wired it on and uprated the fuse to handle.


Thanks!

Yep too much thinking and too little action :lol: :lol: :lol: I just want to make sure that if I crash the fuel pump stops and doesn't pump fuel to engine bay when I'm unconscious behind the wheel.

*Tiny update:*

Pressure controlled switches arrived. *Got two extra ones in case some one needs PM me*. 4 PSI and default state open circuit.









Bought a complete low mileage AGU head. Real bargain at £99. Planning to rebuild it with quality parts (valves, cams)in phase3, so for now I'll just clean it when it arrives and store for future use.

Custom ashtray gauge has been ready for a while, but some problems with red screens (pixels dying). I'm waiting for a new batch of red screens to arrive. Pics to follow...


----------



## nate42

*Examination of the large port AGU head 058 103 373 A*

I won't put this head to the car at this point as when I do I want it to be as good as it can be (aggressive cams, inconel valves etc). So just general info / pics of big port head in case someone is planning a swap.

AGU and AEB are the engine codes for heads that have big intake and exhaust (APX/BAM has same size) ports.
Exhaust 36mm
















Intake width ~56mm

















Intake valves look like new, exhaust valves are washed with exhaust gasses all the time so they don't look as good. Exhaust valves are something that could be smart to upgrade, but those intake valves look so good after 85k miles that I'm pretty sure they can take a lot more power.

Valve cover opened the head looked like this








Removed cams








Removed hydraulic lifters and one exhaust valve for closer examination
On the left the valve is removed and stem seal is visible








Exhaust valve, stock valves on 1.8T engines are sodium filled. Sodium melts around the same temperature as water boils, so it is liquid when the engine is running. I believe the purpose is to remove the heat more efficiently from the valve tip as the liquid sodium moves inside the valve.









*Is there a good tool or some tricks to remove valves from 1.8T 20v head? Basic valve removal tool that i bought doesn't work! I want to get the valves out so that I can clean the head properly!*

I was surprised how good condition a 85k miles head can be. Hydraulic lifters and cams where smooth and no showed no wear at all. I'd say the only thing that needs fixing is to get rid of all that carbon build and check the condition of exhaust valves. It's probably smart to replace all stem seals also.


----------



## Grahamstt

Hi Nate
Very interesting, something I've always considered but been waiting til I have to remove the head for whatever reason
Are the valves the same size as the small port head 
and what you are saying I think is that the exhaust port is the same as APX BAM engines - is that correct?

It would be interesting to see what the differences would be on a flow bench between a gas flowed std head as opposed to the large port in std form, probably similar in cost either way so would be a good comparison.


----------



## nate42

We have these lovely emission systems VVT/EGR/SAI/EVAP

Here is a picture of AGU head








Here is a picture (stolen from VWVortex good thread) head with SAI









So if I on day want to change my APX head to AGU I have to remove SAI also.

*SAI* (secondary air injection) is used to pump air to exhaust. This helps to burn all the unburnt fuel and catalytic converter to work properly.

*EVAP* (evaporative emission control) connects to intake and intake manifold, so changing a head doesn't interfere that. I've read that without EVAP it is hard to pass the emission test.

*VVT* (variable valve timing) is found only BAM. VVT parts can be swapped to AGU/AEB head.

*EGR* (exhaust gas recycling) TT doesn't have EGR (thank God!)


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Hi Nate
> Very interesting, something I've always considered but been waiting til I have to remove the head for whatever reason
> Are the valves the same size as the small port head
> and what you are saying I think is that the exhaust port is the same as APX BAM engines - is that correct?
> 
> It would be interesting to see what the differences would be on a flow bench between a gas flowed std head as opposed to the large port in std form, probably similar in cost either way so would be a good comparison.


The valves are same size on all heads 30mm exhaust valve and 27mm intake valve.
Yes the exhaust port is just the same.
I remember seeing a comparison dyno between small and large port head. Small port gave little more low end power and the main difference was after 5000rpm where large port shined. I think it was a big turbo setup tough. I think the benefits of big port head are best seen in +400hp setups.


----------



## TT SMITHY

Hi nate some good stuff there i have an AGU head for my apx what im hoping to get on in the next couple of months unfortunately i didn't find out the milage on mine but some advice i was given was this

"Genarally speaking I get the exhaust guides changed and renew the valve stem seals when doing a head swap... the exhaust guides are the ones that wear the most from a fairly low mileage too... worth getting them done.."

"I then generally swap the cams and tensioner over as I think the AGU has a single window cam position trigger and would imagine yours maybe a 2 window type..."


----------



## nate42

What I can comment to that "single window cam position trigger" is that it had a cam position sensor with one sensor inside and in the end of the camshaft there were four flaps. So the sensor will get 4 pulses per 360 degrees.

I'd change most of the parts from the working head as those are OK for sure, just examine the head for cracks. Haven't removed valve guides or stem seals so can't comment how easy it is. I'm still struggling to get the valves out ... Might have to do some kind of tool for that [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif]

Tried this one but you can get only four (two on both ends) exhaust valves out with it.


----------



## E3 YOB

Liking it Nate - Will be interesting seeing how you get along with doing the headwork yourself 8)


----------



## nate42

Some progress with stripping the head. For the record the exhaust valve plate is ~28mm and intake valve plate is ~20mm. Exhaust valve face 30mm and intake 27mm. Shaft is 6mm on both.

Made my own tool for removing the valves. 1" pipe is perfect for exhaust valves and 3/4" for intake valves, I cut windows on both side of the pipe. Small magnetic head screw driver is really handy for removing locking washers.








Then you need a pretty big clamp and tape a socket to another end, pick a suitable size for the valve head.
Better to tape the metal so that you don't scratch anything. Plastic pipe would probably work too if you make just one window to it...








Tighten the tool against the valve spring retainer so that the locking washer is exposed.








Remove with magnetic screwdriver or some other tool.
















Intake valve and bits.








All the valves out!








Little dirty still, sprayed with engine cleaner and left for an hour to almost boiling water. That carbon really sticks there. I was thinking to make some citrus acid and soak in there to get rid of the rest of the dirt. That would also remove all corrosion looking stuff from water channels.

On the next episode removing valve guides and stem seals :lol: :lol:

Or not, found insturctions on removing valve guides and the safest way to do it is with hydraulic press. Here are the insturctions I found. So no point on doing that now, just final cleaning, protective grease and storage.

*Valve Guides, Replacing*
Special tools and workshop equipment required
punch -VW411-
reamer -3120- (7mm) and cutting fluid
driver -3360-
press-in pad -3361-
Removing
Clean cylinder head and check.

Cylinder heads with valve seats that cannot be refaced or cylinder heads that have been resurfaced to the minimum dimension are not suited for valve guide replacement.

- Insert press-in pad -3361- as follows:
- Install mounting pins for cylinder head bolt holes -A- into threaded hole position -2- and -3-.
- Install pin -B- into relevant hole for valve angle.
Outer intake valves: 21.5°
Center intake valve: 15°
Exhaust valves: 20°

Using driver -3360-, press out worn valve guides as follows:
Valve guide without collar: from camshaft side
Valve guide with collar (replacement valve guide): from combustion chamber side
Installing

- Using driver -3360-, press new, oiled valve guides from camshaft side to collar into cold cylinder head.

After valve guide with collar is seated, insertion pressure may not exceed 10kN (2248 lbs = approx 1.0t), as collar may break off.
- Using reamer -3363-, 7 mm, ream valve guide. Use cutting fluid.
- Reface valve seats
- Replace valve stem oil seals

Valves must not be refaced by cutting or grinding.
Only hand lapping is permitted.

Sodium-filled exhaust valves must not be scrapped without first being properly treated.
The valves must be cut open using a hacksaw, by hand, between the valve head and the middle of the stem.
The valves must not come into any contact with water while being cut.
After cutting open the valves, throw not more than 10 at a time into a bucket of water and step back. A sudden chemical reaction will occur during which the sodium filling is consumed.
Valves that have been treated in this way can be disposed of as normal waste.


----------



## nate42

Tried to clean the old exhaust valves as I don't have anything else to do...
Left 24h in citric acid, middle oven cleaner and right different soaps and degreasers 

















Citric acid bath is the way to do it, really good stuff to remove rust and carbon. I used 5% acid, here you can get a bag 50g bag for few euros in pharmacy.

Ordered some OEM parts that I think I'll need:
1x 058198025A Valve cover gasket
1x 058103383Q Head gasket
1x 058253039L Exhaust manifold gasket (engine side)
1x 8L9253115A Turbo DP gasket

New engine mount bolts:
4x N90596906 
4x N10209605 
2x N10155906

New flywheel bolts:
6x N90665001


----------



## nate42

Some pics for latest parts:








OEM Valve cover, DP to self-made adapter, head and exhaust manifold gaskets








OEM Engine mount and flywheel (dark) bolts








Cosworth T25 gaskets, turbo to exhaust manifold). bought two just in case, only one needed.

Clutch, pressure plate, flywheel and releasing bearing are also on the way. I post some pics when they arrive.

Time goes slowly at the moment I want to get cracking already!


----------



## Diveratt

Hi Nate.
On the cleaning front it may be worth investing in a small ultrasonic cleaning bath great for getting cack off those small parts


----------



## nate42

Diveratt said:


> Hi Nate.
> On the cleaning front it may be worth investing in a small ultrasonic cleaning bath great for getting cack off those small parts


I was looking those and there are really cheap ones and then expensive ones, so I'm guessing those cheap ones are rubbish? I think I have one at work have to give it a try next time.

Some pics of clutch and custom ash tray gauge.


----------



## TT SMITHY

Hi nate nice little gauge there where did you get that ? at the end of this month my AGU head is going for a skim complete strip down clean for £100 + any further parts needed what seems a very good price  also i know i have mentioned before about about would i need to swap the cams what i will probably do anyway but recently searched and found out AGU and APX intake cam have the same part number so it may be possible to drop it straight in with no swap ?


----------



## Matt B

Whats the details of the clutch Nate? My helix is too notchy and I am considering changing but it all depends on how long I will keep the car for.


----------



## nate42

TT SMITHY said:


> Hi nate nice little gauge there where did you get that ? at the end of this month my AGU head is going for a skim complete strip down clean for £100 + any further parts needed what seems a very good price  also i know i have mentioned before about about would i need to swap the cams what i will probably do anyway but recently searched and found out AGU and APX intake cam have the same part number so it may be possible to drop it straight in with no swap ?


To my knowledge AGU and APX/BAM cams are the same, so yes should be a straight swap. If you have BAM engine you have to move VVT stuff from your BAM head to that AGU head. If you are in some point going for over 400hp you might benefit from more aggressive cams. There is German company dbilas that can machine the existing cams in a reasonable price, check their web page. I think V6RUL (Steve) mentioned in some thread that there is also UK company that can do it.

That £100 IS a very good price for head refurbish!!

That gauge is from http://www.zada-tech.com


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> Whats the details of the clutch Nate? My helix is too notchy and I am considering changing but it all depends on how long I will keep the car for.


Did a lot of research on clutches and this Sachs Racing unit seemed to get good reviews everywhere. If you want to keep the dual mass flywheel that is also possible. Two clutch plates to choose from organic and sinter, see Hollys build thread she went for sinter plate with dual mass flywheel. I decided to go for organic plate as I need to do lot of parking. Many clutch kits use painted OEM spring plate, but this is a stronger unit. Best price in EU I found from http://www.ccc-motorsport.de/ part number for the kit in first post.


----------



## nate42

Gearbox is coming out anyway so this got me thinking that should I drop LSD in there at the same time, would be stupid not to?  

What are the benefits, maybe a fast reminder of TT's AWD layout is in place. This is not a pic of TT but same kind of Haldex anyway.








Picture of TT gearbox









Because of the layout REAR AXLE NEVER ROTATES FASTER THAN THE FRONT AXLE, that fact summarizes the problem pretty nicely. To have wheel spin in the rear axle you must have wheel spin in the front axle. Rear wheel can't spin so that front wheels have traction.

Even more strangely if we look at this picture








The above statement should be rephrased to rear axle never rotates faster than the right side drive shaft. I think someone who has actually opened the gearbox can confirm how the take off is implemented. As if the above is true it would mean that left front wheel in the air and our AWD machines are not going anywhere [smiley=bigcry.gif] I have to say the more I investigate the less impress I am of this Haldex. The rear Haldex clutch is just the tip of the iceberg, many of us have fixed it lazy operation with Blue or Orange controller. Those have been discussed a lot on this forum.

As long as there is no wheel spin all the above doesn't matter. The thing is that you don't have to go that much up on power to get those front wheel to spin. Remapped TT, wet asphalt, floor it and the fronts are fighting for grip. With LSD you can put more power to the ground before you get wheel spin and the real benefits are gained when the wheels are spinning as the power goes where the traction is and doesn't escape where it gets out the easiest (as it is the case with the open diff).

Please tell I'm all wrong as otherwise I've run out of excuses of getting a front LSD?


----------



## Grahamstt

Very interesting stuff Nate

I'm just taking my box out so I'll have to investigate this. Although I've never experienced the front left wheel spinning up on it's own and the rear always cuts in when some front traction is lost.


----------



## nate42

I think this could be tested jacking left front wheel in the air and looking if the shaft to rear wheels rotate. I'd go and do that right away but car is in the storage. Found some pictures inside the gear box:

































That open differential gives the same amount of torque to both sides on all occasions. Looking those pics it sure looks like the 50:50 torque split is not between axles but more like front left wheel vs. the right + back axle.

I'm just puzzled that how can it work as good as it does or am I just getting this all wrong? I'd like to know what is the master idea behind the design. The answer is probably that most of the time all the wheels are on the ground and not spinnig, so all this doesn't matter :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Rosso TT

Hi Nate, you're quite wrong there.
I had my gearbox all apart about 3 years ago due to a broken in half selector fork.
I did fit a peloquin TBD and that wasn't a walk in the park. had to shim the diff.
The transfer case is connected to the housing of the diff through a series of splines, so it gets all the torque that comes from the crown wheel attached to the diff and not from the RHS drive shaft.
The haldex system support 50:50 split, athough i believe this statement is incorrect, more like fulltime FWD and part time up to AWD.
I'm toying with the idea on fitting a blanking plate between my stock haldex controller and the box, think is like having the halex competition.
Someone want to try first?


----------



## nate42

Rosso TT said:


> Hi Nate, you're quite wrong there.
> I had my gearbox all apart about 3 years ago due to a broken in half selector fork.
> I did fit a peloquin TBD and that wasn't a walk in the park. had to shim the diff.
> The transfer case is connected to the housing of the diff through a series of splines, so it gets all the torque that comes from the crown wheel attached to the diff and not from the RHS drive shaft.
> The haldex system support 50:50 split, athough i believe this statement is incorrect, more like fulltime FWD and part time up to AWD.
> I'm toying with the idea on fitting a blanking plate between my stock haldex controller and the box, think is like having the halex competition.
> Someone want to try first?


*Thank God I was wrong!* So the long shaft [23] goes trough the take off piece to the differential? So there is a shaft inside of a hollow shaft? You don't happen to have any pics?

I was really thinking that Haldex setup can't be that stupid, statement of the axles rotating speeds is still valid though.

If you machine a solid piece on the place of haldex clutch you will get binding when turning as you are forcing the axels to rotate at the same speed. Removing the front drive shafts at the same time would give you RWD   Probably the parts can't take the power. I think I read some where that couple of R32's were modded RWD for Fast n Furios movies.

ARP head bolts arrived


----------



## Rosso TT

nate42 said:


> :


If you follow the long shaft in the diagram you'll see it goes through the bevel gear.


----------



## nate42

Ok, so I had almost two days to work on a car.









The goal was to get the turbo and exhaust manifold from the car. Couldn't get the head of because I didn't have right kind of tool to get the head bolts off :evil: :evil: . New ARP bolts have triple square so I thought those in the car are the same. Of course they weren't, they look like this








Well I still found things to do as taking the harness off, fluids out (coolant, oil, AC) and taking the front apart offered enough challeges.

That K04 is much shorter than I thought, measured it (still behing the engine) ~21cm from DP flange to intake. That is bad news as I thought it is 29cm long that info was from this picture








Lesson learned, never trust the Internet :lol: Don't remeber where I got that picture but right now I don't trust those measurements.
Well when I get the head off I can decide what to do, probably I have to make a new downpipe too or modify the existing one.

Turbo shaft had a bit of play and oil in the intake just before the turbo. So a good time for an upgrade. Remap/winter/trackdays don't know what is the reason for turbo giving up, car only has 50 thousand miles.

Additional oil pump has in my opnion two possible places.








There or other place is to put in on a battery box as I have some space there.

So plenty of work still to do and I have no idea where I find the time, joys of family life. I hope I get this finished before the winter comes again


----------



## Grahamstt

I take it you mean additional fuel pump Nate -- I've ordered a bosch 044 (I think yours is as well?) so would be interested to see where you locate it.
How are you going to fit the fuel pipe to the rail - will the fitting need uprating to handle the extra pressure and flow?


----------



## V6RUL

Mine is fitted on top of the O/S chassis leg.
Steve


----------



## L33JSA

Bosch 044......excellent choice guys!

However pressure is only going to increase slightly dependant upon what boost you decide to run and its this that will dictate the fittings you decide to use rather than flow.Even OE pipe sizing is big enough to flow enough for some serious power.


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Mine is fitted on top of the O/S chassis leg.
> Steve


That could work if I make a bracket so that those AC hoses still have room to be there, but I think my FMIC pipes take that space...











Grahamstt said:


> I take it you mean additional fuel pump Nate -- I've ordered a bosch 044 (I think yours is as well?) so would be interested to see where you locate it.
> How are you going to fit the fuel pipe to the rail - will the fitting need uprating to handle the extra pressure and flow?


Yes additional fuel pump not oil pump and I went for 044. It is there to make sure the pressure stays solid, not so much for raising the fuel rail pressure. Fuel rail pressure is your fuel pressure regulator rate + current boost pressure. I'll use 3 bar FPR and won't go over 2 bar of boost so there is never more than 5 bar of pressure, to get the idea here the tap water has around 4 bar pressure. That means that no special fitting are needed (they want to sell you the expensive and fancy bits), even Audi used just a hose clip to connect the hose to fuel rail.

I try to find few hours on the weekend to get the head away from the engine. Ordered a couple of special tools, I hope they arrive before weekend and couldn't resist this kit on a local tool store.


----------



## V6RUL

You can just see my 044 on the chasis leg..








i dont run a FMIC, i run a AWIC setup.
Steve


----------



## nate42

Thanks for the pic. Already copied that oil cooler location of yours, will put mine in the same spot.  I got my intake feed on the other corner.


----------



## V6RUL

nate42 said:


> Thanks for the pic. Already copied that oil cooler location of yours, will put mine in the same spot.  I got my intake feed on the other corner.


I have done evap delete to create a little more space as well.
Steve


----------



## John_tt

Congratulations about your project! I can see that you give attention to detail and that's the basis of high quality tuning. 
I have an Audi TT with an EFR 6758 turbo as well! You will be amassed by how what this turbo can perform. :!: 
At the moment with safe settings I've seen 420 crank hp in a Maha dyno, with 1.8bar overboost and 1.65bar constant. It also spools really well but about 300-400 rpm higher than the EFR 6258 which spools almost like the stock K04-023...it's insane!

I wish you the best with your project!

John


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Congratulations about your project! I can see that you give attention to detail and that's the basis of high quality tuning.
> I have an Audi TT with an EFR 6758 turbo as well! You will be amassed by how what this turbo can perform. :!:
> At the moment with safe settings I've seen 420 crank hp in a Maha dyno, with 1.8bar overboost and 1.65bar constant. It also spools really well but about 300-400 rpm higher than the EFR 6258 which spools almost like the stock K04-023...it's insane!
> 
> I wish you the best with your project!
> 
> John


That is good news John! May I ask if you have early APX engine or later BAM version and what software/injectors combo you are using? Should get some more tools on the post on Monday, so lets hope I get the engine apart soon.


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> That is good news John! May I ask if you have early APX engine or later BAM version and what software/injectors combo you are using? Should get some more tools on the post on Monday, so lets hope I get the engine apart soon.


Hello Nate.
Of course you can ask me whatever you want! I hope I have some time soon and describe the entire project.
The engine is the BAM version and the injectors are the Siemens Deka 630cc. The software is custom made by Dyno Exelixis -Mike Paridis, is the programmer of EVOMS USA. The program has been made in Athens-Greece on the dyno. 
Some more quick details...
-I used a second in line fuel pump- Walbro 255 and kept the oem intank one.
-also used TFSI coil packs not hitachi and Bosch F5dpor sparks
-Greddy boost controller- I didn't use the efr N75 valve
-Full 76mm exhaust with HJS 100cpi catalyst
-...

Have in mind that you have to make an adapter if you will use the internal wastegate of the efr because it wont be fitted otherwise.


----------



## ttnotter1

Great thread bud [smiley=thumbsup.gif] . I'm hoping i can afford to be this thorough with my build lol


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Have in mind that you have to make an adapter if you will use the internal wastegate of the efr because it wont be fitted otherwise.


Yes I will use the internal wastegate, you mean the wastegate canister? Mine has it fitted. Did you use the integrated DV. My plan is to use that too but also leave the stock location DV in place and use stiff spring on it. So it's like a backup...


----------



## nate42

Bolts used in VAG 1.8 heads. My APX looks like VAG Ribe and replacement ARP's are XZN.








From left to right. Torx T-55, Ribe 10mm, VAG Ribe, Tripple square/XZN 10mm


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> Yes I will use the internal wastegate, you mean the wastegate canister? Mine has it fitted. Did you use the integrated DV. My plan is to use that too but also leave the stock location DV in place and use stiff spring on it. So it's like a backup...


Please take a look at the photo attached to see what I mean about the adapter. 
Yes I am using the integrated DV, it works ok but when the turbo is hot sometimes you can hear that it doesn't seal very well because of the plastic component. I want to check using 2 DV as well, the intagrated one and an aftermarket with stronger spring...maybe I will check it out in the future. 
You can also use a Forge DV as a replacement of the integrated DV...is the one used for Porsche 996 turbo by forge. 8)


----------



## nate42

You mean 997 OEM DV replacement as it looks like this








And that looks like it could fit straight on. That is really good info. I have Forge 007P at the moment as a DV and that is the one I'll keep also. I just need to figure how to block the integreated DV if it starts to give me trouble.








I think the easies way is to open it, take the spring away and put some washers between the cover and piston. I hope it works as it will be tricky to work with once the turbo is installed.

I'm going to get underslung manifold made so my turbo will be other way round, so I might get away without a extra bracket. Will see...


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> You mean 997 OEM DV replacement as it looks like this


Yes thats the one!  Here is a photo of it fitted on the EFR turbo. 









If the integrated DV starts to trouble you, you can block it by putting a metal piece to replace the spring. I believe that you can also find aftermarket kits for this purpose as well. My opinion is to keep the integrated DV, if there is any problem use the Forge one with the 007 you already have especially if it is fitted close to the throttle body.

Something else you have to check is the Wastegate canister, if it has the medium spring you won't be able to have more than 1.4-1.5 bar of constant pressure. If you need more you should have the high boost one. 
I am trying to give as many information as I can and think in order to avoid wasting time and money by searching like I did.


----------



## paul-murphys

i am also buillding a efr6758 on a seat leon cupra r here is my build

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthr ... 86&page=32

im wanting around safe 450 BHP from my turbo but i also have a sem inlet and water methnol
are you going to stick with the medium actuator i have seen treadstone have some items but they havnt emailed me back yet, 
im wanting to run 26 psi is this not achievable on the medium actuator and is it not ok to use the n75?


----------



## Grahamstt

I've got to say I love the look of the efr turbos

I'm not changing the bottom end on mine so I will be looking for a good hybrid rather than a big turbo but I'm well jealous when I see these pics


----------



## paul-murphys

Grahamstt said:


> I've got to say I love the look of the efr turbos
> 
> I'm not changing the bottom end on mine so I will be looking for a good hybrid rather than a big turbo but I'm well jealous when I see these pics


i have used hybrid before had mine at 330bhp but used standard manifold, relentless is meant to be really good gains

cant wait to get my efr complete, love looking at what other people with the same people have achieved, treadstone performance do a few upgrade parts for the efr6758 which is also a bonus


----------



## Grahamstt

What hybrid did you have? -- I have a new ex. man to use which is another deciding factor to using hybrid or I will have to change that as well


----------



## John_tt

paul-murphys said:


> i am also buillding a efr6758 on a seat leon cupra r here is my build
> 
> http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthr ... 86&page=32
> 
> im wanting around safe 450 BHP from my turbo but i also have a sem inlet and water methnol
> are you going to stick with the medium actuator i have seen treadstone have some items but they havnt emailed me back yet,
> im wanting to run 26 psi is this not achievable on the medium actuator and is it not ok to use the n75?


Good luck with your project! Of course it will produce 450 crank hp with water-methanol, I believe under 2.0bar of pressure depending on the exhaust if it is decat or not. You have to use the high boost wastegate spring for sure. Mine with catalytic converter and very high IAT temps (68 oC- my intercooler is small for this setup) produced 420 crank hp at 1.65bar constant pressure. A skoda Octavia I know with the EFR6758 with water methanol produced about 470 crank hp at 2.2bar constant pressure.
450ps is my goal too!  
About the efr N75 valve I didn't use it because I already had the Greddy profec bc. A friend of mine with an Ope GT uses it and it works just fine.

ps.we have the same exhaust manifold. 8)


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Something else you have to check is the Wastegate canister, if it has the medium spring you won't be able to have more than 1.4-1.5 bar of constant pressure. If you need more you should have the high boost one.
> I am trying to give as many information as I can and think in order to avoid wasting time and money by searching like I did.


Thanks again!! I was wondering earlier on this thread about the wastegate canister and I tried to order my turbo with high boost canister but at that moment they didn't have any. Turbo was just realeased and all of them were shipped out with medium canister. At this point 1.4-1.5 bar will probably be enough for me, that gives close to 400hp. I will use N75 to control it.

Is the boost pressure and exhaust gas pressure in straight correlation, or why doesn't the wastegate stay shut in higher boost levels?

I think I'll order high boost canister also just in case, I know I will need it one day anyway


----------



## nate42

paul-murphys said:


> i am also buillding a efr6758 on a seat leon cupra r here is my build
> 
> http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthr ... 86&page=32
> 
> im wanting around safe 450 BHP from my turbo but i also have a sem inlet and water methnol
> are you going to stick with the medium actuator i have seen treadstone have some items but they havnt emailed me back yet,
> im wanting to run 26 psi is this not achievable on the medium actuator and is it not ok to use the n75?


Nice to see more people on the '1.8T + EFR' wagon 

That engine mount disaster in your thread didn't look good at all. Is that common thing to happen? I know there are lots of aftermarket engine mounts around, but I already bought new stock ones with stiffer rubber from 034 Motorsport. Maybe I can weld some reinforcements to them, I have to see...


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> At this point 1.4-1.5 bar will probably be enough for me, that gives close to 400hp. I will use N75 to control it.
> 
> Is the boost pressure and exhaust gas pressure in straight correlation, or why doesn't the wastegate stay shut in higher boost levels?


I believe that it will produce 400hp with the medium canister, I think mine made 340hp at 1.0bar pressure.
There's no need to buy it now, check the medium canister first and if it can't keep the pressure you need change it.
About the w/g canister...the spring tension is calculated in detail so they keep a certain mechanical pressure to the turbo when boosting in case there is no N75 or boost controller attached. That pressure can be higher through the N75 or b/c because the canister gets pressure from the top supporting the spring. With the med boost canister the mechanical pressure was 0.4-0.45bar and with the high boost 0.90bar.


----------



## paul-murphys

John_tt said:


> paul-murphys said:
> 
> 
> 
> i am also buillding a efr6758 on a seat leon cupra r here is my build
> 
> http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthr ... 86&page=32
> 
> im wanting around safe 450 BHP from my turbo but i also have a sem inlet and water methnol
> are you going to stick with the medium actuator i have seen treadstone have some items but they havnt emailed me back yet,
> im wanting to run 26 psi is this not achievable on the medium actuator and is it not ok to use the n75?
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck with your project! Of course it will produce 450 crank hp with water-methanol, I believe under 2.0bar of pressure depending on the exhaust if it is decat or not. You have to use the high boost wastegate spring for sure. Mine with catalytic converter and very high IAT temps (68 oC- my intercooler is small for this setup) produced 420 crank hp at 1.65bar constant pressure. A skoda Octavia I know with the EFR6758 with water methanol produced about 470 crank hp at 2.2bar constant pressure.
> 450ps is my goal too!
> About the efr N75 valve I didn't use it because I already had the Greddy profec bc. A friend of mine with an Ope GT uses it and it works just fine.
> 
> ps.we have the same exhaust manifold. 8)
Click to expand...

cheers mate  im hoping the sem inlet to help too  they turbo is awesome and not sure if im going to be one of 1st people in uk to use it  but i also run nos  what you think this turbo will prodice max with the high canister? and i have bog forge fmic for lowering the inlet, i have noticed with meth can abuse car then when get home open bonnet and the inlet manifolds so cold to touch, would defo recomend using methanol if you dont have it, what you done with the nipple on the turbo have you blocked it off?

im using a 3" downpipe and decat and i use http://www.injectordynamics.com/ID725.html for fueling


----------



## paul-murphys

nate42 said:


> paul-murphys said:
> 
> 
> 
> i am also buillding a efr6758 on a seat leon cupra r here is my build
> 
> http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthr ... 86&page=32
> 
> im wanting around safe 450 BHP from my turbo but i also have a sem inlet and water methnol
> are you going to stick with the medium actuator i have seen treadstone have some items but they havnt emailed me back yet,
> im wanting to run 26 psi is this not achievable on the medium actuator and is it not ok to use the n75?
> 
> 
> 
> Nice to see more people on the '1.8T + EFR' wagon
> 
> That engine mount disaster in your thread didn't look good at all. Is that common thing to happen? I know there are lots of aftermarket engine mounts around, but I already bought new stock ones with stiffer rubber from 034 Motorsport. Maybe I can weld some reinforcements to them, I have to see...
Click to expand...

hi the engine mount was uprated rubber but the mount its self is the same as an original one, i have these now

http://blackforestindustries.com/blog/2 ... on-mounts/

i dont know about reinforcing the uprated ones, maybe a bar welded over them might help  what power you wanting ive read that people get 500 out the turbo in the usa, you think this is true?


----------



## John_tt

paul-murphys said:


> John_tt said:
> 
> 
> 
> cheers mate  im hoping the sem inlet to help too  they turbo is awesome and not sure if im going to be one of 1st people in uk to use it  but i also run nos  what you think this turbo will prodice max with the high canister? and i have bog forge fmic for lowering the inlet, i have noticed with meth can abuse car then when get home open bonnet and the inlet manifolds so cold to touch, would defo recomend using methanol if you dont have it, what you done with the nipple on the turbo have you blocked it off?
> 
> im using a 3" downpipe and decat and i use http://www.injectordynamics.com/ID725.html for fueling
Click to expand...

I believe that you will be close to the max output of the turbo by using water meth, high boost canister, nos...and decat. Around 480 crank hp. A friend made 470 hp at 2.2bar with water-meth injection, but with blocked wastegate, he used an external one. Maybe TFSI engines can produce more than 500ps with that turbo. For sure those turbos can deliver the power that they are rated at.
Regarding the 'nipple of the turbo'...do you mean the integrated DV? I am using it and it works just fine.


----------



## paul-murphys

John_tt said:


> paul-murphys said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> John_tt said:
> 
> 
> 
> cheers mate  im hoping the sem inlet to help too  they turbo is awesome and not sure if im going to be one of 1st people in uk to use it  but i also run nos  what you think this turbo will prodice max with the high canister? and i have bog forge fmic for lowering the inlet, i have noticed with meth can abuse car then when get home open bonnet and the inlet manifolds so cold to touch, would defo recomend using methanol if you dont have it, what you done with the nipple on the turbo have you blocked it off?
> 
> im using a 3" downpipe and decat and i use http://www.injectordynamics.com/ID725.html for fueling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe that you will be close to the max output of the turbo by using water meth, high boost canister, nos...and decat. Around 480 crank hp. A friend made 470 hp at 2.2bar with water-meth injection, but with blocked wastegate, he used an external one. Maybe TFSI engines can produce more than 500ps with that turbo. For sure those turbos can deliver the power that they are rated at.
> Regarding the 'nipple of the turbo'...do you mean the integrated DV? I am using it and it works just fine.
Click to expand...

thankyou, i mean the other nipple, there is one that goes to the dv and the other one that is on the housing, you got a readers ride on the forum you are on


----------



## John_tt

paul-murphys said:


> thankyou, i mean the other nipple, there is one that goes to the dv and the other one that is on the housing, you got a readers ride on the forum you are on


haha...I was 'nipple' confused!  I connected this nipple to the Greddy boost controller. If you keep the efr N75 you should connect it there.


----------



## paul-murphys

John_tt said:


> paul-murphys said:
> 
> 
> 
> thankyou, i mean the other nipple, there is one that goes to the dv and the other one that is on the housing, you got a readers ride on the forum you are on
> 
> 
> 
> haha...I was 'nipple' confused!  I connected this nipple to the Greddy boost controller. If you keep the efr N75 you should connect it there.
Click to expand...

my turbo never come with the n75 i guess i could use the original one which will be using to control boost, is it high pressure or is it more like the hose that goes to the turbo intake pipe? glad found some more people using the same turbo on the same engine


----------



## nate42

Step by step... got the head away from the block, not that hard to remove, you just need to disconnect and label quite many hoses and wires. So now I have the stock turbo, exhaust manifold, heat shield and charger pipe attached to my spare AGU head.








Attaching oil and water lines look promising as the connections are just the same as on the EFR turbo!








Inputs on the above picture, smaller is oil and bigger is coolant. These were both connected with banjo bolts.








Outputs on the above picture, hole with bolts is oil out and the other coolant with banjo. Only difference with EFR is that in K04 both inputs are from the top. EFR should be installed so that oil comes from the top and drains in the bottom, coolant goes in from other side and exits from the other. So I have to get rid off one 90 degree bend in the end of coolant input hose, that should be easy.

Intake should be kept pretty much in the same position. I have LHD car so brake cylinder is really close and also coolant lines going to cabin. My intake should squeeze past those just, but if it gets too tight I just have to change those coolant lines to flexible and reroute them a bit.








Intake of the new turbo should be kept pretty much in the same spot. There is enough room and exhaust manifold should be doable.


----------



## John_tt

paul-murphys said:


> my turbo never come with the n75 i guess i could use the original one which will be using to control boost, is it high pressure or is it more like the hose that goes to the turbo intake pipe? glad found some more people using the same turbo on the same engine


Yes I think you can use the oem N75 of the car. What do you mean 'high pressure'? If you are referring to the hose of the efr N75, it is silicone one with rubber on the outside.


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> Only difference with EFR is that in K04 both inputs are from the top. EFR should be installed so that oil comes from the top and drains in the bottom, coolant goes in from other side and exits from the other.


Yes, that's right, but the inlet and the exit should be placed in diagonal and not in a straight line. I think you can see what I mean here. 









Nate, I would like to ask you about the inline fuel pump that you are going to use. I've seen the connection plan you made with the switch that will control and open the second pump after 0.3bar. How will the car be working, at idle lets say, if the inline pump is not working? I believe that the fuel won't be able to get through the inline pump if it isn't working.
Please correct me if I mistook something.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Nate, I would like to ask you about the inline fuel pump that you are going to use. I've seen the connection plan you made with the switch that will control and open the second pump after 0.3bar. How will the car be working, at idle lets say, if the inline pump is not working? I believe that the fuel won't be able to get through the inline pump if it isn't working.
> Please correct me if I mistook something.


Lot of drivin is done under 0.3bar, what I'm trying to achieve is I don't need to stress the inline pump when it's not needed and also I don't have to listen the whine it makes. I've been told that Bosch 044 fuel pump lets fuel go trough when the power is not connected to it, so OEM fuel pump keeps the pressure in the fuel line when then inline pump is shut down. Of course it adds a bit of resistance but fuel flow is slow in these below 0.3 bar conditions.

It will take atleast couple of weeks to get the manifold done, during that time I should change the rods and clutch. Can't wait :lol: :lol:


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> Lot of drivin is done under 0.3bar, what I'm trying to achieve is I don't need to stress the inline pump when it's not needed and also I don't have to listen the whine it makes. I've been told that Bosch 044 fuel pump lets fuel go trough when the power is not connected to it, so OEM fuel pump keeps the pressure in the fuel line when then inline pump is shut down. Of course it adds a bit of resistance but fuel flow is slow in these below 0.3 bar conditions.
> 
> It will take atleast couple of weeks to get the manifold done, during that time I should change the rods and clutch. Can't wait :lol: :lol:


I thought that the resistance is big enough, that's what my mechanic told me about the walbro I am using. I hope that this can be done, it would be really great! The only disadvantage is that you rely on a hobbs switch and if it fails to read the true pressure...'Huston we have a problem' :lol: 
About the sound that the Bosch 044 makes you can put some insulation and cover it. The pump is cooled through the fuel, so there would be no overheating issue. As a matter of fact I am going to put insulation tomorrow to the Walbro, I am tired of hearing that noise all the time and I will also get a separated power line from the front of the car to the inline pump in order to have correct power. Until now I had it connected to the oem pump. :?

ps.for insulating the pump you can use armaflex with aluminium tape in tha one side. Is the material they use to the air conditioners for insulation.


----------



## V6RUL

I dont mind the sound of my 044 whistling, it tells me that it is still working, however passengers have commented on the noise.
Steve


----------



## nate42

I know I will have to keep on eye on that Hobbs switch, that is the reason I decided to make a switch to bypass it and fuel pressure measurement taken right after the pump. I could test the pumps resistance to flow by connecting it to tap water, it is around 4 bar here which is pretty close to fuel rail pressure. Measure how much it flows through in a minute, from that I can see if the resistance is a problem or not. Hmm might just do that in the weekend. Better to try than trust the internet :lol: :lol:

Today I had a bit of time to look the wiring, got a bit carried away with isolating the connections.








Hobbs to hose connection, on NPT threads Teflon tape is always a good idea.








Had to try soldering iron also  








OK a bit too much, even but at least I know my connections are not going to fail under the bonnet.

Walbro is said to be louder than Bosch, if the noise is too much it's good to know that it doesn't get hot and can be isolated. I've ordered some alloy that I'm going do a kind of box inside the battery box. I'll put the connections in there. Going to run two Odyssey PC680 batteries, so there should be enough room for one fuel pump.


----------



## nate42

Tested the fuel pump with tap water, my shower hose gave 2L in 15s. Trough pump I got 2L 30s, that is plenty so the OEM pump should be able to maintain the correct fuel pressure on low boost conditions when the inline pump is not running.

Sensors in a group shot, missing the ones that come to downpipe (exhaust temp and wideband lamda).








From left to right: Fuel pressure, Oil pressure, Boost pressure, Oil temp, Hobbs pressure switch

Dropped the parts to manifold shop (Facebook 'KKDMotorsport'), should get it in 2-3 weeks. Before that I should take the engine out change the rods and the clutch, so when the manifold arrives engine is ready to be put back on the car. Still no clue where I'll find time to do all this...


----------



## John_tt

That's great Nate. It seems like the system will work with no problems. About the location of the inline pump, they say that it is better to be placed close to the oem one, that's why most people place it to the position of the fuel filter. I wouldn't put it inside the engine bay for safety reasons but I know a lot of people that have done so with no problems.
Furthermore, the Walbro isn't more noisy that the 044, the bosch is louder. I've check it out a lot of times.

At the moment I am gathering the parts for a custom made water injection system to place outside of the i/c and I will use a Hobbs switch as well to make it open automatically after 0.80bar. I hope it will work because 'summer is coming'...not winter like in Game of thrones. :lol:


----------



## John_tt

Hello Nate! How's the project going on?
Today I tried a second DV to work with the EFR integrated DV. It works superb and the turbo surging I was hearing often since I updated to the bigger intercooler (more air to be diverted) stopped! I used the oem audi TT 225 plastic black diverter valve, maybe I will buy a forge one in the future.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Hello Nate! How's the project going on?
> Today I tried a second DV to work with the EFR integrated DV. It works superb and the turbo surging I was hearing often since I updated to the bigger intercooler (more air to be diverted) stopped! I used the oem audi TT 225 plastic black diverter valve, maybe I will buy a forge one in the future.


Good to know that dual DV setup works also in practice  Next weekend it's engine out, new clutch and rods in. Let's see how it goes, so far no big problems. This might be only in LHD cars but the power steering line behind the exhaust manifold is too close to heat so will reroute that under the engine.

Normal oil/fuel hoses are only rated to 100-120 Celsius, that is OK for fuel lines but oil lines are a bit too close to the limit. Don't want to take any risks so braided Teflon hose is better choice. I have bought different type of hoses, connectors and clamps, I hope I have enough stuff to make proper connections to all lines. It's nice that I can work on the turbo coolant/oil lines when the engine is out as the access will probably be quite limited.


----------



## John_tt

I am posting 2 pics of the second DV installation, I will change the hose to the throttle body and the DV will get a little lower than now.


----------



## nate42

Looks good. Just one question now when the throttle body closes the boost pressure comes to the side of the DV, I always thought that pressure should come from the bottom (against the spring) and exit from the side of the DV. Not sure about that one but worth Googling as it is easy to flip the other way round.


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> Looks good. Just one question now when the throttle body closes the boost pressure comes to the side of the DV, I always thought that pressure should come from the bottom (against the spring) and exit from the side of the DV. Not sure about that one but worth Googling as it is easy to flip the other way round.


You are wright Nate! When I'll change the DV to an aftermarket one like Forge I will place it like you describe but the OEM audi DV that I am using at the moment is placed in this direction, that's how it works. 
I am borrowing a photo from the forum...










The OEM DV is placed like this, it gets the pressure from the side...in this pic the Forge DV is installed in the wrong way because it should get the pressure from the bottom. Most of tuned TT's and S3's I've seen have the DV like in the photo above...which I believe is not correct. :? Only the oem dv should be placed like this.


----------



## nate42

Engine is out, the amount of cables and hoses is insane... I hope this project has a happy ending at some point :lol: :lol: 
















Removed gearbox and clutch also from the engine. Then I noticed I don't have bolts to attach the engine to engine stand   That was show stopper for my rod change, so decided to take pretty much all the bits away (alternator, mounts, AC, powersteering pump, coolant/oil lines) from the block and just lift it in the boot and take it with me to city. Now I got the bolts, so for the engine:
1. Engine to engine stand
2. New rods in
3. New oil pickup in
4. New timing belt in

Manifold should be ready soon and fuel pump location plan has also cleared. Lots of work and no time... [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## nate42

Had few hours to work on a car and did a battery tray from 2mm alloy sheet and bolted it to original battery case. Then attached fuel pump in front of it and did some wiring also.








Battery box should still close nicely so I got everything in there nice and stealth. All the mounting points to car are accessible so I can just bolt the whole thing to the car at once.

Actually now I noticed that I forgot the inline fuse for the fuel pump, well it's easy to add later.


----------



## nate42

On to the rods...








Oil pan off








Oil pump removed








OEM vs SCAT
















Bearing closer to the piston on the right, it has different kind of coating. It has to deal with bigger forces so that is probably the reason it has special coating on it.

Custom exhaust manifold is also done   Have to do some traveling so no time to pick it up yet. In a couple of weeks I'll see how the turbo will sit on the engine, can't wait.


----------



## John_tt

Looking great Nate! I hop everything will go as planned. 8) 
The inline pump looks fine in this position and the noise it makes will be eliminated more or less by the engine's one. In my car I choose to place it in the position of the oem fuel filter and I used an insulating material to reduce the noise...it worked about 40%.
Are you going to change the oil pump as well? I would recommend you do it as a precaution.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Are you going to change the oil pump as well? I would recommend you do it as a precaution.


My engine has less than 50k miles, so I've decided just to put a new oil pickup pipe. I thought that oil pump is easy to change when the engine is in the car also, so I'm not going to change it at this point. I'll have an oil pressure gauge that should tell me if the pump is about to go, it has an alarm for oil pressure drop.

Everything is going as planned at the moment and it's nice to notice that there are no more things to take apart, it is assembly from now on.


----------



## Grahamstt

Good work Nate

Are you changing the head as well? Is your exhaust man coming from the company you mentioned earlier in the thread?
Sorry for all the questions but I'm still on the fence as to what to do with mine at present :?


----------



## Matt B

Getting mine refitted with calico coated race bearings - the wear on mine was evident after 25k of hi power running.
Not sure the spec of the ones you are installing but worth spending a few quid.


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Good work Nate
> Are you changing the head as well? Is your exhaust man coming from the company you mentioned earlier in the thread?
> Sorry for all the questions but I'm still on the fence as to what to do with mine at present :?


I will keep the OEM head, intake manifold and throttle body. If I'd put in the large port head I should change the valve seals and runners to it at minimum, that is a engine shop job. Also I don't like to do a half a job, so at the same time new valves, springs and cams (machined to bit more aggressive). Then to get all the benefits, better flowing intake manifold and bigger throttle body should go in also. To get it working 100% I would need new engine management system as my car is APX. These would be at least 4k€ (enginemanagement half of that).

Same thing with going 2.1L, the engine management would have to go to get the benefits.

Custom software time is also not cheap and probably half a day of that would be needed at minimum.

There still a chance that it doesn't run sweet with Revo Stage3 software. Then I have to put the new engine management in and let tuner to make a software for me. After that it would be easier to put new head and go 2.1L as software could be easily adjusted to get the benefits.

If all goes well I should land between 350-380hp, that is a nice gain over Stage 2 TT and so far I'd say my spending has been pretty reasonable. Small bits and tools have added little more than expected but otherwise like I thought.

Yes, KKD Motorsport I mentioned earlier has done the manifold. Can't wait to see how it came out, looking at the manifolds they have done I must say I have quite high hopes


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> Getting mine refitted with calico coated race bearings - the wear on mine was evident after 25k of hi power running.
> Not sure the spec of the ones you are installing but worth spending a few quid.


My OEM ones looked good so will put those back for now. As you could see in the picture other one had some kind of coating.

I didn't know that OEM rods are rifle drilled, if I've known that I would have bought rifle drilled rods to replace those :evil: :evil:

My SCAT rod are stronger but "lower spec" than OEM [smiley=bigcry.gif] There will probably be enough oil as the squirts are spraying there all the time but still rifle drilled rod makes a better oil film that is for sure. Audi didn't rifle drill their rods just to show off, I'm sure there was a reason for it.


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

Looking real good Nate, keep us updated 
Did i understand right that KKD made you underslinger manifold and not that typical turbo showoff style that most manifolds are?
And other thing that gets me wondering why you are trying to run on Revo Stage 3 and not custom tune? porkkis can do tune for you and its gonna work a lot better


----------



## John_tt

Tommi[FIN said:


> ":3kxfkysq]
> And other thing that gets me wondering why you are trying to run on Revo Stage 3 and not custom tune? porkkis can do tune for you and its gonna work a lot better


I agree with Tommi, a custom made file is much better and I believe it is almost mandatory with an Efr turbo because this turbo makes about 50-100ps more than other turbos that have similar spool...it is totally new data for most programmers.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Tommi[FIN said:
> 
> 
> 
> ":1m6hbp76]
> And other thing that gets me wondering why you are trying to run on Revo Stage 3 and not custom tune? porkkis can do tune for you and its gonna work a lot better
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with Tommi, a custom made file is much better and I believe it is almost mandatory with an Efr turbo because this turbo makes about 50-100ps more than other turbos that have similar spool...it is totally new data for most programmers.
Click to expand...

I will try it first because it is so cheap, it will ask the boost GT2860RS is capable. So will loose potential in the top end for sure, spool wise (rpm to create some) they should be pretty close. If that doesn't work at all then it's custom map. If Stage3 map works OK, I can live with the fact that not every HP was not squeezed out from the turbo. I'm still thinking I'll do the phase2 and 3 some day and it would be nice to get real benefits then too and not just a couple of HP and custom map plays a big part in that.

Some progress, pistons were pretty dirty so decided to clean them. First I tried some CRC Gasket Remover, it kind of worked but you have to spray - wait - rub, spray - wait - rub and it was time consuming and boring. Bough some fuel and I'll let them marinade over night, that didn't work. So when I left for holidays I left them to citric acid that worked good for valves...









*Dirty pistons*








*After the citric acid bath and some rubbing*








*From the side in 'as new' state*

I've just taken the first one out from the acid and noticed that the two lower piston rings didn't like the bath at all. Lowest oil ring disappeared and only the spring wire was left (will take proper pictures of the rings when new ones arrive). It didn't cross my mind that those might not like the acid and I didn't even have the tool to remove piston rings. Bought the tool and also noticed that the top ring wasn't perfect.








*Piston ring missing bits of coating*

I don't know if that was something that the acid did or if they were like that already before that. Pretty sure that is not how they should look, well new rings are going in, so doesn't matter.

As you can see that first piston has few marks on the top but that shouldn't matter as the sides are perfect.


----------



## nate42

Also picked up the exhaust manifold   










































And trial fitted to engine


































It came out just the way I wanted. Location to charger pipe is nice, just need to put some heat protection to that between manifold and 90 degree bend from turbo to charge pipe. Turbo intake location is pretty much perfect, made a carton template to mark the location.

Here is the stock setup as a reminder

















And the location of the new turbo, this is important to get my intake sit nicely. Coolant lines going to cabin radiator often get in the way but will see if those need modding.


----------



## John_tt

Keep walking Nate! Everything looks great. I am posting a small video I took few days ago to check it out since we have the same turbo in the same car. 8)


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Keep walking Nate! Everything looks great. I am posting a small video I took few days ago to check it out since we have the same turbo in the same car. 8)


That looks really quick! Have you recorder some passing times with GPS for example 60-160 Km/h or similar?

Some pics of today's progress









































Today cleaned rest of the pistons and installed new rods and piston rings to them. Small end on the SCAT rods was really tight, had to sand it lightly with fine sand paper and water to make the wrist pins fit. Bolts on the rods were really tightly installed, probably some pre stretch procedure for the bolts. Putting the wrist pin clips back sucks, my fingers hurt. Measured the piston rings in the block and all of the top rings had a gap of 0.3mm that and middle rings had a gap of 0.4mm. I was happy with that so no fine tuning needed there.

Tomorrow pistons and oil pump back to the block. Water and oil exit lines from the turbo will fit without modification. Oil input line is also really close, so probably with some slight bending it will fit too. Coolant into turbo will need some work to fit, but doesn't look bad.


----------



## L33JSA

nate42 said:


> Small end on the SCAT rods was really tight, had to sand it lightly with fine sand paper and water to make the wrist pins fit


Not sure I'd be happy with that procedure I'm afraid mate as you've just altered the clearances on parts and in effect pre-worn very important parts of the build. They are tight for a reason.

You'd of been better off using heat and chilled pins.


----------



## nate42

L33JSA said:


> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Small end on the SCAT rods was really tight, had to sand it lightly with fine sand paper and water to make the wrist pins fit
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure I'd be happy with that procedure I'm afraid mate as you've just altered the clearances on parts and in effect pre-worn very important parts of the build. They are tight for a reason.
> 
> You'd of been better off using heat and chilled pins.
Click to expand...

I try to explain why I decided to use sandpaper, I might be wrong but what is done is done    Wrist pin was clearly harder material than the inner surface of the small end -> it is designed so that if something will wear it is the rod surface not the pin. Pin surface roughness (Ra) is really small it is like polished, small end Ra was big you could clearly see the machining marks on it. Sanding with water decreased Ra but machining marks were still visible. I sanded just enough (only few sweeps were needed) to get the ping through, compared the feel to old rod and it was a bit tighter but could rotate it by hand.

I thought about heating the rod and cooling the wrist pin, even went so far that the rod was already in the oven and writs pin in the freezer and tried them together but they didn't go easily, so stopped. Started to think how that part should work, there should be an oil film between the parts working as a bearing. If I mate these different temperature parts (they will be in the same temperature for the rest of their lives) is there a risk that the bond is too strong and that prevents the oil film between them. Of course the piston sides would still rotate and it would probably work OK, but that is not how it is meant to be. So decided to smooth (take the Ra down a bit) the surfaces on the rods.

Pretty sure I'm not the first one in this situation, is the heat and chill really the normal procedure here. Never heard of that with wrist pins?


----------



## L33JSA

Yes, heat & chill one normal procedure for fitting wrist pins,Ithink 400degrees is the temp you should be looking to heat the rod too. You should have around .0010 clearance on them I believe.Alternatively you can also have them pressed in but you have to be absolutely accurate in doing this otherwise you can damage the piston/pin if its ever so slightly at an angle.

Bear in mind that the pistons & the rods/bushes are made from different materials so they wont have the same thermal properties as each other when running in an engine so will expand at different rates thus helping the clearance/film of oil.

Google 'wrist pin fitting' for some examples.

At the end of the day its your engine mate.Whats done isnt really done - you can always get new pins. I take it they werent DLC coated either because if they were you might have removed the layer of coating too?


----------



## nate42

I read lot of mixed opinions from the internet and decided to call to a guy who has some first hand experience. He told me that yes heating the rod is a standard way to install wrist pin to a rod, but on that type of rods the pin is not meant to rotate. Floating wrist pins should go on with just lube! He advised against heat & chill with floating type. I asked what he thinks of my method... he said that I shouldn't worry if they were still a tight fit. Advised not to do it again tough and next time take it to machine shop that can do controlled honing.

L33JSA thanks for your input, I surely learned something today  Have you build floating wrist pin engines with this heat & chill method with no problems or were you mixing things with another type of engine.

Here a picture of standard rods small end. Looks shiny and has also this copper/bronze looking bush.









Bottom end is now done, torqued the ARP bolts three times to 55 lb ft (75 Nm).


----------



## L33JSA

I'll be honest - I've only ever assembled rods that used floating bearings - the past 3 1.8T engines I've stripped down all allowed me to remove/refit the wrist pins with very minimal effort. I put that down to slight wear allowing me to do this.

However I'll be assembling brand new wrist pins/pistons etc in the next few weeks so I'll let you know how I get on.

There must have been a machining error somewhere along the line with yours though for you to need to remove material to get them to fit.

Are you aware that there are 2 sizes of wrist pin for the 1.8T engines - 19mm and 20mm?


----------



## nate42

L33JSA said:


> There must have been a machining error somewhere along the line with yours though for you to need to remove material to get them to fit.
> 
> Are you aware that there are 2 sizes of wrist pin for the 1.8T engines - 19mm and 20mm?


I agree, I think my set was not as it should have been. I can imagine that this kind of machining error can easily happen manufacturing a bigger set when the blade in the machine wears. I have APX engine so I bought the 20mm pin rods, opening up the 19->20mm would lead to disaster for sure :lol: :lol:

These SCAT rods were competitively priced and balanced +- 1 gram (checked and all of them were 575 g), but looking at this now I'd buy IE Tuscan rods (these are rifle drilled).


----------



## badger5

nate42 said:


> L33JSA said:
> 
> 
> 
> There must have been a machining error somewhere along the line with yours though for you to need to remove material to get them to fit.
> 
> Are you aware that there are 2 sizes of wrist pin for the 1.8T engines - 19mm and 20mm?
> 
> 
> 
> I agree, I think my set was not as it should have been. I can imagine that this kind of machining error can easily happen manufacturing a bigger set when the blade in the machine wears. I have APX engine so I bought the 20mm pin rods, opening up the 19->20mm would lead to disaster for sure :lol: :lol:
> 
> These SCAT rods were competitively priced and balanced +- 1 gram (checked and all of them were 575 g), but looking at this now I'd buy IE Tuscan rods (these are rifle drilled).
Click to expand...

hope you dont develop small end rattle from non-rifle drilled rods
seems hit and miss to me on engines which run quiet to those which go on to develop pin wear and small end rattle, from non-rifle drilled rods and relying on splush lube to get oil there.


----------



## Matt B

badger5 said:


> hope you dont develop small end rattle from non-rifle drilled rods
> seems hit and miss to me on engines which run quiet to those which go on to develop pin wear and small end rattle, from non-rifle drilled rods and relying on splush lube to get oil there.


Is it possible to get rods drilled (if they weren't bought like that)?


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> badger5 said:
> 
> 
> 
> hope you dont develop small end rattle from non-rifle drilled rods
> seems hit and miss to me on engines which run quiet to those which go on to develop pin wear and small end rattle, from non-rifle drilled rods and relying on splush lube to get oil there.
> 
> 
> 
> Is it possible to get rods drilled (if they weren't bought like that)?
Click to expand...

Yes it is possible to get rods drilled (actually the hole is probably done with EDM) but your rods must have enough meat in the middle. H-bean rods doesn't have much in the middle.

Engine is pretty much back together (pics to follow, don't have a proper internet here) and gearbox is washed and ready to go back on with new clutch. Then it is the moment of truth, will it fit (LHD car so little nervous of that brake cylinder)...


----------



## jamman

Hope all goes well mate


----------



## nate42

Manage to do quite a bit of work to the car, the engine is back in the car   On monday it will go to KKD Motorsport for custom downpipe that will be mated to Pipewerx catalysator (I got Milltek non resonated for the rest of the way).

*Turbo location*

I knew it will be tight and it's risky to do underslung manifold, thank God it fitted. Manifold maker did amazing job it was positioned just the way I wanted.








_That's how the intake side looks_

Integrated DV just clears the water lines going to cabin heater radiator. Bought alloy cover to DV because I was afraid of the heat and that the nipple could brake easily on the stock cover. Measured the EFR stock spring just in case I need to source stronger one later on. I was made from 1.13mm wire , was 39.69mm long, diameter was 18.13mm and has 7 rounds.








_If you want to go for stronger spring probably source roughly same size/rounds just thicker wire ~1.5mm _

Fitting the intake is tight.








_Starting with 90 degree turn to ID 3" (76mm)_

Intake will be little oval shaped close to turbo but still better than going for smaller diameter. Will probably heat wrap the bottom section just to protect the silicone hose (mainly worried that brake line will rub a hole in there over time when engine moves).








_90 degree turn in place_

On the firewall side the biggest issue was the wastegate canister that I kind of forgot when taking measurements... Luckily there was enough room for it with stock barcket   








_Plenty of room to make a nice 3" downpipe_

*Oil lines to turbo*

Existing lines worked pretty good.

Oil in was a tight fit and a bit hard to attach but in the end got it. Old line fitted nicely just had to straighten the last bends a bit. 









Oil out line I had to drill the holes in the flange bigger, but then it attached to turbo without problems and was just the right shape.
















_Lines in place_


----------



## nate42

*Water lines to turbo*

Water line that goes to turbo comes from the water pump, problem is that on the K04 it goes to the top of the turbo is it had tight 90 degree bend in the end. Luckily it fitted really nicely when rotated the whole final part of it 90 degrees. Had to put adjustable 90 degree fitting to be able to do that.








_Adjustable 90 degree fitting, had to remove that bracket also_








Water line fitted and added some heat protection as it will be quite close to downpipe and the water going to turbo shouldn't be too hot.

Line out fitted easily just some slight bending and it was there.








_Water leaving from turbo back to the block_

*Power steering lines*

Problem with power steering line is that it takes space close to fire wall.








_Power steering line is the one with heat protection_
I think the idea why it is routed from there is that the fluid would heat up fast I can't think of any other reason. ID 10mm line had two chokers (no idea it that is the right word...) to restrict the flow. One was right after the reservoir and the other one just before the cooling loop that is below the radiators.








_Chokers found inside the OEM hose_

For now I just used a fuel hose under the engine, but I will replace it with stainless steel braided Teflon hose and will route it slightly behind the engine to maintain the idea of one part of the hose being in a warm environment.

*Engine/Gearbox mounts*

Not happy with 034 Motorsports gear box mount as it is weaker than the OEM mount :evil: :evil: You can easily see from these picture that it's made from "lesser models" mounts.








_Top view Audi TT OEM vs. 034 Motorsport track mount_








_Side view Audi TT OEM vs. 034 Motorsport track mount_

So clearly I'm not trusting on that one it has to go. What is the best (strongest, but not solid) gearbox mount?

Engine mount was same kind than OEM (just stiffer rubber) so that one I'll keep.









*Clutch / Wlywheel*
All went smoothly on the installation, haven't bled the clutch yet though. Almost forgot the 6mm allen bolt inside the 4wd transfer box   Engine was already in the car when I remembered it, luckily it was still easy to put on.








_Flywheel in place_








_Clutch in place_


----------



## nate42

I want to keep the OEM look so wanted to use the OEM charge pipe. I had to raise the bracket a little and do a proper heat wrap to protect the silicon hose inside.








_Heat wrap_

New belt went in too








_Kevlar belt_

Slight problem found on the coolant hose bend exiting in front of the block. There was some casting error blocking ~30% of the hose, that is clearly not good. Took the purges out.








_Manufacturing error blocking flow_


----------



## nate42

Looks like on the transmission/gearbox mount there are at least three options to go for.

http://www.vibra-technics.co.uk/audi/tt_mk1_8n/417/VAG406M/left_hand_engine_mount_mt_18_r32








http://store.blackforestindustries.com/bfimk4mk54cy.html








http://vf-accessories.com/?page_id=108









I'm linking the Vibra Technics the most and thinking of the road version as I read from their webpage that competition model is ridiculously stiff (engine movement something like 3mm !?!?!). Single mass flywheel will add some rattle so too stiff mounts are not a good idea. Any votes against Vibra Technics or should I just get one.


----------



## UR_TT

Have a couple of my TT friends over here i SE that run the Blackforest one, so far no worries. Approx two seasons an all of them.


----------



## nate42

New spacers for the front are here, same size as the old ones but wasn't 100% happy how they center the wheel when installing.








Picked up injector seats









After thinking the situation with the intake hose and brake cylinder on my LHD car I've decided it needs some modding. Engine moves so the brake line would eat its way through the silicone hose sooner or later and that would be a half ass job.









_Intake hose pressing the brake lines_








_Brake cylinder_

It looks pretty much like that on my car, can't remember if it has that extra middle port or not. Part number is 1J1611301B asked that from Audi when I picked the injector seats and some missing torx screws from Audi. I tried to verify the port sizes and threads from them but they had no clue. After furious Googling brake lines from cylinder to ABS box are M12x1 and those pressure sensors are M10x1. I've decided to do new banjo brake line connections from cylinder to ABS box. That will free up few precious centimeters for the intake hose. ABS box and cylinder surface quality looks good enough for banjo sealing. Originally these are flare type connections.

At least the other pressure sensor is also a bit on the way. These are more tricky, sensor probably has a cone type tip that seals to the bottom of that M10x1 hole. M10 x 1 male / M10 x 1 female elbow would work if that tip in the picture is similar to that pressure sensor tip.








Mixed information of those port sizes in the web, so I guess only way to find out is tear it apart and see myself.


----------



## nate42

Downpipe is done, haven't seen it yet. I was told it was really tight but doable. So all I need now is time to work on the car and at the moment it's not looking very good on that department [smiley=bigcry.gif] 








_DIY brake line parts for intake fitting problem_








_Spark plugs_

Went for the Vibra Technics mounts in the end and bought both sides as thought maybe they are designed to be installed in pairs.

Still TODO atleast:
-Cut the intake to right length and connect DV.
-Sensor wires from engine bay to cockpit
-Connect and install gauges
-Put all the sensor wires nicely
-Change the engine mounts
-Fit the oil cooler
-Put proper hose and clamps to some vacuum lines
-Bumper, lights, cold air feed, FMIC and panels back on
-Change fuel filter
-Bleed the clutch
-Top up gearbox

I'd say it is a days job, but I don't have a day. Car is 1,5h from where I live so I have to drive there in the evenings. I hope two evenings is enough to get it to running condition so that I can drive it closer. I'd like to have pretty much all hardware done properly before I start my adventures with the software.


----------



## nate42

Slowly but surely...

Had a few hours yeasterday to do my project. Car is back from the DP fitting and oh boy the downpipe looks really nice!!
It is really tight fit as 3" DP always is in TT. Decided to put one extra vband to where it enters the engine bay, makes thigs much easier if it needs to come off. Pics to follow

Brake cylinder is getting on my nervs. Lines leaving from the cylinder and going to ABS box are M12x1.0 that is just as common as slut looking nuke scientist. Banjo is the way to do it as it leaves most room. Finally sourced some M12 banjo hose with OD 1/4" stainless steel braided PTFE hose (made to order) and M12x1.0 banjo bolts. Will cut that hose in half and add those Venhill connectors to other end with M12x1.0 to M10x1.0 adapters.








_ABS box end will look like this and other end M12 banjo_








_This is how the Venhill lines are assembled_
One of the brake pressure sensors is also on the way, so that has to move also. That should be M10x1.0 so should be easy.

Vibra Technics mounts arrived.
















_Vibra Tech engine mounts_

Casting looks strong, but the bolts... They are strong enough I'm sure of that but for a product that costs as much as this A4 grade stainless steel bolts would be nice. Under the bonnet is nice and dry most of the time, but still why use zinc palted bolts for saving £5...

Replaced some of the worst looking vacuum lines with proper clips and hose.








_ID 4mm / OD 9mm fuel hose used as vacuum line_

Also did some wiring work for new sensors (seven in total), there is a nice hole ready hole in the firewall so it was easy job. Next is to connect everythig and see if the readings make any sense :lol: :lol:


----------



## nate42

Drove the car back home, still on stock injectors and software. Cruising on highway AFR was around 14.7 and EGT 550 Celcius. Soundtrack has changed dramatically, it is much louder than it was. I'm on Pipewerx cat and Milltek non-resonated center section and cat-back. Maybe resonated center section would be a good idea, are those available separately?

Clutch pedal is heavier but parking is just as easy as it is with OEM clutch. I need more miles and proper driving before I can say more.









_On DIY BT projects this is a must :lol: :lol: _

Got the brake lines done, because the confusion on the sizes they look like this. Easiest way would have been just right length M12 banjos and no extra adapters like I used. 








_Intake space issue solved_

Intake connections part, should have taken two of the small ones as the emission system hose to middle size was really tight fit.
















_Intake connections _








_Intake in palce, was tight as fok and pure pain to fit_








_Still "some" wiring to do [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif] _

Next new injectors on and the software in, just have couple of uninteresting and annoying jobs to do before that.

Strut brace is too close to charge pipe are there some OEM looking aftermarket ones with more clearance or should I take it up with thick washers?

I hope I find time soon and can drive it before the winter is here again :lol: :lol:


----------



## jamman

The last picture scares me :lol:

Just get those wires nice and neat, do it right and do it once.

Enjoying this build, good no great work.


----------



## cookie

Epic build mate, love reading your thread glad to see everythings going good I look forward to the next update 

One question where did you source the different diameter outlet pipes for the intake pipe as so far I've only found 6mm take off valves.


----------



## nate42

It scares me too :lol: I have strict policy on my wiring: don't mess with the cars original wiring harness. All that junk is separate cabling needed for various sensors. I will do a proper job with cabling it's just quite boring stuff to do and takes ages to complete.



jamman said:


> The last picture scares me :lol:
> 
> Just get those wires nice and neat, do it right and do it once.
> 
> Enjoying this build, good no great work.


----------



## nate42

cookie said:


> Epic build mate, love reading your thread glad to see everythings going good I look forward to the next update
> 
> One question where did you source the different diameter outlet pipes for the intake pipe as so far I've only found 6mm take off valves.


Thanks! I got those from here: http://www.revotec.com/catalogue_SelfSeal.asp They seem expesive but they are reusable and really useful.


----------



## nate42

Forgot to add a picture of that downpipe. Under the car there is a flex part just like in the Pipewerx 3" DP. One extra v-band was added so that downpipe can be removed when engine is in place.








_Right side v-band is attached to turbo, then lambda and temperature sensors and extra v-band before going under the car_

Awesome GTI was happy to help with resonated center section.








_So this resonated pipe will be replacing..._








_... this straight pipe that is currently in the car._

I hope that is enough to bring the noise back to sensible level.


----------



## nate42

Should have the Stage3 Revo software installed next week, it will be interesting to see if the N75 can keep the boost in check.

New injectors are in. Had to manufacture a tool from a bolt (sand the sides down until it was 20mm) to get them out as I don't have 20mm allen key. Removing them was surprisingly easy as the tool was really tight fit.








_Old seats out_
Decided to use Teflon tape instead of sealant paste as I thought they will be easier to remove. I over tighten one of the new ones when fitting and it cracked [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif], not much so car is drivable but enough that I have to buy a new one from Audi.








_Teflon taped and ready to go in_








_Old vs new_








_Old vs new_








_Old and new injector, new injector has an adapter to fit the harness_








_New injector in new injector seat_

Car started nicely and checked the basic with VAG-COM and current software could handle the injectors so that I could drive home. Couldn't resist to give it a bit of gas to see when the turbo starts to spool... When it started to spool I lifted off right away. 
Y-axle mbar and X-axle RPM.








_EFR_








_My old K04 boost graph_

Map is the same but I've upped the boost with SPS since the K04 log was taken, that's why it is asking more boost. On EFR run I floored the throttle later that is why the requested boost is not up from the beginning of the graph.

Way too early to draw final conclusions, but K04 has 1 bar of boost at 2800rpm and EFR hits 1 bar at 3900rpm. Roughly 1000rpm later, I was hoping bit sooner but too early to tell.


----------



## John_tt

You shouldn't make any conclusions about the spool Nate before the car gets flashed. Actually it spools really quicker than you describe and it depends on the exh. manifold and the gear as well. 
Take a look at my dyno graph at 1.70bar constant pressure with 1.80 overboost. The magenta line is the boost pressure.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> You shouldn't make any conclusions about the spool Nate before the car gets flashed. Actually it spools really quicker than you describe and it depends on the exh. manifold and the gear as well.
> Take a look at my dyno graph at 1.70bar constant pressure with 1.80 overboost. The magenta line is the boost pressure.


Thanks for the graph that is a good reference, now I know what I should get out from it  I have no preload on the waste gate canister so that could have leaked also, probably going to add some. Yours is hitting 1 bar @ 3500rpm that is really good, that is something I secretly hoped :lol: I noticed that when the boost comes it comes like BANG   that is good for the gear changes, don't have to wait for boost to build after every gear change. My manifold was designed to give as fast spool as possible, pulses coming in good angle and not too big runners.

You were taking it to 7500rpm on the dyno, have you done something to the head or can stock head take so much revs?


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> You were taking it to 7500rpm on the dyno, have you done something to the head or can stock head take so much revs?


No the head is stock. The rpm are limited to 7250, maybe the programmer set it to 7500 just for one run on the dyno...I don't know  :roll: 
About the boost pressure the interesting thing is that you are going to have boost from 2500rpm which makes the car easy to drive with low rpm (city driving). You will have overboost of 2bar around 4100rpm which is really fine compared to a Garrett 3071r that has similar power output.


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

John_tt said:


> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You were taking it to 7500rpm on the dyno, have you done something to the head or can stock head take so much revs?
> 
> 
> 
> No the head is stock. The rpm are limited to 7250, maybe the programmer set it to 7500 just for one run on the dyno...I don't know :roll:
> About the boost pressure the interesting thing is that you are going to have boost from 2500rpm which makes the car easy to drive with low rpm (city driving). You will have overboost of 2bar around 4100rpm which is really fine compared to a Garrett 3071r that has similar power output.
Click to expand...

My tuner set my rev limit to 7800 on stage 1 software. He said that after you chance cams and turbo we can up it to 8500 if wanted.

Nate remember to tell how it works ASAP, atleast im wating results =)


----------



## Bikerz

Tommi[FIN said:


> ":35zkjcv9]
> 
> 
> John_tt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You were taking it to 7500rpm on the dyno, have you done something to the head or can stock head take so much revs?
> 
> 
> 
> No the head is stock. The rpm are limited to 7250, maybe the programmer set it to 7500 just for one run on the dyno...I don't know :roll:
> About the boost pressure the interesting thing is that you are going to have boost from 2500rpm which makes the car easy to drive with low rpm (city driving). You will have overboost of 2bar around 4100rpm which is really fine compared to a Garrett 3071r that has similar power output.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My tuner set my rev limit to 7800 on stage 1 software. He said that after you chance cams and turbo we can up it to 8500 if wanted.
> 
> Nate remember to tell how it works ASAP, atleast im wating results =)
Click to expand...

WTF? Surley when you change your value train is when you can rev higher :roll:

That seems very late in teh rev range for 1 bar for a 65 series. Still 1.8? Or gone 2.0?


----------



## nate42

Tommi surely that kind of RPM's are not healthy with stock head, valves just can't keep up. Stiffer springs, solid lifter and so on needed for that kind of revs.

Some progress, but I just don't have time to work on the car [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif] Just bought a house (has a garage, tiny but better than nothing   ), bad news is that it needs some renovation that will again eat my time. I must finish this project before the renovation starts at the new house!

New oils are in, not much track time this year so saved the Motuls for next season.








_Runnig in oils are out and using this now_

Revo Stage 3 software is installed. AFR is all good and the car feels OK on non boost driving. I try to post some logs on the weekend. I Just want the additional fuel pump running before I make full boost runs, at this point OEM pump is doing all the work and fuel is just flowing through additional Bosch 044 pump.

Still to do
-Wiring for gauges and fuel pump
-Change engine mounts
-Change fuel filter
-Connect OEM gearbox speed and oil level/temp sensors (little tricky to route them in place at this point...)
-Oil cooler install
-Resonated center section to exhaust
-Powersteering hose from rubber to braided teflon

Clutch is nice to operate but the sound, well let's put it like this you can drive it so that it's quiet but it's not easy. Engine braking makes gearbox noice that is quite loud when you have high revs. Little disturbing so will have to try that Fluidampr pulley and hope it makes miracles.

My logging PC, slow as hell and running the oh so marvelous Windows Vista... But size matters, fits to glovebox nicely








_Starting with boost 7 and timing 1, Fuel setting doesn't do anything on APX engine_


----------



## nate42

Did some quick logging, these were the blocks I was interested the most. X-axle is seconds in all of the graphs.









First did couple of third gear runs and it was clear that too much boost got away once the N75 opened the wastegate. You can feel that kind of boost changes very well in the car feels like the boost goes on - off - on - off.








_Boost 7, Timing 1_

First I was thinking that I should let the car cool down and add more preload to wastegate, but started thinking that boost level is still quite low so wastegate might not be on it's working range yet and on higher boost it might work better. So upped boost to 8 with SPS device and did more runs.








_Boost 8, Timing 1_

Now that's more like it, it pulls nicely but boost still overshoots a little when it arrives and you can feel that sharp edge on the boost curve. I must say it felt pretty good to notice that this actually works. Still one more level of boost to go, but I want to have the wiring done before I do that (to get the gauges and fuel pump working).

Here is the N75 duty cycle on that run








_N75 Boost 8, Timing 1_

Looks like there is easily enough flow on the wastegate, might still have to add some more preload to get smooth boost operation. Boost creep is of course something that might appear if too much preload is added.








_Wastegate flow vs stroke_

It feels very quick already and it is strange now that the car just keeps pulling, you have to keep your eye on the revs. With K04 you know when to change gear as it runs out of puff, now the steady boost is there as long as you keep your foot down. Looks good so far


----------



## Diveratt

Hi Nate, Just a quick one why have you still got the secondary air pump kit fitted? you'll save about a KG but it give you a bit more room too?

By the way its really It's really looking good


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

That really looks promising =) 
What kind of AFR and timing you are running atm?

On those revs: I have all stock head and there isn't any sings of valves floating with 7800rpm so no worriers


----------



## Matt B

Any timing logs?


----------



## nate42

Diveratt said:


> Hi Nate, Just a quick one why have you still got the secondary air pump kit fitted? you'll save about a KG but it give you a bit more room too?
> 
> By the way its really It's really looking good


Yes I got the air pump still, I was close to removing all that junk but ended up keeping it. Kept it because I thought I want to see the engine running fine first, then when I remove it if some symptoms appear I know the cause. So I was afraid to do too many changes at once. Might sound little funny, but this was the first time I took an engine apart. I think sooner or later it has to go as it makes changing oil filter difficult.



Tommi[FIN said:


> ":1btesqdt]That really looks promising =)
> What kind of AFR and timing you are running atm?
> 
> On those revs: I have all stock head and there isn't any sings of valves floating with 7800rpm so no worriers


AFR sits around 1 (14.7:1) on cruising and on boost in the low 0.8 region (11-12:1). I need to wire the rpm signal to my gauge before I get useful logs out from it.


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> Any timing logs?


Just logged one run of timing, timing is set to 1 and looked like this









MAF reading is a bit low, it should be able to show until 278 g/s, I think I have to get a new MAF just in case. Current one has been in the car for two years.


----------



## Diveratt

nate42 said:


> Diveratt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Nate, Just a quick one why have you still got the secondary air pump kit fitted? you'll save about a KG but it give you a bit more room too?
> 
> By the way its really It's really looking good
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I got the air pump still, I was close to removing all that junk but ended up keeping it. Kept it because I thought I want to see the engine running fine first, then when I remove it if some symptoms appear I know the cause. So I was afraid to do too many changes at once. Might sound little funny, but this was the first time I took an engine apart. I think sooner or later it has to go as it makes changing oil filter difficult.
Click to expand...

Im sure the air pump & system only function on start up and its just for cold start emissions so there should be no issue. just link the pump out with a resistor and there is no EM light. Its would have been a lot simpler to remove with the engine out too, its a bit of a strugle with it in the car but it can be done.


----------



## John_tt

In what boost pressure the maf counted 278gr/sec? Is the maf stock S3- TT225? If it isn't it has to be calibrated.. I believe you already know that Nate.  
At 1.70bar my maf (S4) shows about 325-335gr/sec.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> In what boost pressure the maf counted 278gr/sec? Is the maf stock S3- TT225? If it isn't it has to be calibrated.. I believe you already know that Nate.
> At 1.70bar my maf (S4) shows about 325-335gr/sec.


That 278 g/s was years ago with faulty MAF, from that I figured that it is the max ECU can view. You can see the MAF values from that Excel screenshot.

I'm running stock MAF as Revo software is designed to use stock TT225 MAF. With MAF it is the same case as with fuel pressure and injectors, not wise to change those without altering the software.

Maybe someone here knows how it works and can explain but here are my 2p. Bosch MAF is probably a hot wire meter, there is a fixed current that is heating the wire, air flow cools the wire. More air flow -> cooler wire. From this and air temperature the actual airflow is calculated. When the MAF is out from its range, wire is colder than recommended it will probably still work but not that accurately. So it could be possible to extend the measuring range. Easiest way is of course getting a bigger MAF housing and calibrate the software accordingly.

Fuel pump is now also wired, not far from getting the ashtray gauge online too.








_Fuel pump, its relay and fuel pressure sensor_

I added more preload to wastegate canister hoping to remove that hick-up around 4500 rpm, added too much and got worst. I hope I find the sweet spot soon as I have to remove the charge pipe and bracket every time to get to it, car has to be cold too as it is right next to exhaust manifold and downpipe... [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

nate42 said:


> Maybe someone here knows how it works and can explain but here are my 2p. Bosch MAF is probably a hot wire meter, there is a fixed current that is heating the wire, air flow cools the wire. More air flow -> cooler wire. From this and air temperature the actual airflow is calculated. When the MAF is out from its range, wire is colder than recommended it will probably still work but not that accurately. So it could be possible to extend the measuring range. Easiest way is of course getting a bigger MAF housing and calibrate the software accordingly.


You have understand it allmost right. Bosch MAF is indeed hotwire meter and the airflow is cooling the wire, By altering MAFs volts it tryis to keep wires temperature at same point all the time, higher the air flow -> higher the volts. Stock TT MAF is capable to calculate 350hp and that point MAFs output voltage is 5V. By enlarging MAF housing more air can get to engine with same volt output.


----------



## Matt B

nate42 said:


> Matt B said:
> 
> 
> 
> Any timing logs?
> 
> 
> 
> Just logged one run of timing, timing is set to 1 and looked like this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MAF reading is a bit low, it should be able to show until 278 g/s, I think I have to get a new MAF just in case. Current one has been in the car for two years.
Click to expand...

Good. MAF does seem low if this is the 1.4bar setting from your graph
Dont know about the APX maf but the Bam one tops out at 292 g/s


----------



## John_tt

You can try to clean the maf sensor with isopropyl alcohol, I think there is a DIY somewhere on youtube about that.
In my car I used the oem TT225 maf sensor and I put it in the S4 case. Then the file has been calibrated on the new maf diameter. 
About the hick-up at 4500rpm, maybe something is wrong with the N75 of the turbo. I am using a greddy b/c and I never had any issues.


----------



## L33JSA

Tommi[FIN said:


> ":23q3tx9c]That really looks promising =)
> What kind of AFR and timing you are running atm?
> 
> On those revs: I have all stock head and there isn't any sings of valves floating with 7800rpm so no worriers


It's not just valve float you've got to worry about its the actual strength of the valves - the heads can fall off and cause serious amounts of damage.



Matt B said:


> Dont know about the APX maf but the Bam one tops out at 292 g/s


APX MAF tops out slightly lower I believe - something like 270odd seems to ring a bell.

Nate - looking good mate.

When you graph your logs you are best off using RPM as your X axis rather than the timestamp - it will make things clearer for you to read & analyse.


----------



## nate42

Will continue with more logging when the new MAF is on, it's still on the post.

This arrived also today. I will review it later and how it works with my clutch/flywheel setup. It's quite heavy, but I think it has to be how could it other wise dampen anything. 

















New exhaust center section also arrived, so have to get that fitted too.


----------



## Diveratt

nate42 said:


> Will continue with more logging when the new MAF is on, it's still on the post.
> 
> This arrived also today. I will review it later and how it works with my clutch/flywheel setup. It's quite heavy, but I think it has to be how could it other wise dampen anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> New exhaust center section also arrived, so have to get that fitted too.


I was thinking of going the otherway and fitting alloy pullys to reduce the rotational mass. Do you have a problem with vibration Nate?


----------



## nate42

Diveratt said:


> I was thinking of going the otherway and fitting alloy pullys to reduce the rotational mass. Do you have a problem with vibration Nate?


I've removed the dualmass flywheel, like the name says it has two masses that are springed together. This means that connection to gearbox is not 100% stiff and this means it absorbs some of the vibrations coming from the engine.

My singlemass flywheel is not even alloy, so it has some mass. Noise is not terrible and you can keep it quiet, but I don't want to drive like that. Braking to a turn you are often engine braking same time at 5000rpm and at the moment that makes the gearbox sing too loud for my liking. My old engine mounts were really soft (10 year old OEM units) I changed those and of course that affects too, so singlemass flywheel is not the only component to blame. I hope the Fluidampr solves this, will see.


----------



## badger5

Diveratt said:


> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Will continue with more logging when the new MAF is on, it's still on the post.
> 
> This arrived also today. I will review it later and how it works with my clutch/flywheel setup. It's quite heavy, but I think it has to be how could it other wise dampen anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> New exhaust center section also arrived, so have to get that fitted too.
> 
> 
> 
> I was thinking of going the otherway and fitting alloy pullys to reduce the rotational mass. Do you have a problem with vibration Nate?
Click to expand...

please dont fit non damped crank pulleys on your cars
seriously bad idea.. gains nothing, risks a lot.

have a read on fluid dampers site for why...
I have some carnage pictures of a "billet crank pulley" and a broken crank I could post...

stick with stock unless pushing higher revs and high power motor - imho


----------



## badger5

nate42 said:


> Maybe someone here knows how it works and can explain but here are my 2p. Bosch MAF is probably a hot wire meter, there is a fixed current that is heating the wire, air flow cools the wire. More air flow -> cooler wire. From this and air temperature the actual airflow is calculated. When the MAF is out from its range, wire is colder than recommended it will probably still work but not that accurately. So it could be possible to extend the measuring range. Easiest way is of course getting a bigger MAF housing and calibrate the software accordingly.


page 56 explains how the Hot Film MAFs work..
http://badger-5.com/bin/published-bosch-sensor-data.pdf


----------



## Grahamstt

Nate

Where did you get the fluidampr from - there seems to be a big variation on price
I'm looking around to order one but can't see the best place to buy from

Cheers Graham


----------



## nate42

badger5 said:


> page 56 explains how the Hot Film MAFs work..
> http://badger-5.com/bin/published-bosch-sensor-data.pdf


Thanks Bill that PDF is a real gem!!! I can't see how ribbon belt pulley with some fluid in it could destroy my engine  Well lets see what happens. I'm not after their power claims, just less noice from gearbox. I'm really happy with the clutch, just the sound. I know the track engine mounts that I still have in the car play a part in this too, should change those to vibratechnics units and see if that further helps the issue.



Grahamstt said:


> Nate
> Where did you get the fluidampr from - there seems to be a big variation on price
> I'm looking around to order one but can't see the best place to buy from
> 
> Cheers Graham


Bought it from 034 Motorsport as I had some unused discount there, also their delivery is quick and they had them in stock.


----------



## E3 YOB

Cool Nate - I can recommend the fluid dampr. My engine is noticeably smooth with this is place, well worth the investment imho. [smiley=cheers.gif]


----------



## nate42

I've been trying to adjust the wastegate actuator to help the N75 to get the boost in control. It just doesn't work, software is asking so much boost that the N75 can't control it with this actuator. Adding more preload didn't help, things just got worst when the wastegate didn't open enough. So ordered a new high boost actuator unit, let's see if N75 gets better results with that. If not then it's plan B, not quite sure what that is yet :wink: 








_N75 duty cycle and boost pressure, X-axle RPM_

Next week booked to fit the resonated exhaust center section, I'm sure it's stuck to backbox and cat so I don't even try it myself.

I think my Compbrake top mounts are failing, have to investigate that too. They are making noise and the steering feels loose. KW also make solid top mounts to mk1 TT?


----------



## s3tt

Nate, are you adjusting any of the n75 maps to control the boost? Or is it just all being done by actuator pre load?

N75 will cope if its mapped correctly. I may need lot of work with the PID maps but if you get the main n75 map tuned it will deal with the boost and or actuator.


----------



## John_tt

Nate the Medium w/g canister that I used could keep up to 1.4-1.5bar without any problem. If you are trying to make more boost on that spring it's not easy, although it might work up to 1.7bar. With the high boost w/g canister I have 1.70bar pressure and the screw at the w/g canister is at the lowest position. 
Maybe the best way is to use a boost controller instead of the n75.


----------



## V6RUL

John_tt said:


> Nate the Medium w/g canister that I used could keep up to 1.4-1.5bar without any problem. If you are trying to make more boost on that spring it's not easy, although it might work up to 1.7bar. With the high boost w/g canister I have 1.70bar pressure and the screw at the w/g canister is at the lowest position.
> Maybe the best way is to use a boost controller instead of the n75.


I agree that the OEM waste gate will only cope with so much boost and an EBC will allow better control, however there becomes a point where the WG is too small to be able to react to spool and boost and an EWG may be the option to go with.
Steve


----------



## nate42

s3tt said:


> Nate, are you adjusting any of the n75 maps to control the boost? Or is it just all being done by actuator pre load?
> 
> N75 will cope if its mapped correctly. I may need lot of work with the PID maps but if you get the main n75 map tuned it will deal with the boost and or actuator.


My problem lies exactly there, N75 map is for different turbo. I was a bit naive and thought that by adjusting preload on wastegate actuator I could make the EFR wastegate behave like the one on GT2860RS and it would work. N75 maps are for that Garrett turbo on my Revo Stage3 map and I have no access to them. With stiffer actuator it might still work, so ordered one I will need it one day for sure :wink: I'm just tired of playing so decided to go for plan B, manual boost controller.



John_tt said:


> Nate the Medium w/g canister that I used could keep up to 1.4-1.5bar without any problem. If you are trying to make more boost on that spring it's not easy, although it might work up to 1.7bar. With the high boost w/g canister I have 1.70bar pressure and the screw at the w/g canister is at the lowest position.
> Maybe the best way is to use a boost controller instead of the n75.


This is what I'm going to do now. Ordered the same Greddy unit you have. 1.4bar is all I need so will try first with medium actuator if not happy, then change to the high boost one. Went for Greddy as it works for you, my VEMS gauge has integrated boost controller with PID and boost levels are adjustable by RPM. Just too much trouble to start playing with that now, especially when there is almost zero information available on how to use it...

From my logs I know the requested boost levels of the Revo software, will adjust the Greddy to meet those and it should be all good...

Steve the wastegate on EFR is quite big and in a good angle so I believe that wont be a trouble, it's around the same size than K04 manifold connection 8)


----------



## John_tt

Let's hope that the software will work with the Greddy b/c. If not you are going to need a custom file for this turbo. The way that turbo performs is totally different even to the new garrett GTX line, for example the gtx2867 that has the same power output with the efr6758. Especially at the low rpm the efr is much more powerful than the gtx. A custom file is the best thing to do!
About the Greedy unit I would recommend you to place it like the photo below.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Let's hope that the software will work with the Greddy b/c. If not you are going to need a custom file for this turbo. The way that turbo performs is totally different even to the new garrett GTX line, for example the gtx2867 that has the same power output with the efr6758. Especially at the low rpm the efr is much more powerful than the gtx. A custom file is the best thing to do!
> About the Greedy unit I would recommend you to place it like the photo below.


That is a neat place for the controller, might have to copy that :wink: 
Been busy destroying bathrooms and dropping walls, but that is no excuse. The real reason is that the boost controller is still not here :evil: :evil: Should be next week, some bad luck with the company I bought it from. I want to do some logging and do at least on dyno run before the winter comes... Good thing is that now that I have a garage, I can work on the car the winter months and it should be in top shape for the next season.

I think it will work as long as I give the car the amount the software is askin (no more than 1.4 - 1.5bar). What settings are you using in your boost controller for *Gain* and *Start Boost* on your boost controller? High boost canister is also in the post if I need it, will try first with medium canister.

Resonated center section is in place, sounds much better. Nothing special, it's a four pot no matter what type of exhaust setup you bolt on it :lol: :lol:


----------



## John_tt

nate42 said:


> What settings are you using in your boost controller for *Gain* and *Start Boost* on your boost controller? High boost canister is also in the post if I need it, will try first with medium canister.


I have the following settings at the moment:

*Low boost*
Set: 58% 
Set gain: 1.30bar
Gain: 12%
Warning: 1.35bar and drop pressure by 4% if pressure exceeds 1.35

*High boost*
Set: 82% 
Set gain: 1.70bar
Gain: 12%
Warning: 1.80bar and drop pressure by 4% if pressure exceeds 1.80

With the low boost it keeps about 1.30-1.35bar constant pressure and with the high boost has overboost of 1.75-1.80 and keeps about 1.70bar to the limiter. I want to give more attention to the Gain setting because It might keep higher pressure but I am always bored to do so.


----------



## nate42

F*king finally the boost controller has arrived, it's better that I don't say a word about the seller because I'm too pissed.

























High boost actuator also arrived, might not need it now but one day for sure   









Might have to burn some midnight oil to get this installed as time is still an issue.


----------



## smartass

nate42 said:


> *Power steering lines*
> 
> Problem with power steering line is that it takes space close to fire wall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Power steering line is the one with heat protection_
> I think the idea why it is routed from there is that the fluid would heat up fast I can't think of any other reason. ID 10mm line had two chokers (no idea it that is the right word...) to restrict the flow. One was right after the reservoir and the other one just before the cooling loop that is below the radiators.
> 
> For now I just used a fuel hose under the engine, but I will replace it with stainless steel braided Teflon hose and will route it slightly behind the engine to maintain the idea of one part of the hose being in a warm environment.


I have been figting that PS-line a lot.
Do you have some more info on how you solved the problem?
How did you attach the ends of the fuel line to the existing system?


----------



## nate42

smartass said:


> I have been figting that PS-line a lot.
> Do you have some more info on how you solved the problem?
> How did you attach the ends of the fuel line to the existing system?


I replaced it with fuel line as I had that at hand, I've bought stainless steel braided teflon hose as a final solution for more heat and wear protection. Good route for the line is down from the reservoir and then under the engine. Just make sure you attach it so that it doesn't rub anywhere as the engine moves. One more thing, you need to take the OEM hose apart as there are restrictors inside that you need to put to your replacement hose. At least I think you should they are there probably for a reason.

For fuel lines I kept the OEM lines and extended the one going to the pump using 8mm brass barded straight fuel hose joiner








Jubilee clips are used on most of the fuel connections, just like OEM. Fuel pressure is just slightly higher than OEM so no need to go fancy with connectors.

I'm so busy at the moment that I have no time to work on the car, I hope that changes soon [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## nate42

Finally I have some time and a place to work on the car. Should be on the track with it in two weeks! I had some time to drive the car before winter, software had AFR in check but couldn't handle the wastegate. Will see if the manual boost controller helps, but before that few things to fix.

Today fixed leaks in the power steering. I reused the copper washers and in my case it didn't work too good, it was leaking slowly but surely. So had to replace those.








_These were the leaking connections_








_Banjo bolts are different size and other one has probably a check valve inside_








_Two restriction pieces that are inside the power steering line between the reservoir and steering rack _

Then installed the Fluidamper pulley. Two 1/2" black hoses are oil cooler lines. Braided 304 grade steel and Teflon hose inside. Painted black to keep my stealth OEM engine bay theme going :lol: 








_Easy job, loosen the belt, remove old and bolt the Fluidampr on_

Also started to install the oil cooler, need to make few brackets and space is tight (as usual with TT engine bay). Will make some kind of scoop for it as it is in angle and not straight against the air flow.









Also the new Vibratechnics engine mounts are installed.

TBC


----------



## V6RUL

My oil cooler is in a similar place but I don't have FMIC, I have a charge cooler..

25 row mocal.
Steve


----------



## nate42

Oil cooler bolted on and oil lines done.









Also did power steering line from reservoir to "front loop" that is below the pipe that used to connect the side intercoolers. Does anyone know why there is so much piping for powersteering? Probably has something to do with keeping the fluid on certain temperature, still there is way too much pipe IMHO.

Pure PAIN was to install the wires to oilpan and gearbox that I forgot to plug when putting the engine back on. I could just reach the gearbox plug with my figer tips. Had to extend both about 30cm and route them to plugs. Must have been close to two hours fighting with these  Boys and girls what ever you do, don't forget to plug those before...

Next boost controller install, gearbox top up (lost some when trasfer box was removed), fluids (coolant, power steering, oil) in and test drive


----------



## John_tt

Fluidampr is a great choice! Let us known about the engine mounts of vibra tech., I was thinking about ordering them too. The positioning of the oil cooler is the best in my opinion, I had it placed just over the i/c but it doesn't work as expected since it can't transfer heat as in the smic position.
I hope you complete the project soon and test it on the road!


----------



## nate42

Got everything together yesterday and started the car. Power steering always sounds scary before you put enough fluid in there. Engine mounts less shaky than the 034 Motorsport ones I had before and clutch is silent when idle, so this combination seems to work.

Boost controller installation was pretty easy. N75 valve is replaced with this








_Greddy boost controller valve_

It had three ports COM, NO and NC.
COM - Port that connects to wastegate canister
NO - Meaning normally open, so this is connected to charge pipe. If no boost is asked valve is open.
NC - Meaning normally closed, boost goes here when the valve is opened. This is connected to intake pipe after MAF.









_Good place for the valve found under the strut brace_









_Engine bay lookin as I wanted, OEM baby  _









_Boost controller location_









_Behind the panel. Two 10mm holes needed, one for cables and other for pressure input_

Left the N75 connected as software still thinks it is in charge of things.









_N75 plugged and still connected_

Fixed broken headlight clips. Audi has a ready kit for this. There is even a place for the screw ready, so they knew these will brake :evil: Should have made these strong enouhg in the first place, shame on you Audi  








_Broken headlight clip_









_Fix kit_

Next some logging and test run.


----------



## John_tt

Nate are you planing to change the intake? I don't think that the oem intake can supply the turbo with the air it needs even if the panel filter is an aftermarket one. They say that turbos might get damaged if they can't suck as much air as they should and 6758 is a 500hp turbo.
I would suggest you use a Pipercross foam filter, its one of the cheapest solutions and great in perfrormance...and sound.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Nate are you planing to change the intake? I don't think that the oem intake can supply the turbo with the air it needs even if the panel filter is an aftermarket one. They say that turbos might get damaged if they can't suck as much air as they should and 6758 is a 500hp turbo.
> I would suggest you use a Pipercross foam filter, its one of the cheapest solutions and great in perfrormance...and sound.


Good point, I did think of that 8) In the airbox there is a pipecross panel filter and although the airbox is sealed it has an extra vent that is routed to corner of the bumper. I wanted to get as cold air as possible so that is why I kept the orginal fender intake and just added extra one next to it. Smaller battery allows routing the pipe.









_Inside the air filter box_








_Airbox and the pipe that goes under the headlamp to the front of the car_


----------



## John_tt

That's nice Nate. The volume of the air that the filter can handle is doubled. Although I believe that a foam filter is better in terms of air supply but in terms of intake temp isn't as good. When the car is moving the amount of fresh air in the engine bay is very much and the foam filter gets cold air as well. When the car stops this cant happen of caurse. 
But I can assure you that even in the summer the intake air temps are very low compared to the enviromental temp. and believe me...summer in Greece are realy hot!  
With 35 degrees celcius env. temp I have up to 45 degrees intake temp in a 2nd-5th gear full rev drive.


----------



## nate42

Car is giving me hard time. First the boost controller hose was squeezed behind dash panel and boost controller didn't show the boost properly. Saw max boost of 1.35 bar, still room to tighten that low boost wastegate canister.

When I got this fixed went to do more runs. Suddenly clutch stick to the floor. I remembered right away the shitty plastic clutch bleed nipple that had corroded clips. I didn't have new proper clips in hand at the time and used what I had, planned to change them later. Well forgot. [smiley=bigcry.gif]

Luckily happened close to home and the starter motor has enough power to start the car from stationary when the first gear is in. When the car is moving changing without clutch is pretty easy with TT. So managed to drive it home.

So on Monday to dealer to get a new clutch bleed valve with fresh clips and gaskets.

With my short runs I manged to get some data and found out that Revo Stage 3 software is asking 1,5 bar when boost is set to 9 with SPS. So now I know my goal level where to aim with that Greddy.

Well not all bad a new set of wheels arrived for future use. I'm not very creative they look pretty similar to old ones :lol: :lol:


----------



## nate42

Clutch is bleeded and works again. You can't buy just the clips so had to get a new valve from the stealer €50...








New bleed valve with fresh clips

As John told working with medium canister is not easy. Wastegate leaks and boost comes on slowly or too much preload -> wastegate flow is limited and you over shoot when the boost hits. Unfortunately changing to the high boost canister looks to be in my case an engine or subframe out job... [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif] So I have to keep trying to get the best out of it with this hardware. First got lazy rising boost that peaked at 1.35, then tigtened more (too much) and it overshot 1.5 bar limit. Iteration continues...


----------



## John_tt

Nate you should check for boost leaks because with the medium boost canister I had 1.80bar overboost. Did you add any preload on the spring by turning the screws by 2-3 turns? Maybe the wastegate port isn't shut and thats why you can't get overboost.


----------



## Grahamstt

Nate your DV looks to be the opposite way round

Is that because you're using it in tandem with the one on the turbo

I have decided to go along this route with this turbo now so I may have some questions for you (and John) in the future

Graham


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Nate your DV looks to be the opposite way round


I've kept it like that always, pressure hits the spring to the bottom and escapes to intake from the side. I've heard that Forge 007P works both ways. Good luck with build, keep us posted.

Trackday done, no big drama. Coolant was rock solid at 90 degrees and didn't have to use the oil cooler fan. I was running only around 1.1 -1.2 bar of boost :lol: Very happy with suspension setup, changed to stiffer rear springs. More story of that here viewtopic.php?f=2&t=264970&start=15

Fluidampr has improved the idle and the flywheel is not singing as much as it used to. Clutch is very good I like it, but at times on idle it starts to resonate and make sound. When that happens pressing clutch and giving a little gas normally makes it quiet. I can try to make a video of it.

I try to explain what I did with the wastegate canister. First I started to add preload. Got to a point when I had too much preload so wastegate flow was not enough and boost started to rise on high revs. I the end I think I got to the point when I could rev to 7000rpm and the boost stayed at around 1 bar. Boost controller set to 0% so it is not doing anything. When wastegate sees pressure it opens.

Did this because to be able to control boost there must be enough wastegate flow to do so. The more you got preload the less flow you have trough wastegate. You want to have preload because otherwise the wastegate cracks open and you get lazy response.

With boost controller I can get a lot of boost. Vacuum on the intake is connected to canister and this makes it possible to keep shut at higher pressures. The problem is that when the solenoid opens the effect is too big, the boost is not smooth. Car also sounds like crap when the boost is going back and forth on full throttle.

Here is a 4th gear pull. Little too much boost and it creeps on the high revs. Might have too much preload and wastegate flow is not enough. Graph gives the idea on how the boost arrives with this turbo, should be possible to match that requested boost curve nicely.








_Attempt to make requested boost with medium canister_

Timing was all zeros on these runs. I haven't touched those yet. With Revo SPS I can add timing later, I want to get the boost right first.

Haven't noticed anything worrying on EGT's or AFR's, here is one video of 3rd gear pull to 7000rpm. Cruising AFR sits at one (14.7) and WOT between 0.8 and 0.9 




Today fitted a decat just to get more flow to exhaust, I don't know how restrictive that Milltek backbox is.








_Cat and decat, Pipewerx parts_








_Exhaust parts. Center pipes and backbox Milltek_

I think I just have to tackle on changing that high pressure canister... Maybe on July, as I'm off to holidays soon.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Nate you should check for boost leaks because with the medium boost canister I had 1.80bar overboost. Did you add any preload on the spring by turning the screws by 2-3 turns? Maybe the wastegate port isn't shut and thats why you can't get overboost.


I don't think I got a boost leak. If I add too much percentage boost shoots close to two bars. So it will peak but not hold nicely. Hard to explain, boomy noise when boost controller is working. Here is a boring video of me cruising in the track and starting at 4:30 you can hear the sound that appears when upping boost too much. That low resonance type noise. When that sound comes it doesn't pull hard anymore and boost is not constant.




I winded the boost pretty close to target to see if the problem would miraculously clear it self. That didn't happen surprise surprise :lol: :lol: So had to drive around 1.2 that still felt good. Below a pic of BTDC's and boost.









_Boost pretty close to target, but boost delivery spikey and not pulling properly_

Vacuum on the canister keeps it shut I think, that is the reason it can hold more boost than what is stated on EFR guide. I tried to maximize the preload and was little too greedy maybe...

That Greddy is some piece of work. I have no idea what that Gain does. I've read that if boost starts to fall on high RPM and Gain. I kept it to 5% as keeping 1.5bar is walk in the park for this turbo. Instructions are not the greatest, pretty much trial and error job. It is PID controller in the end, why not use those terms in the GUI...


----------



## nate42

Looks like it was the wastegate. Decreased preload and right away it feels much better and that dumping boost noise is gone from the top end. No time to put the boost settings in place and dial off that hiccup as I'm off for couple of weeks. Can't wait to get back on this project. Here is a boost curve ATM just with old settings on boost controller. Those last 1000rpm felt pretty crazy!


----------



## John_tt

Hello Nate.
First of all the 007 DV is installed correctly. The pressure comes from the bottom and not from the side as in the OEM DV which has a diferrent structure than the 007. I have it installed just like you but placed just before the throttle body because the system works better with the 2 DV in the two edges of it.

The Profec unit although it seems easy to configure, you have to try many settings to get the best one. I have it for about 2 years now and I am still learning what it can do.

SET (in %): is the duty cycle of the wastegate- how much you want it to open. When it's tuned to 80% the wg can open to max 20%. I have it at 86%.
SET GAIN (in bars): is the point- pressure that you want the wg to start opening. The higher it is tuned the best spool you get, but you might have boost spikes. I have it at 1.20bar with the high boost canister.
GAIN (in %): is the stifness of the wg canister and affects the constant boost pressure. If it is tuned too high you might get boost spikes. The more % you add the overboost gets higher, so the SET setting is getting affected as well! So you have to tune the SET and GAIN the same time!...until you find the best combination. I have it at 8% at the moment.
WARNING (in bars): is the overboost limit, put it about 0.05bars higher than the requested boost. I have it at 1.98bar.
LIMITER (in %): how much boost you want it to lower the overboost if exceeded. I have at 5%.

If you want to check the boost without the b/c- mechanic pressure, you can just turn it off by keeping se button pressed for 3 sec. You don't have to put SET to 0%. This is the safest way to assure that the unit doesn't interfere at all.

With those settings and the high boost wg canister I have overboost 1.95bar and constant pressure of 1.75-1.80bar. 
Just to let you known, I changed the efr 6758 to the smaller 6258 which spools about 600rpm faster. With those settings the car showed 450 crank hp on the dyno. 8)


----------



## nate42

Thanks John for your post, it was very helpful. That 6258 is probably best for 1.8T, I still live in the dream that one day I'm running 2.1L with this 6758 turbo. How things are going ATM I don't see that happening very soon :lol: :lol:

In the end I got the low boost canister to work pretty OK, got stuck when I tried to add more boost to mid range with gain. I think it is running too rich, AFR drops to 11's. That rich and very conservative timing can't be good. Got it to hold 1.4 bar from 5500-7000rpm, that was 268 g/s on VAG-COM, so around ~330hp. When I tried to go up hiccups appeared and sounds like excess fuel is burning in the downpipe. Also occasional back fires when shifting.









_This is where I got with low boost canister before problems at mid range_

Managed to change new plugs and also the high boost canister. That holds now 1.2 bars with boost controlled shut. Medium hold around 0.7 bar. Added very little preload to get best possible wastegate flow.

I was just starting to investigate this fueling thing and log AFR's to find out why the hiccups appear. For now I've been just following AFR from the gauge as I've thought 12's are fine on WOT. Then noticed that hiccups could occur when it momentarily drops to 11's. Idle and cruising stays at 14.7 so that is all good.

Then noticed that power steering is leaking again :evil: This time it is from the steering rack itself [smiley=bigcry.gif] Dust cover was full of fluid. So have to get that fixed first before I can go on [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif]

Even if I get the software to work I'll probably get 350hp tops with 1.5 bar. It's a good gain over stage2 but on today's standards not that much :lol: Don't want to "experiment" with that software too much as I don't want to brake anything, so after the steering rack is fixed I'm pretty ready to take it to a shop for a map.


----------



## John_tt

Nate with a propper map and AFR about 12 you will get more than 400hp in 1.5bar...easily. I told you from the beginning that efr is a special turbo and won't work with the existing software. A custom map is the best thing to do. 8)


----------



## Nathanho123

cant wait to see a video


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

Just take it to ''porkkis'', he know a fair bit of tuning these things.. Allso i would recommend switching to E85


----------



## nate42

Tommi[FIN said:


> ":jajzbhz9]Just take it to ''porkkis'', he know a fair bit of tuning these things.. Allso i would recommend switching to E85


What company he works for, his based in Lappeenranta right? Could you pm his phone number so I can give him a call and discuss my options.


----------



## nate42

So I think I have pretty much all I need to fix the leaking steering rack. OEM is made by ZF, so wanted also a ZF unit to make sure I have no issues fitting it. Called to Audi and they quoted around 1100 EUR for a replacement part, but they were uncertain of their stock. So called around and they were out everywhere, 5-7 weeks to get stock depending where I called. Tried Finland, Germany and Austria.

I the end decided to order from US as they got stock and advertised same refurbished ZF units on eBay. So got this in the post. *Those tie rods look a bit suspicious to me... should they look this different from side to side? *I'm thinking if I should buy some quality parts or are these fine? Joints are really tight and had absolutely zero play, will they last is another thing.








_New steering rack and tie rods_

There are many part numbers for this part and this was 1J1 422 105, lets see what the one that is in there now has. The most important thing with these is that it has 2.7 turns from side to another. Golf, Skoda etc ones have 3.5 turns.

Once the front will be disassembled will install some goodies from this forum at the same time. These has been on my ToDo-list for a while, but I was going to make my own. These were reasonably price so saved myself for the trouble. I got basic powerflex there ATM and slamming the brakes from high speed before corner is a bit wobbly. I hope these help.








_Front steering bushing sleeves and new bushes_

Will change all the ball joints also ARB links, ball joints, tie rod ends








_New ball joints and tie rod ends_

I will also change a bit stiffer springs to my coilovers and noticed that I can't get them off without an impact wrench. Now there is an excuse to get one :lol: Worked great, now I just have to get a quiet compressor the one I borrowed is ridiculously loud. 








_Ingersoll-Rand 2125QTI-MAX to motivate the mechanic  _

Garage is a bit mess have to get my tools and stuff organized before I can get to work. Shouldn't be too hard job to get the steering leak fixed, but as always something will appear :lol: :lol:


----------



## nate42

OK got something done again.

Alloy sleeves were easy to install. I just put them on ice and heated the wishbone with hot air blower, then just pressed in with vice. Cut the superpro bushes in half that way they were easy to install. Powerflex bush that I took away was two piece design.








_New front bushes and alloy sleeves installed, back bushes were already Powerflex. Alloy sleeve reduces front bush size from 45mm to 30mm_

Upgraded my coilovers to 80kg/cm springs








_New springs and solid top mount on, ready to go back to car_









_Subframe out of course also and little cleaning on that too_

Pretty pissed on the steering rack quality... turned out it was leaking like hell from the both ends. Both dust caps were filled with fluid.








_The man who engineered these should look in the mirror... New on top_









_Old one had part number 8N1422061D_

Hopefully car back on the street before week end. Four wheel alignment has to be done too, planning on running a bit more camber than -1 that I used to have.


----------



## Bago47

I hope you didn't pay anywhere near 1100EUR for refurbished unit, I got mine for about 500EUR (with postage and taxes).

AFAIK, the unit that dealership sells is also refurbished.


----------



## nate42

Bago47 said:


> I hope you didn't pay anywhere near 1100EUR for refurbished unit, I got mine for about 500EUR (with postage and taxes).
> 
> AFAIK, the unit that dealership sells is also refurbished.


I paid $350 plus $100 deposit, they want my old unit in return but they are not going to get it. It costs at least that $100 to ship it to US, so I rather let them keep the deposit. With shipping etc it was around 450EUR. Not the end of the world but would rather spend it on something more interesting.

Might try to take the old one apart and see how it is sealed, I'd like to know why these don't last.


----------



## nate42

Steering rack assembly went nicely all the new parts in and four wheel alignment booked for tomorrow. The literally the last bolt destroys the whole thing :evil: :evil:

There was so much paint around so I didn't notice it when the steering rack was off the car. Lower banjo connection had thread repair sleeve in it... and the dodgy work was done badly [smiley=bigcry.gif] [smiley=bigcry.gif] . The sleeve rotated and came out with very little force, it was like it couldn't go long enough to even tighten the banjo. First three round or so went easily with fingers.

This is how the connectors should look








_Banjo connections on the old unit_

Banjo bolt with sleeve, sleeve looks too short... and how does it seal between sleeve and body? Just some thread sealant or what?!?!
















_Bolt with repair sleeve that rotated and came out_

Don't know what I'm going to do to fix this, first I want my money back from the seller :evil: 








_State of the threads [smiley=bigcry.gif] _


----------



## cookbot

Haha, cookbot-con pictures get everywhere!

Did you think about doing the steering rack refurb yourself? Mine is a bit baggy and the preload adjusted hasn't removed all of it, just wondered if anyone had managed to source the parts and DIY'ed it. Ones referbed by others seem to cost the world or be a load of crap!


----------



## keithtd

Could use a thread converter but you's need to drill out and re-thread.


----------



## nate42

Don't know what the part sticking out from the rack is called, but lets say its neck :lol: The neck comes off easily, what a relief. I can just take the neck from the old one and put it to new one. There is a lot of metal around the destroyed threads so one could use adapters there, like the previous repairer, just do it right... I think I've said it before but IMHO steering has way too much piping in the engine bay. One proper cooler to it and shorter lines would be a good thing to do.









_Steering rack neck removed_









_Neck has bearings and gaskets also_

I have to look why the steering rack was leaking from both ends and what type of seals they use there. But for now the focus is getting the car back to streets, so that examination has to wait for later.


----------



## nate42

Car is back on the road. Combining parts from the two racks got me one that doesn't leak. Steering feels better than ever. Lighter also so definetly the old rack had some issues. Wheels aligned with 1,5 degrees camber front and back. New stiffer springs feel good, had to dial the dampers stiffer as on the loosest setting the ride was bouncy.

Just found out that on APX engine the misfire count doesn't work...   Pretty basic stuff I'm sure, but how could I know that :lol: Well should have guessed as VAG-COM was just showing "-" instead of "0" when logging...  Ordered TFSI coilpacks and adapters, lets see if that helps on my hiccups under boost.

Found a good machine shop that is specialized to heads, that is all they do. So will continue with the spare big port head I have. Fast chat with them got me convinced that +1mm oversize on valves is a good idea. First 10mm behind the valve are the most important on turbo engines I was told. +1mm gives more room to work on it. Couple parts arrived to phase 2 head.








_New valve guides and seals_








_SEM Motorsport intake manifold_








_Right size ports for large port head_








_Adapter plate for 65-70-75mm throttle body_


----------



## Matt B

Good choice with SEM, I have 70mm cadillac GTS throttle body and its great, flows plenty and tickover is good too.

What is your target for this build ?


----------



## nate42

Matt B said:


> Good choice with SEM, I have 70mm cadillac GTS throttle body and its great, flows plenty and tickover is good too.
> 
> What is your target for this build ?


SEM gets praised everywhere so was an easy choice  I've read that problems start with 75mm or bigger, so 70mm probably from Bosch, S4 or similar. That Cadillac TB is Bosch unit also I believe.

Target for the engine is fast spooling reliable package with +400hp. Fast spool >> top hp numbers. Clutch should hold some serious torque, so would be nice to get big mid range torque also. It spools pretty OK already, but with cams and stroker bottom end it should spool 500-700rpm sooner. For the whole car I'd like to achieve a car that is comfortable enough to be driven stealth in traffic and can take flat out track work at least 10 consecutive laps without overheating the engine or brakes.

For now it is enough to get the car run OK with flat 1.5bar of boost. Winter is coming and this year I want to drive the TT this year. So fat winter tyres and mud flaps are on the shopping list :lol: Have to lift it to Allroad heights and remove the Leon Cupra lip, will look funny for sure. Was planning to filt rear LSD also before winter, don't know if I have energy to that.

Over all this a hobby and should be fun so that's why my pace is slow, so much other things to do now a days [smiley=bigcry.gif]

Here is a good read to everyone who thinks, what the heck that mapping actually is.
http://contiman.free.fr/reprog/reprogrammation moteur 1.8t.pdf


----------



## TT SMITHY

Really nice work  always enjoy checking up on 
this thread I must admit I admire your patience 
all done at a steady pace I suppose it's not just
the final product of a build but the journey
Along the way especially as you can complete
Most of the work very cool


----------



## jamman

Always enjoy reading these thread updates (understand very little)

Good luck with it all


----------



## Grahamstt

I'm green -- you're buying all the right parts that I wish for


----------



## nate42

Thanks guys for the comments! Good to know there are still some people reading this :lol: :lol: I know looks like diary of worlds slowest engine builder...

Valves (+1mm over size) and springs arrived. Main reason to get these was uprated spring rates, could save the engine in case of mis-shift. Big fan of Inconel as a material also, so Inconel exhaust valves were a must. For those who don't know Inconel is a mostly Nickel and Chromium. It is awesome because it had great corrosion resistance and it stays very strong in high temperatures. At 600C (1100F) it is as strong as it is in the room temperature. Something else will brake because of high exhaust gas temperatures before these valves. Inconel valves were surprisingly cheap at http://www.re5pect.pl, it is expensive metal.








_Valve specs_

I'd like to measure the spring rates compared to OEM, as that is the main selling argument of these. I might have a access to device to do it, I'll look into that later. For now I just weighted all Supertech parst vs OEM.















_Supertech intake valve vs. OEM intake valve_

*Weighting results:*
supertech intake valve 31.50 grams
OEM intake valve 31.48 g

supertech intake valve retainer 5.08 g
OEM intake valve retainer 8.26 g

supertech intake spring 23.30 g
OEM intake spring 23.36 g

supertech exhaust valve 45.47 g
OEM exhaust valve 41.48 g

supertech exhaust springs 42.15 g
OEM exhaust springs 41.46 g

supertech exhaust valve retainer 8.88 g
OEM exhaust valve retainer 15.10 g

Supertech is lighter in total but just slightly.

Sprigs were interesting. On the exhaust side there are two, other one goes cleverly inside the bigger one.








_OEM vs Supertech exhaust valve spring_

Intake spring is longer giving it more preload. 








_Supertech intake valve spring vs. OEM_

Still waiting for the FSI coilpacks from Awesome GTI :x I hope I get them soon to get some boost dialed in and performance logged. Drooling engine parts is fun, but driving a TT beats that easily


----------



## nate42

TFSI coilpacks ROCK!

Finally these arrived








_INA TFSI coilpack adapters and TFSI coilpacks 06E 905 115 E_

Installation was really easy. They need quite a bit of force to get in place (deep enough), so light tapping with rubber hammer was needed.








_Half way of installation_

Hesitation when the boost comes is gone! So all this time when I tought I had trouble with keeping the boost in check the actual cause seems to be coilpacks. They worked fine when I had stage 2 setup and these were early Hitachi coilpacks, that has a reputation of being bullet proof. Well they are 12 years old, so looking at this now it was quite stupid to not replace them by default.

Had time to do just one pull with logging and everything looked and felt good. Boost controller was OFF and this was just against the wastgate spring, so not a lot of boost. Next I have to start adding boost and adjust software (well not much I can do to software, just adjust timing with SPS and rough fueling with Lemmiwinks).








_Logs after a pull with new coilpacks. Boost including atmospheric pressure_


----------



## nate42

Some progress again, pretty happy with the car 

Did some logs to see where we are on acceleration. I got 3.3s runs on my Stage2 setup when doing rolling *80-120 km/h* on third gear. This is same as *50-75mph*. I was pretty constant around *2.65s*, so more than half a second quicker  In TT 80-120 km/h is roughly a pull from 4000 to 6000rpm on third. I was using Racelogic GPS that should be really accurate. Runs were done flooring the throttle at around 2500-3000rpm.








_80-120 km/h pulls_

Got the boost also about sorted. Top end was easy but had to dial in a lot of gain to get the boost right up to 1.5bar. My current settings at the boost controller are

Wastegate duty cycle 64%
GAIN 23%
GAIN SET 1.45
WARNING 1.55
WARNING L 8%

Boost controller gets it's boost info from the FPR. Here is combined boost graphs of two 3rd gear runs from VAG-COM block 202. I'm giving it a bit more what it asks, looks like it can take it  As I was doing 80 to 120 km/h these runs were not all the way to redline (@7200). Boost stays constant all the way of course as the turbo is so big, so top power is right at the limiter  









Timing is set to 5 with SPS, no it is not all zeros anymore when logging but very low numbers 1-3.

RPM input to AFR gauge is also installed, still need to configure it before I can get proper EGT/AFR logs up. Now I've done just some logs with camera facing the gauge :lol:  From those looked like nothing to worry about. Found a shop to dyno the car also. Will do a bit more runs and logs before I take the car to dyno.

So finally Phase 1 is done and it worked!

Also dropped the head to specialist, got some winter tyres and 70mm TB. Pics to follow.


----------



## nate42

Range for pressure is 8bit so you have 256 unique values. ECU scales them from 0 to 2550 mbar, 10mbar increments. There are TDI sensors that go to 3bar and 4bar, but some serious tweaking on the ECU would be required. Idea would be an ECU that takes OEM harness, but is adjustable without memory limits.

Some pics.








_SEM trial fitting before taking the head to a shop_









_70mm internal diameter_









_75mm external diameter_









_Bosch throttele body 078133062C can be found for example on Audi S4_

As for winter tyres I went for the European version of Continentals winter tyres. This saved me 400€. I do most of my driving on busy roads that are melted in winter also.








_ContiWinterContact TS 830 P_









_Skandinavian version ContiVikingContact_

I have a small steering fluid leak somewhere, have to look into that again [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## nate42

Still no dyno :x Have to go there soon car works great, so would be nice to get some figures.

Big port AGU head has been waiting for cams, now they arrived. Decided to go for Integrated Engineering street cams IECVA2, these should open up the top end without loosing power on the bottom end of the rev range.








_Impressive promises..._








_Intake camshaft_








_Exhaust camshaft_








_Work quality looks good_

Decided to get adjustable cam gear also, as with that you can get the turbo to spool a bit earlier. Not much, maybe 500rpm... but still worth a shot. IE cam gear kit was a safe choice with their cams.








_Integrated Engineering cam gear kit, with ARP bolt and friction shim_








_-3 degrees is supposed to give you earliest spool..._

Still have to check the condition of the hydraulic lifters I have and chain+tensioner. If they look OK, then the new head can be completed. Before installing it I have to choose my tuner and engine management system for the car. APX engines Motronic is not ideal... PnP ECU would be nice to minimize wiring hassle.

Next post hopefully some power figures with current setup. Revo is working pretty OK with this turbo. Got some back fires on decreasing loads, but took some fuel out with Lemmiwinks and that helped. Good read on Lemmiwinks found here http://s4wiki.com/wiki/Lemmiwinks


----------



## Grahamstt

Hi Nate

Are you still happy with your choice of turbo. Not many people seem to go for the EFR range but I am soon to buy my turbo and the 6758 is the one I have planned to get.
Going the Garrett route is still an option for me, especially the HTA range from Owen Developments, but the Borge Warner seems to sort out all of the turbine housing variables as it is the spec I wanted.

Cams look good

Graham


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Hi Nate
> 
> Are you still happy with your choice of turbo. Not many people seem to go for the EFR range but I am soon to buy my turbo and the 6758 is the one I have planned to get.
> Going the Garrett route is still an option for me, especially the HTA range from Owen Developments, but the Borge Warner seems to sort out all of the turbine housing variables as it is the spec I wanted.
> 
> Cams look good
> 
> Graham


Very happy  There is a new compressor map out for the EFR6758, the one they first released was conservative as they hadn't done proper testing at that phase. So turbo is not the one slowing me down that's for sure :lol: Here is the new map








_Updated compressor map for EFR 6758 now 53 lbs/min (400g/s)_

With stock engine (rods of course) you can get +400hp easily with *EFR6258* and 600rpm faster spool like John_tt stated in this thread, he's had both. In my opinion early spool and spool pickup are the key variables on BT build, if the car is a daily driver.


----------



## Grahamstt

Thats my problem -- mine going to be my daily driver, maybe going 2.0ltr tho which will help


----------



## nate42

Finally quick trip to dyno. I was running 1.4 bar not 1.5bar :evil: , I blame the Greddy and the weather. Noticed this from logs at home... Dyno was done in FWD mode and dyno bolted to front wheel hubs. Anyone running big brakes ask if they have spacers and longer bolts for connection. We had to take the calipers off to get the dyno connected.
















_First dyno sheet of the project, best run_









_Ready to go_

I don't know what are the transmissions losses on a TT in FWD mode. I think it is safe to say about 350-365hp on the engine now. I logged boost, timing, EGT and Lambda values during the runs. Did three runs first was best, the two after that were 11hp and 15hp down.

Once I've chewed the collected data I will post some findings (if there are any :lol: ). On a quick look I'm running a bit too rich as low as 0,76. With Revo you can only change fueling on whole RPM range so I have to see if there is anything I can do. EGT sensor is after turbo and peaked on the 770-780C region when engine was hot.


----------



## Matt B

You can use lemmiwinks for more adjustability - but do so at your peril


----------



## nate42

Logs that were recorder during dyno run. Apologies for EGT and AFR graphs as the rpm signal doesn't work properly I had to do some tricks on Excel to get them drawn against RPM, that is why they don't look very smooth...

These are from the first run so car was at normal temperature before pull









_Timing_








_Intake manifold and intercooler pressure_








_Lambda_








_EGT after turbo, before temps should be 150C higher..._








_Coolant temperature and air temp @ intake manifold_

Also found archive of dyno pulls done on the same dyno that I was using http://rototest-research.eu/index.php?DN=29


----------



## L33JSA

You could do with sorting those intake temps out......are they reflective of what it's like on the road?


----------



## jamman

Love this build no ego just a real passion comes through for the car.

Only thing I would question is the Revo map get yourself over here for a few days holiday and visit WAK the difference will be NIGHT and DAY.


----------



## nate42

L33JSA said:


> You could do with sorting those intake temps out......are they reflective of what it's like on the road?


Good point, have to do some logs on the road! Looked the later runs and they were even worst. I have big FMIC, so might be just the dyno... will see.



jamman said:


> Love this build no ego just a real passion comes through for the car.
> 
> Only thing I would question is the Revo map get yourself over here for a few days holiday and visit WAK the difference will be NIGHT and DAY.


I HAVE TO do something to that mapping soon, that is a fact. Otherwise I'm just wasting good parts... 
I paid something like 150€ for the Revo Stage3 upgrade, just got quoted for ~5000€ for engine management installed and tuned  I'd like to keep existing wiring, stock ECU location, dashpod fully working, knock sensors and easy to use software on PC.

EFI Euro4 and Vi-Pec are two that I've been looking. Finding skilled tuners is not a problem here and there is also retailers with dynos to both of those softwares. So you get the car tuned by people who are used the the ECU you are getting. Skilled Motronic ECU tuners seems to be hard to find here now a days, every one wants to sell you some aftermarket ECU...

Holiday to UK is one serious option  I have a place to stay in London and I can leave the car to UK for a while if problems arise. So could easily drop it to some shop for a week.

The only downside of stock ECU is that tweaking it afterwards is harder for me. There is a lot of info of the tables and how it works and after looking into it, well I didn't get very exited. I've done enough reverse engineering with comptures in my life already :lol: :lol: And with this kind of cars there is never final setup, so would be nice to be able to do easily some slight adjustments to software later on.

Decisions, decisions... Have to do some driving (and saving :lol before I make my move, I want to keep the car on the road for a while now.


----------



## John_tt

Hello Nate,

The losses between crank and wheel measurement is about 40-50hp on the tt, so your crank power is about 360-370hp.
You are running too rich! You have to make the mixture leaner to get some power. You can go up to 0.81 mixture without any danger. As you have already said you need a proper ecu flash!
About the pressure, did you use the high boost wastegate actuator? If you did I believe that the software you are using at the moment doesn't let you have more boost in case it has a torque limiter. 
With that wastegate canister I easily had 1.70bar+ of constant pressure with the spring in the softest position.


----------



## nate42

John_tt said:


> Hello Nate,
> 
> The losses between crank and wheel measurement is about 40-50hp on the tt, so your crank power is about 360-370hp.
> You are running too rich! You have to make the mixture leaner to get some power. You can go up to 0.81 mixture without any danger. As you have already said you need a proper ecu flash!
> About the pressure, did you use the high boost wastegate actuator? If you did I believe that the software you are using at the moment doesn't let you have more boost in case it has a torque limiter.
> With that wastegate canister I easily had 1.70bar+ of constant pressure with the spring in the softest position.


It gives a lot more boost I'm sure of it, I was just playing safe  If you look at the earlier post you can see that the software is asking 1.4bar closer to redline. So I manged to give it just about what it wants. I've been running on the street with 1.5bar as everything looked OK. I was supposed do that also in the dyno, but at some point I've must have altered the settings and didn't remember it...

Revo software only thinks it's controlling the boost but it doesn't, N75 is connected to car but all connections are capped. I also have very little preload on the wastegate spring at the moment and I think I've finally understood how the Greddy boost controller works :lol:

Picked up the new large port cylinder head from the shop.








_New springs and spring plates in place_








_Valves installed_








_Some extra room was made to one intake valve on all the cylinders_

Channels were also opened to maximize the benefit from +1 mm size valves. Have to take pictures of those with proper camera. Detailed head specs (part list) on the first post of the thread.


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

Looking good there Nate! 8) And gratz for good solid dynorun


----------



## nate42

Nathanho123 said:


> cant wait to see a video


Took a while but here is a cold start video for starters with proper sound :lol: 




Microphone is behind the car and picture is just from cellphone. Planning to do some tunnel run videos on some point, just need an assistant to make it happen.

Last final parts for the new head arrived








_New gaskets_








_New Febi/Bilstein chain and tensioner_

Also got a call from the machine shop that 2.1L stroker crank from 1.9TDI was straight and it is now balanced and polished. I think it is time to start hunting a spare bottom end 8)



Tommi[FIN said:


> ":bbtly37h]Looking good there Nate! 8) And gratz for good solid dynorun


Thanks Tommi. I think lower manifold temps and 1.5 bar at manifold would have give even better results. Next time I think I have to take the bumper out as the fans on the dyno weren't too powerful.

There is still one original line on my power steering system and now that is leaking from one of the joints between rubber hose and hard pipe [smiley=bigcry.gif] New line is ridiculously priced and also goes around the engine bay way too much. Will probably replace the whole line from steering pump to steering rack with AN fittings and braided stainless steel Teflon hose.


----------



## nate42

Found a new block. Gotta love UK car prices as that means perfectly good cars are stripped to parts. Found this 06A 103 021C block from BAM engined 2003 S3 and the price was OK even with £90 shipping to Finland. Block itself is same on APX and BAM. First thing to do is clean it!








_Block with main caps, oil squirters and oil cooler_








_Block seems to be in good nick. Weighted it and it's 40.7kg!! _

Updated rough part list on the first post. Will post every now and then when I get something done. Will take long to finish that is for sure :lol:


----------



## nate42

Some slow progress









_Surprisingly heavy crank was balanced and bearings polished. I was told that it is in very good condition _









_Quick trial fit, seeing is believing, TDI crank goes to 06A block_









_Febi/Bilstein oil pump, oil cooler and water pump_









_Boring OEM colors for the block with excellent VHT paints. Black for block and very hot parts, aluminum for the head , sump, brackets and charge pipe_









_ARP studs and nuts for the crank_









_Notice the fine pitch on the nut end. Fine pitch means more clamping force with smaller tightening torque_









_ACL Race Series rod bearings_









_Forge baffled sump. It doesn't have Audi/VW stamps so the base is non OEM_









_Inside_









_Clever rubber gates_









_Gates let the flow towards the oil pickup pipe_

Started to remove SAI pump and all the hoses that it includes. Won't document that as there are lot of howto's, its just removing parts and adding couple of resistors basically. Have a small oil leak close to filter some where and also loosing power steering fluid slowly. Those are next on my todo list. Other than that car has worked great, it just goes


----------



## Matt B

Good choice getting a baffled sump- I have one on mine but it's a backdraft one - very similar design tho.

Look forward to seeing the build coming together


----------



## MrOloko

Awesome build. Just went through this with my polo GTI that I recently sold. 
Mapped it to 390 BHP. There was more to go but that power in a FWD car was insane :mrgreen: 
That first time you turn the key and it starts is very satisfying.


----------



## UR_TT

Hi Nate,

Any news on your build? Been waiting forever for an update! Or has simlpy "life" gotten in between? Hope everything is ok.

Regards,

Crazy Swede


----------



## nate42

Slowly but surely :lol:

Finally I've been putting some miles on the TT at wasn't so called plain saling from the start. Here some issues I've had that has probably more to do with the cars age than BT build.

First I got oil leak that just got worst. Suspected the oilcooler sandwich plate. So changed o-ring there. Still leaking. Took 
the intake away and changed all seals on the oil cooler mount and it stopped. I think it was the oil pressure sensor that 
leaked.

Then my favourite buddy power steering started to leak again. I've changed the rack and some hoses while doing that but I 
didn't change the long one in front as it costs a fortune. In priciple I think it is stupid to change parts to same type if 
they are known to fail...









_Pipe cutter, to cut the leaking hose away_








_Must have tool, makes very clean cuts_








_Leaky hose cut apart and examined..._








_Plastic hose inside the rubber hose, notice the holes_

Only reason for this part that I can think of is to reduce pressure stress to outer hose and/or act as some kind of pulsation dampener for the pump. As I don't care if there is some powersteering pump vibration on my steering wheel I decided to abannon this design and just replace with a hose I know can take the pressure.

So wanted a hose that can take pressure and is chemically strong. No idea what the power steering fluid is made of and how rubber would handle it... Stainless steel braided PTFE (Teflon) hose is what I went for.








_Below one with ferrule is correct type for braided PTFE hose, upper one is for rubber hose_

There might be easier ways to do it, but I used first Swagelok connector to go from pipe to NPT cone thread. then to that I attached NPT to AN connetor. Then I could connect the braided PTFE hose between.









_Pipe to NPT and NPT to AN fittings_








_NPT cone thread up close_








_Couple of rounds PTFE tape to the thread_








_Then tighten to other fitting_








_All done and painted black_

And now after a month or so from that fix I got another leak... this time it is behind the engine some where in the middle of the rack... Can't believe my luck.

Too long post already, I put the build related stuff to another post :lol:


----------



## nate42

Some help would be great on how to tackle the lag after changing gear. Problem is more noticeable on higer hears. This happes probably with every turbo car, but I think mine is far from optimal. With K04 playing with stiffer springs on Forge P007 diverter valve solved the problem. With a fast shift from 3rd to 4th I didn't loose all the boost.








_You can see that time lost in shifting from 3rd to 4th is about 0.3s, this was with K04 Revo Stage2 software and parts_








_Blue curve 4th to 5th and red 3rd to 4th_

As you can see it takes 0.7s from 3rd to 4th and the we go again...

I'm as fast from 100 km/h to 200 km/h no matter 3rd-4th-5th or 4th and 5th (like in the picture) that is how much time I loose shifting. From that 12.4s 4th+5th run you can see that it takes 1.5s to get back on power... I think this car should do 100-200 km/h close to 11.0s if I fix that problem. Then I can go 3rd-4th-5th.

So big turbo boys, help me out here. Should disable the turbos own diverter valve, then I could use that spring trick again? What normal delay on gear changes?

This could be software / boost controller related also... As car reacts to throttle fast and builds boost really fast when you have enough rpm. It is with shifts that the issue really appears. I have the pipewerx 200cel cat at the car as I just took the MOT. Have to remove that to make sure it's not blocking the flow.

Ah forgot G200 sensor broke and threw ESP light on. That was easy fix just bought a new OEM sensor. Moment of shame when I got the new part and the package said "made in Finland"... We should know how to make a simple sensor like that properly 

The what come to new motor. Some parts have arrived, nothing interesting, just new OEM parts. Missing bolts etc. When the intake was off the car for fixing oil leaks I took few pictures next to SEM.
















Then current vs new big port head

















Missed the first trackday of the year, have to make another try soon. Busy times in life, but not giving up on this hobby yet


----------



## V6RUL

A remap with 'no lift shift' or change your box to DSG..
Steve


----------



## jamman

V6RUL said:


> ......change your box to DSG..
> Steve


 :roll:

I really do think you need to be looking at the mapping Nate I will bet my life the Revo mapping will cause all sorts of niggles


----------



## Matt B

Log your ignition timing afr and boost


----------



## UR_TT

Cant help you on the mapping issues, but great to hear that you are doin some progress at least. 
Now take Mr Murphy steadily around the neck and show him the door and keep pushing. I know him all to well and it´s not a man you want hanging around your garage  [smiley=cheers.gif]

//U


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> A remap with 'no lift shift' or change your box to DSG..
> Steve


DSG :lol: no that won't be in the cards. That Vi-Pec ECU I've been drooling can handle 'no lift shifts'. I think they call it flat shift. It can also read info from fuel line sensor that detects if you have gas or ethanol or a mix in a tank. Then change to correct map accordingly. CAN bus is supported so tacho/etc works. They have a plug in model for 1.8T
http://www.vi-pec.com/ecus/iseries-feature-matrix
http://www.vi-pec.com/ecus/iseries__pluginecu








_Vi-Pec plug in ECU_

Software looks easy to use and you can download it free from their website. It comes with 1.8T plug in file, so it is interesting to see what it can do to your TT.








_View from Vi-Pec software_
Here is a Youtube video showing the software in action 




Anyone here using Vi-Pec or has experience about it?

Integrated Engineering uses these ECU's and they got these 1.8T based 800hp engines with smooth idle. Good enough for them, should be good enough for me.

So was about to order some pistons and rods, but I think instead I buy this ECU and put the engine build on hold for a while. New ECU will be useful for me before the new engine also. So next winter it is new ECU learning and install  Have to fill those boring winter nights with something :lol: Now I just want to drive the car and put miles on it. It is drivable with current setup, but could be better as I've described.

With quick look I found out that we have a tuner in Finland that uses and sells these Vipec ECU's. So I can take the car there for fine tuning. I'm planning to install the ECU and make the car run on my own. Time to start hunting good price for that ECU.



Matt B said:


> Log your ignition timing afr and boost


I'll have to do more of this too. But they have been pretty steady. AFR a bit on the rich side still, but better like that than the other way. Boost stays nice and flat and very conservative timing. I´ll post logs when I have time to do some runs again. Could be interesting to log these over a gear change to see what actually happens. VAG-COM logging is so slow that it doesn't give too many log points unfortunately, so might not tell a whole lot.



jamman said:


> I really do think you need to be looking at the mapping Nate I will bet my life the Revo mapping will cause all sorts of niggles


You are right. Most annoying is that if I find what is wrong there isn't much I can do about it... That's why new ECU has jumped on top of my shopping list.

Well new steering rack is actually on top of the list [smiley=bigcry.gif] It is a real pain that ZF Factory refurbished ones were out of stock in Europe when mine broke. Still haven't located where it leaks. Have to remove the steering rack dust boot to make sure it comes from there. As looking from the dripping point in theory it could also be the connector on the steel line on the rack itself, those I have in stock  And that could be DIY fix.








_I mean this connector_

Very eager to get the car to track, test the new stiffer springs and new pace. First work trip, then family holiday so that has to wait for at least a couple of long weeks...


----------



## s3tt

Are you still running the n249?

What most people don't realise is the n249 opens the dv before actual throttle shut vacuum to stop an over shoot of boost. So if you still have it installed it's good for the turbo as removing it or adding a stronger spring just leads to an over spool on the turbo..


----------



## s3tt

As for ecu I run a custom built emulator on my TT. It runs in real time and can be hooked into a laptop and tuned in real time as well. Software is free via tuner pro and you can do it all for less than £400.. Unfortunately the software needs you to configure but I can bet it's alot cheaper than other options.


----------



## nate42

s3tt said:


> Are you still running the n249?
> 
> What most people don't realise is the n249 opens the dv before actual throttle shut vacuum to stop an over shoot of boost. So if you still have it installed it's good for the turbo as removing it or adding a stronger spring just leads to an over spool on the turbo..


Removed n249 with all the other cold start emission junk a while ago. Both DV's see the manifold pressure, one hose that has a T-piece close to DV's. Stiffer spring to the DV that is integrated to turbo is what I was thinking. Should be possible to change the spring if I take the intake apart.

FullRace sells stiffer spring in US, but haven't find a seller in EU. Probably won't cure the problem, but will need this later for sure when running more boost. So might try it. I just think minimum shipping charge will make it stupid expensive.









Interesting that ECU you got. I live in the city so don't have open roads (also very little skills :lol for tuning. So I value highly if I can get it right the first time. I admit that Unitronic, Eurodyne etc are tempting for a DIY guy like me, but this time I don't want to take the risk. I think what you save in the ECU price might cost you in labour when tuning, if you aren't doing it all by yourself.


----------



## V6RUL

Lots of plus points for the EFR setup ie integral BOV and WG, but will the WG cope...
I'm looking into this for mine but the 8000 series.
Steve


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Lots of plus points for the EFR setup ie integral BOV and WG, but will the WG cope...
> I'm looking into this for mine but the 8000 series.
> Steve


Very happy with EFR Steve and no problems with boost creep. I'm still running low power level for this turbo so should suffer from boost creep if it was an issue with the turbo. EFR 8374 would suit your mental motor nicely, good for 800hp or something crazy like that 

I think the steering rack is fixed for now or at least its not leaking as much as before :lol: Changed the small o-ring and metal gasket on the connector pictured on above post. On LHD car that connector is very close to downpipe, there is a cheat shield between but maybe the heat cycles have made it loose. That metal seal thread opened suspiciously easy...

Then happy motoring for couple of weeks and suddenly ESP light comes on. First thoughts were not the acceleration sensors again... Read ESP codes:
*01314 - Engine Control Module
79-00 - Please check Fault Codes*

So it tells me to check engine fault codes... looked for those:
*16486 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Signal too Low
P0102 - 35-00 - -*

Looked for MAF reading at idle








_That is way too low, so MAF is dead_

I changed to a new MAF just in case when I put the new turbo in, so had the old one in stock still. Changed that and much better.








_After MAF change_

Car had some trouble at idle with broken MAF, revs were bouncing a little and it was very lean 1.1 to 1.3, same thing when cruising it went lean. When MAF is working it idles and cruises at 0.99 to 1.01 typically. You can't tell that it's going lean, I couldn't feel it driving but I could see it from the VEMS gauge that it's not good. Remember check engine light was not on. So driving with ESP light on can also do damage to your engine!

Pretty happy that MAF is not needed with new Vi-PEC ECU, it controls fuelling with intake manifold pressure/temperature and RPM. My setup is bottoms the MAF so it has to work quite hard. That is why the lifetime was not that great. MAF has a wire that is kept to certain temperature with voltage. More air flow cooling the wire means more voltage. And more time/cycles on high voltage it gets the faster it wears, that is my guess.


----------



## s3tt

how does the new ecu control the ESP/ABS? as it needs a maf signal for load to the esp controller to work properly


----------



## nate42

s3tt said:


> how does the new ecu control the ESP/ABS? as it needs a maf signal for load to the esp controller to work properly


You can connect MAF to ECU and maybe it is even needed, but I can go bigger and put S4/RS4 MAF that should take the beating better. MAF is not needed for fuelling though, that is done with MAP (with temperature correction) and RPM. There is Torque Management menus in the software so I think Vi-PEC has that covered also. There are all the things imaginary: air condition clutch control, wheel speeds, motor fans, cruise control etc... so at this point I believe it can do it all. That is to be seen, some how I don't think it will be 'plug and play' easy


----------



## nate42

This arrived today, I don't know how I can resist installing it right away  
Maybe a quote from tuner to perfect the mapping will slow me down :lol: :lol:


















Any experience on these with a TT is welcome!


----------



## nate42

Had some time to work on the car. Fitted RS4 MAF housing to OEM airbox. It fits just... after some dremel work of course  
















_RS4 MAF housing fitted to OEM airbox_

Have to take some measurements and calculate right values to get accurate readings from the bigger housing, sensor will stay the same. They don't have to be spot on just to keep the ESP happy.

Then took the old ECU out and Vi-Pec fitted straight on as it should. Today will put the power on and start testing sensors etc. Vi-Pec has analog inputs 0-5V. My VEMS wideband lambda sensor has 0-5V output  I hope I get those too to work together so I don't need to buy another wideband. My APX has a narrow band lambda and for closed loop tuning of AFR wideband is needed.









_OEM vs Vi-Pec ECU_

Also found a tuner that is interested to help and make the software. Hardest part will probably be closed loop control of the boost pressure. I want to do that for best boost response.


----------



## fixitagaintomoz

this will be an interesting one to keep an eye on! keep up the good work!


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## nate42

All the important values appeared the ECU once connected. Have done some maintenance before dropping the car to tuner next week.

-Haldex oil and filter. Filled trough inspection hole without spills. Have done this job couple of times from drain hole and it was messy.
-Motor oil Motul 8100 X-Clean 5w30 and Bosch filter as usual
-Spark plugs NGK BKR7E this time gapped to 0.7mm, I've been running 0.8mm before but as we are probably going up on power a bit decided to put a little smaller gap to give easier job to coils
-Continental Conti Winter Contact TS 830P tires fitted as temps will soon be below freezing here. These are central europe winter tyres so decent to drive without snow also. Will take a pair of Toyo R1R's to dyno just in case of traction problems.
-Also noticed that battery levels where not where they should. I'm running two Odyssey PC680´s. C-TEK charger (orange bit on the picture) has refresh mode, used that on both of the batteries separately and fully charged voltage got up nicely 8) 
-Added middle silencer (Milltek) to exhaust to save the ears of the tuner

550cc injectors might become a limiting factor, I have 4bar FPR to up them to ~620cc. That should be enough.

New motor will run also with E85 ethanol and need huge injectors. Suitable are expensive (like Injector Dynamics ID1300) so will go with the ones I have for now...









_Trial connection of the ECU, simple and all looked good_

Exited to see what kind of curves we get. If closed loop tuning of turbo is successful then some extra midrange punch is possible. Not going for max HP at this point, instead a level that keeps the temperatures in check so that I can take the car to track without constant fear of melting something :lol:


----------



## V6RUL

Injector Dynamics are a very good brand and I'm running 1000s, but I do run 6 of them.
Steve


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## nate42

V6RUL said:


> Injector Dynamics are a very good brand and I'm running 1000s, but I do run 6 of them.
> Steve


Yep ID 1000's are legendary. Good idle should be possible with 1300's and need to go big when using ethanol and only four pots. Ethanol gives huge gains before boost, that is also important factor for us running a tiny 06A block 

Forgot to mention that I had torqued the cam cover to spec with new gasket. Looks like I've should have checked it after a while as oil in the spark plug threads tells it hasn't been tight enough... Other than that old spark plugs looked good to me.








_Your spark plug thread will look oily if cam cover is not tight enough  _


----------



## V6RUL

The V6 has rubber seals between the cover and head, these don't last forever and should be changed eventually..
Not sure about 4 pot seals.
Steve


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> The V6 has rubber seals between the cover and head, these don't last forever and should be changed eventually..
> Not sure about 4 pot seals.
> Steve


4 pot is the same type seal. I've changed the seal every time I've opened it, so I thing tightening could do the trick this time.

Vems wideband lambda is connected to ECU








_Vems connector end. Output cable soldered. White one is RPM input to Vems that I never got to work properly_








_ECU plug opened and 0-5V signal connected to aux input pin_

I was told that car runs fine on AWD mode on rollers, maybe this is because it has blue haldex controller. I've hear that Haldex cars can be tricky on four wheel drive rollers.
















_On rollers_

OEM knock sensor are not showing on the ECU by default so that is something I have to do some research on [smiley=book2.gif]


----------



## s3tt

They čan work ok on DD rollers but they can also have a "fit" every once in a while. Early haldex controllers won't work, the later ones seem to be but do again have moments. From experience, running the in fwd and esp off is by far the best anyway, it's not going to make any difference to your power readings


----------



## Grahamstt

Usually removing the abs fuse allows the car to run in 2wd mode, this gives a better result usually.
You can do this even with the blue controller.

Looks like you're making some more progress now Nate


----------



## nate42

Previous dyno trip I did with haldex controller unplugged and ESP off. As that is what everybody is telling. I think these DD dynos can calculate the engine power no matter running 2wd or 4wd mode.

Progress looks good at the moment as a pro is working on the car not me :lol: Found out that ECU should have internal knock control circuit so it should understand those Bosch sensors. It's just not turned ON by default. Might need some calibration.


----------



## nate42

Progress got halted by oil pressure warning that suddenly appeared... I was very sceptical that there would be issues with oil pressure, so first thing to check was the oil pressure switch that gives the signal to dash pod. Basically it is just a switch that activates if oil pressure drops below 1.2 - 1.6 bars. Alarm is RPM dependant, red somewhere that at idle it is not monitoring the pressure only after 2000rpm. If somebody has facts confirm please. Pressure switch was changed (and original tested and it works) and still the same thing. I have an aftermarket oil pressure sensor fitted (APX engine doesn't have one standard, don't know if BAM has), signal from that indicated that oil pressure is good and rises with revs.

Then RPM's suddenly jammed to 3000 at the dash pod. So dash pod was thinking 3000 is zero. Signal coming from the new ECU is showing right RPM and it worked for a while... so dash pod is faulty. It has been once repaired for broken motors and LCD. This time looks like it's the ECU of the dash pod is dead. Luckily you don't need dash pod for tuning the engine, so we can continue and I just have to take the car to dash pod repair when it's mapped.

Always something, but if this was easy everybody would do it 

I hope next time more interesting news :lol:


----------



## nate42

After dash pod issues tuner started to add boost. Injectors were maxing out much sooner than expected. Reason being the fuel pressure is trailing at higher revs. It can't keep the constant difference to manifold pressure. Fuel filter was changed recently so this means OEM in-tank pump is restricting in-line Bosch 044. Of course with bigger injectors you could go around this problem but that would be a dirty fix.

Don't feel like opening the fuel tank and also couldn't find upgrade in-tank solution. So surge tank has to be installed. Surge tank means that there will only be pressure between in-line pump and fuel pressure regulator.








_Surge tank connections_

This means pressure switch for in-line pump that I have installed that keeps the pump quiet when off boost has to go and it will be always on. It makes some noise... So this 034 Motorsport solution looked ideal.








_Fully Enclosed FP34 044 Fuel Surge Tank_

Couldn't resist and also bought 3-5bar adjustable fuel pressure regulator to stretch those [email protected] injectors a bit further.








_3-5 bar adjustable fuel regulator to OEM fuel line_

I will drive the car back to my garage and after surge tank is installed then back to tuner.

My only concern is where in the tank the surge tank will return the fuel. Optimally this would be a as high point as possible to make sure it gets replacement air to surge tank when needed and not gas (more resistance to suck that).








_Fuel tank connetions_

What number is return line?


----------



## Grahamstt

Nate

I have replied to your pm with a link to the surge tank that I have (034) showing the return to the fuel tank. The reg return is intercepted and then continued to the fuel tank so you don't need an extra return pipe you use the existing one.

Very similar to your diagram except the 044 pump is inside the surge tank (which keeps the noise down)

Graham


----------



## s3tt

What bhp were you at when 550s started showing issues? Do you know the duty cycle and what m/s they where running..

Are they actual Bosch 550s? Or genesis or copies?


----------



## nate42

s3tt said:


> What bhp were you at when 550s started showing issues? Do you know the duty cycle and what m/s they where running..
> 
> Are they actual Bosch 550s? Or genesis or copies?


They are genuine Bosch items. Duty cycle was going over 100% on the top of the rev range. Car had this issue already with Revo Stage3 software I just thought it was bad map and that is why it went lean in the end. But real reason was probably duty cycle maxing out because of fuel pressure drop.








_Lambda with Revo Stage3 map, you can see it going lean_

When problem was noticed aim was 0.8 lambda, injectors went over 100% duty cycle at ~300hp :lol: If there is one bar fuel pressure missing [email protected] becomes a [email protected]

Next I'll take car to dash pod fix, we have a skilled guy in Helsinki for that. Then it's time to crawl under the car for surge tank install. Photos to follow once I get to work. Then back to dyno.


----------



## s3tt

Are you sure the fpr is working properly ?

3 bar fuel pressure with 1 bar boost in the inlet then becomes 2 bar fuel pressure net. Even if 3 bar in the fuel rail 1 bar acts against it..

The reason we have rising fuel pressure is to hold 3 bar net..my point is that you might not actually be missing 1 bar fuel pressure as you have 3 in the rail..

To actually get 3 bar fuel you needed 4.5bar if 1.5 bar boost acting against the flow..


----------



## nate42

s3tt said:


> Are you sure the fpr is working properly ?
> 
> 3 bar fuel pressure with 1 bar boost in the inlet then becomes 2 bar fuel pressure net. Even if 3 bar in the fuel rail 1 bar acts against it..
> 
> The reason we have rising fuel pressure is to hold 3 bar net..my point is that you might not actually be missing 1 bar fuel pressure as you have 3 in the rail..
> 
> To actually get 3 bar fuel you needed 4.5bar if 1.5 bar boost acting against the flow..


What I've understood is there is spring that gives you fuel pressure difference for example 3bars. Then the hose coming to FPR from intake manifold will help the spring and add force (or remove force when idle and vacuum at intake) to compensate the manifold pressure. So injectors will always spray to manifold with same pressure as the difference between manifold and fuel rail is fixed.

Tested with two FPR's 3bar and 4bar. At idle they were working properly showing 2.5bar (3bar - 0.5bar vacuum) and 3.5bar (4bar - 0.5bar vacuum).

When boost started to rise fuel pressure also raised. It just couldn't keep the pressure same on high revs. If I have steady boost of 1.5bar with 3bar FPR my fuel rail pressure should be 4.5bar trough the whole rev range. This didn't happen. Pressure was dropping ~1 bar at higer revs from what it should have been (4.5bar) and that's why injectors were maxing out early. That is what I meant with one bar missing.

My explanation on the previous post was not very clear :lol: :lol:


----------



## Grahamstt

Was the 044 running as well?
The lack of fuel could be the std pump isn't supplying the 044 quick enough?
My understanding is the flow of the std pump is ample as the 044 takes away the pressure loading so it can flow freely.
What is condition of your fuel filter - this could restrict flow


----------



## nate42

Grahamstt said:


> Was the 044 running as well?
> The lack of fuel could be the std pump isn't supplying the 044 quick enough?
> My understanding is the flow of the std pump is ample as the 044 takes away the pressure loading so it can flow freely.
> What is condition of your fuel filter - this could restrict flow


044 was on "always one mode" on the dyno, I have a switch for that. 
That is exactly what I think. I will investigate when I get the car. I think I can force the fuel pump on from the ECU so that I can run gas to bucket at different pressures and measure the performance. Small fuel lines will also add resistance. Will change the fuel filter also, it was done about 15k miles ago last time. Looks like the OEM pumps flow is not enough even the in-line pump takes care of the pressure. I report when I get some facts.


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## nate42

Got cracking with fuel issues. First wanted to measure where we are with current 044 in-line setup. So adjusted fuel pressure to 4.4bar (imagined situation of 3bar fuel pressure + 1.4bar boost). I was getting only 0.75 litres/min!!! Car is not running so had battery charger plugged in and voltage was ~12V during the test. Of course with 14V when alternator is pushing amps it would be higher.

Changed fuel filter and then measured again, same result, so fuel filter was not restricting the flow.

So no wonder injectors started to max out way sooner as tuner had to compensate the fuel pressure drop with injection time.

Simple calculation reveals that to get 400hp at full boost you need around 2.0L of fuel per minute.
400hp ~ 320g/s of air
1 l of gas weights ~ 750g
full boost AFR 12.5









_Adjustable FPR_

I found from Bentley manual that tank pump can push 1.8l/min 3bar fuel on a good day.








_OEM pump flow voltage chart_

I will measure the unpressurised performance of OEM pump also.

I will try to avoid any restrictions for the fuel to enter surge tank to make OEM pumps job as easy as possible. Even drilled fitting a bit bigger to maximize flow.









_Fuel line going to surge tank bottom_


----------



## jamman

Always impressed with your attention to the details, good work.


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

I have allmost identical pump setup as you have and I don't have any fuel issues. Stock pump is feeding 044 that makes pressure, stock is just moving fuel to 044. No surge tanks or nothing, just added 044 before fuelrail.
There's something wrong because mine pushed allmost 450 from crank with 2.3bars and E85.. Lambda 0.84


----------



## nate42

Tommi[FIN said:


> ":1wx6otce]I have allmost identical pump setup as you have and I don't have any fuel issues. Stock pump is feeding 044 that makes pressure, stock is just moving fuel to 044. No surge tanks or nothing, just added 044 before fuelrail.
> There's something wrong because mine pushed allmost 450 from crank with 2.3bars and E85.. Lambda 0.84


I know this setup should work :evil: Never measured the output so I don't know if it has ever worked for me or broken recently. 044 got electricity straight from the battery with short and thick wires so shouldn't be electrics issue either.

Measured the stock pump on 12V:

3.5 l/min to 0.0 bar (so will keep the surge tank full)
0.9 l/min through 4.4bar

So 044 and additional fuel lines were just restricting the flow... Let the battery charge over night so might be it was a bit flat also when I measured the system yesterday. 044 might be broken also, when it runs it sounds right but will measure it next. Would be nicer to measure at 14V but I don't have a power supply with enough amps.

Tommi good to know you run E85, how much kilometres you have put on to your car with that setup? Any issues?

Going to be tight fitting the surge tank to engine bay. Will use the space were the SAI pump used to be.


----------



## nate42

*Bosch 044 is dead* :x Doesn't pump anything, does make noise and rotate but nothing comes out. So have to buy a new pump.

What killed it? Well probably my clever idea of pressure switch that activates it when there is boost. Pump saw thousands of starts/stops and didn't like it...? I ask if a friend he can do an autopsy to the pump and tell me why it's not working.

Will test the in-line setup first when I get a new pump, if that works surge tank install can wait as it looks a bit tricky. Snow is coming and I need the Quattro :lol:

eBay bargain appeared for future use. Looks thick, anyone installed one? Do they fit all right with stock fans or are upgraded slim ones needed?
















_Direnza radiator_


----------



## Tommi[FIN]

nate42 said:


> Tommi good to know you run E85, how much kilometres you have put on to your car with that setup? Any issues?


~20k in this setup, from that ~15k on E85. No big worries, some small mishaps. Opened bottomend couple weeks ago, all looked good.

Keep up the good work Nate. :wink:


----------



## nate42

Went to http://www.finjector.com which is close by, great shop for injectors and fuel related stuff. They also sell VAG connectors that always get broken. They ship worldwide. They had 044 pumps in stock.








_New Bosch 0 580 254 044 fuel pump_

Connected that to car the same way I had the previous one and both fuel pumps on it was pushing 3 litres/min at 4.4bar pressure. Very happy not far from advertised 3.3 l/min @ 5bar. Problem solved, happy days 

Next I will take the car back to dyno (I hope soon) to continue mapping.

Learned interesting stuff about injectors at the shop. Injectors can be listed as different flow rate and the only difference are the size of the small holes in the disc that is at the tip. Common mod to do is remove that disc completely to get the maximum flow. Injectors don't have different patterns when you go big so disc is useless. Bosch motorsport even has their own injector now that has the disc already removed I was told.


----------



## nate42

After some thinking I realized it is stupid to map the car for these 550cc injectors if I go bigger anyway with this motor on E85 (85% ethanol) gas. So will buy new injectors and flexfuel sensor first and then take it to mapping. Let's see how it goes maybe we can do ethanol maps also at the same time.

Took the broken fuel pump apart. From my opinion it was broken because the car was standing still and some moisture got in the pump, there was visible rust. Then this rust probably jammed the pump and when started plastic clips broke and after that only the motor was rotating.









_Parts that were broken from the bottom of the motor circulated_








_Slots where the plastic bits go_








_Place where the bits were cracked from_








_Corrosion on the magnet_








_Corrosion on the motor_

Lesson learnt don't let your car stand too long, drive it


----------



## nate42

Shopping done.

Got modded Bosch EV14 inejctors from http://www.finjector.com Balanced set and notice the tip where the mesh is removed. This is a short injector with long tip so extension plug were included









_1300cc/min injectors balanced set 2% tolerance_









_Modified tips close up_









_Ethanol sensor, might get fuel temperature out from it too..._

Next fitting...


----------



## nate42

New injectors are in. Massive pain to put everything (mostly fuel pump and lines) back to tiny engine bay. Didn't remember to take pictures of engine bay, but ethanol sensor found a place next to gas evaporation tank.

Was a bit nervous to start the car with new injectors. There is a value in Vi-PEC called "Master Fuel" and it is milliseconds. It is overall trim of the fuel injectors (detailed explanation on excellent Vi-PEC help file is someone is interested). For stock car it was 21ms (380cc injectors), tuner had set it to 11ms (550cc and 4bar FPR). So I made a guess and set it to 5ms for 1230cc injectors with 3bar FPR. 








_Maste Fuel value on Main Fuel settings_

Then I updated the injector dead time values.








_Injector dead time settings_

After that it was just deep breath and start the engine. It fired up but was running rich. I tried to set Master Fuel lower but 4ms was as low as it allowed. Still rich so started correcting the value by hand and got the idle Lambda to 1.0

I let the car idle awhile and tuned the cells close to idle. Then disabled closed loop lambda correction and started Quick Tune. Quick Tune basically tunes your AFR automatically based on your lambda reading. Car was running rich so took it to slow spin and managed to get the basic cruising cells tuned.

Tested also the logging feature, wow that is nice. It stores all possible parameters for you and you can make graphs and play the log afterwards. 5 minutes made 12MB file, as a .zip file one tenth of that.









_Sample view of the logging_

Vi-PEC also has handy view where it places the data points to fuel map, so you see where corrections are needed.









_Correction view_

You can see from that "quick tuned" cells are already close to target. This is enough so that I can drive the car safely to dyno. Before that I still need to wire the ethanol sensor to ECU and test it, that is next.


----------



## nate42

Ethanol sensor wired








_Ethanol sensor_









_Engine bay_









_Nothing to see here, it's a stock motor  _

I'll write a longer post on wiring/config of ethanol sensor later. Looked also MAF and the signal is not linear 0-5V, it looks tricky to get accurate reading out from it. Good that I don't need accurate MAF reading as ECU operates based on intake manifold pressure.


----------



## nate42

Wired the Ethanol sensor in the end to Digital input no.6 that is pin 40 on the ECU. Put a little Ethanol (E85) to tank and value changed right away, sensor works  Also the fuel temperature value from the ethanol sensor looks sensible.









_Oscilloscope view of the signal_

Then next was playing with boost control. With some educated guesses :lol: and trial and error managed to get the PID controlled boost control to work. I'm talking full throttle now. Second gear was a bit eager to overshoot, bigger gears are easy as the there is more time to react. I was running the engine with ~1.6bar.

Why I'm hyping about this closed loop PID boost control? Well in theory your boost level changes according to your throttle pedal input. With Revo map and manual boost controller it was all or nothing on acceleration. Getting on and off the boost is jumpy when running a lot of boost.

So at this point car was running quite good on full throttle. 3rd gear passing times 80-120 km/h (50-75mph) were down from previous 2.65s to 2.40s. Then I decided to put the latest firmware V5.2.2 to ECU. This messed up my fuel table, so decided to try with new advanced Modelled Multifuel mode. Traditional mode was very straight forward and easy to follow








_Traditional fueling mode on Vi-Pec_

Modelled has much more inputs








_Modelled fueling mode on Vi-Pec_

It will take time to get that setup right, but it will give the best results and true flexfuel capabilities. I want to have the car running at least as good as it was running on traditional fueling mode before the dyno trip. Now the weather is so slippery you can't do any pulls.

As you can see 



  8)

Good old friend steering rack is leaking again. Looks like it's same place as last time,fitting next to downpipe. So changing the o-ring helped a while, it is too hot for o-rings there I suspect. Have to drop the subframe and investigate [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## nate42

OK has been quiet lately. Car runs quite OK, but cold starts and cold idle was quite bad. There were no issues with 550cc injectors that I remember so this was probably due to injectors being so big and not working on the linear area at idle.

I wanted to get the data for injectors to be able to tune to E85 use. I didn't quite know what all I need and also didn't find anyone that was particularly interested on doing these measurements for me...  So decided I'll do them myself 8)









_So this arrived to my garage. It is one of those cheap Chinese ones called MST-A360_









_For fluid decided to use ASNU Flow - Rite that is designed for the job_

So connected injectors all filled up and of course the pump doesn't work... I cursed the Chines and decided to tore it apart.









_Inside of MST-A360 looks pretty simple, two power supply's and a board _

DC pump is controller with PWM (pulse width modulation) and there was Texas Instruments chip for it. I'm no electronics pro just googled the chip numbers :lol: There was adjusting screw that looked to control the current through the chip. Twisted that and pump sparked to life. I was pretty happy with that fix.









_PWM chip on the right and R18 is the current limiter_

After that got it running. Tested with my old 550cc injectors and found out that shortest pulse width for them was 1.3msec. Found out also that they are not nicely matched set, might be that they are dirty. I can only increase the pulse width in the increments of 0.1msec, it might not be enough to get as accurate data as I need. My oscilloscope has wave form output so might be able to run the injectors with that for more precise control. I keep you posted once I get some measurements done.

If what I'm doing here makes no sense here is a good read of what I'm trying to achieve: http://injectordynamics.com/articles/low-pulse-tech/ Their style of writing is a bit "American", making the injector business sound like rocket science :lol:


----------



## V6RUL

I use the ID1000 and they are trouble free.
Steve


----------



## nate42

V6RUL said:


> I use the ID1000 and they are trouble free.
> Steve


Those Injector Dynamics are Bosch made injectors also, comes with needed paperwork. Looked at ID1300 but after VAT price with EURO diving is ~260€ per injector plus shipping! Too much for me. These Bosch injectors are pretty much the same mechanically but without paperwork and are 90€ per injector from a local store. So it was easy choice to go this route. Of course after shopping injector bench etc would have been cheaper to get Injector Dynamics, but would have missed all the fun and chance to learn something on the way. I like the hard way :lol:

Will be interesting to see how these injectors perform against Injector Dynamics data.


----------



## V6RUL

Wow..that is expensive.
I got mine from the US but shipped as part of an undervalued consignment.

It's good to find your own path and some peeps may encourage that as it adds good knowledge to the forum..but you will always get the odd person who can't understand that a different path is taken..
Steve


----------



## nate42

First measurements done. Chinese bench is not very accurate, setting pulse width to ie 1.5 msec gives you 1.56 msec... No biggie connected my oscilloscope to the system to monitor pulse width during test. My test was three minutes per pulse width. Pulse frequency 12.5HZ, so 2250 pulses, 3bar and 14V. Worked up from where injectors started to pulse with 0.1 msec increments. That is the best resolution this machine can do. Measurement glasses doesn't start from zero... :roll: This means I had to add estimated volume below zero line to all the measurements.









_Flow vs pulse width graph_

First measuring point that gave somewhat linear results between injectors was measured pulse width of 1.46 msec (machine adjusted to 1.4msec). Linear area seems to starts around 1.8 msec. Area between is useable if corrected in the ECU.

Not 100% happy with these measurements. Might build something to feed the pulse to injector from waveform generator, this would give me greater resolution. Then I could also find out how battery voltage effects on injector flow. Noticed that with lower pressure injectors can respond to shorter pulse widths. That info is useless for a car with FPR.


----------



## nate42

Injectors are under control now I think. In the end I set the minimum injector pulse width to 0.2ms








_Injector Dead Time table for EV14_

So shortest pulse width is 0.2ms plus value from the table above. Idle areas are pretty close to to lower limit of the injectors but still OK.

Been running very safe fueling on boost (rich) and played little with boost settings. I've managed to to get the car to give boost based on throttle pedal position. This is really nice feature.








_Safe AFR target map_

I changed to stiffer wastegate canister all ready earlier on this project because had problems with setting the boost with external boost controller. Did now a run against waste gate spring with no boost controller interference, it creeps to almost 1.4 bar at redline. I think with looser wastegate canister it was giving around 1.0 bar...








_Minimum boost I can run when flooring from low revs_

So this is basically my MOT power level 

I've set up now the boost level request like this. Note that on this chart 100MPa means ATM so 0 bar of boost








_Boost target depending on throttle pedal position. When flooring target is 1.6bar, it holds it easy_

I'm very happy with this feature. Accelerating smoothly was not an option before (with external boost controller), you have to lift - loose boost - and the floor it again. It might not sound like a big difference, but when you are on boost lets say 5000rpm 1.2 or 1.6 bar makes a huge difference. This will be handy on track going out from the bends.

I have fixed all little things and car is ready to go back to dyno for mapping, both gasoline and E85.


----------



## nate42

Once software is finished I'm expecting ~400hp with gasoline on the dyno and who knows what happens with E85. Exhaust flow might become a limiting factor so installed pressure sender to de-cat pipe. I still have Milltek 2.75" exhaust with middle and backbox. There are talks that it could be restrictive. So I want see if that is true and measure the back pressure levels on WOT. I only had 0-4bar sender it has 1% accuracy so should be OK for the job. ECU has 5V output and input so I can wire it straight to ECU for logging.








_Pressure sender installed on de-cat pipe. Beautiful craftsmanship :lol: _


----------



## s3_nick

Hi Nate ive got one of these ECU's on my big turbo MK1 S3 im having a little trouble with my throttle cold start the throttle hunts continuously until the car has warmed up and also when coming to lights the revs drop to say 400-500 rpm then hunt and settle I don't suppose you had any issues with your throttle did you could I possibly see your throttle table and idle fuel table to compare it to my own if you didn't mind?

Tried to PM you but im a new member here you see so it wont let me 

Regards Nick


----------



## nate42

Hi Nick

Cold start was bad for me also. What I did was that I logged AFR right from the start, had to up the enrichment tables so that AFR was OK. Also raised the idle a bit. It is better now but not perfect. There are so many things to adjust and haven't studied all of them yet. Cold idle is not so interesting but of course should be sorted. My car stalls when cold if I lift the throttle and turn at the same time. Power steering pump draws current from the alternator and that is enough resistance to the motor to cause it to stall when revs are dropping at the same time. I'll PM you maybe you are allowed to reply with your email address so that I can send you my ECU file.



s3_nick said:


> Hi Nate ive got one of these ECU's on my big turbo MK1 S3 im having a little trouble with my throttle cold start the throttle hunts continuously until the car has warmed up and also when coming to lights the revs drop to say 400-500 rpm then hunt and settle I don't suppose you had any issues with your throttle did you could I possibly see your throttle table and idle fuel table to compare it to my own if you didn't mind?
> 
> Tried to PM you but im a new member here you see so it wont let me
> 
> Regards Nick


----------



## nate42

These arrived today  My third set of OZ Superleggera wheels  Some R32 owner from UK was nice enough to send this set to me, huge thanks for that.








_OZ Superleggera with Toyo R888 GG compound_
Will be nice to see if there is much difference between R888 and R1R in track.


----------



## s3_nick

Still won't let me reply because I'm so new  my email address is [email protected] I will keep a look out for your email  it's nice to find someone with the same ECU to confer with


----------



## nate42

Decided to be brave and go out and try flat shifting. It went better than expected  
Gathered info mostly from excellent help files of Vipec software. Ended up with these settings:








_Settings for flat shifting_

So simply the shift period is determined by clutch switch that TT has as standard, signal found on DI 4. ECU will start flat shift event if: RPM above 5500, Throttle pedal position over 95% and speed above 30 kph.

So third gear floor it, the keep throttle pinned to floor, clutch down, next gear, clutch up and that's it.

There are settings on tables that can be tuned per gear. I list mine here just for reference if someone wants to try them AT THEIR OWN RISK. Used same settings for all gears to start with.
Cut % for ignition: 90 (percentage of sparks removed during shift)
Torque introduction time: 200ms (time that ignition retard and spark cut are returned to normal)
Ignition trim: -20 degree (amount of ignition trim during shift)
Fuel trim: 5% (amount of fuel added)









_3rd-4th-5th gear pull_

Could change faster but I was taking it easy as I don't trust this 100% yet. Bangs from the tail pipe are ridiculous :lol: Boost drops a bit too much, maybe removing less sparks would keep the boost up. Have to try that.

Here is graph of what happens to ignition and fuel during shift








_Ignition timing during shift_

'So how fast it is' what everybody wants to know  Not that fast: 100-200 km/h was 12.3s, from that clutch was down 1.8s (two shifts). So with ripping the next gear and perfecting boost hold (when the clutch is down) should be able to shave time off. I was also changing at 6500rpm to be sure not to hit the limiter (6900rpm).


----------



## nate42

Been quiet here, but have done some small things just to perfect everything. Car works fine but no dyno time yet so car has just a map that I did on the street  I'm runnig 1.6bar (23psi) boost that is flat from 4k to redline. Timing map is "educated guess". I know I'm gambling here but the urge to get to the track was too big. AFR's are where I want, those were relatively easy to get right on boost, vacuum area is more tricky.

Have done ~150km on track. Second track day was a bit hotter day, but still temps stayed in check. I was driving AC OFF to save the compressor (I've heard they don't like fast rev changes) and oil cooler fan ON. Coolant stayed at 90 and highest I saw on oil was 120C.

Nice track Botniaring, versatile and is not easy to master (at least for me :lol: )








_Day was perfect. I was not the only TT there, this nice black one was wearing 245s on 8.5" on front... Very flush_

Not all good news. Went out from tarmac on the second trackday, turned in too early with cold tyres, real rookie mistake. Lost just a splitter but the car didn't stop on grass and hit a bump in grass that almost got the car airborne [smiley=bigcry.gif] Left front tire got 1degree extra camber after that and was sitting slightly lower. Cup where coilover attaches has deformed a little, I hope I can hammer it down and get the alignment in spec. If not big things coming


----------



## NickG

Awesome write up Nate!

About to sit down and watch your video too, hope the damage to suspension isn't too bad also!


----------



## brushwood69

Great stuff, what software did you use to map the track and speeds etc ? Harry's?

BW


----------



## nate42

brushwood69 said:


> Great stuff, what software did you use to map the track and speeds etc ? Harry's?
> 
> BW


I used RaceChrono, very easy to use. Then you need QStarz BT-Q818XT 10Hz GPS receiver (maybe £50). I have old 5Hz version that does the job OK too. Phones have just 1Hz and they smoother the signal so it's useless for track work. I like RaceChrono because you can export data to different formats. Racelogic's software Circuit tools and Performance tools are free and useful for accurate acceleration measurements and comparing your laps with friends.

I bought Harry's Laptimer too but that was not so easy to use and was giving me trouble on Android phone. I've heard it works great with iPhone + Racelogic VBOX sport GPS.

Both can take also data from ODB2 if you get bluetooth ODB2 sender. Then you get throttle position and revs for example.

To layout the data I used free software called DashWare, there are tons of different gauges to add.

Easiest way to get started is to mount phone so that you use it's camera to also to record video not just data. Both Harry's and RaceChrono can do that (you need to buy full version from app store). I think they can even do data overlay for you. I haven't tried it because I have other camera. My camera is too big and moves on the mount resulting a shaky picture. Youtube's stabilizer does a good job of removing the shaking.


----------



## jamman

As I've said before always love reading this..... whilst understanding very little.


----------



## nate42

Thanks for the comments to everybody!

Well it seemed that I got lucky with the bump I hit, but no [smiley=bigcry.gif] One of the strut towers has deformed. Car will go this week to a guy who is specialized on fixing race cars (rally and track), he has seen this kind of damage before and said its not bad. Basically the solution is to hammer it correct way and problem solved :lol:

Both shock absorbers in front have probably damaged seals as they are VERY stiff now, I'd say jammed. Those will go to AST for inspection. They are solid billet items that can be rebuilt so I hope its just some seals and easy fix. Other hub assembly is damaged also, basically bent. That causes extra camber on the left side. Front bumper needs to be painted and new Leon Cupra splitter.

Ok enough for the sad news. Good news are that I've booked mapping session with a pro after issues are fixed. We should also get results with E85 ethanol.

And post is always better with pics so here are few of exhaust cam install that I did on the weekend.









_Friction shim and gasket first_









_Degreased threads with acetone, then red Loctite to ARP bolt_









_Torgue to 55 lbf_

Got a small ultrasonic cleaner, makes terrible noise but is effective








_After 20min in ultrasonic bath_









_Exhaust cam in place_


----------



## Madmax199

Nice project, looking forward to seeing your E85 results (post some pics of your E85 timing curve please). Cheers!


----------



## nate42

Madmax199 said:


> Nice project, looking forward to seeing your E85 results (post some pics of your E85 timing curve please). Cheers!


Once done I hope I can show some comparison of the dyno results, to see what difference E85 makes. I can post my timing maps that is even better :wink:


----------



## nate42

Tiny update

Chassis is sorted so shock absorber top mounting points are hammered back in place, that was not a big operation. Only thing found broken in the end where both shock absorbers, replacements ordered already. To do is investigate that alloys are still round. Currently driving with stock front suspension  Soft and very allroad height  Front bumper needs paint as it got scratched in the incident, also couple of other scratches here and there. Car is now 15 years old, thinking of full respray to celebrate that :lol: Next summer it will be good as new I hope.

During the winter I'll also install power steering cooler. On track lost fluid from the system and at street it has been fine even when driven hard. So fair guess is that fluid is getting too hot in the system -> seals get softer -> leak. Have to find nice small Mocal and a place for it...

When TT is undergoing repairs I'll just have to take a blast with this 8) Raw machine, I like it a lot!


----------



## nate42

Quick update, I'll write detailed post when all is done.

Car has been in the dyno to check my self-made "street tuned" map. It was not that far off I was told, maybe the tuner was just polite :lol: I was guessing from acceleration figures that I'm ~350hp and that was pretty much spot on.

With RON98 safe timing advance for this engine is 11 degrees. At 13 degrees knock is already present. Below are two graphs red 13 degrees and green 11 degrees. These pulls were done with 1.6bar boost.








_Warm engine pulls_

So safely this setup doesn't give more than that with RON98 and hot engine.

Next VE fueling model experiments and E85.


----------



## nate42

So E85 went to tank. UK readers might not be familiar with this stuff but it has ~85% ethanol and ~15% gas. Knock is not an issue so you can dial in more advance that we all know makes more power. On RON98 advance was the limiting factor of power. With E85 there was a new limit that surprised me.

"Turbos spool faster with E85", I had heard that phrase many times but newer thought why. Reason is simple E85 produces more exhaust gas, there is a lot more steam coming out from the engine. Also more CO2 compared to air entering the engine. Estimates of the exhaust gas volume is 30-40% more than with gas. This is also why engines run cooler as more of the heat goes out from the tailpipe.

My flexfuel gauge was showing 77% ethanol content once filled with E85, maybe there was some residual gas on the tank. I've heard that ethanol content of E85 also varies from pump to pump. Car was making more power when adding advance, boost was kept at 1.6bar. Then came a stop and boost was rising too much. Exhaust side of the turbo is likely maxed out. At this point we were making *[email protected]*. That produces same amount of exhaust gas than 520hp on gas. EFR6758 is capable to +500hp with gas, but not with ethanol.

This was new news for me, I didn't know that you have to choose a different kind of turbo to have optimal performance with E85. I also have standard Milltek catback, that could be quite on the limit and creating back pressure. Tuner said that symptoms were more turbo than exhaust flow related.

So probably to get most out of this setup I should run with a blend that allows more advance but doesn't produce too much exhaust gas :roll:

Graphs, map comparisons etc to follow.


----------



## jamman

Ive said it before and I will say it again always interests me this build good work.

I obviously missed the bit where you dumped that bloody awful Revo tune GOOD MAN....


----------



## Madmax199

That's weird Nate. I have ran E85 on many turbo cars and what you're experiencing is not normal to say the least. The fuel used should not be limiting the turbo (heck, I ran it with the stock turbo at 2.25 bar for years before moving to a hybrid). E85 should allow you to max out the turbo's capability in terms of boost, and max out the motor's timing curve (MBT).

You likely have a hardware issue. I would check boost control, wastegate operation, and inspect the exhaust for blockages (internally swollen flex sections, clogged cat converter, restricted chambered muffler etc.). If not, it's look into the tune, but something is definitely no right. Can you get any logs for us to review?


----------



## Beunhaas

Interesting read mate.

Looking forward to see some graphs for comparisson. Did you also have values from the pressure probe you mounted in the downpipe?


----------



## nate42

I have my doubts on the exhaust restricting also, I need to upgrade it at some point anyway so why not do it now. I tried to log my exhaust back pressures before I took the car to tuner but my pressure sender had too large scale. I have now new one with more suitable scale. Logging exhaust back pressures at WOT will be the first things to do.

Turbo's turbine side is 58mm A/R 0.64 no idea what kind of numbers that size should flow on E85.

Madmax199 I appreciate your tips on hardware checkpoints, I'll get to work when I get the car back and also post logs.

Jamman, yes Revo is long gone. There used to be too little options to tweak, no there are too many [smiley=bigcry.gif]


----------



## nate42

_Both runs hot engine and 1.6bar boost_

With E85 we couldn't go all the way with timing as boost started to creep, reason not known yet. So potential gains of E85 are even bigger.


----------



## Madmax199

nate42 said:


> _Both runs hot engine and 1.6bar boost_
> 
> With E85 we couldn't go all the way with timing as boost started to creep, reason not known yet. So potential gains of E85 are even bigger.


Nate, what's your timing curve like?


----------



## nate42

_E85 timing map_








_RON98 timing map_


----------



## Madmax199

Wow, maybe the tuner is not used to E85 but that's is virtually nothing over the regular pump timing. You're barely scratching the surface for what is capable on corn. I'll post some maps so you can have an idea of how far E85 timing map should go on these motors.


----------



## Biitti

Hieno Nate, että jaksat kirjotella tänne! Jatka samaan malliin! 8)


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## Madmax199

Nate, here is a screenshot of the timing curve in my car. It is not even fully optimized as I like to see RR TQ figures in steady state to squeeze every last bit out of the potential. This was done the old school way via EGT monitering, but gives you a good idea how far you are from what the fuel can allow.


----------



## nate42

Thanks for the map, it sure looks like there is a lot of room to go further. How much boost where you running?

Nothing to do with the tuner to leave it at that level, it was my car that was acting strange. I try to solve the exhaust side issues soon and then revisit the dyno. I know there is plenty of power to be released with E85, probably more than it is smart to take out at this point. No point of braking the engine on purpose. It's a stock engine with just H beam rods that are not even riffle drilled


----------



## Madmax199

That timing map has been used on two tunes, my solo tune at 32 psi (2.2 bar) of boost and my circuit tunes which run at 27 psi (1.86 bar) of boost. You are not going to hurt the engine with timing on E85 unless you go over MBT. If anything you're making it safer for the engine because more timing advance means less heat and EGT (I know, most people mistakenly think it's the opposite). BTW, all I have is a stock motor with rods that are not riffle drilled as well. You are making the engine run hotter than it has to with this flat timing curve on E85, get to work!

This a logged (with VCDS) running timing curve that was optimized on the RR at 33 psi. This shows you how aggresive it can be and how much room you have to grow (especially your midrange cells). As mentioned, just watch EGT go down with more timing.


----------



## CollecTTor

All you need is rods! All together now.....all you need is rods! :lol: Yes, need more timing. Max is the timing junky.


----------



## Gonzalo1495

CollecTTor said:


> All you need is rods! All together now.....all you need is rods! :lol: Yes, need more timing. Max is the timing junky.


 :lol:


----------



## Madmax199

CollecTTor said:


> All you need is rods! All together now.....all you need is rods! :lol:


LMAO, now that is funny!!!


----------



## NickG

CollecTTor said:


> All you need is rods! All together now.....all you need is rods! :lol: Yes, need more timing. Max is the timing junky.


I like your style!! :lol:

This is something I've been pondering recently. What new bits would you need to only change rods for a nice forged set? I'm considering this as a halfway between, while I build-up another engine and stroke to 2.0l.


----------



## CollecTTor

NickG said:


> CollecTTor said:
> 
> 
> 
> All you need is rods! All together now.....all you need is rods! :lol: Yes, need more timing. Max is the timing junky.
> 
> 
> 
> I like your style!! :lol:
> 
> This is something I've been pondering recently. What new bits would you need to only change rods for a nice forged set? I'm considering this as a halfway between, while I build-up another engine and stroke to 2.0l.
Click to expand...

Rings are optional according to some, depends on if you want to rehone the block. If your compression is good and you're not burning oil from excessive ring wear (leak down test will confirm this beforehand), you should be okay to reuse the rings as long as you put the same piston back in the bore it came out of. Rehoning the block means dropping the crank, but doesn't mean replacing the bearings IF they look good. Short answer: head gasket, head bolts, the rods, and bearings. Depending on mileage, may want to do the timing belt and water pump while you're in there.


----------



## nate42

Madmax 2.2bar of boost  E85 and that kind of timing... I'm even afraid to ask your torque and power numbers.

Here is how my turbo spools on street with E85








_Boost build up on 3rd and 6th gear_

You can see that third gear needs some tweaking, everything happens so quickly that PID contoller has trouble keeping up with current values. ECU supports gear based wastegate maps, those might be easiest way to get a nice and smooth boost curve on all gears.

All you need is rods - titi didi di :lol: :lol: 
I did new piston rings, head gasket, belts and ARP head bolts. Didn't have to open the crank bolts. I reused rod bearings as they looked good to me, was low mileage engine back then.


----------



## Gonzalo1495

nate42 said:


> Madmax 2.2bar of boost  E85 and that kind of timing... I'm even afraid to ask your torque and power numbers.


As they say in Merica', "Go big or go home" :wink:


----------



## Madmax199

nate42 said:


> Madmax 2.2bar of boost  E85 and that kind of timing... I'm even afraid to ask your torque and power numbers.
> 
> Here is how my turbo spools on street with E85
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Boost build up on 3rd and 6th gear_
> 
> You can see that third gear needs some tweaking, everything happens so quickly that PID contoller has trouble keeping up with current values. ECU supports gear based wastegate maps, those might be easiest way to get a nice and smooth boost curve on all gears.
> 
> All you need is rods - titi didi di :lol: :lol:
> I did new piston rings, head gasket, belts and ARP head bolts. Didn't have to open the crank bolts. I reused rod bearings as they looked good to me, was low mileage engine back then.


Looks like you have all your bases covered as far as the bottom end of the motor is concerned. Just handle the issue that is making your boost creep and really get started on E85. The boost and timing you are running are nowhere near what E85 can support, so you have all the room in the world to grow.

I have learned over the years (with lots of miserable experience with solenoid based boost control) to stay away from ECU boost control that is outside of standard parameters. Just like you are finding, PID comtrol often struggles with extreme setups. Good old mechanical boost control with a ball and spring never fails at providing linearity and consistency (regardless of the conditions). That's why it has been my weapon of choice and what I recommend to anyone building out-of-the-norm forced induction projects. Nothing wrong with electronic boost control, just not hassle-free enough for my taste.

Since you didn't ask, here are the Wheel TQ and Wheel HP figures I achieved with the setup on the stock ECU (2 bar of boost and the running timing curved I posted)


----------



## Madmax199

Gonzalo1495 said:


> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Madmax 2.2bar of boost  E85 and that kind of timing... I'm even afraid to ask your torque and power numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> As they say in Merica', "Go big or go home" :wink:
Click to expand...

Makes is sound like we're all offsprings of Donald Trump. :lol:


----------



## Gonzalo1495

Madmax199 said:


> Gonzalo1495 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nate42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Madmax 2.2bar of boost  E85 and that kind of timing... I'm even afraid to ask your torque and power numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> As they say in Merica', "Go big or go home" :wink:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Makes is sound like we're all offsprings of Donald Trump. :lol:
Click to expand...

We? lol I just live here man :lol: Thank god my roots don't actually go back to this place. It's a nice place to live but the culture and society are something else entirely lmao.

I refuse to even write that man's name in any of my posts, so I'm going to pretend like I didn't read that


----------



## Biitti

Moro Nate! En pysty vielä kirjoittamaan yksityisviestiä, niin vastaan jotain tänne. Itselläni TT on ollut päivittäisessä käytössä ja en ole vielä aloittanut moottorin virittämistä. Kaikki virittämiseen suunnitellut rahat on mennyt huoltoon. 
Ajattelin aloittaa virittämisen ensin "lastuttamalla" tuon, mutta olisiko järkevää laittaa ensin 3" downpipe, catback putkisto ja 3" tip? Mitä viritysohjelma tekijää suosittelet? Sulla taitaa nyt olla Revo:n ohjelma sisällä? 
Paljon olen lukenut näistä TT:stä, mutta moottorin säätäminen on jäänyt vähän vähemmälle.


----------



## nate42

Damaged suspension issues are now sorted and car feels great again. It's cold in here so switched back to gas from ethanol. You can notice the difference: gas wins on cold starts and ethanol on performance 

Finished the new head. Cams installed, new chain tensioner etc. Painted valve cover with VHT engine enamel.









_Done!_








_Valve cover paintjob_

Bottom end next on the menu. I've set 2017 as a target for new engine to go in.

Next job is new radiator as car was getting hot on the dyno when doing pulls with gas, it was also running quite hot on track. OEM radiator can't cope with the power levels. Power steering was also dripping on track due to too hot temps, so that will get a cooler also. Planning to do this right this time, so proper scoops to radiators etc.

Also bought a little xmas present for myself for the car, a mod that I don't normally do as it is visible :lol: Pics to follow

Way too much fun to drive at the moment as snow has arrived, so has to keep the car on the road for a while now. Overheating is not an issue in this weather :lol: 








_Happy winter drifts for 2016 to everyone!_


----------



## Beunhaas

This car is coming back strong in the summer!

What is done to the head?

Did you experiment with a blend of E85 and 98 fuel to make over 400 hp with the stock compression?


----------



## nate42

Beunhaas said:


> This car is coming back strong in the summer!
> 
> What is done to the head?
> 
> Did you experiment with a blend of E85 and 98 fuel to make over 400 hp with the stock compression?


Head has all the goodies (detailed info on first post):
big port head
Oversize +1mm Inconel valves
Dual springs and titanium retainers for high RPM
IE aggressive street cams
IE adjustable cam gear
All new OEM parts: seals, chain, hydraulic lifters, etc

E85 blend gave me 385hp so far. Limiting factor was wastegate flow, boost started to creep from 1.6bar up. I will change softer wastegate canister so that it will open fully to see if it solves the problem. My turbo is with 0.64 A/R turbine housing so spools fast but not the most flowing thing out there :lol:

Pretty confident that next dyno trip will take me to +400hp club with stock compression. I don't see the compression as a limiting factor with E85, since knock is not an issue. More the engine flow capabilities. More lift, longer valve opening and bigger valve makes the difference. Valve curtain area and how long it is open in a cycle is the key.








I think I've seen people flowing +400hp with stock head, not sure though :? With this kind of built heads people are pushing silly number with huge turbos +600hp. I don't want a bigger turbo as I want to have wide power band. So planning to eventually squeeze out everything from the one that I have.

I hope I got a solid machine next summer lets see you never know with these things :lol:


----------



## nate42

Took the car to 4 wheel alignment. Forge adjustable tie bars were totally jammed. We tried induction heater and that resulted to some movement but not usable. Took the car home and took the arms off the car. Shorter end twisted off with some force. The other end was stuck hard. Applied a bit more force and then this happened.








_Snapped bolt on Forge adjustable tie bar_

Happy it snapped on the work bench and not on a fast corner. Cause combination of cyclic fatigue and stress corrosion cracking due to bad material choice for salty environment. There must have been quite long crack already as that size bolt is not easy to snap on a vice with hand tools. Next up was drilling that piece out. It was like drilling plastic, I don't know if it was the good drill bits or induction heating had softened the bolt or just very bad metal... :roll:

Drilled the threads out. Did it in 5 phases and last size 17,5mm was just perfect. Then at tapped new M20 threads.








_Tapping new threads_









_3 out of 4 done at this point_

Next I need to get some A4 grade (AISI 316) M20 bar to connect the pieces back together and also clean and paint them. Will be SAFER than new. More pics to follow.

Then some new purchases








_10 row Setrab cooler for power steering arrived_

Need to sort fittings for that and figure out location and air ducts, more on the installation later...

I just couldn't resist this one. After Caterham steering wheel TT feels a bit like a bus, so tried to add sporty feel  








_Sparco 350mm steering wheel_

Size feels nice, not too much smaller. OEM steering wheel on TT has a diameter of 370mm and this is 350mm. Also got the Sparco hub so should be walk in the park installation. Some airbag resistor is needed, if some one has done this let me know what size resistor is needed (ohm and watts).


----------



## Matt B

nate42 said:


> Took the car to 4 wheel alignment. Forge adjustable tie bars were totally jammed. We tried induction heater and that resulted to some movement but not usable. Took the car home and took the arms off the car. Shorter end twisted off with some force. The other end was stuck hard. Applied a bit more force and then this happened.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Snapped bolt on Forge adjustable tie bar_
> 
> Happy it snapped on the work bench and not on a fast corner. Cause combination of cyclic fatigue and stress corrosion cracking due to bad material choice for salty environment. There must have been quite long crack already as that size bolt is not easy to snap on a vice with hand tools. Next up was drilling that piece out. It was like drilling plastic, I don't know if it was the good drill bits or induction heating had softened the bolt or just very bad metal... :roll:
> 
> Drilled the threads out. Did it in 5 phases and last size 17,5mm was just perfect. Then at tapped new M20 threads.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Tapping new threads_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _3 out of 4 done at this point_
> 
> Next I need to get some A4 grade (AISI 316) M20 bar to connect the pieces back together and also clean and paint them. Will be SAFER than new. More pics to follow.
> 
> Then some new purchases
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _10 row Setrab cooler for power steering arrived_
> 
> Need to sort fittings for that and figure out location and air ducts, more on the installation later...
> 
> I just couldn't resist this one. After Caterham steering wheel TT feels a bit like a bus, so tried to add sporty feel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Sparco 350mm steering wheel_
> 
> Size feels nice, not too much smaller. OEM steering wheel on TT has a diameter of 370mm and this is 350mm. Also got the Sparco hub so should be walk in the park installation. Some airbag resistor is needed, if some one has done this let me know what size resistor is needed (ohm and watts).


Sorry to hear of your tie bar woes - You should speak to Forge as i am pretty sure they offer a lifetime warranty.


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## nate42

Matt B said:


> Sorry to hear of your tie bar woes - You should speak to Forge as i am pretty sure they offer a lifetime warranty.


I see Forge has now a protective sleeve over the threads, so I'm not the only one who has had this problem. Also if you go proper low the Forge ones doesn't have enough adjustment to correct camber, at least not on my -00 LHD car.

Now my tie bars as are good as new 8) Only that you have to remove the other end to adjust lenght. I don't see that as an issue as it's quite rare thing to do. Also I can only alter the length in multiples of M20 thread pitch divided by 2, so 1.25mm.









_Thread is stolen from A4-80 grade bolts. Stainless steel so wont rust and crack. This is not strong bolt around same as 8.8 bolts, but with better corrosion resistance. Strong enough at a size of M20  _

















_Drill in steps and finally with Dremel open so that your final 17.5mm drill will be right in the center_









_Double check your allingment_









_Test fitting_









_First coat of zinc spray and then some black stone chip_









_Jamming again is not an option, tons of grease and plastic shrink tube on top of the thread for protection_









_Some more stone chip just for the looks  _

Job worth doing? Well if you have access to a good drill and lot of spare time and enjoy a bit of a struggle, then YES. Also you will most likely kill the 17.5mm drill bit as there is dirt in the treads. Good 17.5 drill bit is not cheap... Don't even try to drill bolts with cheap drill bits. HSS-E Cobalt etc are suitable for the job.

Bent rims are also back from the shop. They need paint, what colour should I go for? I'm thinking GOLD!?

Next bigger job is to fit new main radiator and power steering cooler. Planning on doing some air scoops for radiators also.


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## nate42

MOT passed, woo-hoo 

Right after that it was trial fitting of the new steering wheel. Has to be the easiest thing I've done to the car. Took 5 minutes to get to this point. Still have to wire the horn and fit airbag resistor.


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## nate42

Been a while since the last update. I didn't have motivation to take the car apart again as it works really good 8) 








_Plasti dipped the rims with a rattle can product, they turned out great_

Old silver powder coat was little tired color. First couple coats of white and then sliver on top of it.

















_Products that I used_

Then let's talk a little about ethanol. I've been driving with ethanol now all the time  Car is much faster and it's cheaper to run, so what's not to like. Consumption is ~16L / 100km, with gas it was 11 L / 100km. 85% ethanol costs 0,90€/L and good octane 98 fuel 1,50€/L.

The extensions I did to the inline fuel pump where just regular NBR fuel hose, I knew it's not Ethanol compatible but in the beginning I was thinking I just run E85 sometimes. If you can choose at the pump 350hp or 400hp that is also cheaper of course you take 400hp everytime :lol: What was I thinking not to use this stuff all the time.

I investigated the effects on my NBR fuel hoses and they were already in quite shocking state. So I knew I have take the car apart and fix those. On the bends they were already cracking.









_NBR fuel hose and ethanol, not a good mix_

Have to love Audi for using quality parts on their cars. Apparently TT fuel system is ethanol proof. 16 year old OEM hoses were nice and soft and looked OK.








_Audi OEM fuel lines were FPM rubber_

Have to change fuel rubber hoses on the fuel system to FPM rubber and I will also fit a surge tank in the place of battery and move the battery to trunk. Will also put then new coolers on.









_New cooler vs OEM cooler_

Since the front was open decided to give a clean to engine bay also. Highly satisfying way to spend 15 minutes.









_Engine bay cleaned with some basic AutoGlym engine cleaner_

So this is where we are now, car somewhat apart again...


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## Beunhaas

Keep the good bits going!

Do you have a picture of how you fitted the RS4 maf in the stock airbox?
And the partnumber of your RS4 maf?


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## nate42

Beunhaas said:


> Keep the good bits going!
> 
> Do you have a picture of how you fitted the RS4 maf in the stock airbox?
> And the partnumber of your RS4 maf?


There are some pics earlier on this thread. Dremel job but wasn't that hard to make it fit. I try to remember to dig that part number for you.

Today made a bracket to battery tray and trial fitted surge tank / fuel pump on it. Looks like it will fit nicely 8)









_New FPM hoses. Tank will be wraped with Dynamat later on for extra sound proofing_








_Alloy bracket on 10mm rubber mat. Rubber is there to prevent noise going to car body_








_Just the right size so that battery tray will still close properly_


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## nate42

Of course the headlight was too close to that bracket :evil: [smiley=bigcry.gif] So had to make a new one. Should have had banjos on all three fittings but this just have to do for now. Should be on track on Monday so progress is a must :lol:









_New surge tank bracket design that gives more room to geadlight_









_In place_









_Ethanol sensor in its place_

Connecting new lines was easy straight forward job. Except for the fuel rail in hose, the angle is just all wrong.









_Hose coming from bad angle_


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## nate42

Solution was to use Swagelok 8mm 90 degree fitting and a part named Port Connector that was used to attach the hose.









_First cut the tube with tube cutter_









_Open to tube end after cutting to allow maximal flow_









_Swagelok fittings in place_









_Solved_

Two Odyssey PC680 batteries are going to trunk, some progress on that also








_Sneak preview of the battery relocate installation. Some heavy fuse should withstand starter current, but will see..._

Requested picture of big MAF product number


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## NickG

Love keeping tabs on this build!!

Keep up the good work and keep the knowledge flowing! 8)


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## nate42

Pics of the batteries to trunk installation









_Before_









_After some sound deadening_









_Sanded the bare metal out_








_Ground wire connection_

I put a large cabbage bag to trunk and then filled a layer of foam on the bottom. Then plywood on top of that with some weights. This way I got the plywood in level and tight fit to the trunk.









_Foam behind the plywood_









_Batteries on their brackets and 300A fuse installed close to battery for short circuit protection_

I used products that are meant for heavy car Hi-Fi installations. 50mm2 cable. Starter motor eats lots of power so wanted to make sure cable is not a restriction.

There was a nice route to engine bay next to brake lines. I was in a hurry to get the installation done for a trackay so I just zip tied the cable like crazy underneath the car. Keeping it out from anything that gets hot. Planning to put the cable in alloy tube later on.


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## Madmax199

Good work as usual Nate!

Why two batteries though? A small 4 cyl like a 1.8t doesn't require much to start (even in cold climate). 200 CCA is enough to turn this thing over day in, day out. Not concerned about the extra weight? Now a pair of powerful and light (about 1kg each) lithium batteries would be sweet if you need the juice for accessories when the engine is off. Keep the updates coming!


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## nate42

Madmax199 said:


> Good work as usual Nate!
> 
> Why two batteries though? A small 4 cyl like a 1.8t doesn't require much to start (even in cold climate). 200 CCA is enough to turn this thing over day in, day out. Not concerned about the extra weight? Now a pair of powerful and light (about 1kg each) lithium batteries would be sweet if you need the juice for accessories when the engine is off. Keep the updates coming!


Thanks!

Was running with just one PC680 before, but it didn't like the short trips and alarm stealing juice from the battery all the time. When the weather got cold I had trouble starting. Added another next to it and after that had no issues even if the car is sitting for a week or two. I didn't have a garage back then and parked on the street in a city centre.


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## nate42

Sad news, crashed my TT on the first trackday of the year [smiley=bigcry.gif]

It was all my fault, no mechanical issues. Corner that wasn't much of a corner before was now the one that took the TT out. I had ran only 20 or so laps on that day before the crash. As car has been under work I wanted to start slowly and up the speed. On the previous sessions did 5 quite fast laps, that is what I typically do. 2-3 laps to warm up then some fast laps and 1 cool down lap.

So this corner... Well you come out with 3rd from the previous corner, through 4th and then to 5th before turn in. It's a long curve so you just ride with fifth feeling the limit. The difference this eyer was that I was able to get much more speed on the straight. I looked at last years logs and best was 155km/h at the turn in. Now I lost the back at 170km/h [smiley=bomb.gif] On the same day I did 160Km/h no problems. I think my rear tyres wasn't warm yet as it snapped really fast. I've never lost the back end at those speeds so can't comment how it should be. Did a quick 45 degree correction with wheel and it wasn't clearly enough, back continued to slide. Video in the end see it for yourself... (it sure was quick out from the corners :lol: )

















_Last pictures in one piece_








_After the crash_

So what's next. Likely the engine bearings are shot as car ran few seconds upside down with no oil pressure. Otherwise technically the car looks to be OK. Haven't taken it apart much yet. I have way too many good parts so will build another TT for sure, but I have to collect some motivation first. Don't know yet if it's worth while to fix the dents or buy a new chassis. Stock car with good rust free chassis and V6 bumper would be optimal. Will see, have to take the car fully apart first, but looks like suspension, wheels etc are fine. Without the roll maybe new bumper would have been enough. The sand island made the car semi airborne and braking had little effect, then on the wet grass/field I was just a passenger. Looks like half cage at least is a must :lol: I had quite much speed going out so with bad luck I could have rolled much earlier, no the car was basically stationary when it rolled.


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## NickG

Ahhhhh CRAP!!!!

You were so unlucky, would have been virtually fine until that last little bit.

So sorry and gutted for you dude, but get back on it and bring her back from the dead!!


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## 3TT3

Very ouch 
also a very pro thread and I havent looked at it much before.
Could "the batteries " have had any influence ?
Normal TT big corner weight on the lhs rear.QS no corner weight but battery mounted on the lhs rear.
Twin rear batteries mounted across midline, while adding rear weight wouldnt have a lhs bias . weight transfer n stuff.
Dunno, just an idea.


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## jamman

That's rubbish, don't know what to say except don't give up mate.


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## Jay-225

Sorry to read/see what has happened, was reading this thread few days ago and thought the car looked stunning on the superleggera wheels 

Main thing is you are OK, cars can always be put back together


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## Matt B

Shit man. The car was running great as well.
I am sure it will live again, the main thing is you are alive to rebuild it


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## Jez xbx

Glad you're ok even though I'm sure you're hurting!
Hope you get back in the saddle soon, you've done so much more than most to your car!


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## Oranoco

That's a gutting sight mate, glad you're OK. Had a couple of similar moments on track, 1 at Bedford last year where I lost the back at about 110mph fortunately it didn't dig in as I went grass cutting

Hopefully not too much is damaged so a replacement car can be had for its she'll and you can start transferring the surviving good bits.


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## sco

That sucks and you were properly unlucky for it to roll like that.

I reckon the bearings will be fine - running with low or no oil pressure at no load is what happens at every start and particularly every oil change.

Simon.


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## nate42

3TT3 said:


> Very ouch
> also a very pro thread and I havent looked at it much before.
> Could "the batteries " have had any influence ?
> Normal TT big corner weight on the lhs rear.QS no corner weight but battery mounted on the lhs rear.
> Twin rear batteries mounted across midline, while adding rear weight wouldnt have a lhs bias . weight transfer n stuff.
> Dunno, just an idea.


I've removed the rear ballast weight years ago. I think extra weight there didn't play any significant role. At speed it gets light and being very nose heavy car once the rear lets go it doesn't grip back very easy. I have slightly less camber on the rear and the car is set up so that it's more oversteery than understeery. Just more fun to drive like that, I'm not racing so I don't care about the last seconds of the laptime.

At least the batteries were nicely in place also after the crash, so it was rigid enough :lol:


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## nate42

Thanks to everyone for the wishes. Yeah it's not the end of the world, part of the hobby and could have been worst.

I already have some ideas that I could do better on the next build, so one day I'll be back... :wink:


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## Jez xbx

I'm a bit of a simpleton at heart
You're still posting after a crash
It's all good, the rest is a bonus


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## spaceplace

Really sorry dude [smiley=bigcry.gif] epic crash though! Looks like lift off over steer, back just went light. I'm guessing you track it with the esp off?


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## Von Twinzig

Q: when the oversteer kicked in did you brake or accelerate?

VT


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## IPG3.6

wow interesting thread!!!! (bad end of thread though but i'm sure there will be greater plans to come!!!)

just wondering if you ever did logs with the EFR setup? or a dyno run?

it would be good to know where the power was being made & how much???

i love how the aim was to go against the grain and (possibly) ended up with a very steerable setup?

look forward to hearing back!


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## nate42

Von Twinzig said:


> Q: when the oversteer kicked in did you brake or accelerate?
> 
> VT


Before this day there has been no need to brake. Just stop accelerating and roll into the turn with 5th gear. When you see the end of the long curve you start to accelerate again and then hard bracking to a right hand turn.

Here is a picture of the track. You can see that island that I drove over.


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## nate42

ianpgonzaga said:


> wow interesting thread!!!! (bad end of thread though but i'm sure there will be greater plans to come!!!)
> just wondering if you ever did logs with the EFR setup? or a dyno run?
> it would be good to know where the power was being made & how much???
> i love how the aim was to go against the grain and (possibly) ended up with a very steerable setup?
> look forward to hearing back!


Thanks, page 24 is the latest dyno and page 25 some spool graphs. Since that I've upped the boost a bit and running 1.7bar flat line on full throttle. On the last dyno had just 15 degrees of timing that has gone up also to +20 degree region. In the end there was for sure +400hp and full boost before 4000rpm (gear dependant), happy with that. I got plenty of logs, there are excellent logging capabilites on the Vi-Pec ECU. Part list on the first post.


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## Biitti

Sorry to read what happened! Your TT was stunning! I know that you will be back! Suomi Sisu Perkele


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## Madmax199

This really sucks Nate, glad you're Ok! You're too far into the platform to give up now, a cheap shell from a breaker and swap everything out. You will be back in no time!

As for the crash, it looks like the unloaded rear did it. Lifting induces rotation and when that happens at those speed it's usually hard to recover. That's why I am always preaching to all listening ears "dial in some rear toe-in on your track TT to induce high speed cornering stability. It may not seem like much, but 1/16" of toe-in in the back could mean great stability at high speed VS a rear end that wants to bite and can't be saved once gone.


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## UR_TT

Sad sad ending to your fine build Nate. [smiley=bigcry.gif]

Good thing is that cars are replaceable, you aren´t. Glad too hear you walked away! Rollcage next time is a must!

Take care,

//U


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## BadNun

Quote the hamster "yeah but you can tell your mates"

I still talk about killing my Subaru 10 yrs ago.


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## Davetheconfused

Mr Niaeve here, so don't flame me too much.
If it's basically straight stick a cage in, hammer the messy bits out to almost where they should be, straighten what needs straightening to allow a new screen, and correct geometry.
Then get back in and call the damage battle scars.
You could be out on track within a couple of weeks.
Then look for a donor shell and start again on your upgraded dream track car, at your leisure.
Apologies if I'm oversimplifying, but who cares what the outside looks like when your inside looking out and buzzing your nuts off !
You've already shown more motivation and skill than I could even dream of having, don't stop, don't let the dream die, it's a hiccup in the build thread, not thread over, not even over for now. Good luck, now go get your hammer out!


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## nate42

Well after going back and forth of what to do I've decided to build another TT. I've tracked this TT enough to know how it's on track. Fast but a bit nose heavy and hard on front tyres. Bulding high HP car that can take the track abuse is not easy, especially if the car is heavy. Heat is the enemy on the brakes and in the engine. Even the 6-pot setup with ducting was on the limit with 400hp full interior car. Powersteering fluids boiling, EGT's and so on...

I need a 2+2 as this way I can use the car much more. I got two small kids so many times I need a car that can take 3 persons. So I've decided to build "GT" spec car. Quiet and fast. Firm riding and tastefully lowered.

I've dismantled the old TT. In the end there was very little damage if you exclude the panels, bumper, roof and windshield. Engine was not turning because there was oil on top of the pistons. When the car was upside down oil got everywhere is shouldn't. So I got a lot of spare parts :lol:

I've looked for mobile.de and autoscout24.de for months. Finally there came up one owner car with 116tkm (73k miles) on the clock with service history at Audi. I wanted APX EURO3 emission class car. Because my previous one was also APX and becase it's not as restricted to modify as EURO4 car. Also had to be black in / black out and xenon car.

Paid 7k€ for the car, it's not perfect but I'd say 9/10 considering it's 17 year old car. 99% stock. So now I basically have all the good bits from the old one, lots of parts for stroker engine and stock TT. This should be fun. I start a new build thread once I have had time to inspect what I've bought properly. I try to document the engine build and technical things as I'm planning to do most of the interesting work myself.


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## Matt B

nate42 said:


> Well after going back and forth of what to do I've decided to build another TT. I've tracked this TT enough to know how it's on track. Fast but a bit nose heavy and hard on front tyres. Bulding high HP car that can take the track abuse is not easy, especially if the car is heavy. Heat is the enemy on the brakes and in the engine. Even the 6-pot setup with ducting was on the limit with 400hp full interior car. Powersteering fluids boiling, EGT's and so on...
> 
> I need a 2+2 as this way I can use the car much more. I got two small kids so many times I need a car that can take 3 persons. So I've decided to build "GT" spec car. Quiet and fast. Firm riding and tastefully lowered.
> 
> I've dismantled the old TT. In the end there was very little damage if you exclude the panels, bumper, roof and windshield. Engine was not turning because there was oil on top of the pistons. When the car was upside down oil got everywhere is shouldn't. So I got a lot of spare parts :lol:
> 
> I've looked for mobile.de and autoscout24.de for months. Finally there came up one owner car with 116tkm (73k miles) on the clock with service history at Audi. I wanted APX EURO3 emission class car. Because my previous one was also APX and becase it's not as restricted to modify as EURO4 car. Also had to be black in / black out and xenon car.
> 
> Paid 7k€ for the car, it's not perfect but I'd say 9/10 considering it's 17 year old car. 99% stock. So now I basically have all the good bits from the old one, lots of parts for stroker engine and stock TT. This should be fun. I start a new build thread once I have had time to inspect what I've bought properly. I try to document the engine build and technical things as I'm planning to do most of the interesting work myself.


Great to see this - I loved the detail in your build and was gutted when you had the smash. 
I'm also working towards getting my TT back into shape this year, so hopefully there will be a couple of interesting stroker threads for 2017.

Matt


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## nate42

Matt B said:


> Great to see this - I loved the detail in your build and was gutted when you had the smash.
> I'm also working towards getting my TT back into shape this year, so hopefully there will be a couple of interesting stroker threads for 2017.
> 
> Matt


Thanks and good luck with the build Matt and keep us posted.

There were few things that I've liked to do differently and now I can, so in that sense it's nice to take a fresh start. This time no corners cut and no half ass solutions.

I've started a new thread for the build:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1465233


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