# Impreza sti



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

Oh dear, my ol' mans only gone and bought one! It's an 06, 2.5 t.

How would I hold against it with a stage 2 remap and a little weight loss, should be about equal I would have thought?


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## ecko2702 (Jan 26, 2009)

you wouldn't keep up :?


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

ecko2702 said:


> you wouldn't keep up :?


But why...

They're 275bhp, and 1495kg.

Stage 2 remap should see around 270bhp, and with a little bit of weight loss I could easily see 1400kg.


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## jayz_son (Jan 11, 2009)

are imprezas gear ratios different, shorter?? 
and they have much bigger turbos too dont they?


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

In fact, thinking about it....

even if a st2 remapped tt doesn't run the full quoted 275bhp, it's got to be hitting a real 255bhp at the fly, coupled with around 300lb/ft of torque ( the impreza is 290lb/ft), the power to weight ratio would be 185bhp/ton, exactly the same as an impreza sti!

Obviously the scooby has better brakes and 4wd


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## ecko2702 (Jan 26, 2009)

the gearing is different the turbo is bigger the way their 4wd system operates is different. remapped TT225 against wrx I'd go for the TT STi vs remapped 225 I'd go for the STi


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## ecko2702 (Jan 26, 2009)

If the TT had torsen rather than Haldex I'd say it would be better matched


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

ecko2702 said:


> the gearing is different the turbo is bigger the way their 4wd system operates is different. remapped TT225 against wrx I'd go for the TT STi vs remapped 225 I'd go for the STi


Gearing shouldn't really make much difference in acceleration.

So what if the turbo is bigger? If they produce the same power, the produce the same power!

The 4wd is better admittedly, but a good launch on the tt and I recon it will be even stevens..


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

chris_p said:


> ecko2702 said:
> 
> 
> > the gearing is different the turbo is bigger the way their 4wd system operates is different. remapped TT225 against wrx I'd go for the TT STi vs remapped 225 I'd go for the STi
> ...


If the turbo is bigger it will take longer to spool up, not a good thing.


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## roddy (Dec 25, 2008)

chris_p said:


> Oh dear, my ol' mans only gone and bought one! It's an 06, 2.5 t.
> 
> How would I hold against it with a stage 2 remap and a little weight loss, should be about equal I would have thought?


you are ASKING us,,, :? :? :? you have the tools .... you should be TELLING us !!!!.


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## 26ash_tt (Jul 16, 2008)

figures might be more or less the same but two completely different machines, the stats for the sti are just over 5 sec to 60


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## krismc (Apr 4, 2009)

the benefit of the tt is you dont look like your about to do an armed robbery or your a drug dealer


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## gazzerb (Oct 20, 2008)

krismc said:


> the benefit of the tt is you dont look like your about to do an armed robbery or your a drug dealer


 :lol: :lol: 
Or that your out in your grandads four door hatchback


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## Hark (Aug 23, 2007)

Maybe I'm looking at the wrong car, stats I looked at were 4.7 sec
http://www.modernracer.com/subaruimprezawrxsti2006.html

I've tried it though mate (mine is stage 3, just still on standard k04 turbo)

You will loose and it will be by several car lengths.

Maybe it's because I'm yet to see *ANY* TT make the remap quoted figures on the rollers. It's also 2.5L so forgetting peak bhp his turbo will spool faster or if it's a bigger turbo it won't have a huge lag.

Wrong league mate. :wink:


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## zabzy-TT (Jul 9, 2008)

The tt will get beaten. All these figures about remaps hitting 270 bhp have never been proven at the rolling road days as above. Your kidding yourself if you think your even gonna come close..... oh unless you have a remap and a K&N!!!! :roll:


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## taylormade-tt (May 14, 2007)

Who cares :roll: well you i suppose... why?.. i couldn't tell you.. :roll:

all this is my TT faster than a (insert car here) is soooooooo boring :?

Can we just erase these pointless threads :roll: they are cropping up every other day and are chavtastic [smiley=argue.gif]

Tom.


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## ecko2702 (Jan 26, 2009)

taylormade-tt said:


> Who cares :roll: well you i suppose... why?.. i couldn't tell you.. :roll:
> 
> all this is my TT faster than a (insert car here) is soooooooo boring :?
> 
> ...


Agreed but at least this time it isn't a damn Clio :lol:


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## 26ash_tt (Jul 16, 2008)

taylormade-tt said:


> Who cares :roll: well you i suppose... why?.. i couldn't tell you.. :roll:
> 
> all this is my TT faster than a (insert car here) is soooooooo boring :?
> 
> ...


why dont you just not read them then


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## matteeee (Mar 5, 2007)

ecko2702 said:


> If the TT had torsen rather than Haldex I'd say it would be better matched


..because?


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

26ash_tt said:


> figures might be more or less the same but two completely different machines, the stats for the sti are just over 5 sec to 60


0-60 is a load of wank, it's pub talk. Too many factors to be considered. 
Power to weight ratio is the most important statistic


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

taylormade-tt said:


> Who cares :roll: well you i suppose... why?.. i couldn't tell you.. :roll:
> 
> all this is my TT faster than a (insert car here) is soooooooo boring :?
> 
> ...


I care, hence the thread.

There's nothing wrong with a little bit of comparison with regards performance. Nothing chavvy about it imo, especially with the tt being a 'sports car' :lol: ..... Is Clarkson a chav?

It's not the end of my world if the impreza is faster, it's more a case of curiosity! At the end of the day, the only thing the impreza really has going for it is performance, the tt is a style icon, built better, sophistication, and it's nippy. If I could get the performance anywhere near an impreza sti I'd be dead chuffed with my car as performance is the only thing it's lacking currently imo.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

ecko2702 said:


> taylormade-tt said:
> 
> 
> > Who cares :roll: well you i suppose... why?.. i couldn't tell you.. :roll:
> ...


I still stand by it, my clio 172 cup would mince my tt 225!


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

Hark said:


> Maybe I'm looking at the wrong car, stats I looked at were 4.7 sec
> http://www.modernracer.com/subaruimprezawrxsti2006.html
> 
> I've tried it though mate (mine is stage 3, just still on standard k04 turbo)
> ...


Yeah that's the US spec, it's a UK spec...living in the uk and all. 275bhp, 0-60mph in 5.5 seconds.

IIRC remapped tts hit 60 in around 5.5?

And also, if i remember correctly, a remapped tt will 1/4mile in around 14 flat, looking at this http://www.letstorquebhp.com/4wd.asp the STI (uk spec) will do it in the same.

I honestly think it's fair game!

And yes I know I comparing a modified car to a standard, but it's only a bit of fun. Tune the scooby (which is easy) and you're back to square one, bye bye tt!


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## 26ash_tt (Jul 16, 2008)

chris_p said:


> 26ash_tt said:
> 
> 
> > figures might be more or less the same but two completely different machines, the stats for the sti are just over 5 sec to 60
> ...


its not really though is it, on a straight run on the strip the sti's going to be hitting 60 in just over 5 and the tt isnt. and power to weight ratio means nothing on its own its how the car puts the power down you can have an amazing power to weight ratio but if you cant get it down as well as the next car its useless.

the other arguable point could be the handling but the the sti would beat the tt again anyway.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

26ash_tt said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > 26ash_tt said:
> ...


Both cars have 4wd and a lot of weight, getting the power down is not an issue!

0-60 really is poo, 0-100mph, 1/4 mile times are a good way of judging a sprint. 
In gear times 30-70 etc are a good way of judging day to day driving.

And anyway, I've heard many reports of mapped tts hitting 60 in around 5.5, the same as the sti, so what's the issue? :S
And before everyone gets on their high horse saying it's not possible, the QS hits it in 5.7 with minimal weight loss and less power so it's totally believable.

As for saying remaps don't offer the claimed bhp, fair play, they don't always, but even if it were to hit 255 (which again, is believable) it would have the same power/weight.

As I said earlier, the impreza would have better handling and brakes, but this wouldn't come into effect in a drag race.


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## SteveS TT (Apr 23, 2008)

My new car is probably in the region of about 250bhp per tonne if not more. My TT would have left it at a set of lights!!!!

But then once you're out of 2nd gear the new car would pull a lot of lengths so yes 0-60 does mean something and it's not 'pub talk'.

If we're talking 30mph - 120mph that is what matters in my opinion.

If you want a performance car then you've brought the wrong car.


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

Its a scooby end of teh day they would have to be seriously fast for me to ever have one


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

I remember my stage 1 and 2 re-map by Custom Code

Stage 1 re-map helped a little, but STIs would still pull miles in front

Stage 2 with de-cat, milltec exhaust, silly air filter and forged inter-cooler made a difference but still they won.

Twin scroll Kit kick there ass.

My new 2.0 litre big turbo even kicks modified STIs running high bhp. :lol:

LEGO


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## Charlie (Dec 15, 2006)

As much as there have been comments slating this type of thread, they always seem to generate a lot of posts and create a discussion, heated or otherwise and to me that's kinda the point of the forum 

I know that my car isn't the fastest, I may not be happy about it but at least I know I'm looking good as a Scooby flies past making some sort of ridiculous braaarp noise shouting about what it's up to 

Charlie


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## Super Josh (May 29, 2009)

chris_p said:


> And anyway, I've heard many reports of mapped tts hitting 60 in around 5.5, the same as the sti, so what's the issue? :S
> And before everyone gets on their high horse saying it's not possible, *the QS hits it in 5.7 with minimal weight loss and less power *so it's totally believable.
> 
> As for saying remaps don't offer the claimed bhp, fair play, they don't always, but even if it were to hit 255 (which again, is believable) it would have the same power/weight.


Chris, not so sure the QS has less power. The results of the recent RR session showed that the QS had the same power/torque (around 240 BHP/ 250 lb/ft) as a remapped car without any other mods
Then the QS is lighter too. Thought a remapped car was supposed to be around 5.9 to 60? Which would stack up with the same power and slightly more weight?

Josh


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## freegeek (Aug 26, 2005)

Stage 1 remap, no spare tyre and almost no fuel gave this after about 30 attempts (not all at the same time), this one was with a cold clutch.

Since then I have had to change the gear selector fork and clutch, ouch.

0-60 is as much about the driver as it is the car, whithin reason. The first second is critical in a 4wd turbo car so as not to get bogged down.


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## KentishTT (Jun 28, 2007)

I've always thought my TT is slow to get going but if you don't mind high revs and easing in the clutch smoothly it can really fly from a standing start but it's not that great for the life of the clutch!

Scooby STi's I have found are quite an even match for a stage 2 remapped TT, the TT being slightly faster on the straights.
The WRX is a different matter, I managed to keep up with one on the straight on my way to APS a while ago but he lost me on the bends and around roundabouts. He kept letting me catch up so he could leave me behind on the bends again, I was under no illusions!


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

KentishTT said:


> I've always thought my TT is slow to get going but if you don't mind high revs and easing in the clutch smoothly it can really fly from a standing start but it's not that great for the life of the clutch!
> 
> Scooby STi's I have found are quite an even match for a stage 2 remapped TT, the TT being slightly faster on the straights.
> The WRX is a different matter, I managed to keep up with one on the straight on my way to APS a while ago but he lost me on the bends and around roundabouts. He kept letting me catch up so he could leave me behind on the bends again, I was under no illusions!


I think you're getting the models mixed up mate, there's the wrx, then the wrx sti (being the faster one)


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

SteveS TT said:


> My new car is probably in the region of about 250bhp per tonne if not more. My TT would have left it at a set of lights!!!!
> 
> But then once you're out of 2nd gear the new car would pull a lot of lengths so yes 0-60 does mean something and it's not 'pub talk'.
> 
> ...


0-60 really is school boy talk, lets be honest.

What's your new car? Sounds spesh 

I didn't say I wanted a performance car, I would have bought a meggy r26 if I wanted something fun, I was just wondering what people would say to the tt vs scoobaru debate, and it was as I expected...they all think its a veyron slayer


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

The most important thing is women are far more impressed in a TT than a JAP box, thast the important thing :wink:


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## GEM (Jun 21, 2007)

chris_p said:


> I was just wondering what people would say to the tt vs scoobaru debate,
> and it was as I expected...*they all think its a veyron slayer*


Oooooh......I know I shouldn't, but I PMSL :lol: Nice one.
John.


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi,

I my opinion, the subaru STI would be great/better car for me and the track, at the time when I was buying my TT it was the looks of the car what made me buy it, not the performance.

There are to many scoobys around may area to, But think about for 5 - 8k you can get a 2nd hand STI fully loaded with more BHP a TT owner could dream off.

LEGO


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## KentishTT (Jun 28, 2007)

chris_p said:


> KentishTT said:
> 
> 
> > I've always thought my TT is slow to get going but if you don't mind high revs and easing in the clutch smoothly it can really fly from a standing start but it's not that great for the life of the clutch!
> ...


Oh OK, I thought the WRX was a higher spec later model than STi.

I followed one on the way to work this morning (an STI) and when he saw me catching up he floored it and so did I and I was as quick as him ..........in a straight line anyway :lol:


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

Is their handling that good? They have a higher center of gravity surley so that doesnt help?


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## ttsteve (Nov 1, 2007)

Bikerz said:


> The most important thing is women are far more impressed in a TT than a JAP box, thast the important thing :wink:


Now we're talkin.....


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## Sickboy (Oct 13, 2004)

especially when all you're wearing is one of these!


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## horsesuitedfool (Jan 31, 2008)

I have a stage three mapped 225 with hi flow cats, exhaust, dv valve etc etc and i had a race last week with an STI both neck and neck used up first second and third gears before a roundabout and there was sod all in it, i was a few metres ahead and so merged in ahead of him but really nothing in it.....Was his standard?? Who knows but he had a massive noisy exhaust!!


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## KentishTT (Jun 28, 2007)

Bikerz said:


> Is their handling that good? They have a higher center of gravity surley so that doesnt help?


Oh yes, very good indeed.

I would have gone off the road had I kept my foot down to keep up with the Imprezza I was following.


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## roddy (Dec 25, 2008)

Bikerz said:


> Is their handling that good? They have a higher center of gravity surley so that doesnt help?


it might not help,,but it does'nt hinder much either !!


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

horsesuitedfool said:


> I have a stage three mapped 225 with hi flow cats, exhaust, dv valve etc etc and i had a race last week with an STI both neck and neck used up first second and third gears before a roundabout and there was sod all in it, i was a few metres ahead and so merged in ahead of him but really nothing in it.....Was his standard?? Who knows but he had a massive noisy exhaust!!


There we go then, that pretty much answers my question! Cheers very much


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

The red car and the blue car had a race !!!

All red could do is stuff his face !!! :roll:


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## krismc (Apr 4, 2009)

fact is scoobys are good motors, but they are just boxes, and not a design classic and a statement car like a tt,

but damn i love the sound of the boxer engine through a big exhaust


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## Hark (Aug 23, 2007)

chris_p said:


> horsesuitedfool said:
> 
> 
> > I have a stage three mapped 225 with hi flow cats, exhaust, dv valve etc etc and i had a race last week with an STI both neck and neck used up first second and third gears before a roundabout and there was sod all in it, i was a few metres ahead and so merged in ahead of him but really nothing in it.....Was his standard?? Who knows but he had a massive noisy exhaust!!
> ...


I have the same setup but also have fmic. The one I played with pulled a few car lengths before 60. And he had 2 passengers, I only had one. It might have been a wrx sti? Maybe it was modded? Maybe I suck? lol


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

krismc said:


> fact is scoobys are good motors, but they are just boxes, and not a design classic and a statement car like a tt,
> 
> but damn i love the sound of the boxer engine through a big exhaust


The sound is pure awesomeness with a fat exhaust on there!


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

Hark said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > horsesuitedfool said:
> ...


People are still getting confused with the models lol! Horse raced a wrx sti and was even stevens. That's the quick one.

I pulled away from standard WRX's in my clio sport.

The one you raced was either modified or a special edition mate, they're so easy to modify.


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## DAZTTC (May 20, 2005)

lego man said:


> The red car and the blue car had a race !!!
> 
> All red could do is stuff his face !!! :roll:


 :lol: I bet your red one would win. :wink:


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## 26ash_tt (Jul 16, 2008)

chris_p said:


> horsesuitedfool said:
> 
> 
> > I have a stage three mapped 225 with hi flow cats, exhaust, dv valve etc etc and i had a race last week with an STI both neck and neck used up first second and third gears before a roundabout and there was sod all in it, i was a few metres ahead and so merged in ahead of him but really nothing in it.....Was his standard?? Who knows but he had a massive noisy exhaust!!
> ...


how does that answer anything :lol: it doesn't mean the cars quicker it just means he drove quicker than the other guy thats two completely diferent things :lol:


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi ALL
My 2p worth after having 4 TT'S one being a chipped QS & now a few Scoobies.
A bog std wrx 2.5 ltr will just about keep up with the QS in a drag race....
A uk spec 2.5 ltr sti will just about pull away from the QS....
A uk spec ppp (prodrive kit) will leave the QS ....
And most of the 2.0ltr jdm (jap domestic market) cars will laugh at a QS....  
The 2.0 ltr cars have much better engines by far.......we only have 2.5 to purchase new now in uk to meet emissions.
All this is based on the traffic light grand prix.......if ya throw a few bends in the std wrx..... will im sure leave the QS  
Oh & before some of you say thats what im going to say owning a scoobie..........after having it for 7/8 months i dont really like it that much......... it has more toys in it than the TT has as std...... but im still not a fan.....
Thats why the MRS drives it :wink: 
All the BEST
Cheers


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

26ash_tt said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > horsesuitedfool said:
> ...


My thread was asking if I could keep with a uk spec impreza wrx sti, he did, and claims they were going for it. The figures/stats also say the same thing. So yes, that does answer my question tbh


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

mobbster said:


> Hi ALL
> My 2p worth after having 4 TT'S one being a chipped QS & now a few Scoobies.
> A bog std wrx 2.5 ltr will just about keep up with the QS in a drag race....
> A uk spec 2.5 ltr sti will just about pull away from the QS....
> ...


Sounds about right, thanks for another useful reply. Too many people here spouting off nonsence.

As you said, a uk spec sti will just about pull away from a QS, that's as I thought, add a remap and more weight loss and it would be equal.


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi chris_p........you have one problem mate :wink: 
Most of the people who own sti scoobie's get a remap to fella ..........  
All the BEST
Cheers


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

DAZTTC said:


> lego man said:
> 
> 
> > The red car and the blue car had a race !!!
> ...


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## Hark (Aug 23, 2007)

mispost


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## jayz_son (Jan 11, 2009)

evo 9 fq360 or the scooby in question ???????????lol


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

I test drove an Evo 9 FQ 360 as well as a TT and I choose the TT. The evo I took out from a main dealer, the aircon didnt work, when I questione dif they would fix itbefore I brought it, he said "They all stop working after a while" I replyed "Does it just need re gassing?" He said "No, most seem to just stop working and no-one seems to get them repaired" :roll: :lol:

Put me off a bit


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Bikerz said:


> I test drove an Evo 9 FQ 360 as well as a TT and I choose the TT. The evo I took out from a main dealer, the aircon didnt work, when I questione dif they would fix itbefore I brought it, he said "They all stop working after a while" I replyed "Does it just need re gassing?" He said "No, most seem to just stop working and no-one seems to get them repaired" :roll: :lol:
> 
> Put me off a bit


So he was a good salesmen then 8)


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi.... Bikerz
That must have been one hell of a nice motor you took out for a spin :roll: 
Dont know how we got on to talking Evo's ....... :? 
The threads about scoobies v tt ....
But willing to discuse em seeing as you you brought the subject up :lol: 
(what you want to know...... how slow they are or how poor the plastic dash trim is ? )
All the BEST
Cheers


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

Evo / Scooby same thing really thast why I said it. TT and Scobby / Evo are totaly different!


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi....... Bikerz
Evo ...&..... scoobie are nothing like the same thing...... :wink: 
Yes they both have 4 wheel drive and a big rear spoiler thats it........
Oh and both cars have won the wrc numerous times  
How both cars drive and how the power is made and delivered to the tarmac IS totally different.......
If you had driven both im sure you would know this........ or ask BamTT :!: Im sure he will tell you the same as i have.
And i dont mean having a 5 minute put put up the road on a test drive with some salesman pearched next to you......
Cheers


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

chris_p, you are not looking at the bigger picture.

PEAK bhp and torque maybe equal (near as dammit). Power to weight may be comparible.

What about the Area under the Torque curve tho? and where that Torque is? And the gear ratios? and the fact the STi is newer and likley to have an engine in better condition?


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## HighTT (Feb 14, 2004)

chris_p said:


> Gearing shouldn't really make much difference in acceleration.


Take any car and lower its final drive ratio - you will improve its acceleration.


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

Oh. Been in many Scoobies (mate has 550bhp one) and mates have evos of all types and sizes. Ive only ever driven a Evo tho.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

swfblade said:


> chris_p, you are not looking at the bigger picture.
> 
> PEAK bhp and torque maybe equal (near as dammit). Power to weight may be comparible.
> 
> What about the Area under the Torque curve tho? and where that Torque is? And the gear ratios? and the fact the STi is newer and likley to have an engine in better condition?


Torque doesn't make a difference in a staight line drag. As for the age of the car, that's fairly irrelevant. You'll find the 1.8t shouldnt have lost much/any power in that small amount of time, engines actually produce better figures with some miles under the belt.


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

chris_p said:


> Torque doesn't make a difference in a staight line drag.


  really?!? How do you work that out?!?


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

swfblade said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > Torque doesn't make a difference in a staight line drag.
> ...


There's nothing to 'work out'.

Torque will make for a nicer drive, and it will 'feel' faster. But in a straight line drag, the only things that matter are bhp, weight, traction/grip and gearing.

If were're talking about real life driving, yes more torque will make better progress when sitting in a higher gear etc, but when it comes to 0-whatever mph, it's near enough irrelevant.


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## drjam (Apr 7, 2006)

Bikerz said:


> Is their handling that good? They have a higher center of gravity surley so that doesnt help?


Not sure that the centre of gravity would be that much higher? Isn't part of the whole boxster engine thing that it sits flatter and lowers the CoG?
We used to have a bog-standard, non-turbo impreza, so was slow in a straight line, but the handling was superb on a twisty b-road. Just felt brilliantly well balanced, nice light "feely" steering, hardy any roll, went where it was pointed - very confidence inspiring. So even without much power, could rattle along at a fair old rate.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

For the record, we're collecting the impreza tonight, so I will report back after I've had a little play


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

swfblade said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > Torque doesn't make a difference in a staight line drag.
> ...


Example:
Mondeo 2.0 tdci ghia - 330nm torque.

VS

Mazda rx8 - 211nm torque.

Which one wins in a race?

The mazda, it would kill it due to having a hell of a lot more bhp despite have pish all torque.


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## SimonQS (Jul 21, 2008)

mobbster said:


> And most of the 2.0ltr jdm (jap domestic market) cars will laugh at a QS....


Well, upto abour 112mph anyway :wink:


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

chris_p said:


> swfblade said:
> 
> 
> > chris_p said:
> ...


No, no no.... you are once again looking at Peak torque not where it is/how it is delivered!!!

Sorry, I can't agree with what is above that either. BHP is just Torque x revs, is it not? and if your Torque comes in quicker and lasts longer with a bigger curve, the BHP/torque throughout the rev range is going to be better, giving more acceleration throughout the rev range.

I'm sure I could find another example, I'll let you know if I do.


----------



## nick-569 (Apr 20, 2009)

i came from a sti v2 to a 225 tt and there is no comparisson whatsoever to performance, impreza would eat my tt for breakfast, make it look silly but i didnt buy tt for performance i brought it for everything else, a bit upset as to the quality of build quality of the tt though, its only done 48000 and both rear springs have snapped and something feels loose through the steering wheel and there is more rattles in this than my impreza, wouldn't swap back though.


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

nick-569 said:


> i came from a sti v2 to a 225 tt and there is no comparisson whatsoever to performance, impreza would eat my tt for breakfast, make it look silly but i didnt buy tt for performance i brought it for everything else, a bit upset as to the quality of build quality of the tt though, its only done 48000 and both rear springs have snapped and something feels loose through the steering wheel and there is more rattles in this than my impreza, wouldn't swap back though.


we are talkin about a stage 2 remapped TT tho mate i think with the 275 bhp STI it would be a decent race


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## nick-569 (Apr 20, 2009)

still put all my money on sti mate, in standard form it was 4.6 to 60 but mine was running around 300bhp, was the lightweight version with alloy panels etc, never been in a remapped tt and i would love a go in one to compare to standard form.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

nick-569 said:


> still put all my money on sti mate, in standard form it was 4.6 to 60 but mine was running around 300bhp, was the lightweight version with alloy panels etc, never been in a remapped tt and i would love a go in one to compare to standard form.


The scooby in question in a uk spec 2.5 turbo mate.


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## nick-569 (Apr 20, 2009)

sorry lads i just jumped in without reading, mine was a totally different model, jap import etc... sorry again.


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## zabzy-TT (Jul 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> nick-569 said:
> 
> 
> > i came from a sti v2 to a 225 tt and there is no comparisson whatsoever to performance, impreza would eat my tt for breakfast, make it look silly but i didnt buy tt for performance i brought it for everything else, a bit upset as to the quality of build quality of the tt though, its only done 48000 and both rear springs have snapped and something feels loose through the steering wheel and there is more rattles in this than my impreza, wouldn't swap back though.
> ...


yeah one of those fantasy 275 bhp models that hit more like 235 on a rolling road!!


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Well let us know the outcome chris


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

zabzy-TT said:


> Dance171 said:
> 
> 
> > nick-569 said:
> ...


yes you're right, I'm wrong, 10bhp increase lol!

Let me guess, you dont have a remapped 225 yeah?


----------



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> Well let us know the outcome chris


i will mate


----------



## drjam (Apr 7, 2006)

Here's a reasonable discussion of the power vs. torque vs. acceleration debate: 
http://autospeed.com.au/cms/title_Power-versus-Torque-Part-2/A_108648/article.html

Or, if you can't be arsed reading it through, a few lines of conclusion chopped out:

"You can compensate for a lack of torque in a powerful engine by shortening gearing. But you cannot compensate for a lack of power by gearing."

"The example of a human: By appropriate gearing, you can get a human being to generate a lot of torque at the driven wheels of a bike at extremely low speeds. The ability to hold this torque at higher revs is power, and the fact that a human being does not generate much power is the reason that a human-powered vehicle is not able to accelerate quickly at any but the very lowest speeds."

"Power is the critical determining factor for maximum acceleration and torque is necessary for driveability. Trucks and industrial vehicles use engines with large amounts of torque with a fairly flat torque curve, but relatively little power. Racing and sporting vehicles use high revving engines, with high power and relatively little torque in comparison to their power outputs. That is why you have F1 having engines revving to over 18000 rpm. There's no use doing that if to maximise acceleration all you needed to do was maximise the amount of torque you had."

So my reading of all this in relation to the TT/STi debate before is: you certainly can't compare the two cars torque figures and say the highest one accelerates faster. You _might _be able to compare two cars power figures and say that, but only on the assumption that their gear ratios are set up similarly too.


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi All
SimonQS :wink: Yes fella 112mph..........but all are delimited on reaching uk shore by the importer usually.
Also we did used to have the 2.0 jdm type spec in the uk up until 54/05 plate i think.. (i may be wrong on this point)  
Dont get me wrong a chipped 225 or a QS are very quick cars...... They are not the best to get off the line fast as this does take a little practise......but quick once rolling in all gears :!: 
The uk spec 2.5 sti is a good car and very fast off the line which is very easy to do (even ya nan could do it)
I dont think its really fair to compare the tt v the sti........ but a tuned tt will just be short of the sti outright performance in a straight line. Around the twists of an A or B road the subaru would stretch an even bigger gap.
Also remember when having the tt tuned......there are so many companys which claim differeny figures.

To zabzytt .... i dont disagree with what you say....however an sti in good health will push 270/280 + bhp all day long.
In many cases 10 bhp more..... its not usually less on an sti like on many cars makers claims....
Most of the jap stuff used to be limited through an agreement to 276bhp but some cars when put on the rollers 
here in uk and were 310bhp +..

Also when people say will my tuned keep up with xyz..... you must remember others tune there cars up so you can never be 100% sure you are racing..like for like... I would also say a very high percentage of say subaru owners also mod there cars to......which will ...with a quick remap and exhaust be 310/335 bhp.

ALL THE BEST
CHEERS


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

chris_p said:


> yes you're right, I'm wrong, 10bhp increase lol!
> 
> Let me guess, you dont have a remapped 225 yeah?


Chris, I understand you're skeptical about remaps only achieving relatively small increases in peak BHP, but unless you've got some evidence that it's not true you're not really in a position to disagree. You might claim that rolling roads give inaccurate readings (although I've not seen you back that claim up), but at least there is some repeatable methodology there. A remappers claimed BHP is just that. A claim. They all include the magic words "up to" for a very good reason.

There is no doubt that a remap makes a TT feel much better to drive (you can judge this on the sheer number of positive reviews on here) but that doesn't mean that the peak BHP must have gone up by more than 20. A good remap could keep the peak BHP the same and *still* transform the drivability of a car.

Honestly, I think you're defending a pointless position here.


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

Dance171 said:


> nick-569 said:
> 
> 
> > i came from a sti v2 to a 225 tt and there is no comparisson whatsoever to performance, impreza would eat my tt for breakfast, make it look silly but i didnt buy tt for performance i brought it for everything else, a bit upset as to the quality of build quality of the tt though, its only done 48000 and both rear springs have snapped and something feels loose through the steering wheel and there is more rattles in this than my impreza, wouldn't swap back though.
> ...


An STI v2 weighs about 1250kgs and has some pretty short gearing FYI


----------



## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Spandex said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > yes you're right, I'm wrong, 10bhp increase lol!
> ...


I Can see both of your points to be honest as to the Remap being a higher bhp claim that you actually get is most likely true

as far as saying could keep the bhp the same but change drivability is nonsense tho ive raced a mate in a 225 standard and mine is mapped and there is no comparison on one stretch of private road i was hitting 120 and he was hitting 110 and this 10mph might not sound like much but it sure looked it with the distance it put between us!!! i really do think the STI 275BHP version would be a good race with a decent stage 2 map the 300bhp STI is a diff story

just my 2Ps worth


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Dance171 said:


> as far as saying could keep the bhp the same but change drivability is nonsense tho ive raced a mate in a 225 standard and mine is mapped and there is no comparison on one stretch of private road i was hitting 120 and he was hitting 110


You misunderstood my point. I'm not saying a remapped TT is the same speed as a non-remapped one. I'm saying that the driveability (which is a very subjective thing, linked to the shape of the power delivery throughout the revs) can be improved massively without increasing peak BHP.

Basically what I was trying to illustrate is that just because a remapped car feels very different when you get it back, doesn't mean all that difference you feel is down to the peak BHP. A car can feel quicker just because a remap can make that power more useable in normal driving, but that doesn't always guarantee a fast 0-60 time (this is why I like big, NA engined cars. A well tuned TT might well beat me to 60 from the lights, but I'll never know because I won't be trying... I will be enjoying better performance once the cars rolling though, because I don't have to hunt for a narrow power-band every time I want to press on).


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Ah right i see what your trying to say

i suppose its personal preferrence myself i prefer the turbo type with that big surge of power all of a sudden and not just quick off the lights quick enough all the way to top speed  where as you obviously prefer the type of power band you just described which is fine too 8)

i think the 275 STI and the stage 2 TT will both put there perfomance down in different ways but the end result distance over time (speed) will be very close which is the point of the topic i think

not causing arguements or meaning anything in a nasty way if anybody is thinking that just a general discussion


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi all,

I got to put my 20p worth in.

Mk1 TT Designed for a nice soft but sporty ride. But no rally car.

Imperza Sti Designed purpose for rally events.

The Mk1 TT :-

1. Does not handle like a STI 
2. Does not deliverer like power like a STI
3. Is not as fast has a STI

Basically the STI is in a different league from standard.

Ok, some of your guys have re-map your lovely TTs and seem to think you have a chance with a STI. 
Instead just driving fast on the M1, try challenging a STI on a Donnington Race Track / Cadwell Park.

You will need more that a Stage 2 remap to come anywhere close to a standard STI. ( Bin there, done it )

Convert your mk TT from a 1.8t to 2.0t or turbo your V6 and you may be up there with the big boys. 
Still lots of work to be done for the handle issues but can be sorted, even still when they are, does a modifed MK1 TT
handle as well as a modified STI. I hope so with the correct expertise setting to car up.

Its a great post because it always causes a lots of friction between members. However, the Mk1 TT was never meant to be mega fast, or even a track / rally car.

For example, look at me, I cracked my windscreen within days ! ( flex in the body or what )

Still if any STI wanna race me, bring it on ! mu hahahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I think I have had more than 20p so over and out !

LEGO


----------



## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

Bikerz said:


> The most important thing is women are far more impressed in a TT than a JAP box, thast the important thing :wink:


My comment still stands tho :lol:


----------



## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

LEGO i totally agree that they were two cars made for two different purposes and round corners and track etc it is no comparison in a straight line i just think everyone is thinking we are talking about the jap spec 300bhp STI when we are talkin uk 275 version i think the stage 2 TT will be a good race as i have already said!!! look at the stats and there is nothing in it


----------



## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Dance171 said:


> look at the stats


There's the problem. There are no stats for a modified TT. There are rolling road results that some trust and some don't and there are various claims from people with a vested interest in making remaps sound desirable, or people keen to justify the money they've spent.

Every modified TT will, ultimately, perform differently. So, the only answer to the original question is "no one knows" (ok, my answer would actually have been "no one cares", but I'm guessing I'm in the minority).


----------



## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

lol wasnt expecting that answer but made me laugh 

dammit now the only way to find out is to get a mate to buy a 275 STI and race it lol

after all thats wot friends are for 8)


----------



## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> LEGO i totally agree that they were two cars made for two different purposes and round corners and track etc it is no comparison in a straight line i just think everyone is thinking we are talking about the jap spec 300bhp STI when we are talkin uk 275 version i think the stage 2 TT will be a good race as i have already said!!! look at the stats and there is nothing in it


Do you mean a race in a straight line ? Maybe, i can remember racing a few STIs with a stage 2 re-map, intercooler, de cat pipe and miltec exhaust system, in fact I think a have it on video somewhere.( will dig it out and post ).

The STI had the edge, remember TT = 1780cc STI 2547cc, Big Big difference ! 

But who races in a straight line now days? Forget going forward for a minute. A STI will out brake a TT any day, Hence the big brake kits that everyone straps on there TT because standard the will not stop your Gran !

Plus how many standard STI do you find on the road now days ? One re map from them and its all over for you stage 2 re-map owners!

Happened to me, got the power bug and now cant stop !

Heelllpppppppppp !

LEGO


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Bikerz said:


> Bikerz said:
> 
> 
> > The most important thing is women are far more impressed in a TT than a JAP box, thast the important thing :wink:
> ...


Thats only cos you only hang around with fat birds ! ( joking ) :wink:

The slim ones think that TTs are middle aged men going through problems in life ! :wink:

Me, I love my TT, I dont care what women think of it ! :-*

LEGO


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Do you mean a race in a straight line ? Maybe, i can remember racing a few STIs with a stage 2 re-map, intercooler, de cat pipe and miltec exhaust system, in fact I think a have it on video somewhere.( will dig it out and post ).

The STI had the edge, remember TT = 1780cc STI 2547cc, Big Big difference ! 

Yes mate straight line 

doesnt make a difference what size engine tho if they both develop similar power and have similar weight

you wouldnt happen to know if the STI you raced was 275bhp uk spec or jap spec?

if you do that will finally give us the answer to this thread  good to see the vid if you can find


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

lego man said:


> Still if any STI wanna race me, bring it on ! mu hahahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Not me as i only have 340/340 from my STI uk, but i can think of a couple i know who would be happy to give it a go :wink:

But from reading your thread, you must have so much fun bait Porsche baiting etc etc


----------



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

Spandex said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > yes you're right, I'm wrong, 10bhp increase lol!
> ...


Correct, that's my view and I'm sticking to it 
I cannot provide evidence as you know, all I can go by is 1/4 mile times and 0-100mph etc, and these far surpass a standard 225 and as said earlier in the thread, wouldn't be anything to do with torque.

I realise the quoted figure given by the mapper is only a claim, however the performance increases speak for themselvs?

Again, as said earlier in the thread, torque will make for a better drive, and will make the car 'feel' faster, however 'feeling faster' doesn't get you down the 1/4 mile faster, or hitting 100mph a few seconds earlier does it...

I understand your point, people are getting remaps and are expecting 285bhp or whatever the mapper claims, and it's probably bull, but at the end of the day (usually) they're getting more than a 10bhp increase! Probably more in the region of 30-40bhp in real life.


----------



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

lego man said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I got to put my 20p worth in.
> 
> ...


Agree, but that wasn't what the thread was about tbh lol.

The tt isn't really a sports car, I knew that before I bought it, it is however a stylish coupe and once remapped can see off most hot hatches. And maybe even stay with a scoobaru sti at a push 

I saw the scoob last night and it's a beast. The size of the brakes is mad, the caliper must only clear the wheel by about 5mm!

Mine's a road car, so the fact that other cars can outhandle it round a track are rendered almost pointless to me, however as a driving enthusiast I can understand this and yeah, it's obvious, I can't hold the tt's corner in the handling department ha.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

drjam said:


> Here's a reasonable discussion of the power vs. torque vs. acceleration debate:
> http://autospeed.com.au/cms/title_Power-versus-Torque-Part-2/A_108648/article.html
> 
> Or, if you can't be arsed reading it through, a few lines of conclusion chopped out:
> ...


...so i was right.

Thought so


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

chris_p said:


> Oh dear, my ol' mans only gone and bought one! It's an 06, 2.5 t.
> 
> How would I hold against it with a stage 2 remap and a little weight loss, should be about equal I would have thought?


Sorry, I must of drifted of the original topic reading the rest of the thread.

What is meant by " hold against '?

LEGO


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> Do you mean a race in a straight line ? Maybe, i can remember racing a few STIs with a stage 2 re-map, intercooler, de cat pipe and miltec exhaust system, in fact I think a have it on video somewhere.( will dig it out and post ).
> 
> The STI had the edge, remember TT = 1780cc STI 2547cc, Big Big difference !
> 
> ...


***********************
Are you for real ? No offence 
You state that
"doesnt make a difference what size engine tho if they both develop similar power and have similar weight"

So if I said I had a 1400cc TT making peak power at 275 bhp would you say that a TT 1.8t with a stage 2 remap would be a faster car or slower ?

Cant wait for your answer !!! No offence :roll:

LEGO


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

oh by the way check some of these out ...













http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-zG...DIA]
[MEDIA=youtube]w-zGMJVZKs0[/MEDIA]
LEGO


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

what im sayin is it dont matter if you have a 2.5 focus st which is a tubo against a remapped 1.8TT which will win????

The smaller engine!!!!


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> what im sayin is it dont matter if you have a 2.5 focus st which is a tubo against a remapped 1.8TT which will win????
> 
> The smaller engine!!!!


you have lost me now.........

what are you saying ?


----------



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

lego man said:


> Dance171 said:
> 
> 
> > what im sayin is it dont matter if you have a 2.5 focus st which is a tubo against a remapped 1.8TT which will win????
> ...


He's saying engine size isn't the be all and end all. When it comes to accelerating from a standstill peak power is the main thing, so engine size is irrelevant. All down to power to weight ratio, gearing etc, not the person with the biggest engine!

Or that's what I think he's saying anyway


----------



## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

lego man said:


> chris_p said:
> 
> 
> > Oh dear, my ol' mans only gone and bought one! It's an 06, 2.5 t.
> ...


No worries, easily done.

All I meant was how would I fair against it, in a race.

Not that this race will ever happen, although it would be good to have a little play and report back here. I'm just curious more than anything! I'm pretty sure the scoob will make the tt look a little bit silly, but even if it only pulled a few car lengths I'd hold my head up high tbh.


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

chris_p said:


> lego man said:
> 
> 
> > Dance171 said:
> ...


I don not think you really mean that engine size is irrelevant ? Engine size is a big factor.
What is peak power?
If one car has a longer power curve than the other which one would win? 
How would a engine tuner try and increase a power curve? 
Do you know how BHP is calculated?

Ok, power to weight ratio!

Lets do the maths.

Power to Weight.

STI Uk Spec. 
Weight 1495kg (curb weight) BHP= 275 engine size 2495 cc

275/1495*1000= 183.95 per ton (1000kg)

TT non sport 1.8 T
Weight 1465kg (curb weight) BHP=275 engine size 1780cc

275/1465*1000= 187.71 per ton (1000kg)

Not much in power to weight, 4x4 system differ and gear ratio but the power curve is very different.

Like I said early, one remap from a scoob and its history !

LEGO


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

so if the TT has more Bhp per ton in the calculation you just made to me that is saying the TT should be slightly faster but a good race

not disputing if you remap the STI it would win but thats not the question the question was a standard 275 bhp STI against a mapped TT


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> so if the TT has more Bhp per ton in the calculation you just made to me that is saying the TT should be slightly faster but a good race
> 
> not disputing if you remap the STI it would win but thats not the question the question was a standard 275 bhp STI against a mapped TT


Standard 275bhp TT ? Audi never made a MK1 TT with this bhp !

Do you mean a Re maped 225 ?

I only posted a power to weight ratio between both cars. I made a point of both car with have different power trends, and the STI will have a far better one than the re maped TT.

Its a 2.5 for Christ sake not a dappy 1.8 ! with a sort burst of 275bhp max for a split second.

If engine size does not make any difference then we best tell the F1 guys, that they are wasting there money !!! hahahah
Let all go green and run a 1ltr engine with a big turbo if this is the case !

Save the world, CO2 carbon footprints will be reduced to the size of a peanut !!!! lol

LEGO

PS I have increased my cc on my car and what a difference in performance ! I could only dream of going 2.5


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

not disputing if you remap the STI it would win but thats not the question the question was a standard 275 bhp STI against a *mapped *TT

Standard 275bhp TT ? Audi never made a MK1 TT with this bhp !


----------



## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Dance171 said:


> not disputing if you remap the STI it would win but thats not the question the question was a standard 275 bhp STI against a *mapped *TT
> 
> Standard 275bhp TT ? Audi never made a MK1 TT with this bhp !


The standard :lol: I mean MAPPED TT would lose. For one the clutch in a standard TT is pants to launch compared to a STI. 
And two, the STI has a larger engine with better gearing and 4 wheel drive system than a standard TT.

Does this answer your question ?


----------



## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

The way to look at it is this... Lets say you have a car with an imaginary engine that produces virtually 0bhp until it hits 4000rpm, then it produces 275bhp and this drops off at 4100rpm. Now, imagine you put that up against a car that produced exactly the same peak bhp but it does it evenly from 0rpm to redline (like an electric motor).

The second car would obviously win any drag races because it could maintain power through more revs. It also wouldn't have to waste any time changing gear.

This is an extreme example, I know, but it illustrates why peak bhp/weight isn't the only thing you need to look at. Power to weight is important, but if that power is delivered for a tiny percentage of the time, you won't be using it for most of the drag race and you'll be changing gear more.

Most hyper cars with sub 4 second 0-60 times do it by not needing to change gear at all.


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

Spandex said:


> The way to look at it is this... Lets say you have a car with an imaginary engine that produces virtually 0bhp until it hits 4000rpm, then it produces 275bhp and this drops off at 4100rpm. Now, imagine you put that up against a car that produced exactly the same peak bhp but it does it evenly from 0rpm to redline (like an electric motor).
> 
> The second car would obviously win any drag races because it could maintain power through more revs. It also wouldn't have to waste any time changing gear.
> 
> ...


I hope people of thIs thread now understand where I we are coming from. Nice explanation 8)

LEGO


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

Spandex said:


> The way to look at it is this... Lets say you have a car with an imaginary engine that produces virtually 0bhp until it hits 4000rpm, then it produces 275bhp and this drops off at 4100rpm. Now, imagine you put that up against a car that produced exactly the same peak bhp but it does it evenly from 0rpm to redline (like an electric motor).
> 
> The second car would obviously win any drag races because it could maintain power through more revs. It also wouldn't have to waste any time changing gear.
> 
> ...


Nice one Spandex, thats what I've been trying to say since the start...


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## Hark (Aug 23, 2007)

That's also my theory as to why remapped cars don't do as well on the rolling road as you expect.

The peak torque is can be very high, but it doesn't hold it for enough of the rev range so peak power is less.


----------



## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

lego man said:


> Bikerz said:
> 
> 
> > Bikerz said:
> ...


Im only 22 :wink:

:lol:


----------



## SimonQS (Jul 21, 2008)

Hark said:


> That's also my theory as to why remapped cars don't do as well on the rolling road as you expect.


This is all down to the Gen1 Heldex controller (including the unrated ones). When power is transferred to the back when the front wheels slip, this can be seen all to clearly on the graph. Since the wheels are always spinning, an accurate reading on the rolling road cannot be made. Actually the Gen2 on the Mk2 TT and A3s don't have this same problem

Subarus are permanent 4 wheel drive so don't relay on losing traction to gain 4 wheel drive.


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## lego man (Nov 9, 2008)

My comment still stands tho :lol:[/quote]

Thats only cos you only hang around with fat birds ! ( joking ) :wink:

The slim ones think that TTs are middle aged men going through problems in life ! :wink:

Me, I love my TT, I dont care what women think of it ! :-*

LEGO[/quote]

Im only 22 :wink:

Stone ?!
:lol:[/quote]


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## Bikerz (Aug 23, 2008)

oi :lol:

14 stone and 6 foot 4


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## Dance171 (Feb 8, 2009)

Bikerz said:


> oi :lol:
> 
> 14 stone and 6 foot 4


you skinny rake :wink:


----------



## SimonQS (Jul 21, 2008)

Bikerz said:


> oi :lol:
> 
> 14 stone and 6 foot 4


God, I am 6 foot 5 and 16 stone :roll:


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## lmracing (Jul 29, 2007)

I have both mate and all i'm going to add is that my Standard (*NOT* PPP) 06 STI has been dyno'd twice at different rollers at 312.5bhp and then 314.2bhp after a panel filter fitted. 2 remappers have viewed all the graphs to prove it is running standard fuelling and boost. The 2.5's were always reported to be better than standard figures.

So now your talking more than a 225 with a remap! And it just does not compare to me TT in performance but then again



Bikerz said:


> The most important thing is women are far more impressed in a TT than a JAP box, thast the important thing :wink:


is very true! Enjoy the TT for what its good at :wink:


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

lmracing said:


> I have both mate and all i'm going to add is that my Standard (*NOT* PPP) 06 STI has been dyno'd twice at different rollers at 312.5bhp and then 314.2bhp after a panel filter fitted. 2 remappers have viewed all the graphs to prove it is running standard fuelling and boost. The 2.5's were always reported to be better than standard figures.
> 
> So now your talking more than a 225 with a remap! And it just does not compare to me TT in performance but then again
> 
> ...


Those are very good figures for a non PPP car, before i bought mine (2.0 PPP originally :roll: ) i test drove a std 2.5 (280ish i think they are meant to be ) and it felt as quick as the 305 bhp 2.0 but with a lot more bottom end, the PPP'd 2.5 is meant to be 320, if you get a decent exhaust, fuel pump and sports cat which is basically PPP, and get someone like Bob Rawle, Andy Forrest or The Jolly green monster to map it you will have around 350-360 + close to 400 lb/ft, then its a different ball game [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

I am very close to getting a Scooby Clinic performance pack which should take me to 400/400 

Glad you are enjoying it, just be careful if you still have those Bridgestone RE070's on when the weather get wetter and colder


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## lmracing (Jul 29, 2007)

Yeah i still got those semi slicks... there just too good in the dry, i love them, but i think it will spend most of winter under a cover!

I will be looking to either Jolly Green Monster or GRD for a remap later in the year as they are both (GRD 10 mins away) local.

A friend has just brought a 07 STI 2.5 PPP with a Milltek exhaust and he was catching me pretty damn quickly! he's getting it dyno'd in a week or so before he gets it mapped... will be interesting what it gets!

What forum do you use Bamtt? I mainly use Surrey scoobies as its very friendly as ScoobyNet seems too arguementative at times. Oh and 400/400 sounds very nice 8)


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## lmracing (Jul 29, 2007)

oh yeah ... i was watching some Andy Forrest TOTB runs on youtube. Funkin wicked!!!


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi ALL
Quick question to....BamTT
Hi BamTT... I was informed that on the 2.5 engine you should change pistons to forged ones if going over the 340 mark ?
On the jdm & uk spec 2.0ltr cars they were all forged...( i think)...but when subaru changed to 2.5 engine subaru dropped in cheaper pistons to save £...well on the european/uk cars anyhow .... :x 
My mate has the 2.0ltr and i have had the std wrx & the RB320...both with the 2.5 engine....
Both were easy to drive and very quick off the mark at the lights...Even ya nan could do a traffic light grand prix and mulla most cars this side of a 360 ferrari up to 60/80mph ... :lol: 
Off topic....BamTT can i ask why you have never been tempted to move over to the dark side....Evo's :wink: 
All the BEST.
Cheers


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

lmracing said:


> oh yeah ... i was watching some Andy Forrest TOTB runs on youtube. Funkin wicked!!!


The gobstopper vids are cool 800bhp and just over 1000kgs 

I use Scoobynet and the Kent scoobies section in the SIDC, sometimes they can be a bit like a war zone though !!!

Have yet to go to one of their meets though


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

mobbster said:


> Hi ALL
> Quick question to....BamTT
> Hi BamTT... I was informed that on the 2.5 engine you should change pistons to forged ones if going over the 340 mark ?
> On the jdm & uk spec 2.0ltr cars they were all forged...( i think)...but when subaru changed to 2.5 engine subaru dropped in cheaper pistons to save £...well on the european/uk cars anyhow .... :x
> ...


I know quite a few guys are running @ 350 and 380-400lb/ft on standard internals on the 2.5 not sure how reliable though. as you said the JDM engines are the strongest followed by the uk 2.0 which i have then the 2.5

The reason i have have never gone to the dark side is that the STI is my commute car and does around 20k a year, so servicing may not work with an EVO ! Having said that if i am in a dilema at the mo, the mileage is now 55k on my car and i am either going to sell it for a UK 2.5 +map, go for one of the Spec C editions + map, or keep mine upgrade to 400 ish, either way I will need to buy a diesel for the commute as the 18-20mpg is getting rather Dull ! or finally get an FQ-360+map

Not sure, which puts the bigger smile on your face STI or EVO, I know which one sounds best :wink:


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi ALL
Cheers BamTT......No doubt the scoobie sounds better from idle....  
But not at 5k onwards.... i think the Evo is better.. :wink: 
The scoobie rumble at low revs is...... fantastic....
Have you ever looked at the cars xtreme in dudley have forsale.....
And as i have said before...most are just simple oil changes on the Evo...
Cheers


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

mobbster said:


> Hi ALL
> Cheers BamTT......No doubt the scoobie sounds better from idle....
> But not at 5k onwards.... i think the Evo is better.. :wink:
> The scoobie rumble at low revs is...... fantastic....
> ...


They are on my favourites !!!


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## mobbster (Mar 5, 2005)

Hi ALL
BamTT ...Xtreme are real good guys.... jon who owns Xtreme is a top fella as is BIG Simon in service.... :wink: 
Had my Evo tuned by them and purchased a few cars off them.... NEVER had a single problem... :!: 
Cheers


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

There seems to be some scooby knowledge floating about here so I´ll ask a question, I´m thinking about getting rid of the tt for a P1. Thoughts? I know they´re awesome out of the box, but it´s easy to get more power and they weight a large amount lighter than the newer models.


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## TT_me (Sep 5, 2009)

The P1 is just pure perfection, and IS the best looking impreza ever to be launched!

every part is there for a reason, and sets the car off.

unfortunatly to get a good one you have to have DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP pockets!

Good luck

Join Scoobynet, they come up for same often

Daz


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

Also make the its a P1 thats had the all important engine rebuild.or a Classic STI type R its what all the tuners use to showcase their talents


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

TT_me said:


> The P1 is just pure perfection, and IS the best looking impreza ever to be launched!
> 
> every part is there for a reason, and sets the car off.
> 
> ...


They´re not that much are they? I thought a good example could be had for 10k?


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

BAMTT said:


> Also make the its a P1 thats had the all important engine rebuild.or a Classic STI type R its what all the tuners use to showcase their talents


Engine rebuild? Eh? See it´s things like that that put me off lol. Maybe a mk1 focus rs then...


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

UPDATE!

Just had a good long drive in the scoobaru, and all I can say is, it's epic!

There's no way a tt could ever drive like that tbh, yes my car is standard but I know for a fact a remap will not transform it into that monster.


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

Hence one being a rallying, cheap supercar type performance monster, and one being a Luxury Sport's Coupe, GT type of thing.

Comparison is hardly fair IMO.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

swfblade said:


> Hence one being a rallying, cheap supercar type performance monster, and one being a Luxury Sport's Coupe, GT type of thing.
> 
> Comparison is hardly fair IMO.


I never said it was fair lol, I was meerly intrigued! The thing is, I really want one now, oops!


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

lol I gotta admit, I quite like the latest Scooby. The earlier ones don't float my boat, looks wise, but its all personal.


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## chris_p (Dec 14, 2008)

swfblade said:


> lol I gotta admit, I quite like the latest Scooby. The earlier ones don't float my boat, looks wise, but its all personal.


I have to admit I detest the new shape, but like you say mate it's personal taste.

Saying that, this one is pure porn.


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## swfblade (Apr 24, 2007)

Dam, that is one sexy beast.... I may have just done a sex wee.... :lol:


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