# New Dino



## Dr.Phibes (Mar 10, 2006)

more pics and details on autoexpress


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## jbell (May 15, 2006)

Â£80k, kind of puts the R8, V8 Aston etc into the shade


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## TeeTees (Mar 9, 2006)

Wow  I LIKE that......loads !!


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## NaughTTy (Jul 9, 2003)

Yummy, Yummy and....Yummy again 8)


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## BAMTT (Feb 22, 2004)

Tugtastic


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## TeeTees (Mar 9, 2006)

Just had a thought - I've already written my Dear Santa wish list


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

This was in Car last month, but I don't remember it looking like that.

It looks very Cayman-esque in that top pic.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Looks v nice. Any new Ferrari is an event.

Touch of 599 around front lights and wings, 997 proportions to front end, Cayman'esh rear wings and roof line, but all hangs together v well and plenty of nods to original 246 Dino. It could easily be an adobe. :?

I dont see any LEDs? Are Ferrari missing a trick? :wink:

Just when AM must have thought they had the Â£80K exotic sports car bit aced with the lovely looking V8, and suddenly making the R8 look all dressed up and no place to go, Ferrari slip this one in. Great marketing move. Low risk - the car is certain to be a huge hit.

A waiting list worth getting on early for those in the Â£80K market I'd have thought... :idea:

Heritage and pedigree no question, and I am sure it will drive as good as any Ferrari given their recent form. Any Stradale version would be a natural GT3 competitor and I hope they homolgate the Dino for GT racing against the RSRs.

The marketing folk at Lambo now need to come up with an Â£80K V8 car. hmmmm :wink:

Drool. Poster stuff.


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## genocidalduck (May 19, 2005)

I like it...However just a tad overstyled for my liking...Still prefer the AmV8


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Read this in AutoExpress last night & echo Gary's comments.

If it does come out at Â£80-90K then a surefire winner in that market.

Only possible issue is that Ferrari intend to front mount the engine in that car, so perhaps handling may not be as crisp as the Lambo, GT3 or even R8 but i'm sure those Italians have got that nailed down.

It looks stunning from almost every angle as i can't say i'm loving the arse end, but hey it's a Ferrari & it's possibly only Â£80Kish.

They're also increasing the power on the F430 to move that model up a notch.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Kell said:


> It looks very Cayman-esque in that top pic.


It does, doesn't it?



















599/Cayman Photoshop?


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## Dr_Parmar (May 10, 2002)

isnt that an auto express photoshop?


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## ctgilles (Jul 5, 2005)

Hello Cayman 
And yes, 599/Cayman PS. Only "real" pics were the one of the 430 testmule.


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## YELLOW_TT (Feb 25, 2004)

Kell said:


> It looks very Cayman-esque in that top pic.


Very nice 
I have to agree with you there Kell


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

garyc said:


> It could easily be an adobe. :?


The one in car definitely was. Easier to tell on printed material, than on 72dpi monitors.


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

Also interesting to note that it wears the prancing horse badges (though the bonnet badge says Dino) as the original, famously, didn't.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Kell said:


> Also interesting to note that it wears the prancing horse badges (though the bonnet badge says Dino) as the original, famously, didn't.


This is true. 'Dino' was a sub brand for Ferrari. Last Dino badged car was 246 shipped in 1976, then Ferrari name took over.

For engine buffs: the 1968 Dino 206 had a 2000cc V6 that produced over 200hp and revved to 8000rpm. Quite stunning output and rev ceiling for a naturally aspirated production engine now let alone 38 years ago.

The same V6 in larger capacities went on to power the Fiat Dino, Lancia Stratos, Alfa GTV and lastly Alfa 164 in 3.0L form before going EOL.


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

If Ferrari could get that car to market for 80k, and give it running costs similar to other cars in that price range, I'd be very interested...

But with the engine in the front, and wonky Porsche styling, they'd need to do some work for me... although even that photoshop is more of a resolved design than the Cockster.

Even so, they don't have a hope of doing it for under 100k, even if they wanted to lower the value of the brand. They aren't, won't be and shouldn't be a producer of 80k cars. What would their proper customers think?


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

jampott said:


> If Ferrari could get that car to market for 80k, and give it running costs similar to other cars in that price range, I'd be very interested...
> 
> But with the engine in the front, and wonky Porsche styling, they'd need to do some work for me... although even that photoshop is more of a resolved design than the Cockster.
> 
> Even so, they don't have a hope of doing it for under 100k, even if they wanted to lower the value of the brand. *They aren't, won't be and shouldn't be a producer of 80k cars.* What would their proper customers think?


Err wrong Tim. They have been doing so for all apart from the last 15 years of their production history:

The early 1980s Ferrari 328, a sucessor of the Dino lineage, sold for Â£25K new (at which time a Golf Gti was Â£6.5K) - that is about Â£75K in today's money. 'Entry' Ferraris have moved up the cost scale progressively since then, to the point that the current entry 430 is nearly double the 1980s equiv factory offering, and priced way above the Porsche competition.

Reviving the Dino tag, and positioning that in the Â£80k space whilst the 430 moves up the cost/performance scale with V10s and 500+ hp etc, makes perfect sense.

http://www.italiaspeed.com/2005/cars/ferrari/05/dino/0405.html

As for running costs, Â£80K sports cars will cost lots to run, regardless of brand. Depreciation will always be the single largest and most often ignored cost item.

Sell the R8 short.

ps why should it be an issue where the engine is located? Many of the world best handling cars are front engined. Overall weight distribution is main criteria. Unless the AM V8, 599, M3 etc have all become shite handlers in your book, and mid-engined is all of a sudden the best engine location. :wink:

I think Ferrari probably have a better chance of suceeding in selling Â£80K sports cars again, as they used to do very well, than does Audi in starting to sell Â£80K sports cars now against some very stiff and experienced competition. But we'll see...


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## jdn (Aug 26, 2002)

garyc said:


> jampott said:
> 
> 
> > If Ferrari could get that car to market for 80k, and give it running costs similar to other cars in that price range, I'd be very interested...
> ...


He's right. Clearly late night nappy changes have yet to addle the brain..

80K Ferrari - bargain, good value prestige.

80k Audi - overpriced, over-hyped VAG variant.

I know which I would prefer. Shame neither will ever be an option..


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

Definately leans toward Porsche styling. I like it though. RWD and the engine up front 8)

Glad you posted a pic of the original Dino Gary. It has to be one of the prettiest cars ever made. Good ones are still worth Â£50k today


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Arse. Just wrote a longish reply only to delete it by mistake.

They've spent a long time building their niche brand. They're more expensive than a Porsche and that's how it should be. That's there the brand is pitched.

Feel free to remind me of this thread in another 3 years time, but if Ferrari have managed to get an 80k (or its equivalent) car into the showrooms before 2010, I'll eat my hat. Nice dream, guys, but it ain't happening...

Nothing to do with an R8 or otherwise.

The only argument in your favour - Aston Martin have managed it - but only because they've sold out and built an expensive Jaguar / Ford, which is hardly going back to their roots as handbuilt low volume producers.

The Italians simply aren't tooled up to produce for that market. It would be a surefire winner if they could do it, but I'm sorry to spoil your wet dreams, but it won't happen.


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## Niko (May 10, 2005)

Let be honest with our selves, its not going to be Â£80k, i'd think with "usual" extras, it would be close to the Â£100k.

Lovely car, i ve been thinking for a long time that ferrari, lambo and even bugatti should concentrate on that Â£80-Â£90 bracket, i mean really there are a hand full of new cars at that price, Mer sl 55, m6, porsche, cant really go outside those brands, without losing something, i.e an older car or one that is not so usuable everyday.

good idea Ferrari! And on the notion of reducing the brands appeal, with footballers buying every car now and already there are so many high end sports cars out there on the streets, i dont think such a move would damage thier brand.

niko


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

PaulS said:


> Glad you posted a pic of the original Dino Gary. It has to be one of the prettiest cars ever made. Good ones are still worth Â£50k today


When I was a nipper my dads mate had a silver 246 Dino - it was so exotic in a world of Cortina 1600Es etc. It's one of my earliest memories and still one of the prettiest cars ever. 

Oh and the 1970 Dino was list Â£4000, about Â£70K in todays money :wink:


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

jampott said:


> Arse. Just wrote a longish reply only to delete it by mistake.
> 
> They've spent a long time building their niche brand. They're more expensive than a Porsche and that's how it should be. That's there the brand is pitched.
> 
> ...


Deal. :wink:


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

garyc said:


> PaulS said:
> 
> 
> > Glad you posted a pic of the original Dino Gary. It has to be one of the prettiest cars ever made. Good ones are still worth Â£50k today
> ...


How much did a Cortina 1600E cost? Much less than Â£1000 I expect, and it was a fairly "decent" car of its time.

Seeing as the average house price in 1970 was only Â£5000, yet today its nearer Â£190000, suddenly your Â£4k Dino looks rather expensive, does it not?


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## ag (Sep 12, 2002)

The biggest problem that Ferrari would have is making it better than, or even as good as, a 911, but leave a sufficiently large step to the 420 and its derivatives.

As an everyday proposition Ferraris have always been flawed, so the above may be a red-herring. At Â£80k it would really be in a class of one in terms of new cars! All its obvious price competition would be more useable, and therefore less "special". The market for used Ferraris in the Â£60k-Â£80k range has always been quite bouyant.

Every marque needs to generate showroom traffic and drag in customers as young as possible and with so many specialists now servicing to a high standard the used Ferraris, the dealers aren't seeing the potential buyers often enough. This could be just what they need.

I wonder what Lamborghini are planning?


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

jampott said:


> garyc said:
> 
> 
> > PaulS said:
> ...


Tim, a somewhat spurious correlation between house price inflation which has been massive in last 25 years, and new car prices which not risen in real terms over the same period.

A pointless comparison, unless we were discussing where one should have invested Â£4000 in 1969, which we are not. One assumes the Dino purchaser already had a house..

http://www.lotus-cortina.com/library/price/open.htm

1967 Lotus Cortina was Â£999. Todays Focus ST is Â£20K a 20 fold increase.

So, now pay attention. A 1967 Â£4000 Dino at twenty fold price increase over same time would weigh in at....wait for it.....Â£80,000 pounds.

..and that could in turn make any 'cheap' or 'entry' Ferrari four times more expensive than a Focus ST, just as its Dino predecessor was in 1967.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

A fine strike by Charlton










Bet you couldn't believe your luck when the maths worked out so well.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Oh I wouldn't have posted if the maths didn't stack up well. :wink:

But it does genrally work out that new car prices have increased about 20X in 40 odd years.

A 1965 F275gtb retailed at Â£7,500.

It's spiritual successor the F599 lists at Â£171,000.

That's a 22X increase. (actually 575 maranello would have worked out at 20X)

Tim's gonna love his R8 anyway. And it is certainly not going to be crap drive . A Porsche would never be on his list, the AMV8 has Ford parts (like the R8 _won't _have any VW componentry..) if that matters, and the thought of an Â£80K Ferrari galls, so he has made the right choice for himself.

He was right that the on road price of a small Ferrari may end up nearer Â£90K, but then again in a similar vein, it is highly unlikley, given the extent and price of Audi R8 options, than any R8 will ever hit the road below Â£85k.


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Today's Focus ST is probably a Â£15k car, but as that doesn't really change thing 

I beg to differ regarding such things as house prices. I think it is very important what your Â£4k would have bought you in 1970 versus what your Â£80k would buy you today.

Also important is income. Weekly household income in 1970 was Â£304, at constant prices, and this is dwarfed by Â£480 in the year 2000. Extrapolate a bit futher, and its more than likely that household income has topped Â£550-Â£600 based on yr 2000 prices, so people are "earning" twice as much in real terms.

If I'm reading those figures right... 

So even if the cars cost the same in monetary terms (Â£4000 x20 etc) then they actually cost twice as much relative to income of the average household.

You cannot tell me that a Â£4k Ferrari Dino in 1970 was as affordable as an Â£80k car in today's money. I'm just not buying it.


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

Which one are you thinking is LESS affordable Tim?


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Niether - I'm just trying to make out that an Â£80k Ferrari is too cheap. The Dino back in 1970 might have been worth the equivalent of Â£80k based on multipliers of seemingly similar other cars, but when you look at external factors such as income and house prices, cars (in general) were more expensive in relation back in 1970 as a proportion of income, and relation to buying an average house.

So both the Cortina and the Dino were "expensive" in their day, so the Focus is far better VFM than the Cortina, and an Â£80k modern-day Dino is underpriced.


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Besides, as I've already said, even if Ferrari make that car, it won't see the road for under Â£100k and probably more than that.

The R8 was originally supposed to hit Â£65k, but is now more like Â£76k. Having said that, the options list for the R8 isn't as long as a Porsche, so it would be entirely feasible to spec one for Â£80k...

I would hazard a base price in excess six figures for any modern Dino, with the usual Ferrari options taking the actual price well into mental territory.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)




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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

garyc said:


> PaulS said:
> 
> 
> > Glad you posted a pic of the original Dino Gary. It has to be one of the prettiest cars ever made. Good ones are still worth Â£50k today
> ...


My memories of the Dino are from childhood days wathching 'The Persuaders' on TV after lunch on a Sunday afternoon 8)

English Lord Brett Sinclair and American Danny Wilde are both wealthy playboys - Brett (Roger Moore) has the Aston whilst Danny has the Dino...

Ahh dreams eh? Dino or Aston? I think I'd have both :wink:


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## PaulS (Jun 15, 2002)

garyc said:


>


roflmao !

:wink:


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## jampott (Sep 6, 2003)

Rather strangely, Pistonheads were running a story on it earlier today, but it appears to have vanished again.

A quick look at the PH history, though, showed that this idea was put forward well over 18 months ago (with practically identical details) although the mooted price was slightly higher.

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default ... ryId=10317

How things have moved on since April 2005, eh? :roll:

And you think *I* am the one with my head in the sand? :-*


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## ResB (Apr 17, 2005)

I like it.....a lot. 8)


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## TTCool (Feb 7, 2005)

I bought a Ferrari Dino 246 GTB from Mill Garages in Sunderland in 1974. I paid Â£4,750 and my house cost me Â£3,600 :roll:

Joe


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## TTCool (Feb 7, 2005)

PS From memory, I bought the house in about 1967. It was a 3 bed semi.

Joe


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

PaulS said:


> My memories of the Dino are from childhood days wathching 'The Persuaders' on TV after lunch on a Sunday afternoon 8)
> 
> English *Lord Brett * Sinclair and American Danny Wilde are both *wealthy playboys* - *Brett* (Roger Moore) *has the Aston* whilst Danny has the Dino...
> 
> Ahh dreams eh? Dino or Aston? I think I'd have both :wink:


Somebody call? 

Only problem is the "English Lord" bit - I'll settle for posh Scots 8)


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## Hilly10 (Feb 4, 2004)

The new Dino it floats my boat, all the curves in the right places :wink:


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

BreTT said:


> Ahh dreams eh? Dino or Aston? I think I'd have both :wink:


Somebody call? 

Only problem is the "English Lord" bit - I'll settle for *posh Scots* 8)[/quote]

Oxymoron?


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

oh I think many of our Caledonian friends made the trip to the Raj, *P*ort *O*ut, *S*tarboard *H*ome.


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

They did indeed, Gary.

Now if only I was posh enough to have the spare cash for a Dino or an Aston. Either of them would tempt me out of my Merc. That said, if I was posh enough, I could probably have them all. Oh well, only hope is the national lottery because my employer isn't going to do it for me :? (or you, eh Gary?) :wink:


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Kell said:


> BreTT said:
> 
> 
> > Ahh dreams eh? Dino or Aston? I think I'd have both :wink:
> ...


Touche. Your message might look a little better had you got the quotes right though :wink:


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

BreTT said:


> They did indeed, Gary.
> 
> Now if only I was posh enough to have the spare cash for a Dino or an Aston. Either of them would tempt me out of my Merc. That said, if I was posh enough, I could probably have them all. Oh well, only hope is the national lottery because my employer isn't going to do it for me :? (or you, eh Gary?) :wink:


'tis true Brett. Time for change in '07 FPR complete waste of time. The Business thinks we are overpaid. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

These days Cisco. Oracle, Symantec, Juniper, and Brocade all pay 50% more for doing exactly the same.

WFR next time around... 16 months salary to exit stage left. Nice. :wink:

_GT3. GT3. GT3. GT3. Before all those school fees bite ..........................................._


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