# Engine cutting out on start up



## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Hi all, 
I've trawled through previous posts and not found the answer to what I am experiencing. If there have been posts the same in the past I apologise for the repetitiveness.

My TT is a 2000 reg, all standard bar a stage 2 vagcheck remap.

It's been all good up until recently but when left for 2 - 3 weeks the problem started.

First up the battery died so I changed it and it started first time, however the dashboard computers don't turn on, the warning lights do.

Then the engine cuts out a second later, almost as if it's not getting any fuel, but there was fuel in the tank when left (fuel and temp gauge now not working along with dash computer)

Has anyone had anything similar, is there a simple solution to this?

With January 31st just around the corning I am avoiding spending any money on it if at all possible!

I really appreciate any replies or suggestions.

Many thanks
Tristan


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## AmpTThill (Sep 18, 2011)

Check all your fuses mate - if still no good run diagnostics / vag com.


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## AwesomeJohn (Apr 25, 2006)

Cutting out one second after start up is the immobilizer. If the dash isn't lighting up then this is why the immobilizer is cutting in. Like Amp mentioned check the fuses 1st.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Thanks for the replies so far.

Checked the fuses and they are all good, dashboard computer has managed to fix itself along with the fuel / temperature gauges.

Unfortunately still cuts out on start up....


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## AwesomeJohn (Apr 25, 2006)

It sounds like you will need your local specialist of stealer to code it back in for you.


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## ricer (Dec 4, 2010)

tristan said:


> Thanks for the replies so far.
> 
> Checked the fuses and they are all good, dashboard computer has managed to fix itself along with the fuel / temperature gauges.
> 
> Unfortunately still cuts out on start up....


Johns already mentioned this but....

Turn the key to the point before you engage the starter motor. Is the "Key" Icon flashing or illuminated ? If so and you try to start the engine, it will start but then die quickly afterwards... is this happening?


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

This is exactly what is happening, the engine is starting but dying quickly afterwards, but no sign of the 'Key' icon, dash computer says 'OK' .


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## Matt B (Apr 8, 2007)

Fuses on top of battery? One of those powers up the fuel pump.


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## Gazzer (Jun 12, 2010)

Matt B said:


> Fuses on top of battery? One of those powers up the fuel pump.


+1


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

Thought I had posted this hours ago :? 
Corrosion possibilites


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Just checked the fuses and all is good, none broken and no signs of corrosion.....


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

Have you checked for power going to those terminals?.

Leaving a car standing for weeks hmm?.

Have you checked for spark an the coil end?.

When did your TT last have the spark plugs replaced?.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Spark plugs were replaced about 2 years ago I think? I'll go check to see if those terminals are getting power.

Would the engine start at all if the spark plugs weren't working, surely not?


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

tristan said:


> Spark plugs were replaced about 2 years ago I think? I'll go check to see if those terminals are getting power.
> 
> Would the engine start at all if the spark plugs weren't working, surely not?


Usually start and cut out from what I've seen and experienced!.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

muxgt said:


> tristan said:
> 
> 
> > Spark plugs were replaced about 2 years ago I think? I'll go check to see if those terminals are getting power.
> ...


In that case I'll whip them out to check tomorrow when I can see a little more. Just dropped a torch in the engine bay and spent 10 minutes trying to retrieve it!


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

Lol sorry mate, had to laff as its a pain when things drop down and a pain to get hold of!.

Better luck in the morning :wink:


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## lesstatt (Dec 20, 2011)

Not sounding too daft here but do you have another key that you could try, my car only runs with one key, the other starts it but it stops straight away, it needs re-coding, £40ish at the TT centre


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

lesstatt said:


> Not sounding too daft here but do you have another key that you could try, my car only runs with one key, the other starts it but it stops straight away, it needs re-coding, £40ish at the TT centre


I've only ever have the one key unfortunately, so unless it needs recording it's probably not that? Just off to check the sparks and coil....


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Spark plugs and coil all good....


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

tristan said:


> Spark plugs and coil all good....


Any fault codes?.

Possible cam or crank sensor at fault!.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

muxgt said:


> tristan said:
> 
> 
> > Spark plugs and coil all good....
> ...


The only fault code was related to the 4 wheel drive system which also showed when having the remap done a while ago but vagcheck said to ignore as 4 wheel drive is working fine.

Look like I may have to take it to the the garage?


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

I guess


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

muxgt said:


> I guess


booooo  Thanks for your help though. I'll update with the result and problem when I find it


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## muxgt (Apr 12, 2010)

Other things to look at! >>>

Fuel pump relay/engine control relay.
Air intake system/vacuum leaks/split hoses.
Fuel pressure regulator.
Maf sensor-mass air flow sensor.
Cam sensor-under cam cover.
Crank sensor.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

muxgt said:


> Other things to look at! >>>
> 
> Fuel pump relay/engine control relay.
> Air intake system/vacuum leaks/split hoses.
> ...


I've fixed it! Well I say 'I' very loosely! WAK from Vagcheck came up with a few ideas and actually in the end all it took was leaving the negative battery terminal off for 5 mins, then ignition on for 15 seconds and off again, then start up.... hey presto.

A full reset was all it needed.... not sure how or why I didn't do this to begin with.

Thanks so much for the advice. Five 'Audi specialist' garages turned it away saying it needed to be returned to Audi, who quoted £750 + VAT. You can imagine my relief....


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## Wak (May 6, 2002)

You see... I'm not just a pretty face! :roll:

Glad its sorted for you but lets see if it stays ok, the original cause is still a mystery.


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

Wak said:


> You see... I'm not just a pretty face! :roll:


Your not wrong there matey :-* :-*


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## Matt B (Apr 8, 2007)

jamman said:


> Wak said:
> 
> 
> > You see... I'm not just a pretty face! :roll:
> ...


LOL - after posting your mug in your Avatar that is bare faced cheek lmao


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

Matt B said:


> jamman said:
> 
> 
> > Wak said:
> ...


Once you've had fat you never go back......

Something like that anyway :-* :-* :-*


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## John-H (Jul 13, 2005)

Check the immobiliser key symbol now it's working and familiarise yourself with it so if it does it again you'll know


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

John-H said:


> Check the immobiliser key symbol now it's working and familiarise yourself with it so if it does it again you'll know


The immobiliser key symbol wasn't the issue, it hasn't shown from the start


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

It seems my joy was short lived......

A night on the driveway and we're back to square one

Balls


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## John-H (Jul 13, 2005)

tristan said:


> John-H said:
> 
> 
> > Check the immobiliser key symbol now it's working and familiarise yourself with it so if it does it again you'll know
> ...


The key should light up when the ignition is first turned on and when the security check is run when the engine is first started the light should go out to show all is well. If the security check fails then the light starts to flash and the engine is cut out one second after starting. can you remember if the key symbol has ever let up?


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

John-H said:


> tristan said:
> 
> 
> > John-H said:
> ...


I don't think the key symbol has ever lit up, I remember my old A3 had one but I'm pretty sure this one has never shown?

Since playing around a little more I've noticed that if I leave the battery terminal off and reset etc to get it started, the dash computer screen all works as normal and the car is fine, once I turn it off again and try to start up it goes back into 'broken mode' and the dash computer doesn't work or light up at all.... I'm not sure if this may help at all?


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## John-H (Jul 13, 2005)

What year is your TT? It could of course be that you only started looking for key symbols recently but as far as I'm aware all TTs have the immobiliser feature so should show a key symbol when the ignition is first turned on. If yours isn't now showing a symbol then either it doesn't have the feature (first one I'm aware of) or it's a clue as to it's dysfunction - in which case I would suspect the dashpod. :?

Try and warn up the cabin - get a fan heater on an extension lead in there and leave it on for an hour (be careful!) - just aim to get things thoroughly warm - then try and start it and look for the key symbol. If it shows up and starts Ok as I'd previously described then this I would think would confirm the dashpod as the cause. The cause being memory corruption that often first shows up in cold weather.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

John-H said:


> What year is your TT? It could of course be that you only started looking for key symbols recently but as far as I'm aware all TTs have the immobiliser feature so should show a key symbol when the ignition is first turned on. If yours isn't now showing a symbol then either it doesn't have the feature (first one I'm aware of) or it's a clue as to it's dysfunction - in which case I would suspect the dashpod. :?
> 
> Try and warn up the cabin - get a fan heater on an extension lead in there and leave it on for an hour (be careful!) - just aim to get things thoroughly warm - then try and start it and look for the key symbol. If it shows up and starts Ok as I'd previously described then this I would think would confirm the dashpod as the cause. The cause being memory corruption that often first shows up in cold weather.


It's W reg, 2000?

Currently heating up, will see what happens in an hour.

Thanks


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Ok good news, I didn't burn the car to the ground!

We're making progress - warmed it right up for an hour and then tried the dash and to start, nothing different, still in broken mode.

Then removed the negative terminal for 5 mins and it started first time as expected. Turned it off and tried again, usually this returns to broken mode but this time for the first time since the problems began, the KEY symbol showed and it started again no problem. Tried several times and it was all good.

I'm sure in half and hours time when it cools, it will return to broken mode. So i'm guessing you're right John and the dashpod is on the way out?


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

I should point out that the key symbol only showed momentarily with all the other dash lights and then disappeared as expected.


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## John-H (Jul 13, 2005)

Right, I thought that was odd. Mine is a1999 model amd has an immobiliser, so yours should and as you've found does.

The early dashpods had a re-writable processormemory (FLASH) which was incorrectly programmed in production (too quick) which resulted in weak charge storage in the memory cells. This leaks away over time but too early in this case. It first shows up in the cold usually and can affect many functions of the dashpod. Later dashpods had permanently programmed (masked) processors which don't suffer this problem.

The fix (if this is indeed the problem) is to change the processor for the later masked device.

You can get it reconditioned for around £200 by a couple of companies or if you have a full Audi service history, free of charge by Audi.


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

John-H said:


> Right, I thought that was odd. Mine is a1999 model amd has an immobiliser, so yours should and as you've found does.
> 
> The early dashpods had a re-writable processormemory (FLASH) which was incorrectly programmed in production (too quick) which resulted in weak charge storage in the memory cells. This leaks away over time but too early in this case. It first shows up in the cold usually and can affect many functions of the dashpod. Later dashpods had permanently programmed (masked) processors which don't suffer this problem.
> 
> ...


John, thanks again for your help, it's invaluable.

Are there any companies you'd recommend? I don't have a full Audi service history....

I'm based in the South East.


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## John-H (Jul 13, 2005)

Here you go:

Cluster Repairs UK
http://www.clusterrepairsuk.co.uk/repair-list/audi/tt/

BBA Reman
http://bba-reman.com/content.aspx?conte ... rd_failing
Also on eBay:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUDI-TT-DASH- ... 5ae1b8bbcc

ECU Testing:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-TT-Dash- ... 5ad177c4d5

This is the actual processor which would be an option for DIY or if you know someone capable. Taking the dashpod apart is a little tricky and there's potential for damaging it or marking the dials etc. so some caution is needed:

http://www.codecard.lt/electronics/2j74 ... d_127.html

Some DIY tips on disassembly:
http://mk1tt.montebellopark.com/clusterrepair.html

BBA Reman where the first company to offer a postal repair service of the TT dashpod as far as I'm aware and do say they repair for Audi. Their eBay cost seems to be £115.

Whichever company you use speak to them first to describe the fault and ensure that they are going to replace the processor. If you sent it to them without explaining then there is a chance they wouldn't spot the fault if their workshops are warm :wink:

All the mileage key and code numbers are stored in another chip so changing the processor won't affect this as you'll get the same unit back so it will work. If you were to buy a second hand dashpod all this would need recoding and that's a trip to the dealers and a lot of money, plus you wouldn't be sure that the unit you were buying also had the same or another fault. A new one from the dealer is very expensive when purchased out of warranty - I don't know what they charge now but I recall it was around £700.

Here's how to remove the cluster:
http://www.bigmassive.co.uk/blog/wp-con ... emoval.pdf


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## tristan (Sep 16, 2010)

Thanks John, that's perfect.

It's actually working without a fault today in -7.5 but I'm sure it will return

Cheers, Tristan


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