# ap versus brembo 4 pots.



## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Hi , ive just found that the newer cupra r 4 pots are made by ap whereas the earlier ones are brembo .

Has anyone had any experience of both as I'm in between a rock and a hard place as I've been offered both for simular money but the brembos come with pads and carriers.

Cheers
Liam


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## brushwood69 (Dec 17, 2012)

The new cupra is not the mk4 platform so you may need a bunch of work with carriers hoses etc. I run the old cupra R calipers (brembo) and are more brake then the car needs with good pads/discs/fluid etc...


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

brushwood69 said:


> The new cupra is not the mk4 platform so you may need a bunch of work with carriers hoses etc. I run the old cupra R calipers (brembo) and are more brake then the car needs with good pads/discs/fluid etc...


The chap has offered to fit them for me
, he's member on here.

says they bolt straight on and utilise the standard disc but the pads are bigger than the brembo pads and cover more of the disc?


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


> .....says they bolt straight on and utilise the standard disc but the pads are bigger than the brembo pads and cover more of the disc?


One thing GB, if you increase the caliper and pad area without increasing the mass of the disc, either thickness (preferably) or diameter all you are doing is storing up a heat problem. The extra clamping force generates more heat which has to go somewhere, typically back into the caliper via the pad. You may be able to dissipate some through improving airflow, but you need to consider your brake setup as a whole not as seperate elements.

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


> The Godbarber said:
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> > .....says they bolt straight on and utilise the standard disc but the pads are bigger than the brembo pads and cover more of the disc?
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Yeah cheers steve, im.going for the brembo setup as it is a larger disk and ive got those brake ducts now so all should be good,cheers!!

how's your clutch???


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


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In a word..Fecked. Car has regressed to the point of being undriveable. Now has to come out and go back to CG to find out what's wrong. I have emailed both them and the supplier asking who's paying. Not happy, not happy at all.

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

In a word..Fecked. Car has regressed to the point of being undriveable. Now has to come out and go back to CG to find out what's wrong. I have emailed both them and the supplier asking who's paying. Not happy, not happy at all.

VT[/quote]

That's sucks mate, either way you shouldn't have to carry the can!


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## Prawn (May 14, 2015)

The AP calipers in question are Seat Sport AP's. they run on the stock 312 x 25 little rotors. Whilst it's a bigger caliper with a larger pad, there is no extra capacity for heat within the discs at all, which is one of the biggest issues.

The LCR brembos use a 323 x 28mm disc, larger disc with more capacity for heat, it's a decent enough caliper (aside from dust seals burning up on track) with a good selection of pads available, and sets can be had for peanuts these days.


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Prawn said:


> The AP calipers in question are Seat Sport AP's. they run on the stock 312 x 25 little rotors. Whilst it's a bigger caliper with a larger pad, there is no extra capacity for heat within the discs at all, which is one of the biggest issues.
> 
> The LCR brembos use a 323 x 28mm disc, larger disc with more capacity for heat, it's a decent enough caliper (aside from dust seals burning up on track) with a good selection of pads available, and sets can be had for peanuts these days.


Cheers, ive sourced some brembo 4 pots with discs and ds2500 pads at a very decent price indeed!!!


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## CollecTTor (Jan 17, 2014)

Where can you source the LCR Brembos and discs? Obviously not available in North America. Thanks in advance.


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

CollecTTor said:


> Where can you source the LCR Brembos and discs? Obviously not available in North America. Thanks in advance.


Ebay or Car Breakers yard , if you need any help, just give me a shout!


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## cookbot (Apr 19, 2011)

Another option is the Boxter S brembo 4 pot calipers with a 330mm Alfa Brera disk (£70 a pair for genuine brembos on Euro Car Parts!). I've just made some adaptors for these and they look promising so far. Just need to get the calipers stripped and rebuilt when I get chance. Give me a message if you need any more info about this setup, it works out pretty cheap!


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## Madmax199 (Jun 14, 2015)

Sorry to take this off topic, but what's with the semi-obsession to improve the front brakes when the pathetic rear is screaming for help and has way more potential than playing with the front?


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## cookbot (Apr 19, 2011)

Working on that too, adaptors that move the disk onto an S4 disk. Still doesn't alter the fact that the OE front brakes are absolute crap too!


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

cookbot said:


> Working on that too, adaptors that move the disk onto an S4 disk. Still doesn't alter the fact that the OE front brakes are absolute crap too!


Interesting! Are these 5x100 or will they need re-holing?


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## Madmax199 (Jun 14, 2015)

It will be nice to have cheap spacer/adapters to move the stock rear caliper out and use larger discs. I don't know if I would want to cut the spacers for heavy S4 discs, a nice two piece rotor (of similar size) from Willwood would be ideal IMO.


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## cookbot (Apr 19, 2011)

NickG said:


> cookbot said:
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> > Working on that too, adaptors that move the disk onto an S4 disk. Still doesn't alter the fact that the OE front brakes are absolute crap too!
> ...


Nah, they'd need taking from 112 to 100mm PCD, but that's not a hard task for any machine shop.


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## cookbot (Apr 19, 2011)

Madmax199 said:


> It will be nice to have cheap spacer/adapters to move the stock rear caliper out and use larger discs. I don't know if I would want to cut the spacers for heavy S4 discs, a nice two piece rotor (of similar size) from Willwood would be ideal IMO.


Problem is, not everyone can afford/justify the cost of a two piece rotor when those S4 disks are available for £50 a pair. Most here are track day or fun fast road drivers and won't really care about the extra weight.


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

cookbot said:


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Sounds good to me, I'll be needing new rears soon anyway!


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## Madmax199 (Jun 14, 2015)

cookbot said:


> Madmax199 said:
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> > It will be nice to have cheap spacer/adapters to move the stock rear caliper out and use larger discs. I don't know if I would want to cut the spacers for heavy S4 discs, a nice two piece rotor (of similar size) from Willwood would be ideal IMO.
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Maybe you're right Paul, but I don't see how a track day guy won't care about something that will rob power making it to the wheels and the handling of the car. To me this a performance mod, so it should be done to gain performance, not compromise on it. Cheers!


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

I'm sure you can find 2-piece discs to fit this if you want them though! This could be a cheap halfway stage, better braking for now, then lose the weight at another stage.

I got a quote on "custom" standard size 2-piece discs for the fronts this morning, £465 per pair, then £265 for new rotors each time. I'd imagine the rears would be the same if not less.


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## YT-TT (Apr 6, 2010)

Watching this with interest as I need to renew the brakes all round soon.

The Alfa discs and adaptes sound good Paul, let me know more details on those.

Also any more info on S4 discs and brackets for the rear would be welcomed too.

Cheers!


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Guys I sold my 4 pots as the combination of Carbotech XP10 upfront and ds2500 on the rear with standard calipers gave an amazing amount of brakeage!!


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

Glad to hear that Liam! 8)

I'm going to explore Carbotech when i put my brembos on, should have some nice stopping power then!


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

NickG said:


> Glad to hear that Liam! 8)
> 
> I'm going to explore Carbotech when i put my brembos on, should have some nice stopping power then!


Indeed you will but they squeal like a bitch on the road unless you brake late and hard!!!

I'm going to Woodbridge on 11th of June if your up for it.


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


> NickG said:
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Airfield full of cones?

VT


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## cookbot (Apr 19, 2011)

YT-TT said:


> Watching this with interest as I need to renew the brakes all round soon.
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> The Alfa discs and adaptes sound good Paul, let me know more details on those.
> 
> ...


The info is all here:

http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1273586


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


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Probably steve , I don't mind though I've done other airfield days and one of the better days ive had was RAF Marham which I've done a few times!!!

I'm not a snob , a trackday is a trackday to me mate!!!


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## Whisky (May 5, 2016)

Liam, got yourself a proper tyre pressure gauge yet? 

Watch front tyres temps. the layout favors light rear drive cars, which the TT isn't.


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Whisky said:


> Liam, got yourself a proper tyre pressure gauge yet?
> 
> Watch front tyres temps. the layout favors light rear drive cars, which the TT isn't.


No, I don't think I've ever owned one :lol:

Is it a long circuit then????

Cheers
Liam


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## Whisky (May 5, 2016)

The Godbarber said:


> Whisky said:
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> > Liam, got yourself a proper tyre pressure gauge yet?
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It's sort of "medium"-ish length at about 2miles long.

It's also "stonechip central" due to the broken up concrete surface, in addition the broken up bits chew rubber if the car is loaded up, and the car will be loaded up.


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Mmmmm perhaps I will give that a miss then,the only other place I wouldn't wanna take my tt is Bruntingthorpe, I loved that in my crappy 205 but it got peppered! !!!

Patience my ass, let's do it!!


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

Didnt want to mention it....Woodbridge is a tyre killer. A couple of my Essex based Pork owner mates did it once a few years ago, haven't been back. :?

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


> Didnt want to mention it....Woodbridge is a tyre killer. A couple of my Essex based Pork owner mates did it once a few years ago, haven't been back. :?
> 
> VT


Cheers Steve, seems like everyone's trying to talk me put of it :lol:


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


> Von Twinzig said:
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Steer you away maybe 

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


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Didnt work mate , I got the tt for a track car and that's what it's getting used for ,im going it's just a car!!!

And I'm now looking at getting another evo to abuse too!


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


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Each to their own GB, I've never had any interest in non-competitive driving, around a runway full of road cones. Just doesnt do anything for me.

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Didnt work mate , I got the tt for a track car and that's what it's getting used for ,im going it's just a car!!!
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Each to their own GB, I've never had any interest in non-competitive driving, around a runway full of road cones. Just doesnt do anything for me. 
VT[/quote]

So you don't do trackdays at all then as they are non competitive!!


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


> Didnt work mate , I got the tt for a track car and that's what it's getting used for ,im going it's just a car!!!


Each to their own GB, I've never had any interest in non-competitive driving, around a runway full of road cones. Just doesnt do anything for me. 
VT[/quote]

So you don't do trackdays at all then as they are non competitive!![/quote]

.....around a runway full of road cones. Trackdays around cones, setup that morning on an old runway on a disused airfield. Great for the Corsa kids stepping up from Saturday night carparks, but not for me. Like cheap wine and crap restaurants, life's too short.

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


> The Godbarber said:
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> > Didnt work mate , I got the tt for a track car and that's what it's getting used for ,im going it's just a car!!!
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So you don't do trackdays at all then as they are non competitive!![/quote]

.....around a runway full of road cones. Trackdays around cones, setup that morning on an old runway on a disused airfield. Great for the Corsa kids stepping up from Saturday night carparks, but not for me. Like cheap wine and crap restaurants, life's too short.

VT[/quote]

Have you done one? ???


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


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Nope, but I've never stabbed myself in the ear with a spoon, drunk Bulgarian wine or shopped in Primark either. I'm wise enough by now to know that none of these things will enhance my life. I did go to the inaugural meeting at Rockingham when it first opened (never been back since), does that count? 

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Nope, but I've never stabbed myself in the ear with a spoon, drunk Bulgarian wine or shopped in Primark either. I'm wise enough by now to know that none of these things will enhance my life. I did go to the inaugural meeting at Rockingham when it first opened (never been back since), does that count? 

VT[/quote]

Hahahahaha no it doesn't and on this occasion im afraid your input is somewhat irrelevant as you can't voice an opinion on something you've never tried. :wink:


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

Von Twinzig said:


> Nope, but I've never stabbed myself in the ear with a spoon, drunk Bulgarian wine or shopped in Primark either. I'm wise enough by now to know that none of these things will enhance my life. I did go to the inaugural meeting at Rockingham when it first opened (never been back since), does that count?
> 
> VT





The Godbarber said:


> Hahahahaha no it doesn't and on this occasion im afraid your input is somewhat irrelevant as you can't voice an opinion on something you've never tried. :wink:


I can voice an opinion, but whether people pay attention or not is another matter - ask any politician. 

For me I would sooner do fewer events at real race tracks that have gravitas, history and provenance than charge around a cone filled runway or indeed Rockingham. It's an event. Taking a bends like Pouhon and Blanchimont, that you've watched being taken for years by some of the greats, driving over the start/finish line at Le Mans, these are memorable events. For me, personally, temporary airfield layouts don't do it, but each to their own. There's a place for all tastes. I'm a quality over quantity guy. You have the bucket of Bulgarian red, I'll take a glass of Pomerol. 

VT


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Von Twinzig said:


> Von Twinzig said:
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mate I don't even know what Pomerol tastes like as I won't drink it because it tastes like pisswater :lol:


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

The Godbarber said:


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QED 

VT


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## Whisky (May 5, 2016)

Woodbridge... Hmmm...

Goodwood
Croft
Silverstone... They all started life as airfields.

As a platform to muck about with the driver's driving, the car, and managing other cars/drivers, Liam utilize trackdays as a platform to drive in a high energy environment.

I.E. he's not overly interested in photojerking at Tourist locations like Spa @ 4 X the cost of a Bedford.

Also, don't you mean Bugatti?

There's only 1 TDO who has ever let a group out on the full Le Mans, and I didn't see you there.


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

Whisky said:


> Woodbridge... Hmmm...
> 
> Goodwood
> Croft
> ...


It's all the same to me mate, and ill wager there are not many of you on this forum that have actually driven the Grand Prix Circuit at The Nurburgring.

But a track is.a track to me , im in it for the laugh and if my next track car comes off then laughing ill be.


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

I've driven THE nurburgring... but i do really want to go back and try the GP circuit as it looks mega on the tellybox!


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

NickG said:


> I've driven THE nurburgring... but i do really want to go back and try the GP circuit as it looks mega on the tellybox!


I was out there a decade ago when they opened it up for the public for what in was told was the first ever time.
They told us not to film it or wed get chucked off but I thought what the hell im going home tomorrow and me and my mate sarge have a lovely little video somewhere of it!!

Do they open the GP circuit a lot now then???

I've been out to the ring three times, was half tempted to go this year but still not sure if I'm getting made redundant soon.


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## NickG (Aug 15, 2013)

The Godbarber said:


> NickG said:
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Ah that's pretty cool!! 8)

Yeah, i'm pleased to tell you a ring pass is now basically X euros for 1 lap of "The Ring" or the same money for 15 minutes of lapping the GP track... I'd honestly rather have the GP track time at that price! (Watched far too many Nurburgring Fail videos recently!) :lol:


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## The Godbarber (Jul 12, 2015)

NickG said:


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cool,it was 7.5 euros a lap when I was there last but that was ages ago!!!

It's worth driving the GP circuit just to say you have!!!!

I'm pretty much getting shot of my tt now anyway,it's not fun.


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## Von Twinzig (Feb 10, 2014)

Whisky said:


> Woodbridge... Hmmm...
> 
> Goodwood
> Croft
> Silverstone... They all started life as airfields.


Absolutely, Snett and Thruxton too and when Woodbridge becomes a full time circuit, like say Blyton and has 25 years of racing history, I'll go there. I'm not talking about what was, but what is.



Whisky said:


> As a platform to muck about with the driver's driving, the car, and managing other cars/drivers, Liam utilize trackdays as a platform to drive in a high energy environment.
> 
> I.E. he's not overly interested in photojerking at Tourist locations like Spa @ 4 X the cost of a Bedford


As I said before, each to their own. Spa's recognised by most as being in the top echelon of motor racing circuits in the world, Bedford doesn't yet host a motor racing event. Personally I'd do a ratio of 1:4 cost vs Bedford as I think it's more than 4x the circuit, thing is though it's just over 2x for the actual day, though by the time you factor in the fuel and hotel it's a weekend break. Bedford's a good place to explore the limits of your car in a pretty safe environment and close to me, so I'll go there when I need to test the development of my car.



Whisky said:


> Also, don't you mean Bugatti?
> 
> There's only 1 TDO who has ever let a group out on the full Le Mans, and I didn't see you there.


The start finish line of both (which is what I cited) are the same piece of track. Driving up past the pits and through the Dunlop chicane is the same for me and Mark Webber, just that he's going much much faster. 

Have I ever driven round an airfield? Yep, endlessly. I had my first car before I was 16 and spent most Sundays driving round the peri track at Stapleford Aerodrome. It was brilliant. Learnt a lot about car control and in a pretty safe environment, as a result passed my test a few weeks after my 17 birthday. Do I want to go back there, no thanks, life has moved on. If other folk want to, great, but I have no interest in them.

VT


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