# I'LL RUFFLE SOME FEATHERS WITH THIS POST



## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

iT'S A POST ABOUT BUYING STUFF.

It's understandable that everyone wants to buy things for as little as possible. But it's also a question of judgement and integrity. 
When I want to buy something I consider what the maximum is that I'm prepared to pay - and that's what I offer. I don't expect the seller to be beaten down or offered a ridiculous price. Cause that would make me a cheapskate. And I'm not one.

People don't seem to realise that there's a difference between buying a second hand car and quality accessories for it in terms of selling price,

For example;

Lets say there's a TT for sale for five grand. We all know they cost about £32 k New BUT if someone is selling a set of Genesis injectors for £200 that cost £300, the potential purchaser still wants to beat the guy down.

I recently bought a Blue Flame exhaust off a forum member. I know that system cost £550 new. He wanted £350. So I go over and slap the money in his hand and feel good because I've saved £200. I don't want to knock him down an extra £20 cause It would make me a cheapskate when I'm already getting a bargain.

Yes, you can call it human nature and all that. I call it blurred vision. They're called timewasters/tyre kickers etc. And rightly so. CHANCERS and idiots actually.

It's the same philosophy when tipping in a restaurant. You've had great service and a brilliant evening, but then leave two quid on the plate. Slap twenty quid down and leave with grace and FEEL HAPPY for doing so.

My beef? Advertising a two grand black hard top and having people offer me £300 quid.

All I can say is;

"Get a fu***ng life!!!!!!!!!!!

Think about the philosophy and stop wasting everybody's bloody time.

Failing that, "Get a bloody income."


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## Mondo (Feb 20, 2009)

Being moved to the Flame room in 5... 4... 3... 

Yeah, bit annoying, but not the end of the world. In your specific case I wouldn't have bothered replying to the person, just ignored it.

(mind you, if you'd got a coupé in the first place you'd never have had this inconvenience :wink: )


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## matty fitz (Feb 8, 2012)

£310?


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## Hoggy (May 8, 2002)

Mondo said:


> Being moved to the Flame room in 5... 4... 3...


Hi Mondo, Very good.  Great minds think alike. :wink: 
Hoggy.


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## antcole (Apr 4, 2009)

With the so called economic downturn, this phrase "its a buyers market" has been banded about everywhere.....

Does it imply that the seller is sooooo desperate for cash that he or she will be happy to take a sixth of the asking price....?
It seems that the etiquette in buying something has gone and been replaced with blatent piss taking.

Offering 300 quid for a 2 grand motor is a waste of oxygen and deserves a "go get a dog up yer" response.

I sold my 225 last year for 3k, and the buyer didnt even hesitate or haggle a penny off it.

Im going for a lie down now.


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## BrianR (Oct 12, 2011)

When I sold mine earlier this year the buyer tried it on and I wouldn't move - he said, noone buys a car without getting a discount of some sort. I told him that if it was just a matter of practice and thaats what he expected then I agreed. When he paid the £11.5k, I gave hi £1 back. :lol: After saying that I bought my missus a car this week which the garage had really over priced. I knocked him down £500 on a £6k car, but that was the true value. I understand totally your views though and they make perfect sense to me.


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

Maybe he/she thinks your roadster hard top is way over priced in the current climate ?

£1100 isn't it


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

jamman said:


> Maybe he/she thinks your roadster hard top is way over priced in the current climate ?
> 
> £1100 isn't it


Thanks for your replies.

I take your point Jamman, but I don't think it's about climate. You can either afford something or you can't. I think a hard top for £1100 is a bargain on what they cost new. Ok, so i'd take a grand. But people who offer three hundred and are serious about that offer are MAD timewasters.


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

I hear what you are saying a year ago I sold my hard top (with fitting kit) for £1080

But

In the last 6 months I've seen them going for £500-£650 even less.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-converti ... 3ccb0d5a62


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

jamman said:



> I hear what you are saying a year ago I sold my hard top (with fitting kit) for £1080
> 
> But
> 
> In the last 6 months I've seen them going for £500-£650 even less.


That's interesting. So you think I'm asking to much I guess?


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## Gazzer (Jun 12, 2010)

i never haggle, if the price is set as the price no offers and vi want it i have it.........if it says ono and i think it is slightly over priced for the condition then i will ask if he would be open to a serious offer. if no then i leave it


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

Gazzer said:


> i never haggle, if the price is set as the price no offers and vi want it i have it.........if it says ono and i think it is slightly over priced for the condition then i will ask if he would be open to a serious offer. if no then i leave it


EXACTLY my point Gazzer. EXACTLY


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

Serendipitous said:


> jamman said:
> 
> 
> > I hear what you are saying a year ago I sold my hard top (with fitting kit) for £1080
> ...


I'm not saying that it's the right colour and it comes with the fitting kit but I know another forum member has been trying to shift his black hardtop with fitting kit for over a grand and now under for ages (your pics are bad Charlie)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-TT-Hard- ... 3a7a49e3b7

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-TT-Hard- ... 3a79e044bb


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

jamman said:


> Serendipitous said:
> 
> 
> > jamman said:
> ...


I take your point Jamman - Just that, as a buyer, I don;t think like that. I think, "Is this a good price against what it would cost new?" It is - "I'll have that!" No Haggling. No nothing. Then I go and collect and slap the cash in his hand. Deal done. As they should all be done in my book.


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## antcole (Apr 4, 2009)

Im such a bellend.....

"_Advertising a two grand black hard top and having people offer me £300 quid_"

I read that as a two grand black hard top TT.... like as in the whole car..... type of thing.... 

I thought 300 quid for a two grand car was a rather brazen haggle....

Right, ill be in the stair cupboard if anyone needs me..... [and tiptoes silently away....]


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## Gazzer (Jun 12, 2010)

antcole said:


> Im such a bellend.....
> 
> "_Advertising a two grand black hard top and having people offer me £300 quid_"
> 
> ...


didn't i tell you to leave that funny smelling baccy alone bud lol


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## antcole (Apr 4, 2009)

Gazzer said:


> antcole said:
> 
> 
> > Im such a bellend.....
> ...












Gaz, I think youre right..... again....


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## YELLOW_TT (Feb 25, 2004)

Serendipitous said:


> jamman said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe he/she thinks your roadster hard top is way over priced in the current climate ?
> ...


£1100 is way over priced at the moment i paid £550 for a gloss black ( so it will suit any colour with out painting. Add £250 for a good paint job)) hard top and fitting kit last year seen a good few go for £550 t0 £700


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

YELLOW_TT said:


> Serendipitous said:
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> 
> > jamman said:
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Thanks Yellow. I'll bear that in mind.


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## YELLOW_TT (Feb 25, 2004)

I forgot to say that was with the rear fitting kit


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## Matt B (Apr 8, 2007)

I bought a hard top for my e46 for 400 quid


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## L0z (Sep 8, 2011)

My hard top came with my coupe.


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## RazMan (Aug 28, 2012)

Sadly, anything that is sold is only worth what people will pay - regardless of the current economic climate.
For example I recently sold beautiful Freelander 2 with high mileage for 3 grand under book price! I had it on eBay for several weeks with no bids, then put it on Autotrader for 3 weeks at progressively lower prices until it finally sold.

Book prices do not mean anything nowadays but you can always sell practically anything, but not necessarily for the price you THINK it is worth - it is definitely a buyer's market. If it doesn't sell, then the price is simply either too high, or there are not enough people (with the available cash) who want to buy it.


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## CWM3 (Mar 4, 2012)

RazMan said:


> Sadly, anything that is sold is only worth what people will pay - regardless of the current economic climate.
> For example I recently sold beautiful Freelander 2 with high mileage for 3 grand under book price! I had it on eBay for several weeks with no bids, then put it on Autotrader for 3 weeks at progressively lower prices until it finally sold.
> 
> Book prices do not mean anything nowadays but you can always sell practically anything, but not necessarily for the price you THINK it is worth - it is definitely a buyer's market. If it doesn't sell, then the price is simply either too high, or there are not enough people (with the available cash) who want to buy it.


Spot on RazMan, it's a 2way transaction, and something is only worth as much as buyer is prepared to pay, if the seller cannot live with that, then they don't sell.

I have bid for 3 cars this week, 2 dealers would not shift, and 1 has met my budget, (all very similar age/spec), so I am viewing that one tomorrow, if its not the right one then move on and keep looking, eventually the right deal nearly always turns up.

Likewise I still have bits in my garage, that I was bid lower than I prepared to sell for , so either the demand was not there or the price I asked was too high, the fact that I am still tripping over them, probably means that I judged their worth wrongly, so we all live and learn.


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## Hark (Aug 23, 2007)

Can't believe hardtops cost so much lol

And I almost always offer under the asking price. If u want it and the guy says no then I'll offer the asking price.

I'm not in it to balance out some moral good. If you don't want to sell at that price, tell them and that us that. Tbh at £300 I might not even reply.

Case in point guy on lotus forum selling full set of ad08s. £550 new, 1mm worn wants £400. I offer £350 he says no and sticks firm.

I left it but now 2 months later he advertises for £280 and I had them same day.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Serendipitous said:


> I recently bought a Blue Flame exhaust off a forum member. I know that system cost £550 new. He wanted £350. So I go over and slap the money in his hand and feel good because I've saved £200. I don't want to knock him down an extra £20 cause It would make me a cheapskate when I'm already getting a bargain.


Sorry, but I think that's all just wrong. You've not 'saved £200' - you've paid less money for something because it's fundamentally worth less (either because it's been used, or it's 'NIB' but without the warranty you'd get when buying from a retailer). If a second hand Blue Flame exhaust is worth £350, then you've saved nothing, as that's exactly what you've paid for it. If you wanted to save some money, you should have offered him £300 :wink:

Ultimately though, as a seller, *you don't decide what something is worth*, and that's a concept that seems to be trouble a lot of people on here (if other threads like this are anything to go by). Sure, you can decide what you want to sell something for, and you can refuse to sell it for less, but that doesn't change what it's worth - it's still the buyers (as an entity, not individuals) who decide that.


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## Mondo (Feb 20, 2009)

Interesting... It all reminds me of a concept I found unusual at Economics. I'm guessing the UK rules will be similar, but when I wer't lad, we were taught about the relationship between a buyer and a seller and how any 'contract' entered into over price revolves around 'offer' and 'acceptance'. Struck me as odd that the seller isn't offering to _sell _at a price, rather the buyer is offering to _buy _at a price. Subtle, but important, difference.

So when you go into a Newsagents (or 'Dairy' as I still sometimes slip and call them) and buy a £1 newspaper, the seller doesn't have to sell you the paper - at any price. The buyer is offering to buy it (and, in this situation, at the price printed on the front page) and the seller decides whether to accept or not. Simples. Technically I could offer 20p for The Times and the shop _could_ accept it - but probably wouldn't, which is their right.

Your potential buyer offered £300, you didn't accept. Fair enough. As I said, and others echo'd, I'd probably not even have bothered replying.

Trust me; there's more in this life to get het up over.


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## brittan (May 18, 2007)

Mondo said:


> Interesting... It all reminds me of a concept I found unusual at Economics. I'm guessing the UK rules will be similar, but when I wer't lad, we were taught about the relationship between a buyer and a seller and how any 'contract' entered into over price revolves around 'offer' and 'acceptance'. Struck me as odd that the seller isn't offering to _sell _at a price, rather the buyer is offering to _buy _at a price. Subtle, but important, difference.
> 
> So when you go into a Newsagents (or 'Dairy' as I still sometimes slip and call them) and buy a £1 newspaper, the seller doesn't have to sell you the paper - at any price. The buyer is offering to buy it (and, in this situation, at the price printed on the front page) and the seller decides whether to accept or not. Simples. Technically I could offer 20p for The Times and the shop _could_ accept it - but probably wouldn't, which is their right.


Exactly. What the seller is doing (in the same terms as above) is making "An invitation to treat" This is not an offer - It is an invitation to negotiate or an invitation to make an offer.

'Traditionally' most people only do this when they buy certain things, house, car, used goods from a private buyer etc. I've never done it or seen anyone do it at a supermarket, for instance, but there's nothing to stop you. 
I feel a wicked temptation coming on.


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

brittan said:


> Mondo said:
> 
> 
> > Interesting... It all reminds me of a concept I found unusual at Economics. I'm guessing the UK rules will be similar, but when I wer't lad, we were taught about the relationship between a buyer and a seller and how any 'contract' entered into over price revolves around 'offer' and 'acceptance'. Struck me as odd that the seller isn't offering to _sell _at a price, rather the buyer is offering to _buy _at a price. Subtle, but important, difference.
> ...


I get this all the time at work "I saw it for £xx on the web" but people don't realise its for something with differnt conditions and much les flexibility . All people want is the cheapest possible purchase price.


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## RazMan (Aug 28, 2012)

Try a visit to Egypt - the marked prices don't mean anything and when you say you want to buy it, the whole deal becomes a bartering extravanganza - it is almost a sport over there! I hated doing any kind of business while I was there - at least here we have some sort of idea of what we are doing. :lol:


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

Spandex said:


> Serendipitous said:
> 
> 
> > I recently bought a Blue Flame exhaust off a forum member. I know that system cost £550 new. He wanted £350. So I go over and slap the money in his hand and feel good because I've saved £200. I don't want to knock him down an extra £20 cause It would make me a cheapskate when I'm already getting a bargain.
> ...


You're complicating something VERY straightforward. The simple point I'm making is that we all like a CLEAN deal. No bullshitters. No timewasters. No tyre kickers.

I sold the top today to just such a person. The deal took about a minute. Because he was STRAIGHT. This is what they cost new. This is what you want - "I'll bring cash over in the morning."

DONE DEAL. NO SHIT. NO NONSENSE. AND SOMEONE WHO HAS FUNDS.

SIMPLES.


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## YELLOW_TT (Feb 25, 2004)

I would be interested in what you got for it and if it had all the bits fixing kit etc what colour was it PM me if you wish


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## L0z (Sep 8, 2011)

Are you suggesting that someone who is homosexual wouldn't do a deal?

Slightly homophobic...


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Serendipitous said:


> You're complicating something VERY straightforward. The simple point I'm making is that we all like a CLEAN deal. No bullshitters. No timewasters. No tyre kickers.
> 
> I sold the top today to just such a person. The deal took about a minute. Because he was STRAIGHT. This is what they cost new. This is what you want - "I'll bring cash over in the morning."
> 
> ...


it's not straightforward though, unless everyone is a mug and pays the asking price like you suggest. The point is, when an item isn't new, the value of it isn't fixed anymore. What someone is asking for it isn't necessarily related to what it's worth, and it's common sense to expect buyers to have differing views of an items value. Suggesting that making offers or haggling is somehow 'cheap' or not 'straight' is ridiculous.


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

Spandex said:


> Serendipitous said:
> 
> 
> > You're complicating something VERY straightforward. The simple point I'm making is that we all like a CLEAN deal. No bullshitters. No timewasters. No tyre kickers.
> ...


Your missing the point mate.
It's not the making of offers that's the issue. Of course people make offers - it's natural.
I'ts the type of offers I'm talking about. I can understand someone offering say £550/£650 for example. It's a serious offer. But when someone offers £300 it's just taking the piss.


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

L0z said:


> Are you suggesting that someone who is homosexual wouldn't do a deal?
> 
> Slightly homophobic...


It's straight talking i'm talking about, nit someones's sexual orientation.


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## Spandex (Feb 20, 2009)

Serendipitous said:


> Your missing the point mate.
> It's not the making of offers that's the issue. Of course people make offers - it's natural.
> I'ts the type of offers I'm talking about. I can understand someone offering say £550/£650 for example. It's a serious offer. But when someone offers £300 it's just taking the piss.


It's only taking the piss because it's well below what you want - it might be the absolute upper limit of what they think it's worth. You need to stop seeing it all from your perspective.

What something's worth is a function of what buyers are willing to pay for it though, not what you want for it. That means any sensible buyer should offer you whatever it's worth to them - you seem to think they should only make offers that the seller will consider 'serious' (even if they had any way of knowing what that amount is, why should they care about what you think of them if their offer is below what you're willing to sell it for?)


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## A3DFU (May 7, 2002)

RazMan said:


> I hated doing any kind of business while I was there


I *loved* the bartering in Egypt! And I got some excellent deals


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

Spandex said:


> Serendipitous said:
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> 
> > Your missing the point mate.
> ...


J


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

Serendipitous said:


> Spandex said:
> 
> 
> > Serendipitous said:
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Jesus -


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## L0z (Sep 8, 2011)

I think you should leave now...


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

L0z said:


> I think you should leave now...


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## L0z (Sep 8, 2011)

What does that even mean.


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## jamman (May 6, 2002)

Poor responses Serendipitous


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## JNmercury00 (May 22, 2007)




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## ELVIS (Oct 7, 2012)

Serendipitous said:


> iT'S A POST ABOUT BUYING STUFF.
> 
> It's understandable that everyone wants to buy things for as little as possible. But it's also a question of judgement and integrity.
> When I want to buy something I consider what the maximum is that I'm prepared to pay - and that's what I offer. I don't expect the seller to be beaten down or offered a ridiculous price. Cause that would make me a cheapskate. And I'm not one.
> ...


You have some very interesting views chap/chapess.

I do not see how what is colloquially know as 'haggling' , and is generally accepted as the norm in the buying and selling of secondhand parts, makes one possess less integrity and judgment than one that does not.

You present yourself as someone whom is very conscious of what others think about them and do not want to present with any flaws in your character, to the extent you could possibly pay more than the seller would take as their 'bottom price' so that a possible stranger would not thik of you as a cheapskate. That is one of the most ludicrous statements i have read in quite some time. I am sure many of us has felt they have done very well in a deal, being offered more than our own bottom price.
Applying the same principles of integrity, if you had a part for sale at £1000 and would be prepared to accept £900, if i offered £1000 would you refuse it telling me £900 is fine and to keep the £100 for my trouble? you sound like a person of fine moral upstanding that would do such.

As has already been stated by a previous poster, your £200 saving reflects lack of any proper guarantee. Find out the wrong wire has been used to weld it, the internals develop a fault etc you do not have any real comeback. But hells, you did not try to haggle £20 off the price so the seller still likes you. With all due respect i dont really give two shits who buys anything from me aslong as (1) They turn up when they say they will (2) They have money in their pocket.

On numerous occassions i have made some very cheeky offers, the seller always has the option to say no. the conditions of my deal are is that if you say yes i will send cash by recorded delivery by 1300hrs the next day, do an immediate bank transfer or if i have an hour spare will pay the cash into your account over the counter. I am buying unseen and as a seller you would get immediate payment. Yes, some of the offers are very low but a polite no will suffice. Karma dictates there will come a time when i have a part a previously obnoxious person i have dealt with wants or i am wanting to buy from them again but choose to spend a few more pennies on someone elses parts to avoid dealing with them. There is no sense in being needlessly rude as it might come back to haunt you.

Does the above make me a tyrekicker, time waster or idiot? If so i would be grateful if someone could explain why as i am failing to see the connection.

As for the £20 restaurant comment? Personally i think it is vulgar to discuss money in such a manner but seeing as we are on the subject.....................

Did anyone else laugh at the irony of "get a bloody income" when in the same post one is discussing buying secondhand parts. :wink:


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## kazinak (Mar 23, 2010)

L0z said:


> Are you suggesting that someone who is homosexual wouldn't do a deal?
> 
> Slightly homophobic...


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

ELVIS said:


> Serendipitous said:
> 
> 
> > iT'S A POST ABOUT BUYING STUFF.
> ...


Jesus there are some sad arses on this site = So much guff for a simple statement.


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## Serendipitous (Nov 19, 2011)

ELVIS said:


> Serendipitous said:
> 
> 
> > iT'S A POST ABOUT BUYING STUFF.
> ...


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## ELVIS (Oct 7, 2012)

But you obviously liked it as you had the intelligence to quote it twice!

Could you qualify sadarse by any chance? You took the time to post so I thought it was only fair to post a suitably worded reply.

The fact you haven't seen fit to post a response to the actual content speaks volumes. The thread title did give the game away, sorry I didn't blow smoke up your arse chap.

On reflection I do think you might have point " so much guff........" , maybe I should have just replied with "what a plum!"

Now, toddle off and find a better paid job so you don't have to buy second hand parts like the peasants.


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