# Digital Camcorder Buying Advice



## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Been meaningn to buy a new CC since the last one went with the ex last year.....

Not too many prerequisites....

*needs to be good value
*reasonable battery life
*screen viewfinder (not eyepiece)
*night mode would be good
*mountable inside a TT (coilover hoop?)
*stills capability with memory expansion

Don't want to break the bank - but a mixture of features vs good value is what I'm after...

Any recommendations, pointers or even 2nd hand ones considered!!


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## davidg (Sep 14, 2002)

Don't know any model Nos but all sony CC are exellent ,good batt's with info some last 12hrs


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## Howard (May 7, 2002)

Get one with a DV in socket - that way you can mount an external pencil cam on the outside of the car also...


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Yeah good call, Howard. If it doesn't add too much to the price, that is certainly a feature I'd like to have...

So can anyone recommend a good place (online?) for buying?


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

ditto
http://www.********.co.uk/ttforumbbs/YaBB.pl?board=OffTop;action=display;num=1055060888


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Grrrr you guys aren't helping too much!!

Ok I did a little web and shop research today (ain't contracting a wonderful thing!)

Am looking to spend similar money to Nick, so advice for both of us would probably be similar.

The kind of model I'm looking at:

Panasonic NVGS50B
Canon MV630i / MV650i (saw the 630i in Dixons on special offer)
JVC GRD?? (still trying to work out the model differences!)

Am trying to steer clear of Sony for the reasons stated above (ie I can get hold of MUCH cheaper SD cards than I can memory sticks!)

Now all of the above would come in around Â£500ish, all have DV in AND out, all have colour LCD etc...

My only gripe is that for the kind of money I'm looking to pay, the still image quality isn't going to be great........ so is it worth looking for a cheaper camcorder (is there one?) that would retain the recording features that I'm after, but sacrifice the stills function?

C'mon guys you know you wanna help!


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## r14n (Jan 10, 2003)

Jampo / Nick, your doing better than me, I posted a while back asking for help / advice and got NO responce.

Have decided on a Sony TRV33.

Magapixel for the Still option onto Mem card. DV in/out and Hi-res night shot thingy on the cam. And fits in your pocket.

Got a good deal via our companies IT department, so saving a good lump over shop prices, would not spend this ammount normaly, but got an offer I could not refuse. 

Ian


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Rough guide to price?


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## r14n (Jan 10, 2003)

550 - 600 ;D ;D

800 - 850 everywhere else.


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

Can you get hold of any more?


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## jonno (May 7, 2002)

Tim
I've just bought a Sony TRV19 - its sub Â£500, but excellent (no stills tho, so if thats a must you'd have to try a different model :-/ )
Picture quality is excellent, only -ve is that the viewfinder is B&W
(The touch sensitive screen is the biz tho)
Its got night mode and DV in/out


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## R6B TT (Feb 25, 2003)

I was thinking of the Canon 600i - mate of mine has the 550 and is well pleased with it. 403 online if you look on www.pricerunner.com. If you don't want the DA converter in the 600i you can get the 600 for 330.
I've bought a Canon A70 today for stills from Amazon - best deal overall, 244 for the Camera plus an additional 64MB CF, 20 for a fast 2 hour charger with 4 x 2000 NiMh AA cells


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

sorry to sound like a technophobe, but whats a DA converter?

Is it Digital to Analogue?
What does this mean in the real world?
Do I need a DA converter???? ???


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## djp10tt (Jul 20, 2003)

I am a Sony fan and I have one of these
http://www.microanvika.co.uk/SONY/produ ... O=SON52145
It's a very small palm size. Takes movies AND stills on micro dv tape or memory stick :-/
Resolution on still is not brill for printing (less than 800,000 pixels) but ok for pc/web. Movie mode is briliant. Cost me Â£1300 about a year ago now less than a grand


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## R6B TT (Feb 25, 2003)

NickP,
I don't know if you need one or not - but I have a Sony Analogue Hi8 Camcorder, and my understanding is that I can plug it into the Canon and stream the Analogue tapes through it into my PC for editting via a Firewire card - so it will make my old technology convertable to new.

I still need to do a bit more research - but its about 5 years since I editted any tapes so have some catching up to do. My mate with the Canon's main reason for choosing it was he found the Sony Compacts a bit too compact for his pudgy fingers -

If my expectations are incorrect someone please tell me! Looking forward to the A70 arriving tomorrow though, looks like a really good piece of kit. ;D

Any Camcorder with stills is going to be weak quality wise for stills against a 100 quid plus Digital Camera - horses for courses I guess


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Hrmph

Cheaper Canon's were looking excellent - the 600 does look good - but unfortunately doesn't have the DV in!

So the Canon choice (for me) would have to be the 600i, the 630i and the 650i. THe 630i is the same as the 600i but with a slightly better optical and digital zoom, plus the MMC/SD facility for stills. At a cost of about Â£80 more than the 600i. The 650i adds MPEG movies function plus a better "Super Night Mode"

Hmmmmm choices. Will also check out JVC but their model range is quite hard to decipher!


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

Tim.....not being an expert what would you use the DV in for :?

Is it a ' must have feature'?

If not then the 600 does look very good value


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Well the one feature ScoTTy already mentioned - it would allow the input from a "pen cam" or similar - basically any device with its own DV out.......


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

I'm not sure I really need that feature....as funds are a bit tight after just about buying the entire stock of 'Mama's and Papa's' if its not going to affect editing on a PC etc....then the 600 might be the route I'll go down.


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Right

MV600i is Â£412.99
MV630i is Â£498.27
MV650i is Â£569.00

Quite a big difference between 650i and 600i for what is essentially the same piece of kit (as far as I can tell) - 600i lacks the MMC/SD still features, the MPEG movie and the Supernight Mode. The 630i is a halfway house....

If I can find the MV600i in the highstreet for that price (or someone prepared to price match) I reckon I'll go for it. But may still end up with the normal MV600 and sacrifice the DV-in for the sake of cheapness. MV650i still a possibility but the MPEG4 function I would use, but would get on my next digital stills camera anyway...... and the nightmode - well I don't think I'll need an amazing nightmode, and it has a standard one anyway......


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

600i Â£389.99

at that price I may be tempted!
http://shopping.lycos.co.uk/3441enE459597.html

Will let you know if I find it cheaper anywhere else


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## r14n (Jan 10, 2003)

> Can you get hold of any more?


Sorry Nick, one off deal as we are buying alot of kit with them, they tell me it's a loss leader, to get the business. going to be less than 500. 

Could not leave it on the shelf. Ian.


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Nick,

unfort. that price is plus VAT, so Â£458 inclusive 

keep looking!

Â£412.99 at Amazon.co.uk

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASI ... 54-1779813


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## NickP (May 6, 2002)

doh!! 

http://www.digital-point.co.uk/model.asp?ID=313

Â£409 free p&p


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## scoTTy (May 6, 2002)

I've been offline all week so am just catching up.

**** I don't think DV in is what you want for a pencil cam ****

I didn't say it was, I just said that you may need to consider if you wanted the abillity to plug in a pencil cam. Howard posted that DV in would allow it and if so I am very interested as I have DV in and would love to be able to stick a camera in but...... :-/


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Right....

I bit the bullet and bought something yesterday and first impressions are very favourable! Although I've not got much to compare it with....

And I did what I swore I'd never do! Walked into Dixons and handed over my debit card!!! *lol*

I went for the Sharp VL-Z8H in the end..... why?

Well I've read mixed reviews of the Canon(s) citing loud motor noise and extremely poor quality indoor recording. The former might not be that important to me, but the latter would be..... I think the 1/6" CCD and 800k pixels just isn't up to a wonderful job...... so the JVC would suffer a similar fate.

I noticed Dixons Online were showing details for the VL-Z8H and its exclusive to that chain.

Main features (over and above the Canon 630i)

*built in flash
*1.33 megapixel 1/4" CCD - so MUCH better basis for digital stills
*camera body in 2 parts and swivels through 225 degrees
*silicon LCD supposed to work better without backlight

plus it has the features I was looking for - SD/MMC capability, DV In/Out, remote control etc etc.

Its an Â£800 camcorder but Dixons are flogging it for Â£499, and the package includes 2 batteries.....

They are also doing a "kit" which includes 5 JVC Mini DV Tapes plus a largeish carrybag (RRP of the pair Â£50) for 1/2 price, so Â£524 lighter in the wallet I have almost everything I need....

Next additions are the incar mount plus a firewire card/cable for my PC.

Took some footage of my dogs playing with some pikey horses whilst out walking yesterday and the quality seems very good...........

So anyway, I found it was possible to get a reasonable still camera AND DV Cam all in one package 

The camera body looks a bit like this:










and the VL-Zxx website is here (but my one isn't listed)

http://www.sharp.co.uk/viewcamZ/

Opinions invited


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## R6B TT (Feb 25, 2003)

Enjoy it Tim - my new Canon A70 stills camera arrived yesterday, first impressions very good once you have peeled the naff stickers off. I have saved them for TTotal though. ;D
Looking forward to having a proper play with it at the weekend - the manual is about 1cm thick!


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## scoTTy (May 6, 2002)

Seem a good price Tim. DV picture quality is good and once you get some decent video editing s/w like Studio 8 then I'm sure you'll be very happy together!

Did anyone find out about whether there is a pencil cam option for DV in?


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## scoTTy (May 6, 2002)

I've just done a quick search on the web and found this quote :


> *your DV or 8mm camcorder must have AV inputs in order to use any of our cameras, DV inputs alone are not suitable.


I think this is true for all pencil cams as I believe they are just a dumb analogue device.

Howard - do you know different?


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## Howard (May 7, 2002)

Yikes - didn't mean to confuse! Memory dump or typo! Scotty you are absolutely right. The DV in is for re-editing. The AV in is analogue for pencil cams. JampoTT - don't worry, the Sharp has an Analogue input.

I was recommended the Sony ones here.. http://www.rfconcepts.co.uk/cameras.htm by friend with an Elise that has front and rear facing cameras.


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