# Major oil leak after changing Rear Main Seal



## scottatx

I've been working on this car for almost one year, day and night, have literally spent and sold everything I own just trying to get this started and running again after a water pump failure...

So replaced the timing belt kit, took about four months, lol... started it and oil instantly poured out all over the ground...
So took everything apart and replaced the Rear Main Seal. Took about four more months, just tried to start it a few days ago... and it was almost identical, sputtered like a go-cart and oil seeped out all over the ground.

During this time I have replaced and rebuilt almost every single physical part. The Rear Main Seal only goes in one way, and I made sure the lip was pressed in, etc. I can't see how that could fail after just replacing it.

Here is a photo hosted on my website, oil seeps out as far as I can see from the edge of the gearbox, and the two seams of the engine as outlined... I have spent an hour or two looking around the entire turbo and engine with a mirror and cannot see a single drop of anything, except for those three seams.

This last time I was in a hurry, well... it's been a frigging year and I'm broke now... so I left off the red flat gasket that goes around the gearbox shaft that you're supposed to replace with the two small rubber green ones... the red flat one was all decayed and broken anyway, and took two weeks to get here so I just left it off thinking no oil or fluids passed through there and I would come back to it and replace it after I see if my work was successful and the car started.

So that, and other than that... I have rebuilt everything, new head gasket, valves repaired from the machine shop, new oil pan gasket, valve cover gasket, and every single part in between.

Now there is just some major baffling oil leak... I have the timing set perfectly I think. Even after it running for a few moments twice, every factory notch is lined up perfectly. So the leak itself is preventing any pressure to the turbo so it starts to smoke slightly, and sounds like a sputtering golf cart.

I either have to take everything apart again, or I am missing something, doing something stupid, etc.

Any hunches or experience on this?

Thanks.
Scott


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## rawlins

This is well beyond my experience so can't off any direct help, but Charles the Humble Mechanic did an excellent 1.8t rebuild recently which might help you spot where things are going wrong in your process.






Only other thought is did you have any overheating which may have warped something which is preventing a good seal?


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## Delta4

Take it apart and have some one else look at it a fresh pair of eyes may see what's wrong.


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## Charmadize

I’m trying to work out exactly where the oil is coming from on your picture. I think you said you replaced the rear main seal? When you did that, did you make sure that the inner part of the seal, that sits over the crank was heavily oiled before putting it together? If you haven’t, when the engine cranks for the first time, the dry rubber of the seal rubs on the dry metal of the crank and it damages it, then it leaks.

Also, did you have your crank machined? If so, the diameter of the crank will be smaller and so you would have had to used a smaller diameter seal. Also, if it was machined, did you make sure you cleaned off all the anti corrosion agent that machining shops spay over the crank? This can also damage the seal.

either way, I’m sorry to say that I think that you are going to have to split the engine again and have a look.


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## scottatx

Awesome thanks for the replies... This has been simply, incredible, hardest work I have ever done, and I was a commercial fisherman in Alaska for six years

But it's worth it??!!?? lol

Thanks for the video...


Yes my neighbor is a mechanic and he is going to check it out and maybe do a smoke leak test or something, he just needs to inspect everything.
The crank was not machined, but you may be on to something about the seal being heavily oiled. I did not do that. I had lightly rubbed it with oil several times just to keep it moist, but basically it was just clean and crisp and dry when I installed it. Then after I installed it of course it too about a month to put everything back together correctly. This all started because it dried out and cracked the first time during the time that I was trying to get the timing belt correct.
No heat damage or warping, if so only on the head, which I removed and took to a machine shop, and they replaced eight bent valves. I re-installed that and everything in between.
You kind of have to "practice" with this car anyway, and the leak is obviousl;y coming from that area, out of the three seams of the engine... zero leaks above that horizontal line of the entire engine... So I guess I will just take everything off again, and redo the rear main seal, maybe the entire thing is there is just more to installing that than I thought... that and have my mechanic neighbor inspect it first and confirm.

Thanks again


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## Charmadize

S’ok, and good luck. I know what a ball-ache it is when something isn’t right as you put stuff back together.
As for whether it is worth it? I would say; absolutely yes! I love my TT. I will never sell it.

I wonder if you can be buried in your TT? I’ll have to look into that. 😀


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## scottatx

Charmadize said:


> S’ok, and good luck. I know what a ball-ache it is when something isn’t right as you put stuff back together.
> As for whether it is worth it? I would say; absolutely yes! I love my TT. I will never sell it.
> 
> I wonder if you can be buried in your TT? I’ll have to look into that. 😀



Haha, yes! It's worth it. I have often wished that I could just park it in my living room so I can sit here and stare at it and polish it lol...

Flickr photos of most of what I have done

Gotta get Diablito III back in action


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## StuartDB

Is the oil leaking out of the crankshaft oil seal inside the gearbox bell-housing from behind the fly wheel? Or is it gearbox oil leaking out from the input shaft seal?


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## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Is the oil leaking out of the crankshaft oil seal inside the gearbox bell-housing from behind the fly wheel? Or is it gearbox oil leaking out from the input shaft seal?



That's the million dollar question.

I'm not a mechanic I'm just mechanical. It was running like a Ferrari and the water pump failed, tilted, and timing belt shredded... So I installed an ECS Tuning kit, took me four months, started it, sputtered, turbo smoke and oil poured out all over the ground quickly.

My mechanic said that going that long with no oil in it would make the rear main seal brittle and crack and leak like that, so I spent another four months replacing the rear main seal. 

So I just finished all of that and started it, and oil poured out all over the ground again, almost identically to the first time. I'm fairly certain I installed the rear main seal correctly, it only goes on one way, I had sprayed it with WD40 lightly but did not "heavily oil it" as suggested above... I made sure the lip of it was secure and seated, etc. The timing looks perfect but sputters drastically hopefully due to extremely low oil pressure. I have spent months on the timing alone so hopefully I at least have that right now.

Took me about a month to even get the transmission back on and everything else in place after the rear main seal install, but I don't see how even that could cause a leak like that, or even the bolt tightening sequence...

I've never heard of "gearbox oil", maybe you just mean... oil. But I have been working on this so long I cut a corner, I left off the flat red seal/gasket that goes over the gearbox shaft, that you are supposed to replace with the two little green ones. The flat red one was completely damaged and did not look like it sealed any oil or anything, so I left it off, thinking I would just come back to it.

So now I _thought _I did everything pretty much perfectly, and all I know now is that I see not a single drop of anything above the lower seams of the engine, I have looked with a mirror in detail...

I just see oil drips from the seam of the gearbox, the seam of the engine and the seam where the intermediate plate is...

In this photo... top is the gearbox seam, then the two main engine seams, you can just see that it is coming from the interior somehow, with zero visible leaks above those areas.

My plan is to have my neighbor do a smoke test, also, I'll probably add some oil, start it again for a minute, then immediately get under it and watch it come out.

I'd hate to take it all apart again and find that I actually did everything correctly, and there is some other simple obvious problem that I have missed.

Thanks a lot for the replies. This is driving me insane.


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## StuartDB

Too much to read..

Did you repair the car after the timing belt snapped?


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## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Too much to read..
> 
> Did you repair the car after the timing belt snapped?



Haha sorry Just some paragraphs actually, details are important...

I have repaired everything, rebuilt and bought new everything. Machine shop replaced eight bent valves... I basically left off one seal/gasket over the gearbox shaft, that is the one glaring thing I was coming back to, but don't think that seals oil.

So all I can think of at this point is that gearbox gasket, or that the rear main seal is more technical than just placing it on and bolting it all back together.


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## Delta4

I'm that the seal may have been put on the wrong way around ? or the leak is coming from elsewhere, turbo oil feed pipe will pour oil out as soon as the engine is running, a clean and inspection may save you the hassle of removing the gearbox again.


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## silverbug

If you haven’t replaced the gearbox/transmission oil then judging by the colour of those oil drips that is fresh engine oil which is leaking from somewhere.
Without wanting to sound rude it’s never a good idea to leave out gasket/seals when assembling an item, they are there for a purpose .


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## desertstorm

The rear main seal is a PTFE seal so should NOT be oiled at all when it is fitted other wise it will leak. The seal comes with a white cap which is a guide that needs to be used to fit the seal. If you dont put the guide over the end of the crank when the seal is fitted the lip will fold over and will leak. If you fit the seal with oil it will leak.






Changing Audi TT 1.8T Rear Main Seal - radare.net


Changing the rear main seal and oil pan on my 2001 Audi TT Quattro.




radare.net


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## desertstorm

Charmadize said:


> When you did that, did you make sure that the inner part of the seal, that sits over the crank was heavily oiled before putting it together? If you haven’t, when the engine cranks for the first time, the dry rubber of the seal rubs on the dry metal of the crank and it damages it, then it leaks.
> 
> Also, did you have your crank machined? If so, the diameter of the crank will be smaller and so you would have had to used a smaller diameter seal. Also, if it was machined, did you make sure you cleaned off all the anti corrosion agent that machining shops spay over the crank? This can also damage the seal.


The seal is a PTFE item and needs to be fitted correctly with the white locating tool supplied with the seal. And has to be fitted completely dry with no oil on the seal and no oil on the crank surface. Also a machine shop would never machine that surface, there aren't different size seals available. See the post above with links to some videos.


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## Charmadize

Thanks Desertstorm, I stand corrected.

I haven’t actually done the bottom end on a Audi yet, my experience is from many other engines over the many years and I was unaware of new PTFE seals. And in the past, you used to get different sized seals because the running surfaces could be machined. But will bow to your knowledge on this one.

Anyhoo, I apologise for misleading in this instance.


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## scottatx

Please tell me I found something!! 

I was just getting ready to take every single thing apart again and assume things...

But I just cleaned and dried everything, started it, let it run for 30 seconds, big oil leak, sputtering like a go-cart, subtle smoke...

Then inspected everything... I noticed zero oil was actually coming from the bottom seams I was referring to like a rear main seal leak would do... the oil was coming from a line or seam on the right side of the engine...

So I cleaned and dried everything again, inserted some cardboard, and had someone start it while I watched it...

The oil is coming from a small hole in the Turbo Oil Feed Line, here is a photo.

So that would prevent oil from getting to the turbo, causing the smoke, and hopefully, make it sputter like it is completely out of time, but actually just has zero oil pressure??

Please say yes. This woud save me about one or two months of work.


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## StuartDB

Are you running the car without any coolant?

I'm assuming the circle is highlighting where the oil feed pipe has a hole? What's the 3 arrows about? It's a bit painful but you should be able to get most of that removed without too much of a mission? Not sure about k03 versus k04... but with a k04 you need to undo the manifold bolts to allow the turbo to rest on the support bracket, or even also remove the support bracket bolt to lean the turbo over to remove the banjo bolt from the top of the turbo. It's a good result though.


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## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Are you running the car without any coolant?
> 
> I'm assuming the circle is highlighting where the oil feed pipe has a hole? What's the 3 arrows about? It's a bit painful but you should be able to get most of that removed without too much of a mission? Not sure about k03 versus k04... but with a k04 you need to undo the manifold bolts to allow the turbo to rest on the support bracket, or even also remove the support bracket bolt to lean the turbo over to remove the banjo bolt from the top of the turbo. It's a good result though.


I only started it for about 15 seconds, two times, with low coolant and oil... first time (all fluids full) I thought I was going to drive off into the sunset after all my work but lost 75% of the oil... and just now just to actually watch where the leak was coming from after cleaning and drying the entire engine.

So hopefully my process worked... I thought that oil was coming from everywhere and that I did the rear main seal wrong. But I think that it was just coming from that hole in the turbo feed line, and gushing down and across the whole top of the transmission side of the engine (hence the arrows), and dripping all down into the main engine seams.

So it looks like the rear main seal is blown again, but actually I think it was coming from the top. I just needed to calm down and focus and inspect it all.

Hopefully. About to go back out and start it again after assembling everything and see if it's better or runs.

My question was just if that hole in the turbo line could produce the symptoms we have been discussing here.


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## scottatx

Well... I was so excited to actually see a physical hole and a leak that I just wanted to seal it off and test it. I knew those steel braided lines could not be sealed in any way, I just wanted to see what wrapping it with a hose and zip ties would do... I'm ordering parts and was making a plan. I put a little section of hose around the hole, tied it off with four zip ties as tight as I could, put oil and coolant in it, started it... 

It was running _better_, but still totally sputtering, but maybe twice as good as earlier... and no smoke from anywhere this time... so I think at least some oil was getting to the turbo?

But white/tan frothy oil was spurting out of the hose that I wrapped around the hole. I'll take that as a good sign, because at least I identified a crucial leak, and maybe my rear main seal work is perfect after all.

And I just threw it all together to test it, and make a parts list... but now I sure hope the coolant and oil aren't mixing from some main gasket leak or something...

I guess the name I gave it is fitting. Diablito. lol.

I'm just making a parts list, going to order that turbo oil feed line, and put it all back together perfectly when I get the parts, and see what happens.


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## Charmadize

That does look a bit like an oil and water mix! Are you now running it with water in? Or is it still dry? Did that come out of the turbo pipe? What does the oil look like on the dipstick and what does it look like under the oil cap?

as for the misfire; have you got all the top pipe work connected up? Did you replace the coil packs and DV.

I think you’re going to need a scan.


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## scottatx

I have practically every single part replaced... Twice as much work as these photos.

I have a heavy industrial electronics background, that stuff is actually fun for me...

But I've been dealing with this oil leak since I bought it, eight years ago... so I'll just chalk it all up to crucial work that needs to be done.

Now... I have replaced the valve cover gasket, plugs, coils, took the head to the machine shop and replaced eight valves, picked it up, new Fel-Pro head gasket and bolts, torqued, new oi8l pan gasket... and everything in between.

Now there is an obvious hole in the turbo oil feed line, so I was lowering the engine and emptying the remaining oil, was going to clean and re-assemble everything, while I waited for the new turbo feed line, emptied the oil out of the oil pan with the bolt.... and now this.

*"AUDI TT. THE CAR THAT KEEPS ON TAKING."*

Thanks for all the input. I am fixing this car if it's the last thing I do. It is my only goal in life.


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## Sir Hector

Hi Scott, I'm no mechanic but that looks pretty bad to me, oil and water mix and that makes it a much bigger problem than an oil leak. Reminds me of a head gasket failure on a 70's mini. But you've had the head checked for cracks/pressure tested/skimmed and new gasket. 

8 bent valves and a failed water pump, do you know more about the history of the engine?, why are the valves bent?. When i replaced my water pump, I fished out many broken plastic prop blades from the head/block/pipes and preyed they hadn't blocked water gallerys, which may cause cracks and that's what I'd be worried about I'm afraid to say.


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## StuartDB

Eeekkk










It'll be fine... just get a coffee filter?


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## scottatx

And as usual, with the curse of Diablito III, just accidentally deleted about 10 paragraphs of text I was writing somehow.

Water pump failed, came loose, timing belt shredded and stuck, machine shop fixed and prepared the head, installed it according to specs with new head gasket, new everything, started it, major oil leak - of 95% clear good oil, started it again, noticed big hole in turbo oil feed line, wrapped line with a hose and zip ties just to test and make a parts list, the frothy oil was spraying out of the hose that I zip-tied over the hole... So was just draining the oil to lower the engine, remove the turbo line, and degrease the engine while I order a new one, and that is what came out


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## davebowk

That could be the new head gasket has a problem, the oil cooler attached to the oil filter housing or a cracked head.
Also what caused the oil feed pipe to fail? Is the turbo oil outlet pipe ok? Not twisted or kinked.


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## Sir Hector

Gutted for you mate, reckon your well passionate about fixing it. But sometimes the best way forward is to back off for a while and re - engage with a fresh head and a clear mind a few dayz later. 
Your problems are big and maybe complex and you've gotta work out a cost effective way of moving forward. 
Im thinking new 2nd hand engine but maybe that's because my tech ability is not so great


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> That could be the new head gasket has a problem, the oil cooler attached to the oil filter housing or a cracked head.
> Also what caused the oil feed pipe to fail? Is the turbo oil outlet pipe ok? Not twisted or kinked.


It is a fully-inspected cylinder head from the machine shop— eight bent valves replaced— just put back in with a Fel-Pro head gasket... after meticulously scraping and cleaning every surface of anything...

So pretty sure cracked head is out of the question. I _did _scuff the head gasket as I was by myself and struggled it into position...but did not pierce through it, and can't see how that would cause this much damage... But maybe the lesson of the past 10 months is that you have to be extremely careful with everything and follow the manual to a T basically... You can't cut corners like a '79 GMC pickup or anything

Or it could be something totally simple and stupid that I missed...

But if a mocha latte is coming out of the oil pan hole as if you are changing the oil then that must be a tell-tale sign of something 100% identifiable.

Just set up an engine support bar, lowered the engine, to replace the turbo oil feed line... Also going to replace the cam chain tensioner, the three gaskets on the gear box, fix some stripped cam bearing bolts, new half moon and valve cover gasket on the right side... actually use the cam chain tensioner tool and insert all of that correctly this time...

Put it all back together and start it again Hopefully I can avoid doing the rear main seal again. 

*** So right now my primary concern and question in life, is if that color of oil 100% signifies that the head gasket must be replaced.

The turbo oil feed line... I simply noticed a hole in it and severe leak as I had a neighbor start it today while I watched the engine... after thoroughly cleaning and drying everything. Zero oil was coming from the bottom engine seams, just pouring over the top coming from that turbo feed line, so hopefully my rear main seal and flywheel work is good and can be left alone.

New oil cooler and gasket. All new hoses and clamps. New coolant flanges. Everything.

The turbo oil feed line, down the driver side of the engine, has a hole in it. Oil sprays out severely. The braided line coming from the turbo down to the oil pan though... was totally kinked and twisted. I straightened it up, RTVd the flange and set everything up perfectly, zero leaks.

Something stupid and weird that I am unfamiliar with is wrong... Or I definitely 100% must change the head gasket... again.

So just going to replace the turbo oil feed line, chain tensioner, (I dropped it and one of the poles broke off that guide the chain.)

A hole in the turbo oil feed line would not cause the oil to be white and thick like that though I'm pretty sure...

Looking like I have to replace the head gasket again, pay attention to everything very carefully, new turbo oil feed line, and see what happens at that point.


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## Sir Hector

Yep, sounds like a plan. 
And sounds like you've done it right and done all the obvious stuff

Just some thoughts that might be helpful
3 places that oil and water could mix 
Prime suspect - head gasket
Then - cracked head
Then I'm thinking cracked turbo
Maybe a 4th?

Another thought is - is the oil recurculating through the system and returning to the sump. Could it be blocked? return valve above the oil filter working properly?


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## David C

Sir Hector said:


> Yep, sounds like a plan.
> And sounds like you've done it right and done all the obvious stuff
> 
> Just some thoughts that might be helpful
> 3 places that oil and water could mix
> Prime suspect - head gasket
> Then - cracked head
> Then I'm thinking cracked turbo
> Maybe a 4th?


The oil/coolant heat exchanger.

The DSG also has an oil/cooland heat exchanger for the gearbox and I suspect the 1.8T Automatic does too.


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## Sir Hector

Also, whilst the heads off. 
Call the guys who did the work and discuss the possibility of a crack between water and oil galleries, can they rule this out
Do they pressure test the oil and water galleries for leaks? 
Maybe they can shed some light on it! 
Whilst the heads off - another chance to re - inspect


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## davebowk

You say you have fitted a new oil cooler and seals, i would check that is all correct and also while the head is off get it skimmed. No amount of scraping will get a warped head to seal


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## Sir Hector

Yeah, daves right, oil cooler is a likely suspect too, and an easy revisit


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## scottatx

I _was_... fairly certain that I did the head gasket securely, and 99% technically correct... A little scuff on a corner wouldn't cause this...

I put the old/existing turbo back in there, and checked its casing for any signs of hairline cracks... it had some very small corners on the propeller broken off, and some play in the shaft... but I was on an extreme budget and did not trust any aftermarket turbos I saw online, so I cleaned and tightened the existing one as best as I could and put it back in...

Going to come back and order a Stigan turbo for the 225hp and AMU engine code... maybe

I replaced the oil cooler, new, new hose assembly to it... I left off the flat red seal/gasket around the gearbox shaft, to come back to it, but none of this would cause that I doubt...

Return valve above the oil filter? It's a new oil cooler, new oil filter... Not sure where a "return valve" is?


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> You say you have fitted a new oil cooler and seals, i would check that is all correct and also while the head is off get it skimmed. No amount of scraping will get a warped head to seal


Well they stated that they _shaved _it, or did whatever they do... for a warped head. Supposedly I picked up a perfect head, with all of this addressed and fixed, and I just inserted it...

I guess I will just have to check every single thing somehow.


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## scottatx

Nothing like spending 10 months of your life day and night on _practice_.


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## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Also, whilst the heads off.
> Call the guys who did the work and discuss the possibility of a crack between water and oil galleries, can they rule this out
> Do they pressure test the oil and water galleries for leaks?
> Maybe they can shed some light on it!
> Whilst the heads off - another chance to re - inspect


Thanks I will do that, because they kind of sucked... They called me to pick it up and the cam shafts were not even there, so I caught it as I was leaving and had to wait about two hours while he put the cams in, got totally angry when I asked questions... You just assume they did their job but something may be completely off...

But like I said... There are literally zero drops of oil coming from anywhere other than the hole in the turbo oil feed line, which sprays out under very high pressure and goes everywhere... If you clean and dry everything, then start it and watch it, you can clearly see that everything is dry, and the turbo line leak seeps over the engine, and down along the bottom seams, which makes it look like the rear main seal...

But there must be a reason that the oil was white coming out of the hole in the turbo line. Must be... guessing... the interior surface of the head gasket. Maybe struggling by yourself and letting it slide roughly into place, causing some scuffs, etc., causes some crucial damage.


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## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Thanks I will do that, because they kind of sucked... They called me to pick it up and the cam shafts were not even there, so I caught it as I was leaving and had to wait about two hours while he put the cams in, got totally angry when I asked questions... You just assume they did their job but something may be completely off...
> 
> But like I said... There are literally zero drops of oil coming from anywhere other than the hole in the turbo oil feed line, which sprays out under very high pressure and goes everywhere... If you clean and dry everything, then start it and watch it, you can clearly see that everything is dry, and the turbo line leak seeps over the engine, and down along the bottom seams, which makes it look like the rear main seal...
> 
> But there must be a reason that the oil was white coming out of the hole in the turbo line. Must be... guessing... the interior surface of the head gasket. Maybe struggling by yourself and letting it slide roughly into place, causing some scuffs, etc., causes some crucial damage.


I wonder if I could see/identify it if I lifted the head off... see the areas where the fluids are mixing or leaking?


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## Sir Hector

Not seen it myself, but there is a oil return valve thats closes without pressure(to prevent head from draining oil) and open under pressure to allow circulation.
It's hidden in the oil filter/cooler module somewhere and is worth a look at and clean maybe.


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## Sir Hector

Yeah, it's a bummer when you start to question your work but maybe it's down to the guys who did your headwork, pronlem is - you don't know. 

The leak is a minor problem compared to the nasty water/oil mix. 
If you take the head off again, reckon you need to be 100% sure it's a good un - take it to a head specialist for inspection, test and skimmed. Meticulous rebuild with helper(heads heavy! ) 
Then at least you know its not that if it's not right. 
You've checked the turbo, so I'd be looking for easy fixes first, recheck oil cooler assembly and return valve before I took the head off again.


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## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Yeah, it's a bummer when you start to question your work but maybe it's down to the guys who did your headwork, pronlem is - you don't know.
> 
> The leak is a minor problem compared to the nasty water/oil mix.
> If you take the head off again, reckon you need to be 100% sure it's a good un - take it to a head specialist for inspection, test and skimmed. Meticulous rebuild with helper(heads heavy! )
> Then at least you know its not that if it's not right.
> You've checked the turbo, so I'd be looking for easy fixes first, recheck oil cooler assembly and return valve before I took the head off again.



Thanks a lot for all your input...

I will do exactly this

...as I am waiting for the turbo feed line and chain tensioner, and have about 6 stripped bolts to fix with a coil... 

Some people have regular cars... weirdos


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## fire88

I can feel your pain mate
I just finished rebuilt my TT so totally understand it


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## scottatx

If it means anything... just took off all the hoses down the driver side of the engine, and all the coolant that came out was crystal clear, not a mix of oil and coolant.

I'm just going to take everything off... and put it back together again lol... 

I should probably be working or something

I'll replace the turbo oil feed line and cam chain tensioner, fix all stripped bolts, and take it from there. 

Or maybe I should just go ahead with the goal of lifting the cylinder head off...


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## Sir Hector

Yeah, do the easy cheap stuff first. 
But I wouldn't want to drive 1 mile with oil that colour. 
Somehow, somewhere water is getting into your oil system and this is very serious. 
Must be where they are close together
Oil cooler first - easy
Then turbo or head and gasket - hard
Seems its rare that blocks crack but i don't really know.


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## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Yeah, do the easy cheap stuff first.
> But I wouldn't want to drive 1 mile with oil that colour.
> Somehow, somewhere water is getting into your oil system and this is very serious.
> Must be where they are close together
> Oil cooler first - easy
> Then turbo or head and gasket - hard
> Seems its rare that blocks crack but i don't really know.



Thanks for your input...

Just called the machine shop, they are going to Email me to confirm/list all that they did, I asked if they shaved/planed/skimmed the surface to make it level, and made everything perfectly ready to simply put it in the engine... I'm fairly certain that they did.

As we speak... taking off all hoses, intake manifold, etc. to access the turbo oil feed line and oil cooler... Going to remove all of that, inspect it, clean it, re-assemble it... wait for a new turbo line delivery... Then replace that, and the camshaft chain tensioner...assemble everything carefully and start it.

At that point I should know if the hole in the turbo line was the enti8re issue or if I need to change the head gasket again, or something...,

I should be getting paid for this lol

But... good news is... it's not rocket science. Something is wrong. I just need to determine what it is... and fix it. I'm at least happy and proud that I can literally take every single physical part of this engine apart, and put it back together again.

I even soaked the turbo intercoolers in kerosene, cleaned and re-seated every single hose connection, new O2 sensors, about 10 new switches and sensors... So when I finally resolve this leak, it should run like an antelope.


----------



## Sir Hector

And yes they do, which is whys its all worth it. 
Do oil cooler, and check and clean the non return valve(it's in there) and check your plumming. 
If you can't see problems then
Confirm work with machine shop and redo head gasket and cam tensioner work at the same time, save your dollars on gaskets.
And then flush it and oil it.


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> And yes they do, which is whys its all worth it.
> Do oil cooler, and check and clean the non return valve(it's in there) and check your plumming.
> If you can't see problems then
> Confirm work with machine shop and redo head gasket and cam tensioner work at the same time, save your dollars on gaskets.
> And then flush it and oil it.



Now that sounds like a solid plan Thanks again.

Finally... I get some good feedback on an important forum question Nobody has ever even replied to a question I have posted haha...

But this time it's life or death...

I freelance, and take about eight driving breaks a day... get across Austin and back in about 14 minutes...

My joke is, but it's what I actually do... is go out and race BMWs all day... I miss that, severely


----------



## StuartDB

just stop running it without oil or coolant - you will break it !! What are your 6 stripped bolts from?


----------



## TT'sRevenge

I'm kind of at a loss as to why it took you four months to do a timing belt (or the other things)... Did you work on it 20 minutes a day or something? lol

Jokes aside, I see you rebuilt the engine so yes I can imagine that taking the time but not necessarily just the timing belt or just the RMS. I mean it's not like you're pulling the engine for every individual item/instance here....or at least I hope you aren't?!

Anyway it sounds like you have it figured out now, hopefully everything is all done and you can get to enjoying the car. 

On a side note, I'm not sure how serious you are about "selling everything you own" and going broke over this car but for the future, I suggest you read up on the sunk cost fallacy. It's just some good reading on financial decisions of this sort. Here are two links on the matter...


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost











The Sunk Cost Fallacy - The Decision Lab


The Sunk Cost Fallacy describes our tendency to follow through on an endeavor if we have already invested time, effort, or money into it, whether or not the current costs outweigh the benefits.




thedecisionlab.com


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> just stop running it without oil or coolant - you will break it !! What are your 6 stripped bolts from?


It had about 1/3 oil and of coolant, enough (to me) to run for under a minute or so... But yeah I'm learning that you have to actually be very careful and precise with this car... You can't just half-ass stuff like a truck or jeep or something...

Oh about two or three cam bearing cap bolt holes are stripped... one bolt hole of the three that holds the gear shifter cables and bracket down on top of the transmission, and a few other just random bolt holes... I'm rough on stuff

Also, I re-used the flywheel bolts... and the six correct flywheel bolts are at S Austin Audi down the street... so I might just take the bell housing off, and perfectly correctly put the new flywheel bolts in with Loctite, etc.

And take the gearbox off and put the three new gaskets in... One red flat one and two small green ones...

It sucks to take shortcuts and have that stuff on your mind all the time...

The intermediate plate was totally shot and all bent out of shape but I don't think it serves much of a crucial purpose...

I guess worst-case scenario is do all of the little details I just mentioned... and if it is still leaking out white-ish oil, take the head off and look at the gasket, and I should see exactly where fluids are mixing, etc.


----------



## Sir Hector

Hi Stuart, I'm new on the site, and I'm on hols and tv's shite, got time on hand. 
Whilst you've got the head off, I'd get the turbo out whilst it's easy, get it reconned at auto turbo specialsts(they'll take it apart and call if cracked). £350 and refit
You don't ever want to see that turbo again, ever!.


----------



## scottatx

TT'sRevenge said:


> I'm kind of at a loss as to why it took you four months to do a timing belt (or the other things)... Did you work on it 20 minutes a day or something? lol
> 
> Jokes aside, I see you rebuilt the engine so yes I can imagine that taking the time but not necessarily just the timing belt or just the RMS. I mean it's not like you're pulling the engine for every individual item/instance here....or at least I hope you aren't?!
> 
> Anyway it sounds like you have it figured out now, hopefully everything is all done and you can get to enjoying the car.
> 
> On a side note, I'm not sure how serious you are about "selling everything you own" and going broke over this car but for the future, I suggest you read up on the sunk cost fallacy. It's just some good reading on financial decisions of this sort. Here are two links on the matter...
> 
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sunk Cost Fallacy - The Decision Lab
> 
> 
> The Sunk Cost Fallacy describes our tendency to follow through on an endeavor if we have already invested time, effort, or money into it, whether or not the current costs outweigh the benefits.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thedecisionlab.com


Cool I will check that concept out right now... Sounds exactly like the label for this phase of life Thanks... Like Peter Pan Syndrome or something lol...

Well, I freelance, do not need to go anywhere, and am an obsessive meticulous person, and cannot stand when things do not work easily and correctly, as if you were in a life or death situation, and you cannot trust your tools, etc., so as I was solving these main issues I was also rebuilding the door lock barrels, re-wiring everything, buffing it with Ultimate Compound, ordering rubber clips/seals for along the door top, re-working every single electrical connection, etc. And also it is a PITA for me to do the timing. I have to do it about 9 times to get it right, and still do not even know if it's right, due to this overbearing issue/oil leak/pressure...

So now I am HOPING that a new turbo oil feed line will solve the pressure problem, and at least make it run normally...

And find another error, other than taking the head off and inspecting the head gasket... About to take off the brand new oil cooler and filter, clean all of that and that area, and put it back together...

I'll get it back in action


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Hi Stuart, I'm new on the site, and I'm on hols and tv's shite, got time on hand.
> Whilst you've got the head off, I'd get the turbo out whilst it's easy, get it reconned at auto turbo specialsts(they'll take it apart and call if cracked). £350 and refit
> You don't ever want to see that turbo again, ever!.


Then, replace the whole turbo with something like this:


https://attaturbo.com/2001-2006-audi-tt-quattro-18t-with-amu-engine-turbocharger-jm-j-05


----------



## TT'sRevenge

scottatx said:


> Well, I freelance, do not need to go anywhere, and am an obsessive meticulous person, and cannot stand when things do not work easily and correctly, as if you were in a life or death situation, and you cannot trust your tools, etc., so as I was solving these main issues I was also rebuilding the door lock barrels, re-wiring everything, buffing it with Ultimate Compound, ordering rubber clips/seals for along the door top, re-working every single electrical connection, etc. And also it is a PITA for me to do the timing. I have to do it about 9 times to get it right, and still do not even know if it's right, due to this overbearing issue/oil leak/pressure...
> 
> So now I am HOPING that a new turbo oil feed line will solve the pressure problem, and at least make it run normally...


Ah yes a project car indeed  I wouldn't lose confidence I think you've got it down. If you've rebuild an engine mostly on your own, I think you'll be able to nail down the problem and get it fixed. Definitely replace the oil line, get some oil and coolant in there and try again. Keep in mind the oil line is crucial for the turbo to run. Just like an engine with no oil, a turbo with no oil can get destroyed rather quickly if it doesn't get oil. Hopefully you've not run it too long like this as you don't want another headache!




scottatx said:


> And find another error, other than taking the head off and inspecting the head gasket... About to take off the brand new oil cooler and filter, clean all of that and that area, and put it back together...
> 
> I'll get it back in action


Sounds good! Best of luck with it!


----------



## davebowk

scottatx said:


> Then, replace the whole turbo with something like this:
> 
> 
> https://attaturbo.com/2001-2006-audi-tt-quattro-18t-with-amu-engine-turbocharger-jm-j-05


No, for that price thats probably a chinese turbo and probably won't last long


----------



## davebowk

If they post over there these are good Audi S3, TT Uprated Stage 1 HYBRID K04 Turbo CHRA Cartridge K04-020 K04-022 K04-023 Turbocharger
They also do new hot sides for a good price.


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> It had about 1/3 oil and of coolant, enough (to me) to run for under a minute or so... But yeah I'm learning that you have to actually be very careful and precise with this car... You can't just half-ass stuff like a truck or jeep or something...
> 
> Oh about two or three cam bearing cap bolt holes are stripped... one bolt hole of the three that holds the gear shifter cables and bracket down on top of the transmission, and a few other just random bolt holes... I'm rough on stuff
> .......


I don't understand? you said the head was rebuilt - why would it be rebuilt without cam caps holding down the cams? are you running the car without the cams correctly bolted down - how did you remove and refit the cams - you need to carefully follow a process otherwise they can bend.

_people used to think running desktop processors for a little while without a heatsink was okay, they last about 6 seconds._

did you fit the head to the block yourself? what head bolts and gasket did you use? and did you correctly torque and stretch the bolts?

running a car with some coolant sloshing around is not doing anything.- it is a pressurised system. although I expect there is a different reason they are mixing - but considering you doin't have any coolant pressure as the flange isn't connected, I am not sure how.


----------



## Charmadize

I think that is too milky to be head gasket.
Oil coolant heat exchanger or, your turbo isn’t cracked is it?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> I don't understand? you said the head was rebuilt - why would it be rebuilt without cam caps holding down the cams? are you running the car without the cams correctly bolted down - how did you remove and refit the cams - you need to carefully follow a process otherwise they can bend.
> 
> _people used to think running desktop processors for a little while without a heatsink was okay, they last about 6 seconds._
> 
> did you fit the head to the block yourself? what head bolts and gasket did you use? and did you correctly torque and stretch the bolts?
> 
> running a car with some coolant sloshing around is not doing anything.- it is a pressurised system. although I expect there is a different reason they are mixing - but considering you doin't have any coolant pressure as the flange isn't connected, I am not sure how.



Yes the head was repaired at a machine shop... It did not severely overheat, the water pump just became loose and tilted and the timing belt came off the tracks and snagged into the sprocket of the cam and got a little shredded, etc., but did enough damage to bend eight valves.

They're not calling me back, it was about 10 months ago so they can't find their records of it... But they supposedly checked everything, made it level, resurfaced it iof necessary, (probably wasn't even necessary but that's part of the service), so it was to be a good cylinder head to just install... And I was just saying that they spaced out and didn't even have the cam shafts in there when I picked it up... So I informed them of that, and I then waited there for about three hours while a guy put the cam shafts in and timed it, and completed everything.

Yes I installed it with a Victor Reinz head gasket and new bolts, and torqued them perfectly in the correct sequence. The only issue is that I was by myself, and slid it down into position on two crowbars, then wiggled it into final position, and the gasket got a little scuffed on one corner, but don't think/can't imagine that it was severe enough to be a leak.

And yes I started it with the flange and oil cooler hoses disconnected, just hurrying and specifically trying to identify any leaks above that area with some cardboard put down to see any leaks... That's when I saw the the massive hole in the turbo oil feed line...

Just now I accessed the oil cooler, which is brand new, and no "return valve" in it or anywhere... It's just a box with a gasket that screws on with a biog nut, which I did perfectly... There is not a drop of anything anywhere around that whole area (photo here), but I do think that that plug on the right side is not making connection. The clip is broken off and it is not firmly seated, so whatever that does, I don't think that it has been doing it And I don't think there is any reason to take the oil cooler off? I removed the turbo oil feed line and ordering a new one...

And when I had the turbo off, I inspected it for hairline cracks, didn't see anything. I just cleaned it all up, soaked everything and the interior with PB Blaster and re-installed it.

Having the coolant hoses disconnected on the right side of the engine wouldn't make the oil milky like that I don't think... 

So maybe I damaged the head gasket when I roughly put it into place by myself, but coolant is clear... and maybe/hopefully, the hole in the turbo oil feed line is what is causing it to act like it it severely out of time, and no oil is getting to the turbo...

So still don't know if I need to access and see the head gasket... I'm going to replace the turbo feed line, connect everything and see what happens, I guess. 

Whew I need a nap after writing all of that And I've been doing this every day for 10 months.


----------



## davebowk

The head is ally, sliding it down crowbars will not do it any good, i think that will need to come off and be skimmed and fitted properly.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> The head is ally, sliding it down crowbars will not do it any good, i think that will need to come off and be skimmed and fitted properly.


Thanks. I'm assuming "skimmed" is shaving/resurfacing it... making the bottom side perfectly flat...

I was extremely careful. I was just by myself... I didn't really "slide it down" the bars, with any action or movement or anything, I just used them as an assist, and situated it down into position. But when it made contact, the right rear corner, closest to the steering wheel, scuffed the blue material off of the Victor Reinz gasket a little, couple centimeter scuff, where you could just see white, not a gash or all the way through or anything... Then I just positioned it and torqued down the bolts in sequence.

Also, I have started it a couple times before this, and let it run for probably 15 to 20 seconds... and the oil that came out was clear and good, like new oil. 

Then detached everything from the driver side of the engine, put some cardboard under that area, started it for about 7 seconds, just to pinpoint the new leak I was seeing...

Is it a ruined


----------



## scottatx

See... I _gotta _get this car running😬 It is the absolute funnest thing I do every day... I cannot even hardly believe that I have been walking back and forth to it, day and night, for so long... thinking that it will be all fixed up within a few days, breaking my back in the grease and gravel...
I can't wait until it runs normally again and I can get back to obsessively polishing it.

It's like working on the Space Shuttle.

Hyperbole... but you do have to be extremely careful, do things precisely...

Is the head gasket basically, or literally... the only thing that could make the oil look like this?


----------



## Sir Hector

Yeah, I agree with dave,
Think you go forward on the basis the heads OK, get it re skimmed and very carefully reinstall.
Don't really know what to say about the turbo except make sure it's good when you put it back in, you really dont wanna see it ever again(get it checked over by a pro - may be cracked inside - I don't know) 
Got to be sure!


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Yeah, I agree with dave,
> Think you go forward on the basis the heads OK, get it re skimmed and very carefully reinstall.
> Don't really know what to say about the turbo except make sure it's good when you put it back in, you really dont wanna see it ever again(get it checked over by a pro - may be cracked inside - I don't know)
> Got to be sure!


Well it was running perfectly before this all happened, just some small chips and wear on the ends of the prop blades... So I just decided to re-install it.

If the "head is okay", why would I get it "re-skimmed"?


----------



## Sir Hector

Hi Stuart, just a helpful comment hopefully - you seem to working on this at 100mph - very different from my approach. 
My confidence, knowledge and skill base is extremely limited so I do everything very slowly. I spend as much time researching forums looking at diagrams, reading the manuals, sitting on the sofa thinking it through, tools needed, materials involved lubes and glues. 
My worst enemy is wanting to the drive it asap and I have to resist this and methodically plod on and hope its done before I expire. 
In England we have an expression
A bull in a china shop - tt is a China shop, don't be a bull.


----------



## davebowk

You would get it skimmed as it's cheaper than doing it all again. The pressures involved will find any imperfection. Also for that much water to get in the oil with the system not being sealed, it must be a big leak and literally just pouring in.
If the turbo has chipped blades it will be out of Ballance and destroy itself pretty quickly. You have run the motor with that emulsified oil, for it to be that well mixed it has run for longer than you are admitting to, so i'm not holding too much hope for that engine.
The next topic you post will be asking how much it's worth as scrap.


----------



## Sir Hector

Yeah, you gotta think about wat dave says this seriously, 
You could fix all this stuff and discover other problems thereafter. 
So many problems you know about and what about others your not aware of. 
You can treat this engine as the one you learnt on and spares maybe.


----------



## StuartDB

did you strip the cam cap bolt holes fitting the cams back? they are like finger tight + 1mm   not really but yes just about that I needed to buy a tiny torque wrench I think 8NM or something, any more and it strips the head.

so are you running without all the cam caps bolted down?

the head isn't just torqued it has a further 1/4 turn plus a further 1/4 turn


----------



## Sir Hector

My understanding is that this is one of the most complex inline4's ever made - no shame at all in not gettting it right.
I've jumped from series b mini engines(70's) to the 1.8t and its like time travel. This thing is like a swiss watch and must be serviced accordingly.
Great great care is needed.
If you decide to persevere, recon your present turbo, skim your head, helicoil stripped holes and go again, make many sacrifices to the autogods and good luck.


----------



## Sir Hector

Sorry stuart, previous post was for scott


----------



## StuartDB

yeah I am getting a little confused in this thread of who is who


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Hi Stuart, just a helpful comment hopefully - you seem to working on this at 100mph - very different from my approach.
> My confidence, knowledge and skill base is extremely limited so I do everything very slowly. I spend as much time researching forums looking at diagrams, reading the manuals, sitting on the sofa thinking it through, tools needed, materials involved lubes and glues.
> My worst enemy is wanting to the drive it asap and I have to resist this and methodically plod on and hope its done before I expire.
> In England we have an expression
> A bull in a china shop - tt is a China shop, don't be a bull.



Understood I have been working on this for almost a year, every single day, and night. I haven't just changed the timing belt kit and rear main seal... I have basically fixed, repaired, replaced, every single physical object and part on the entire car.
While waiting for parts, I go out and buff it and wax it, and condition the seats... I soaked every single metal line in PB Blaster, soaked and flushed the intercoolers, plastic welded cracks in the front bumper, sanded and matched the paint, dis-assembled the headlights and polished them, sanded and painted the front grills, new shifter stick, new Michelin Pilot Sport tires, new convertible top relay, rebuilt all the mechanisms inside of the doors, Kicker 10" subwoofer behind passenger seat... So yes I have a lot invested in this car. It is literally practically the love of my life.

Stuart-Not starting it with anything missing... I stripped a few cam bearing bolts because yes, I couldn't imagine them not being tight so I overtightened a few... even if the torque wrench clicked...

I did the head bolts extremely carefully and precise, torque, another 1/4 turn, in the proper sequence, etc. But maybe it is so delicate that that one little scuff, or my positioning of it, was enough to cause this major internal leak and produce that color of oil coming out. I have not started it for more than 15 seconds in this condition. After I installed the head and new head gasket... I started it, and clear good oil poured out. My VW mechanic said that the rear main seal probably became brittle and failed after so much time with no oil in it. So I took it all apart and replaced the rear main seal. Here is a video of the first start after I changed the rear main seal. As far as I know I have the timing perfect this time.

Then, as it was still unclear where the leak was coming from, I put some cardboard on top of the transmission and started it again for about 10 seconds, and saw the leak and hole in the turbo oil feed line. During all of these 10 to 15 second starts, just 2 or 3... the leaked oil has been clear and good.

So NOW, lol (what a nightmare), I was just draining the oil via the oil pan plug, to prepare for the new turbo feed line, and the oil that came out is the white milky oil in the photo.

So now I am at a new point of discovery. I am definitely going to persevere, and I _am _in a hurry, now. It's been about 10 months. I need to end this nightmare and get my car back.

So my latest conclusion from this thread... is that I need to take the head back and have it "skimmed", get a new head gasket, and have two people extremely carefully lower it into position, without any contact to it other than it's first contact with the head gasket.

Then maybe the oil coming from the turbo feed line, made it appear that I did not do the rear main seal correctly, and that the turbo line is the actual big leak.


----------



## scottatx

Just visualizing and plotting options...

I can't see how I could have damaged the head putting it in. There were no hard jars or bumping the surface hard into anything, etc. And the machine shop wouldn't replace eight bent valves without doing the rest, planing the surface to be level... But hell they forgot to put the cam shafts in when I picked it up so maybe they didn't even do that as well, have to call them on Monday.

I have a support bar set up now, lowered the engine to fix a stripped gear shifter cable bracket hole. If the surface and head IS in good shape, and I just messed up the gasket on install... I wonder if I could get away with raising the head with the support bar, lowering the bottom, and sliding a new gasket in there, and re-install and torque new bolts?


----------



## magwych

Before you grt into these complex arrangements to swap out your head, have you checked the oil cooler ?
It is not unknown for this to fail, symptoms are the prolific production of mayonnaise in the engine sump ;-)


----------



## Sir Hector

Yeah, you've gotta be 100% sure its right before you take the head off again because it's so much work and dollar. 

But, how were you going to do the stripped camcap threads( helicoil?) without taking the head off?. Can this be done in car?. 
Gotta recon turbo if its out, itll be out of balance and possible crack. 
Saw the photos, it's a nice clean motor


----------



## Sir Hector

Compression test? - may reveal some more useful info.


----------



## Charmadize

“Is the head gasket basically, or literally... the only thing that could make the oil look like this?”

for this question, my answer would be; no.

I still think you should junk the oil to water heat exchanger for a new one first. It could be the head, or the head gasket, but that is a major failure and the head will be warped because of the amount of water that is going across. My experience is with a warped head that water goes into the oil and oil goes into the water. But you are saying your water is clear.

that leads me to think that is must be where the water pressure is high and the oil pressure is low. The most likely place for that is the exchanger above/part of the oil filter.


----------



## StuartDB

They have been running the engine without the coolant flange attached to the head, surely there is no coolant pressure...


----------



## David C

StuartDB said:


> They have been running the engine without the coolant flange attached to the head, surely there is no coolant pressure...


It's difficult to follow what's been going on here.

The oil-coolant heat exchanger is highly likely to be the cause of that much coolant getting into the oil.
Worryingly though, that usually results in oil in the coolant because oil pressure is (or should be) higher than coolant pressure...

Another thing is that in the picture of the Coke bottle full of milky oil, there isn't even a hint of colour to it, which makes me think he's just using water not coolant.

But as he's stripped threads in the head by not using a torque wrench, the head will need to come off anyway to fix that....


----------



## StuartDB

The car is beginning to remind me of using a junior hacksaw to turn my Mini 1100 special I had crashed into a convertible when I was 18....

Too much petrol sniffing 

I too am struggling to follow what broke and when...


----------



## scottatx

Thanks guys... I had to step away from it for a couple days and mentally regroup.

I have _so much _invested in this, one year of my life and almost everything I own, _literally_. I'm being evicted... Because I have a one-track mind. I'm a freelance web developer, and am basically a "lucky" person, so all of this time, I thought I would just get this fixed, and get back to my web business and catch up quickly. I love this car so much, it is extremely depressing. I should be a commercial for "Audi Obsession." And I don't even have a lot of money, or a garage, etc. I've spent every penny on trying to repair this. I have an industrial level of electronics experience, and an above-average level of mechanical experience so am not an idiot, but fully aware that this car is different.

Here are some basic facts and new questions I'm asking myself:

The few stripped cam bearing cap screws... I basically tightened them enough to start the car for testing then come back to fixing them with a coil... and need to replace the chain tensioner because I dropped it on the ground and one of the two vertical chain guides broke. None of this would produce or have any affect on the milky oil though. Head doesn't come off for that, just the valve cover
I am _fairly certain_ that I did the head gasket and rear main seal perfectly.
The rear main seal that I replaced, the upper square part of the seal was broken and edges missing... After I replaced it, the oil leak that dumped oil out... It _felt _the same, same speed of oil onto the ground, etc., same sound of sputtering as if the timing was off, was clear good oil, and there was no oil on the bell housing, or on the flywheel, etc. I would think that if the rear main seal had a catastrophic leak like that there would be oil all over everything in the bell housing side and flywheel, etc.
So after I replaced the rear main seal finally, and put everything back together to a T, filled every single fluid level perfectly... I started it for about 10 seconds. That is this video. (And I'm fairly certain I have the timing perfectly correct now.)
So then I spent about 2 hours inspecting the entire engine with a mirror. I noticed that I saw absolutely zero leaks or fluids anywhere, above the horizontal line of the bottom seams of the engine, or the bottom seam of the gearbox.
So I decided to detach all of the hoses and flange on the right side of the engine, and put some cardboard down, and on the ground, to actually see where the leak was coming from. I had other things to finalize anyway.
I checked the dipstick oil level, definitely had enough to run for 10 seconds, and coolant... put a quart of oil in, and had a friend start it while I watched for about 10 seconds, then shut it off.
That's when I saw the leak from the turbo oil feed line, in this photo.
And for the first time, out came the milky white oil.
Then I drained the oil from the oil pan, to see if it matched, and to prepare for whatever fix I needed to do, and that's when this came out.
So my new question is... Is having all of that stuff detached on the right side of the engine enough to make the oil mix with the coolant like that?

Hypothetically, could replacing the turbo oil feed line, and putting everything back together, attach all hoses on right side of engine, solve this?

And remember, it is a brand new oil cooler, oil filter, oil cooler nut torqued well, new oil cooler hoses to engine, new coolant hoses and flange, practically everything has been replaced and is new. And I am 99% certain I did no damage to the head when installing, or the rear main seal.

So I am hoping and praying I am just being stupid and missing something stupid.

Scott


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Thanks guys... I had to step away from it for a couple days and mentally regroup.
> 
> I have _so much _invested in this, one year of my life and almost everything I own, _literally_. I'm being evicted... Because I have a one-track mind. I'm a freelance web developer, and am basically a "lucky" person, so all of this time, I thought I would just get this fixed, and get back to my web business and catch up quickly. I love this car so much, it is extremely depressing. I should be a commercial for "Audi Obsession." And I don't even have a lot of money, or a garage, etc. I've spent every penny on trying to repair this. I have an industrial level of electronics experience, and an above-average level of mechanical experience so am not an idiot, but fully aware that this car is different.
> 
> Here are some basic facts and new questions I'm asking myself:
> 
> The few stripped cam bearing cap screws... I basically tightened them enough to start the car for testing then come back to fixing them with a coil... and need to replace the chain tensioner because I dropped it on the ground and one of the two vertical chain guides broke. None of this would produce or have any affect on the milky oil though. Head doesn't come off for that, just the valve cover
> I am _fairly certain_ that I did the head gasket and rear main seal perfectly.
> The rear main seal that I replaced, the upper square part of the seal was broken and edges missing... After I replaced it, the oil leak that dumped oil out... It _felt _the same, same speed of oil onto the ground, etc., same sound of sputtering as if the timing was off, was clear good oil, and there was no oil on the bell housing, or on the flywheel, etc. I would think that if the rear main seal had a catastrophic leak like that there would be oil all over everything in the bell housing side and flywheel, etc.
> So after I replaced the rear main seal finally, and put everything back together to a T, filled every single fluid level perfectly... I started it for about 10 seconds. That is this video. (And I'm fairly certain I have the timing perfectly correct now.)
> So then I spent about 2 hours inspecting the entire engine with a mirror. I noticed that I saw absolutely zero leaks or fluids anywhere, above the horizontal line of the bottom seams of the engine, or the bottom seam of the gearbox.
> So I decided to detach all of the hoses and flange on the right side of the engine, and put some cardboard down, and on the ground, to actually see where the leak was coming from. I had other things to finalize anyway.
> I checked the dipstick oil level, definitely had enough to run for 10 seconds, and coolant... put a quart of oil in, and had a friend start it while I watched for about 10 seconds, then shut it off.
> That's when I saw the leak from the turbo oil feed line, in this photo.
> And for the first time, out came the milky white oil.
> Then I drained the oil from the oil pan, to see if it matched, and to prepare for whatever fix I needed to do, and that's when this came out.
> So my new question is... Is having all of that stuff detached on the right side of the engine enough to make the oil mix with the coolant like that?
> 
> Hypothetically, could replacing the turbo oil feed line, and putting everything back together, attach all hoses on right side of engine, solve this?
> 
> And remember, it is a brand new oil cooler, oil filter, oil cooler nut torqued well, new oil cooler hoses to engine, new coolant hoses and flange, practically everything has been replaced and is new. And I am 99% certain I did no damage to the head when installing, or the rear main seal.
> 
> So I am hoping and praying I am just being stupid and missing something stupid.
> 
> Scott


And I fully inspected the turbo for cracks... I thought I had done everything correctly. I am just praying that I am just missing something totally stupid. But I thought, (assumed), you could start it for a few moments to produce and identify a leak, with the items on the right side of the engine disconnected, and now I am praying, that that alone could cause this oil/coolasnt milky mixture.


----------



## scottatx

Just checked again, loosened the coolant drain plug and the coolant coming out is completely clear, if that is a tell-tale sign of anything:

So the final question (s), before I move ahead further... is, is having the oil cooler to engine hoses disconnected, as well as pretty much every hose on the right side of the engine, and a big leak/hole in the turbo oil feed line... enough to make the oil coming out of the oil pan look like that? All milky and white?

Just trying to exhaust every possibility of any mistake I made before I move on to other solutions.


----------



## StuartDB

You're going to have to flush the engine... and make sure you crank it for a while without the injectors plugged in or a fuse pulled to make sure you get oil up into the head cams


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> They have been running the engine without the coolant flange attached to the head, surely there is no coolant pressure...


I only discoverd the turbo line hole/leak, after I removed the coolant flange, oil cooler hoses and other hoses, and put some cardboard down and had a friend start it (for about 10 seconds)... I was trying to pinpoint the leak, after realizing there were no leaks above or below this point.

After I pinpointed that... in full disclosure, I zip tied a piece of rubber hose tightly around the hole in the turbo feed line, thinking that that would at least produce a difference in the way it sounded or leaked, and tell me if I was on the right track, and that the rest of my work was good...

And when I started it again, for only about 10 seconds, that was the first time that the white milky oil, spurted out of the hose I had zip tied on under very high pressure. So shut the car off, and soon after that, unscrewed the oil pan plug to drain any oil just to prepare to do anything, and that is the oil that came out.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> You're going to have to flush the engine... and make sure you crank it for a while without the injectors plugged in or a fuse pulled to make sure you get oil up into the head cams


But the million dollar question is what is causing the mix of the oil to come out white and milky? During the last few steps that I did? Can having all hoses disconnected on the right side of the engine cause that?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> You're going to have to flush the engine... and make sure you crank it for a while without the injectors plugged in or a fuse pulled to make sure you get oil up into the head cams


And don't forget that I believe that this plug has not been making contact.

But as far as I know, absolutely nothing we have discussed in this thread would cause the oil to come out like that, that color, etc., except a head gasket failure.

Mind you, I am still trying to hope for the best here and preserve my work and money.

My main *ONE *direct question: Could having all the hoses disconnected on the right side of the engine cause this, after running the engine for 10-15 seconds.


----------



## Sir Hector

My opinion is No, 15 secs isn't enough time to cause damage but it's a hotty engine, maybe someone can correct me,
Unless you activated the turbo, reckon that'd break pretty quick without coolant.
Starving the engine of oil for any time will cause critical damage.
Well done for taking a stragetic break, only thinking this through will save your beautiful car and your precarious situation!.


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> My opinion is No, 15 secs isn't enough time to cause damage but it's a hotty engine, maybe someone can correct me,
> Unless you activated the turbo, reckon that'd break pretty quick without coolant.
> Starving the engine of oil for any time will cause critical damage.
> Well done for taking a stragetic break, only thinking this through will save your beautiful car and your precarious situation!.



Thank you Sir

No offense, just being 100% technical... There are no answers here... Maybe there are no definitive answers based on my text alone...

I filled the coolant reservoir each time before I started it. I also (which I just read on a forum), cranked the engine a couple times quickly with the ECU unplugged, to prime the turbo with oil...

_Hypothetically_... You could start it for 10 seconds with no oil, I _think_... But I have had _at least_ oil up to the minimum level on the dipstick, or about a quart and a half, etc., each time I have started it.

I have never started it with no oil or coolant. 

It _*seems/feels* _like... just based on gut feeling and knowing all of the parts I have replaced, that as soon as I disconnected all of the hoses on the right side of the engine, and started it again for about ten seconds, that's when the milky white oil spurted out of the turbo feed line, and then the oil pan plug when I drained it.

*As I'm sure anyone who has read this thread is aware, I am trying to identify any cause of this, _*assuming *_that I did the head gasket and rear main seal correctly, and those are not an issue.

Again, *hypothetically*, even the turbo having no coolant for 10 seconds, or the engine having no oil for 10 seconds... Doesn't seem like still... that that would cause this huge mix of oil and coolant that we see in the Coke bottle that came out of the oil pan. (?)

So the only thing I know for certain, still... is that I need to replace the turbo oil feed line, and re-connect all of the hoses on the right side of the engine. Add some fluids, and start it again for 10 seconds and see how it sounds.

BUT I also... tried to tighten the turbo spindle when I had it out... I did a few questionable things... But _none _of that, would cause coolant to flood into the oil like the oil that is coming out of the drain plug. I don't _think_.

As far as I *know*, absolutely nothing we have discussed in this thread, would cause that color and milkiness of oil to come out of the drain pan... We are still missing the crucial tell-tale sign and solution.

I'm going to go back and re-read every word of this thread. Replace the turbo oil feed line, connect every single hose and line, and do a pressure test, or flush the oil, add oil and coolant, and start it again for 10 seconds. Maybe

What a nightmare.


----------



## Sir Hector

Hi Scott - I'm trying to be helpful, because this could me at another time and I empathise, but you need answers and I'm only a diy-er
Water circuit is leaking into oil circuit and its a pita to work out where?

Im a bit worried about what you did to the turbo, overtightening bolts can crack casings and cause leaks(how big - I don't know)
If you've moved the blades at all, it'll be out of balance(very high precision).

Read threads about cracked turbos to see if anyones got milky oil like yours.
And maybe if none, then you can rule this out


----------



## Sir Hector

Nor sure this is possible but could you have accidentally misconnected the coolant system to the pcv? - certainly give milky oil!


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Hi Scott - I'm trying to be helpful, because this could me at another time and I empathise, but you need answers and I'm only a diy-er
> Water circuit is leaking into oil circuit and its a pita to work out where?
> 
> Im a bit worried about what you did to the turbo, overtightening bolts can crack casings and cause leaks(how big - I don't know)
> If you've moved the blades at all, it'll be out of balance(very high precision).
> 
> Read threads about cracked turbos to see if anyones got milky oil like yours.
> And maybe if none, then you can rule this out


Oh no no... I am extremely grateful for any piece of information I just did not know or realize that the turbo could cause this white oil... As we speak I am researching every single thing about the turbo. I took the whole thing off with the head and put it right in front of my couch After I got the head back from the machine shop and put it all back together, the only way I "primed" the turbo, was to crank the engine a couple times with the ECU unplugged, which I read on a forum.

So with the hole in the turbo feed line, and probably not priming it, it was smoking a little while I started it... 

When I had the turbo out, I basically lightly sanded rough edges on the blades, soaked it in PB Blaster, inspected it for cracks, rinsed the interior numerous times with boiling water... then put the whole engine back together, cranked it a couple times with ECU unplugged, and started it. That's when oil poured out. Clear oil.

So I replaced the rear main seal. Then good clear oil poured out again. Which leads me to believe that it was that hole in the turbo feed line all along causing the major oil leak.

(I was planning on coming back and replacing the turbo, but since it was operating fine to begin with, I decided to clean it and put it back in.)

Then after I finally discovered the turbo feed line hole, and disconnected all of the right engine side hoses and lines, started it for 10 seconds, that's when the milky oil started...

So my _*latest *_plan, lol (not funny), is to replace the turbo oil feed line, prime the turbo with some oil before I connect the line to the turbo itself, connect all hoses and lines on right side of engine, flush engine with cheap quart of oil, add all fluids and start for 10 seconds.

Looking back... I should have just had it towed to the VW shop. But at every single step of the way of this adventure, I thought I had it fixed.


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> Nor sure this is possible but could you have accidentally misconnected the coolant system to the pcv? - certainly give milky oil!


What exactly would this connection be?


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> When I had the turbo out, I basically lightly sanded rough edges on the blades


Yep, that's scrap.


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> Yep, that's scrap.


But... It was like that and operating perfectly... I only improved it? Keep in mind, I am aware these fixes are not perfect, I am not wealthy, I was planning on coming back to it, my #1 priority is just getting the car running and major leak fixed.


----------



## scottatx

Also... I'm not just blindly doing any of this... during crucial decisions I have called Audi, or Austin VeeDub, they said if the turbo was screwed up it would still run, just without a turbo... Or that the rear main seal became brittle and failed, etc.

And also, an old saying from my Navy stepdad... "Wire has a memory." So it is almost impossible to mis-connect something, and I also took hundreds of photos, so if there is any doubt, I figure it out.

I still have _*hope*_, and a _*sense*_, that I have done something stupid, rather than fully screwing up my head gasket or rear main seal install.


----------



## Sir Hector

I'm not sure it's possible to do this and misconnect, but above the oil filter cooler assembly is the pcv outlet and flex pcv pipe that goes to the head.
Lots of pipes down there, is it possible you've misconnected these somehow. Take 5 mins just to check your plumming.


----------



## scottatx

Sir Hector said:


> I'm not sure it's possible to do this and misconnect, but above the oil filter cooler assembly is the pcv outlet and flex pcv pipe that goes to the head.
> Lots of pipes down there, is it possible you've misconnected these somehow. Take 5 mins just to check your plumming.


Going out to do that right now, and it's 5:48am here This is my life, for almost a year...

Also just confirmed the upper end of the turbo feed line, which bolts to remove that... 

But hoses and lines have a "memory", and the two hoses to the oil cooler are cut in certain lengths, so is a long-shot... I am just trying to exhaust every option, before I get into it with the machine shop. Because one shop I called told me to never go to that shop, but I am on a perpetual budget, so I did anyway, and when I picked up the head, the cam shafts were not even there, so I waited about 4 hours for them to install them and set the timing... 

So it is not far-fetched that the only thing they did was replace the bent valves, and blew off or forgot the rest of the procedure necessary when you bring a head to a machine shop... I still find it hard to believe this milky oil is a result of any work that I did, so just eliminating variables.

But you *do not know* how much I appreciate your help and input any of you guys... Thanks again.

**Worst case scenario*, I remove the head again, maybe get into an argument with the machine shop, demand they re-inspect it, "skim" it, etc., maybe replace the interior turbo with the spindle and propellor ( I cannot even get the three bolts loose that connects the turbo to exhaust manifold.) Then get a couple people to help me carefully lower the head down on to a new head gasket.

But I did all of that fairly carefully. It can't be THAT sensitive, assuming the machine shop did their part... 

And _still_, nothing that's not totally obvious, that we have discussed in this thread, would create that milky oil, other than a complete interior head gasket failure... zero leaks around exterior of head gasket, or any gasket for that matter.


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> But... It was like that and operating perfectly... I only improved it? Keep in mind, I am aware these fixes are not perfect, I am not wealthy, I was planning on coming back to it, my #1 priority is just getting the car running and major leak fixed.


You cannot change the weight of the blades, they are balanced at 100,000 RPM.. you also put thinners in, which may get past the seals, and potentially getting dirt onto the seals inside the CHRA or tighten up the locking nuts. 

Some of your approach to your beautiful car, is like a bull in a China shop.. 

I doubt the turbo is making the oil milky, although it would have got everywhere now. 

If you leave the sump plug off and fill the coolant up to the top, does any water drip out the sump? You could maybe try and adapt an eazibleed kit to slightly pressurise the coolant system (you will need to connect up the other pipes...)

If no coolant is obviously disappearing into the sump head etc... then get it back together..


My advice is to replace the turbo oil feed pipe (you know it's damaged).. when are you going to be able to properly bolt down the cams?

After that has been done, and everything is back together..

Drain the remaining oil / gloop..

Drain the coolant, if it is new and not contaminated (keep and filter it, to re-use) don't use tap water on its own, it boils at 100 °C this becomes highly pressurised. 

Ensure everything is properly back together, add some cheap (but fully synthetic) engine oil and an engine flush additive. Put in the coolant. Unplug the fuse to the fuel pump. Let the engine turn over for 30 seconds or so (in 3 or 4 ignition on / offs) - the oil pump should circulate the oil to the VVT (if fitted) , cam shafts / lifters and turbo. 

Check oil and coolant levels top up if necessary.

If no obvious leaks then, start and run the engine keeping an eye on coolant and oil levels / colour. If okay let it come up to temperature, drop down when thermostat opens then back up to temperature. 

Switch off and let it cool down, check levels colour again. If all good then return to normal temperature and then remove the oil and flush and refill with real oil.

If the oil immediately turns milky again, you can do a leak down test and that will highlight if there's head cracks, head / block warps.
When I had my head cleaned and skimmed / repaired, I only gave a stripped head to them and they pressure tested it to confirmed no cracks. I made sure the block was corrected cleaned. If your car overheated when the water pump broke, is it possible the block has a crack which is somehow leaking one way. 


By the way... what is this? Part of the oil filter housing?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> You cannot change the weight of the blades, they are balanced at 100,000 RPM.. you also put thinners in, which may get past the seals, and potentially getting dirt onto the seals inside the CHRA or tighten up the locking nuts.
> 
> Some of your approach to your beautiful car, is like a bull in a China shop..
> 
> I doubt the turbo is making the oil milky, although it would have got everywhere now.
> 
> If you leave the sump plug off and fill the coolant up to the top, does any water drip out the sump? You could maybe try and adapt an eazibleed kit to slightly pressurise the coolant system (you will need to connect up the other pipes...)
> 
> If no coolant is obviously disappearing into the sump head etc... then get it back together..
> 
> 
> My advice is to replace the turbo oil feed pipe (you know it's damaged).. when are you going to be able to properly bolt down the cams?
> 
> After that has been done, and everything is back together..
> 
> Drain the remaining oil / gloop..
> 
> Drain the coolant, if it is new and not contaminated (keep and filter it, to re-use) don't use tap water on its own, it boils at 100 °C this becomes highly pressurised.
> 
> Ensure everything is properly back together, add some cheap (but fully synthetic) engine oil and an engine flush additive. Put in the coolant. Unplug the fuse to the fuel pump. Let the engine turn over for 30 seconds or so (in 3 or 4 ignition on / offs) - the oil pump should circulate the oil to the VVT (if fitted) , cam shafts / lifters and turbo.
> 
> Check oil and coolant levels top up if necessary.
> 
> If no obvious leaks then, start and run the engine keeping an eye on coolant and oil levels / colour. If okay let it come up to temperature, drop down when thermostat opens then back up to temperature.
> 
> Switch off and let it cool down, check levels colour again. If all good then return to normal temperature and then remove the oil and flush and refill with real oil.
> 
> If the oil immediately turns milky again, you can do a leak down test and that will highlight if there's head cracks, head / block warps.
> When I had my head cleaned and skimmed / repaired, I only gave a stripped head to them and they pressure tested it to confirmed no cracks. I made sure the block was corrected cleaned. If your car overheated when the water pump broke, is it possible the block has a crack which is somehow leaking one way.
> 
> 
> By the way... what is this? Part of the oil filter housing?
> 
> View attachment 490580


Thank you Stuart. This is exactly the type of information I am looking for... *depending *on and desperately searching for. Most shops will not even work on this car and my VW mechanic is sick of me I am totally depressed, have my entire existence invested in this, but was walking down the street today and thought, "What would my German, 23 year Navy retired Chief Electronics Lieutenant combat veteran Stepdad (who taught me everything I know) do? He would slow down, not even allow it to affect him, and figure it out. He would spend an hour on the phone with the machine shop if necessary. Do it all over again, whatever it takes. You simply figure it out.

*China shop statement* I admit that. I am so sick of this. I want to get back to just driving and polishing it And am also on an extreme budget. I often need to cut corners and use my best judgement to simply get by, maybe come back to it, and am just now realizing how delicate and precise you have to be.
*The turbo:* The turbo blade tips were slightly chipped, and the spindle had some play, I merely took it all apart and cleaned it out, slightly sanded them, trying to smooth the edges until I came back to it. Any aftermarket turbo companies do not even answer their phone, so since it was working before, I just decided to re-install it for now. My primary goal is to identify and repair the main issue, severe oil leak and timing and just get the engine running.
*Coolant out of the oil pan plug:* I just tested this moments ago, zero coolant/fluid coming out of the oil pan plug when I fill it up with the plug out. The only fluid comes out of the two lines here and it is crystal clear.
*Thought:* The little scuff I caused on the outer corner of the head gasket... there are no exterior head gasket leaks, I did the best I could by myself, torqued the head bolts perfectly according to specs, so the interior seals of the head gasket are even less likely to be the cause of a leak like this.
*Cam bearing caps and bolts:* I can do that right now. That's the least of my concerns. I have the three stripped ones "snug", but am going to put a coil in those three holes and do them all again correctly in the proper sequence and torque once I get a new chain tensioner, which one guide pole broke off and I need to replace.
*Overheating:* Nothing overheated when the water pump broke. I simply allowed to run a little too long and caused more physical damage and bent valves, but no major overheating.
*"Part of the oil filter housing?"*: That is a plug on the right side of the oil cooler, that I need to replace, because just realized that it is moire than likely not making contact, and wondered if it had anything to do with the milky oil output.
And people wonder why I haven't even thought about anything else for a year Takes an hour to even write this stuff down

And I have about 5X as many photos on my phone as I have uploaded. I think I'll upload them to Flickr and categorize them. This is valuable information.

(And if anyone needs a website redesign, please contact me

Thanks again.
Scott


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Thank you Stuart. This is exactly the type of information I am looking for... *depending *on and desperately searching for. Most shops will not even work on this car and my VW mechanic is sick of me I am totally depressed, have my entire existence invested in this, but was walking down the street today and thought, "What would my German, 23 year Navy retired Chief Electronics Lieutenant combat veteran Stepdad (who taught me everything I know) do? He would slow down, not even allow it to affect him, and figure it out. He would spend an hour on the phone with the machine shop if necessary. Do it all over again, whatever it takes. You simply figure it out.
> 
> *China shop statement* I admit that. I am so sick of this. I want to get back to just driving and polishing it And am also on an extreme budget. I often need to cut corners and use my best judgement to simply get by, maybe come back to it, and am just now realizing how delicate and precise you have to be.
> *The turbo:* The turbo blade tips were slightly chipped, and the spindle had some play, I merely took it all apart and cleaned it out, slightly sanded them, trying to smooth the edges until I came back to it. Any aftermarket turbo companies do not even answer their phone, so since it was working before, I just decided to re-install it for now. My primary goal is to identify and repair the main issue, severe oil leak and timing and just get the engine running.
> *Coolant out of the oil pan plug:* I just tested this moments ago, zero coolant/fluid coming out of the oil pan plug when I fill it up with the plug out. The only fluid comes out of the two lines here and it is crystal clear.
> *Thought:* The little scuff I caused on the outer corner of the head gasket... there are no exterior head gasket leaks, I did the best I could by myself, torqued the head bolts perfectly according to specs, so the interior seals of the head gasket are even less likely to be the cause of a leak like this.
> *Cam bearing caps and bolts:* I can do that right now. That's the least of my concerns. I have the three stripped ones "snug", but am going to put a coil in those three holes and do them all again correctly in the proper sequence and torque once I get a new chain tensioner, which one guide pole broke off and I need to replace.
> *Overheating:* Nothing overheated when the water pump broke. I simply allowed to run a little too long and caused more physical damage and bent valves, but no major overheating.
> *"Part of the oil filter housing?"*: That is a plug on the right side of the oil cooler, that I need to replace, because just realized that it is moire than likely not making contact, and wondered if it had anything to do with the milky oil output.
> And people wonder why I haven't even thought about anything else for a year Takes an hour to even write this stuff down
> 
> And I have about 5X as many photos on my phone as I have uploaded. I think I'll upload them to Flickr and categorize them. This is valuable information.
> 
> (And if anyone needs a website redesign, please contact me
> 
> Thanks again.
> Scott


Also... Just realized upon some research that I probably need to remove everything and the manifold gasket... again, to even reach and remove the upper banjo bolt to replace the turbo oil feed line. I have never been able to remove the three turbo to manifold bolts, they are stripped and no matter what I do I cannot loosen or remove them. So instead I just had to separate the head from the manifold and turbo. But now looks like, that I *MUST *figure out how to remove and replace those top three absolutely rusted shut turbo bolts, in order to simply access the top banjo bolt and replace the turbo oil feed return line.

*If you do not ever hear from me for a couple weeks at a time, please call my local mental hospital and check on me    *


----------



## davebowk

You either drill the bolts out (not easy) or remove the head, manifold and turbo together. Then you can set about removing them bolts or replace the turbo and manifold.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> You either drill the bolts out (not easy) or remove the head, manifold and turbo together. Then you can set about removing them bolts or replace the turbo and manifold.


I tried all of that Decided to just clean and assemble it all back together as one piece


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> You either drill the bolts out (not easy) or remove the head, manifold and turbo together. Then you can set about removing them bolts or replace the turbo and manifold.


I need to heat/torch and extract those three stripped turbo bolts, once and for all, to even access the upper turbo oil feed line banjo bolt, no matter what I do: detach the exhaust manifold from the head, whatever... before I can even _*discuss *_doing a single thing else.

Then follow Stuart's instructions above.

This car is earning its title of Diablito III. I joke that it is cursed. Diablito I took me across Mexico for two years. Diablito II to Alaska and back. Now Diablito III has cost me everything I own.

But I'll get it


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> I need to heat/torch and extract those three stripped turbo bolts


Have you got the correct E14 bit for those turbo bolts?


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> Have you got the correct E14 bit for those turbo bolts?


Yes, they are just stripped, and rusted shut, a common problem on any forum topic, and thank you for your input...

I have even tried to hammer a smaller size on them... etc., Did everything except a torch, which looks like is mandatory to figure out this time. Tried PB Blaster, hammering the bolts with a punch, everything except heat...

That was the original reason I had to go through so much trouble in the first place. And now, I think it is impossible to access the upper turbo banjo bolt for the turbo oil feed line to replace it, without removing those three bolts, which I know I need tro do anyway.

Good times!! (Just kidding.)


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Yes, they are just stripped, and rusted shut, a common problem on any forum topic, and thank you for your input...
> 
> I have even tried to hammer a smaller size on them... etc., Did everything except a torch, which looks like is mandatory to figure out this time. Tried PB Blaster, hammering the bolts with a punch, everything except heat...
> 
> That was the original reason I had to go through so much trouble in the first place. And now, I think it is impossible to access the upper turbo banjo bolt for the turbo oil feed line to replace it, without removing those three bolts, which I know I need tro do anyway.
> 
> Good times!! (Just kidding.)





scottatx said:


> Yes, they are just stripped, and rusted shut, a common problem on any forum topic, and thank you for your input...
> 
> I have even tried to hammer a smaller size on them... etc., Did everything except a torch, which looks like is mandatory to figure out this time. Tried PB Blaster, hammering the bolts with a punch, everything except heat...
> 
> That was the original reason I had to go through so much trouble in the first place. And now, I think it is impossible to access the upper turbo banjo bolt for the turbo oil feed line to replace it, without removing those three bolts, which I know I need tro do anyway.
> 
> Good times!! (Just kidding.)


And yes... I even tried bashing them out with a sledgehammer, breaking the rusted shut bolts... I could not get it.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> You either drill the bolts out (not easy) or remove the head, manifold and turbo together. Then you can set about removing them bolts or replace the turbo and manifold.


Agreed I had everything off, tried to hammer those three bolts with a hammer... multiple days soaking them with PB Blaster, trying multiple sizes of sockets, hammering in different sizes... they are just simply rusted shut. A common issue. Most shops around here will not even help me. I need to F'ing drill them out or something, heat, torch, whatever it takes.

Then I can access the turbo oil feed line and replace it and go from there, and follow Stuart's instructions above.

Friggin' crazy

I have been doing something like this, one way or the other, for an entire year, lol.


----------



## davebowk

Yep TT's are fun


----------



## fire88

Hi mate 
How about welding those bolts to something then crack them loose
At least I had done mine. 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## David C

fire88 said:


> Hi mate
> How about welding those bolts to something then *crack them loose*


With a socket and a breaker bar, not a sledgehammer...


----------



## scottatx

Lol.

You guys give me hope.

Fire88's sig is enough to keep me going...

Funny thing is, is that I actually know exactly what to do... in all areas, the second time

But I can't kid myself, it's still depressing... 

I am going back and following Stuart's steps... right now actually.


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> With a socket and a breaker bar, not a sledgehammer...


That was _hyperbole_. I tried... every tool that exists, except heat.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> Yep TT's are fun


I get five years out of it at a time. THIS time, I shall not race BMWs with such vigor... These cars are little precious babies


----------



## scottatx

Talked to the owner of the machine shop where I took the head... He said that they did a valve job, and planed the surface to be level... did everything necessary for it to be installed in the car.

First thing he said was "Did you use the copper spray?" But 90% of what I read said to not use any sealants or the copper spray... So I used nothing. Victor Reinz head gasket, with zero anything on it.


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Talked to the owner of the machine shop where I took the head... He said that they did a valve job, and planed the surface to be level... did everything necessary for it to be installed in the car.
> 
> First thing he said was "Did you use the copper spray?" But 90% of what I read said to not use any sealants or the copper spray... So I used nothing. Victor Reinz head gasket, with zero anything on it.



Going to be hell just getting to the feed line at the turbo to change the line.

Guess I'll just consider the past 8-9 months practice.


----------



## StuartDB

You need an 8mm wobble Allen key to get the oil feed line back in, its easy enough to undo once you have the manifold undone... the most difficult is the little 5mm allen bolt holding the oil feed bracket onto the k04.. some hard pipes for the heater matrix are in the way..


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> You need an 8mm wobble Allen key to get the oil feed line back in, its easy enough to undo once you have the manifold undone... the most difficult is the little 5mm allen bolt holding the oil feed bracket onto the k04.. some hard pipes for the heater matrix are in the way..




I have all of that stuff removed... working on it now. I think I'm just going to use this opportunity, to remove the exhaust manifold bolts, again, just take the whole turbo off with the manifold attached... and go pay someone to torch and break off those three rusted shut bolts. At some point I want to replace the turbo, so might as well attack that once and for all, and I think you even _must _remove those three M14 bolts to even access the banjo bolt of the top oil feed line.

I'm going to follow your last post Stuart, once I replace that line... But what do you think? In layman's terms? As far as I know... the machine shop did their part, have the head gasket perfect, and rear main seal perfect...

Think I should take out the head gasket bolts, and inspect the head gasket itself, look for oil/coolant leaks/damage in the interior areas? But I think I did that successfully. Just going to follow your steps 

I mean... If having all of the hoses and lines disconnected... cannot produce that milky oil mixture... then it has to be the head gasket... right? What else could it be??


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> and I think you even _must _remove those three M14 bolts to even access the banjo bolt of the top oil feed line.


They are special M10 bolts with an E14 head.


----------



## silverbug

David C said:


> They are special M10 bolts with an E14 head.
> View attachment 490719


These bolts that came off my 2003 BAM are titanium, and so too were the brand new bolts from Audi that went back in when I had the exhaust manifold to turbo gasket renewed.


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> I have all of that stuff removed... working on it now. I think I'm just going to use this opportunity, to remove the exhaust manifold bolts, again, just take the whole turbo off with the manifold attached... and go pay someone to torch and break off those three rusted shut bolts. At some point I want to replace the turbo, so might as well attack that once and for all, and I think you even _must _remove those three M14 bolts to even access the banjo bolt of the top oil feed line.
> 
> I'm going to follow your last post Stuart, once I replace that line... But what do you think? In layman's terms? As far as I know... the machine shop did their part, have the head gasket perfect, and rear main seal perfect...
> 
> Think I should take out the head gasket bolts, and inspect the head gasket itself, look for oil/coolant leaks/damage in the interior areas? But I think I did that successfully. Just going to follow your steps
> 
> I mean... If having all of the hoses and lines disconnected... cannot produce that milky oil mixture... then it has to be the head gasket... right? What else could it be??


I don't think you'll manage to get the manifold off the head with the turbo still connected to the manifold there's 2 nuts on studs which are very difficult to reach... if you are going that far... get a Chinafold manifold then you'll never struggle to undo those 3 bolts again... simple 17mm stainless bolts...


----------



## scottatx

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I had to stop attacking it every day and night and step away from everything. Yes... I don't think I will take the exhaust manifold or head off again until I once and for all get those top three M14 turbo bolts off, and just change the oil feed line. I think I've decided to finally get my own torch, or find a welder to weld something to them as mentioned and illustrated above. I could never do that so just took it all off together, brought it inside and took it all apart. That is when I kinked a hole in the turbo feed line.

So when I saw that after putting everything back together, to test it, I tried just wrapping that hole with a section of hose and zip ties, just to test the pressure and see if the sputtering was less drastic, try to further pinpoint, etc. The milky oil was squirting out of the feed line hose temporary testing fix with intense pressure, saw that and shut the car off within seconds.

So a couple thoughts I had after sleeping on it and forgetting about it... Are... It would seem like, if I had the rear main seal in wrong and that was the source of the huge leak, that there would be oil and liquid all over the flywheel when looking through the top and bottom holes of the bell housing. That was perfectly dry. And I have gotten pretty good and knowledgeable about the timing, and even set the camshafts and chain correctly with the notches, and the correct number of chain links, etc., all factory marks on the sprockets and everywhere are all perfectly lined up... so fairly certain that I have the timing right, my rear main seal work is good, and I did not destroy or do anything detrimental to the head gasket when I put the head back on.

And it seems that if the rear main seal had a huge leak, that there would not even be enough pressure to feed oil up through the turbo feed line, to produce the amount of pressure that was coming out of its hole/leak, and of course oil not even getting to the turbo.

So _maybe_, hopefully... Remove the three M14 turbo bolts finally. Replace the turbo oil feed line. Inspect the turbo again for hairline cracks and the seal/spindle of the turbo itself somehow... Put that back together, hook all of the hoses and flange back up on the right side of the engine, flush the engine, fill with oil and coolant again, and start it again.

Maybe that is enough to remove all leaks, have correct pressure for the engine not to sputter making you think it is the timing... and actually run correctly?


----------



## mcak1964

At this i would have bought a second hand unit and fired it in !


----------



## fire88

mcak1964 said:


> At this i would have bought a second hand unit and fired it in !


I don't know about you, but I would not buy another one, I prefer to get it fixed and enjoy the achievement. 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> I don't know about you, but I would not buy another one, I prefer to get it fixed and enjoy the achievement.
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


Yes And when this started, I thought I was just going to install an ECS Tuning timing belt kit and be done with it. But I bent 8 valves, so that started my long nightmare.

This my car, not a hobby. I'm on a rock bottom budget too. Now looking back, I bet the rear main seal was never even leaking, because there would have been oil all inside the bell housing, flywheel area, etc. I just replaced the rear main seal based on a guess from a VW mechanic phone call, because I had not had oil in it for a while.

Now I think (hope) my huge oil leaks when I started the car twice now, came from the hole in the turbo oil feed line all along, that you cannot see because it is braided.

And the oil itself that leaked out, only was milky and tan like that during the last half, of the most recent test start, that I only left the car running for about 10 seconds, and what had changed is that I had the flange and hoses disconnected from the right side of the engine. Before that the oil was clear and good that came out. I even drained it and reused it after the first time it leaked out, of the turbo line, which I thought that I did the rear main seal wrong.

So maybe, (My next steps and attempt) if I replace the turbo line, and hook the flange and hoses back up, everything, the car will run correctly finally. I keep trying and hoping. That will be one glorious day when it starts and actually runs. What a frigging test drive that will be

I need to check out your photos. Here's mine. And... I fixed and replaced about 200 other things while I have been figuring out the main issue, brand new sport clutch, single mass flywheel, shifter, all kinds of stuff. So... I gotta get this fixed and running if it kills me.

Does anyone agree with this possibility? New turbo line and everything hooked back up, eliminates milky oil and sputtering?


----------



## fire88

I have been there and done the whole rebuild thing myself. 

Remember that you only can do one thing at a time, so you can get the main issue fixed then move on to see what else to be fixed. 

Just a small step at the time and don't over do it, which will kill the interest and cause frustration. 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


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## scottatx

fire88 said:


> I have been there and done the whole rebuild thing myself.
> 
> Remember that you only can do one thing at a time, so you can get the main issue fixed then move on to see what else to be fixed.
> 
> Just a small step at the time and don't over do it, which will kill the interest and cause frustration.
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk



Wise advice, lol, exactly what my mechanic neighbor said, who avoids me now I have an obsessive mind, and my car is pretty much my girlfriend... I did exactly the opposite... I fixed and cleaned and rebuilt any and everything I could find, that I had been wanting to do for years, along the way toward getting the engine to run again.

So I have been doing 20 things at a time, for almost a full year. Every single day, and night.

I have definitely overdone it. But I have been on an extreme budget and time constraint... I shouldn't even be working on it where it is parked. My situation is much much different than the typical TT enthusiast. Now I have blown every penny and lost pretty much everything I own, just trying to fix my car. I fixed all the other stuff in the meantime, while I was making the money for the larger stuff. I had already spent $6,000 on a new head, valve job, etc. in California once before, so I was trying to save money this time.

Now I just need to get back to it, and I'm praying that my rear main seal installation, head gasket, the condition of the head from the machine shop, timing... hoping all of that work that I have spent countless hours on is good... and that I have finally found the main problem all along, the hole in the turbo feed line. Replace that. Attach all the flanges and hoses. And hope it runs correctly finally.

Thanks


----------



## fire88

I can't believe that you spent so much money on the head and valves, 

I would get a used head and valves, there are so many different types of 1.8 turbo sharing the same head.

Anyway, it's your choice. But it's just a toy to me, to fix it makes my day better, it's not another way around. 

You have to balance it. 

Enjoy it. 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> I can't believe that you spent so much money on the head and valves,
> 
> I would get a used head and valves, there are so many different types of 1.8 turbo sharing the same head.
> 
> Anyway, it's your choice. But it's just a toy to me, to fix it makes my day better, it's not another way around.
> 
> You have to balance it.
> 
> Enjoy it.
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk



Well the head, valve job, making the surface level, etc., everything they did to it at the machine shop, replace eight bent valves, etc., was only $350 itself.

It's my favorite toy, my girlfriend, my wife, my family... it's everything to me As well as simply my everyday vehicle.


----------



## scottatx

Might as well add to the conversation before I Google it... Probably stupid questions.

I'm assuming there is absolutely no way to cut and splice the kink out of the braided turbo oil feed line right?
I was rushing and frustrated and touched a wrench to the positive battery terminal, to which there is a Kicker subwoofer power line attached, with fuse, and large main battery fuse... big spark, now zero power to anything on the car, battery shows 12.7V, physically looked at all of the fuses on top of the battery and in the fusebox, all look good. Any suggestions or immediate identifiers?


----------



## scottatx

See, big hole, under the braid, right here... When I had a test section of tube zip-tied over it as tight as I could get it, just for testing, it squirted out of the side with the pressure of a diamond cutting water laser, lol (best example I can think of...)

And... My top three turbo bolts aren't even M14. I think they are M12. I even tried drilling a notch to try to crack it off as you can see... But my turbo bolts are not M14, and the skingle turbo bracket bolt as well that ECS Tuning sent me, and is correct for my VIN #, is way too large as well. So not sure if someone replaced it or what previously... 2001 TT quattro 225hp Roadster Convertible AMU eng. code. But as you can see the bolts are stripped, and an Audi mechanic told me the only thing to do is literally break them in half and drill the rest out. But I am looking for a mobile welder, to try a torch first, then weld something on them to turn better, or whatever he can do to get them off.



*My turbo bolts are M10.*


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> And... My top three turbo bolts aren't even M14. I think they are M12. I even tried drilling a notch to try to crack it off as you can see... But my turbo bolts are not M14, and the skingle turbo bracket bolt as well that ECS Tuning sent me, and is correct for my VIN #, is way too large as well. So not sure if someone replaced it or what previously... 2001 TT quattro 225hp Roadster Convertible AMU eng. code. But as you can see the bolts are stripped, and an Audi mechanic told me the only thing to do is literally break them in half and drill the rest out. But I am looking for a mobile welder, to try a torch first, then weld something on them to turn better, or whatever he can do to get them off.
> 
> 
> 
> *My turbo bolts are M10.*


Several times in this thread I've corrected you when you've said "M14".
The turbo bolts are special Titanium M10 bolts with an *E*14 head.
You said you had the correct *E*14 tool for them, you probably haven't as you're still saying M14.


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> See, big hole, under the braid, right here... When I had a test section of tube zip-tied over it as tight as I could get it, just for testing, it squirted out of the side with the pressure of a diamond cutting water laser, lol (best example I can think of...)
> 
> And... My top three turbo bolts aren't even M14. I think they are M12. I even tried drilling a notch to try to crack it off as you can see... But my turbo bolts are not M14, and the skingle turbo bracket bolt as well that ECS Tuning sent me, and is correct for my VIN #, is way too large as well. So not sure if someone replaced it or what previously... 2001 TT quattro 225hp Roadster Convertible AMU eng. code. But as you can see the bolts are stripped, and an Audi mechanic told me the only thing to do is literally break them in half and drill the rest out. But I am looking for a mobile welder, to try a torch first, then weld something on them to turn better, or whatever he can do to get them off.





David C said:


> Several times in this thread I've corrected you when you've said "M14".
> The turbo bolts are special Titanium M10 bolts with an *E*14 head.
> You said you had the correct *E*14 tool for them, you probably haven't as you're still saying M14.


Oh man you are so correct, I apologize. That issue was gaining speed as a priority, so I scanned certain paragraphs quickly... I am under so much pressure in many areas, it's like a battle. I forget that I pawned my set of sockets with the E14 in it,. which I had also attempted and exhausted its possibilities, looking for a mobile welder right now.

I have not even thought about those three bolts until just tonight, after a year of work... Those were the very first things I tried to remove and are rusted shut. I used an E14. Just late;ly aI had just been 1/2 into that one issue, and M14 was stuck in my mind... Either way I tried everything. I gotta get a welder to come by and torch them or weld something to them as people said above...


----------



## scottatx

To me... It's impossible to do one thing at a time. You have to plan ahead, make parts lists, etc. So while looking for a turbo line, I am trying to trace the problem I caused by touching a wrench to the positive battery terminal and big spark and no power. This top fuse has always been like this but works. I think I'd better replace it. I see no blown fuses but going to change that large one anyway and go from there. 

Also checking the camshaft and chain timing I set before I order a new chain tensioner.

Just visualizing this stuff while I look for a mobile welder to remove the three turbo bolts, replace the turbo line, attach everything on the right side of the engine, and hope the milky oil is gone, no leaks and runs correctly and timed. Then if it is still sputtering and any milky leaks, etc., just have to go from there... But I have a funny feeling...,


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> This top fuse has always been like this but works. I think I'd better replace it. I see no blown fuses but going to change that large one anyway and go from there.


That melted socket is for the radiator fan fuse (30A). It is a common issue.
The one next to it (the middle of those three) is for the ABS.


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> That melted socket is for the radiator fan fuse (30A). It is a common issue.
> The one next to it (the middle of those three) is for the ABS.


I wonder what I blew when I accidentally touched a wrench to the pos battery terminal and caused a big spark and blew power to the car, yet battery has 12.7 V. I just went out and re-seated the ECU plugs, inspected every fuse visually and all looks normal. Getting my multimeter tomorrow.


----------



## scottatx

Aaaaaand boom goes the dynamite...

Glad I found a turbo line that wasn't $400.


----------



## scottatx

I wonder if anyone can tell by these images if I have the camshafts and timing chain set correctly. Just going over everything... getting a new chain tensioner soon, since one of the two vertical guide poles is broken off. Just wondering if I have the camshafts timed correctly. One video I followed said that it's normal for one to be off like that, the #29 one on the right in my image.


----------



## StuartDB

I cannot see the notches and the rollers in the same picture. You can get right hand notch in place and jam the chain to stop the cams relaxing the notch back past.

It needs to be 16 rollers. 

*







*


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> I cannot see the notches and the rollers in the same picture. You can get right hand notch in place and jam the chain to stop the cams relaxing the notch back past.
> 
> It needs to be 16 rollers.
> 
> *
> View attachment 491077
> *


Thanks. I have to do it again anyway when I get the new tensioner, just checking my work... But looks like none of the green and blue paint marks that are already on the chain have much to do with anything, as long as you get it like it is illustrated in your diagram here.

The images I just posted, is at when the cam shaft and crank shaft are both perfectly lined up with the factory notches in the flywheel hole, cam shaft sprocket and crank shaft sprocket notches and marks.

Just researching and preparing. I'm determined to get it right this time. Everything.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> I cannot see the notches and the rollers in the same picture. You can get right hand notch in place and jam the chain to stop the cams relaxing the notch back past.
> 
> It needs to be 16 rollers.
> 
> *
> View attachment 491077
> *


Six or seven images in one image with the rollers... I need to do it all again anyway, just practicing. 3rd time's a charm.


----------



## StuartDB

I've seen quite a few cars with 1 or both posts broken, I think it is where the compression tool isn't used properly.. not sure it needs replacing though....


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> Six or seven images in one image with the rollers... I need to do it all again anyway, just practicing. 3rd time's a charm.


None of those show the notches and the rollers. If the notches are lined up with the arrows I only count 15 rollers


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> I've seen quite a few cars with 1 or both posts broken, I think it is where the compression tool isn't used properly.. not sure it needs replacing though....



Cool... I wasn't going to replace it but thought I would finish it off following all the rules... Gathering knowledge right now... About to go out and redo it. I do need the tensioner tool though possibly. I usually just press it down with my hand. But this time I am just doing it from scratch, and insert the two new seals, then make sure the chain is as your diagram posted above. Thank you.

Then just get my new turbo line in 3 days... in the meantime find a mobile welder to crack off the three top turbo bolts, replace line, inspect turbo, re-attach everything and start it.

I take it... to confirm... that the intake is the one closest to the dashboard.


----------



## StuartDB

No... intake valves are next to the intake manifold and exhaust valves are next to the exhaust manifold..

It's a bit awkward to get the intake cam notch aligned with the arrow as that is leaning on a cam, and you cannot use the cam position sensor nut to wind it back because it'll just undo the nut 

The manifold bolts are easier to undo if you get them hot, but a blow torch will not make it hot enough.


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> I take it... to confirm... that the intake is the one closest to the dashboard.


NO 🤦‍♂️

Exhaust is closest to the dashboard (it has the exhaust manifold & Turbo attached to that side...)

Inlet is closest to the front of the car (it has the inlet manifold attached to that side...)


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> NO 🤦‍♂️
> 
> Exhaust is closest to the dashboard (it has the exhaust manifold & Turbo attached to that side...)
> 
> Inlet is closest to the front of the car (it has the inlet manifold attached to that side...)



Haha glad I asked. As usual... I spend about 3-4 to 20 hours in research simply to prepare, to go work on this god-forsaken car

I have about 30 years of heavy industrial electronics experience, my Navy stepdad just taught me how to figure stuff out... But I am always totally lost on the big picture of how all of this stuff works. And with this car, it may take 30 hours, literally, to verify and confirm one tiny detail.


----------



## StuartDB

Sometimes, I think you're just on a wind up..


----------



## David C

StuartDB said:


> Sometimes, I think you're just on a wind up..


It does read like a massive troll post....!!!


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Sometimes, I think you're just on a wind up..



No... I'm just extremely mechanical, but I'm not a mechanic. And I'm on a time deadline, and extreme budget. I just figure stuff out.

I mean yeah... I don't live in England and have three or four of these laying around for a hobby. This is my car. 

Trolls don't have 300 photos of their work.

I have no idea what intake and exhaust actually mean, (well I have an idea, hyperbole I read and follow step by step concise instructions, then make up my own that are better. But I can see that these require much more knowledge than that. But I'm getting it done Definitely been wound up for a whole year. Crazy. Almost there, hopefully.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Sometimes, I think you're just on a wind up..



And can take every part of electronics found in a coal-fired power plant apart and put it back together again, but I don't know how an engine works, or instantly relate to these terms... I'm a web developer. But I can definitely figure it out. With your help Thanks again.


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> And can take every part of electronics found in a coal-fired power plant apart and put it back together again, but I don't know how an engine works, or instantly relate to these terms... I'm a web developer. But I can definitely figure it out. With your help Thanks again.





StuartDB said:


> Sometimes, I think you're just on a wind up..


I confirm everything 3 or 4 times. Two videos I watched started the chain on the opposite side as your diagram. All of this is not precise. You need a group/set of facts then choose the majority. Not even sure if following the Bentley manual would be more precise and clear. 

I'm getting it done. I am not a seasoned TT expert... I'm just trying to fix my car that I love. That's what this forum is for


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> It does read like a massive troll post....!!!


That's strange. Must be a cultural divide or something.

I am obviously just trying to fix an engine.


----------



## scottatx

Saw my mechanic neighbor this morning... He said, instantly, that he suspects that there was water buildup and condensation when I had no oil in it, that created the most-recent milky tan oil... So that is slightly good news.


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> That's strange. Must be a cultural divide or something.
> 
> I am obviously just trying to fix an engine.


It's because you rebuilt an engine and say things like 'you don't know what side has the intake' 

And say "you tested running the engine without the cams properly bolted to the head..."


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> It's because you rebuilt an engine and say things like 'you don't know what side has the intake'
> 
> And say "you tested running the engine without the cams properly bolted to the head..."



They are all "properly bolted" right now... 95% trustworthy. Enough to start the car for 10 seconds, better than that probably. I just know they are stripped, so is on my list of about 15 things to finalize, when I could just try to get the car operating, then I have stuff to come back to and make perfect.

I asked the cam chain question because there are discrepancies online, and I needed to 100% confirm which side to start as "1" on in your diagram.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> It's because you rebuilt an engine and say things like 'you don't know what side has the intake'
> 
> And say "you tested running the engine without the cams properly bolted to the head..."


To someone that lives and breathes this I'm sure I probably sound like an idiot

If we talked about Web Usability or catching King Cobras on mushrooms you might feel the same way


----------



## scottatx

Well I'd say that's a pretty perfect camshaft and chain setup myself...

And when I created a big spark accidentally and lost all power... It's that 2nd fuse that broke in half, shown in the same image linked above.

Things are lookin' up.


----------



## scottatx

Just remembered that it's all totally worth it


----------



## scottatx

desertstorm said:


> The rear main seal is a PTFE seal so should NOT be oiled at all when it is fitted other wise it will leak. The seal comes with a white cap which is a guide that needs to be used to fit the seal. If you dont put the guide over the end of the crank when the seal is fitted the lip will fold over and will leak. If you fit the seal with oil it will leak.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Changing Audi TT 1.8T Rear Main Seal - radare.net
> 
> 
> Changing the rear main seal and oil pan on my 2001 Audi TT Quattro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> radare.net



Hmm... I had it laying on the table in a bag for a few weeks, opened it and looked at it the first day. Then I noticed the sticker that said don't open until installation. So I just fine-sprayed a mist of water into the bag and sealed it for moisture.

Then I think I lightly rubbed motor oil on it a couple of times, wiped it off, just enough to leave a sheen, so it would not become dry and bad.

Who knows that could be enough to destroy everything, with all I have been through But I think the rear main seal is okay actually.


----------



## scottatx

Drilling out five stripped cam bracket holes... Here's another stupid question. Do you absolutely need to use the cam tensioner tool? Never even used that.I pushed it down by hand and changed the half moon and thin gasket there before... just never needed it.

But now being sure... Is that used to do something important other than lower it for you real quick and hold it while you set the shafts correctly?


----------



## David C

scottatx said:


> Hmm... I had it laying on the table in a bag for a few weeks, opened it and looked at it the first day. Then I noticed the sticker that said don't open until installation. *So I just fine-sprayed a mist of water into the bag and sealed it for moisture.*


It is exactly that type of thing that makes this look like an elaborate joke...!


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> It is exactly that type of thing that makes this look like an elaborate joke...!


And once again... I'm just being certain. This is the final stretch possibly. I mean, I know what it does. I just didn't use it.
So now just making sure. I'm thorough. Not wasting dozens of hours of my life pretending I am working on a car? Lol. That sounds more ludicrous than if it _was _a joke...

I have it all done. Just confirming stuff, in layman's terms. Short concise sentences in layman's terms, getting a lock on a step or task that you can depend on 100%.


----------



## David C

Spraying water onto an oil seal isn't a great idea.


----------



## scottatx

David C said:


> Spraying water onto an oil seal isn't a great idea.



Just a few drops, misted in... lol. Just enough to keep the seal from being dry and brittle, which I thought was the entire problem in the first place. Tapping two cam bearing holes and looking for a welder...


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> To someone that lives and breathes this I'm sure I probably sound like an idiot
> 
> If we talked about Web Usability or catching King Cobras on mushrooms you might feel the same way


Lol... I haven't caught King Cobras on mushrooms - I didn't know they did 'shrooms

But I did do my software apprenticeship at BAe dynamics division in 1987 -1989 then worked with thermo-luminessence dosimetry hardware to create a user interface to read doctors and nurses radiation exposure (lithium discs) for a couple of years and have worked with c++ com components with ASP for a Website still in use 25 years later, then c# asp.net and finally Java and Oracle Web Interfaces since about 1995.. what I am glad I am not involved in though is the legislation surrounding 'website accessibility' that's crazy s*it - every item tabable, every item screen readable, every grid header tabable and sortable, every grid cell screen readable... automated high contrast views etc... if that's what you do.. I doth my cap to you...

And have tried a few psychedelics when it was fashionable back in and 80s and early 90s.. including liberty caps and risky Fly
Garrett skin tea..  (it slows your heart to about 30-40 bpm very cold - need to snuggle up in sleeping bags )

But none of that matters... its not a competition dude, we are just trying to help...


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Lol... I haven't caught King Cobras on mushrooms - I didn't know they did 'shrooms
> 
> But I did do my software apprenticeship at BAe dynamics division in 1987 -1989 then worked with thermo-luminessence dosimetry hardware to create a user interface to read doctors and nurses radiation exposure (lithium discs) for a couple of years and have worked with c++ com components with ASP for a Website still in use 25 years later, then c# asp.net and finally Java and Oracle Web Interfaces since about 1995.. what I am glad I am not involved in though is the legislation surrounding 'website accessibility' that's crazy s*it - every item tabable, every item screen readable, every grid header tabable and sortable, every grid cell screen readable... automated high contrast views etc... if that's what you do.. I doth my cap to you...
> 
> And have tried a few psychedelics when it was fashionable back in and 80s and early 90s.. including liberty caps and risky Fly
> Garrett skin tea..  (it slows your heart to about 30-40 bpm very cold - need to snuggle up in sleeping bags )
> 
> But none of that matters... its not a competition dude, we are just trying to help...


Oh no, wasn't competing, I was just saying I'm not an idiot I just talk about auto mechanics in layman's terms because I don't have a full grasp on it a lot of the time.


----------



## scottatx

Just one more 15-step list and seven more products to buy before I test start it again! 

Thinking ahead... I have a feeling (hopefully) that the final conclusion will be, that I did not have the cam shaft notches and chain set perfectly, after loosening it all to replace the half moon gasket, valve cover gasket, etc. I only recently watched a video regarding the 16 rollers and Stuart's diagram confirms that and makes it even more clear. Pretty sure it is perfect now. Going out now to turn the crank a few times and triple check the timing in all areas.

Then... I kinked a hole the turbo oil feed line when I was transporting the head around with the exhaust manifold and turbo attached to it, putting it on a toolbox, propping it up to work on it, etc. I separated the head from the manifold when I took it to the machine shop, but have never been able to crack off those three top turbo bolts.

Which is now my final challenge, hopefully. 100% necessary to get those three bolts off to change the turbo feed line, so looking for a mobile welder.

So I can change the steel line, have a better grasp of the timing now and triple-checking that, put every single thing back together, and hope that moisture buildup in the engine was enough to cause the tan milky oil that came out on the most recent test start.


----------



## scottatx

Okay... Just trying to confirm precisely if the timing is set correctly in all areas... If it is possible to determine with these photos... This is the current state after rotating the bottom crank shaft six times...

First of all, damn I love this car
Notch on the flywheel through the bell housing hole is perfect.
Cam shaft nearest to the front grill starting with #1 roller/chain link, and the green marks from the machine shop match up.
Cam shaft closest to the dash, ending in chain link #16 and notch perfectly centered.
Chain showing #1 through 16 chain links...
Notches on cam shaft sprocket and valve cover now off by one tooth to the right basically.
It is so difficult for me to produce a consistent result with this, that's why I have done it about 90 times.

This time I need to get it right before I start it again, remove the variable of the timing as an issue.

This time, I just started with the cam shaft and the valve cover notch for my initial reference, but when that was perfect, I could not see the notch through the bell housing hole. So I just adjusted the crank shaft slightly, until the flywheel notch through the hole was perfect, as in the image... That is where I'm at now. Any input greatly appreciated.


----------



## scottatx

Okee dokee, lol... Another five or six hours overall analyzing the timing. Getting ready for the new turbo line coming Thursday, got the turbo intake hose off, now just need to find a welder. Called about 15 people and no answer. makes me want to start a mobile welding business.

Now I'm not even sure if the timing is correct. For a guy that needs to physically see the result perfectly, and repeat it many times so it is exactly the same so you can depend on it 100%, this car has been a nightmare.

I turned the crankshaft manually about six or eight times to get everything set and going clockwise, etc., and here is where it's all at right now:

Notch on the flywheel through the bell housing hole.
Camshaft sprocket notch to notch on valve cover.
Intake camshaft closest to grill detail.
Exhaust camshaft closest to dash detail.
Entire chain showing my count of 16 chain pins.
Good diagram I found just now. A video I watched earlier started from #1 on the exhaust (dash) one so I did that.
So whattya think? Is it good to go? Or do I need to do it again? I get it perfect one time, then check it all out, try to perfect it, then the camshaft sprocket to valve cover notch is one tooth off, etc.

I wonder what the Master reference mark is? Depending on if I use the notch on the exhaust shaft itself under the chain, or if I start with the valve cover notch... it is always slightly different. I need a 100% accurate perfectly dependable visual confirmation, that stays exactly the same after I hand-crank it six or eight times... right?


----------



## davebowk

Intake could be a tooth out


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> Intake could be a tooth out


Thanks, going back out here soon.. So I'm quickly assuming I need to... remove all the cam bearing bolts from the intake shaft, lift it up while holding the chain, free it from the chain slightly, and rotate the sprocket one chain link pin to the right, and put it back in... ?


----------



## davebowk

Thats what it looks like yes. Do you have a tensioner tool?
Also mark the positions you want to be inline


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> Thats what it looks like yes. Do you have a tensioner tool?
> Also mark the positions you want to be inline


No I don't have a tensioner tool. In the past I just press it down with my hand which allows the space to do anything in that area... I've never felt the need for a tensioner tool, but I may be completely wrong. I would just press it down by hand, lift the camshaft and rotate it one tooth, allow it to go back down, then apply RTV to the noted areas, wiggle the little edge gasket in there and half moon gasket, then just release it/my hand... (?)


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> Thats what it looks like yes. Do you have a tensioner tool?
> Also mark the positions you want to be inline


Advice taken and implemented. Took off all bearing cap bolts, lifted assembly up slightly, rotated intake cam shaft one tooth clockwise within the chain, re-assembled...

Latest flywheel mark.
Latest camshaft sprocket and valve cover marks.
Intake side new position.
Exhaust side new position.
New 16-count link to link full image.
Still looks a little weird, but then again I have never set the timing correctly and started it successfully. I'm still working on that, 10 months later, lol. (not funny

Taking a break... I guess I should rotate the crank shaft manually six or eight times to settle it all in and then see where all the marks line up.


----------



## davebowk

I think these should be lined up, then 16 rollers to the exhaust cam


----------



## scottatx

I wonder what the odds are of me getting the top three turbo bolts off with a torch and E14 socket only? Or torch and bolt extractor socket...Having a very hard time finding a mobile welder.

Considering how hard it is to even _find _a mobile welder... much less the cost he would charge me... I think I will be forced to buy a torch and a bolt extractor socket, etc. and do it, try it myself.

This oughtta' do it, MAPP torch kit...


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I think these should be lined up, then 16 rollers to the exhaust cam
> 
> 
> View attachment 491267


Cool thanks. Double confirmed... The guy in this video uses your process... I saw another video where they started from the exhaust cam. Well... 5th time's a charm lol... Take 'em out, and be totally accurate this time and start from intake to exhaust.


----------



## fire88

Why bother to get a mobile welder? 
Can you get a Mig welder? Do it yourself then. It's so dirty cheap 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> Why bother to get a mobile welder?
> Can you get a Mig welder? Do it yourself then. It's so dirty cheap
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


Thanks. Little (lot) out of my price range... from what I read a MAPP torch will do the trick. $54 at Home Depot... I'm on an extreme budget.

I'm lucky I haven't gone mentally insane yet. Every single day... for about ten months... I walk out and say to myself "Okay let's wrap this up and get back to work." And here I am, ten months later, still creating parts and tools lists...


----------



## mcak1964

scottatx said:


> Hmm... I had it laying on the table in a bag for a few weeks, opened it and looked at it the first day. Then I noticed the sticker that said don't open until installation. So I just fine-sprayed a mist of water into the bag and sealed it for moisture.
> 
> Then I think I lightly rubbed motor oil on it a couple of times, wiped it off, just enough to leave a sheen, so it would not become dry and bad.
> 
> Who knows that could be enough to destroy everything, with all I have been through But I think the rear main seal is okay actually.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I think these should be lined up, then 16 rollers to the exhaust cam
> 
> 
> View attachment 491267



I'm determined to get it right this time. (Going to try just pasting my images, they never display on these forums.)

Here are my latest cam shaft pics... There is always a discrepancy though... If I _begin_, with the flywheel mark, and it is visible in the center of the bell housing hole... then the marks on the cam shaft and valve cover are off (sprocket mark is about 1/8": off to the right of the valve cover mark), and the mark on the intake cam is off slightly to the right of the bearing cap triangle.

But If I hand-crank the crank shaft six or eight times and stop short... getting the cam sprocket and valve cover perfectly lined up, as well as the intake and exhaust marks perfectly lined up, with 16 rollers in the exact count, and 7 full chain links between them, exactly as in the diagram (only the exhaust mark is not offset as much as in the diagram, they are both perfectly pointed up and meeting the bearing cap arrow exactly... Then all of that seems perfect, except the flywheel notch is not visible. You need to tap the crank shaft mire clockwise a little bit for the flywheel mark to appear in the hole. Then if you get that perfect... the cam shaft sprocket mark and the intake shaft mark are slightly off to the right.

What's the master sequence of marks? Which one is my starting point? Or does all of this look perfect?

*As it is right now:*














































*As it is when I can see the flywheel mark:*









Cam sprocket and valve cover mark off to the right:









Intake cam mark off to the right:


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> Why bother to get a mobile welder?
> Can you get a Mig welder? Do it yourself then. It's so dirty cheap
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


I read one mechanic's reply in another thread... He said he had great luck with a MAP torch, that the MAP fuel was much better than propane or butane, and that he has used it often for bolts like this and works great...

So I was planning on this torch... and just heat it, following some instructions I would confirm... and then using an E14 socket, or maybe I need an extractor socket? and breaker bar...

But I wonder if that is guaranteed to separate and be able to be backed out with these two tools? If not then I would definitely need to find a mobile welder to come by and weld nuts on the bolts and crack them off.


----------



## scottatx

And... I need to flush the oil this time before putting it all back together, adding oil and starting it... Hoping that simply moisture buildup alone when I had no oil in it is what caused the milky white oil on my last start. Another hard-to-locate definitive answer...

So just confirming and wanting to hear it in the simplest terms from someone... I don't want to use any product or anything... I basically just pour some oil in and drain it out, to flush it... right?


----------



## scottatx

Just spent 4 hours creating another, hopefully my final parts list.

I have been looking for this turbo bracket bolt for about 6 months off and on. Finally to the point where I am finalizing and need everything. Does anyone know the turbo bracket mounting bolt part # that goes here in the turbo bracket? 2001 TT quattro 225 AMU


----------



## davebowk

It's just an m6 bolt thats long enough, 35 to 40mm will probably do it


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> It's just an m6 bolt thats long enough, 35 to 40mm will probably do it


Thank you.


----------



## scottatx

Okay this is looking promising. The count between the two shaft marks is 16 and is almost identical to the diagrams... with exact pins (r/l) at the mark, seven full chain links in-between, exhaust mark roller pin slightly off-centered to the left, yet with both marks perfectly vertical at the bearing cap arrows:

Every single mark lines up everywhere perfectly, but you cannot see the mark on the flywheel through the hole in the bell housing. (Staying on topic All of this is preparing to discover that it was not the rear main seal leaking after all.)


----------



## scottatx

Aaaaand more parts to order. I guess if it disintegrates it's time to change it. Two hoses from firewall down to engine, preparing to remove turbo and change turbo feed line.


----------



## davebowk

If you can't see the mark on the flywheel then the belt on the crank pully is not correct


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> If you can't see the mark on the flywheel then the belt on the crank pully is not correct


Damn. I was definitely trying to avoid taking the belt off again. But the notch on the lower crank shaft sprocket, is perfectly aligned with the notch on the crank shaft pulley cover? If I hypothetically took the belt off at the bottom/crank shaft, and rotated the crank shaft a little clockwise, maybe one or two teeth, then the crank sprocket and crank cover notches would be off right?

What's my most simple direct procedure when all is 100% good except the mark on the flywheel is just under the top edge of the hole... It would take me just banging on the drive with my hand hard a couple times and the flywheel notch would appear... But I guess if the belt is off then it does not affect anything else besides the flywheel notch...


----------



## StuartDB

Agreed.. try putting a wooden spoon in cylinder one, then confirm TDC there, turning the crank to get TDC.. I expect you're out by a tooth or potentially 2, as being out by 1 tooth works fine...

You don't need to remove the belt to adjust the belt... just compress the adjuster with a 5mm bar and some washers and a nut...


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Agreed.. try putting a wooden spoon in cylinder one, I expect you're out by a tooth or potentially 2, as being out by one tooth works fine...


Thanks everyone... I mean... I've done this about literally 400 times, and just now learned how to set the cam shafts and chain, etc. Could you please tell me exactly how you woukld do this?

You mean... Put a socket extender or wooden spoon, etc., into cylinder #1 without the spark plug, and hand crank the crank shaft, watching carefully until it reaches its absolute lowest point, as a reference? Then what?

The only way I can get the belt on is by removing the roller of the dampening pin on the far left, and prying it over the cam shaft sprocket, takes me about 1-4 hours... 

So what is the final goal? Slide the belt off of the bottom crank shaft gear and rotate the crank shaft to where the flywheel mark is perfectly centered in the hole? The get the belt back on?


----------



## davebowk

Why on this earth would it be it's lowest point when you are looking for TDC (top dead centre) or piston at top of cylinder or it won't go any higher, sorry i don't know any more ways to describe this.

There was a video posted recently on how to move the belt a tooth by inserting cardboard between the pully and belt and turning it. It lifts the belt and drops it back on 1 tooth different


----------



## mcak1964

T.D.C. = lowest point of piston travel, as i've said buy a second hand engine , this will keep ending in tears...........longest wind up ever?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Agreed.. try putting a wooden spoon in cylinder one, then confirm TDC there, turning the crank to get TDC.. I expect you're out by a tooth or potentially 2, as being out by 1 tooth works fine...
> 
> You don't need to remove the belt to adjust the belt... just compress the adjuster with a 5mm bar and some washers and a nut...





mcak1964 said:


> T.D.C. = lowest point of piston travel, as i've said buy a second hand engine , this will keep ending in tears...........longest wind up ever?



Eeeeh, actually I'm almost there. Like I said, I specialize in many skills, but I'm not a mechanic. 

I simply hadn't done that in a while, I was typing fast... I was getting to the point of "what after that"... I wasn't sure if it was lowest point or highest point. But I bet 100% I would know before I actually did it

Cool I'll use that cardboard method and see what I get, I've seen that video before. Thanks Dave!


----------



## scottatx

Yaay, now I just need a MAP torch and 30 other things


----------



## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> T.D.C. = lowest point of piston travel, as i've said buy a second hand engine , this will keep ending in tears...........longest wind up ever?


Excellent example of a logical discrepancy for an amateur mechanic, that depends 100% on following concise exact steps....

One would _think_... that for the _lowest _point of piston travel... one would be watching for the spoon or socket to reach its absolute _lowest _point

But I would have refreshed my memory before I did it as well... which I am going to do right now.


----------



## davebowk

He should have said piston at the top with *least* amount of travel


----------



## PlasticMac

scottatx said:


> Excellent example of a logical discrepancy for an amateur mechanic, that depends 100% on following concise exact steps....
> 
> One would _think_... that for the _lowest _point of piston travel... one would be watching for the spoon or socket to reach its absolute _lowest _point
> 
> But I would have refreshed my memory before I did it as well... which I am going to do right now.


I'm no expert, but this is what I've always believed:








Mac.


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> Excellent example of a logical discrepancy for an amateur mechanic, that depends 100% on following concise exact steps....
> 
> One would _think_... that for the _lowest _point of piston travel... one would be watching for the spoon or socket to reach its absolute _lowest _point





PlasticMac said:


> I'm no expert, but this is what I've always believed:
> View attachment 491382
> 
> Mac.


Yes I knew it was one of those, top or bottom I'm working at the speed of light... was just verifying the overall method, details came next.


----------



## scottatx

I was just looking at my Flickr photos to visualize separating the turbo after torching the top three bolts this time... and I saw this crack. I didn't catch it the first time because it isn't in the area where people say inspect for hairline cracks. Not sure if this is detrimental to just get the car running correctly and like it was... I am planning on replacing the turbo anyway. I just need to get it running and move it, solve the main issue/oil leak/timing, etc. Just keeps getting better and better


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> He should have said piston at the top with *least* amount of travel


I've done it before... Using an incense, a long socket extension, a twig... anything. Hand crank and look for the exact fraction of a second when it reaches the top, and begins to go back down.

I was verifying that that's what you meant.

Going to maybe step away again and wait until I get all my parts. No sense in driving myself nuts when everything depends on a part or tool I am ordering. Torch, extractor socket, turbo gaskets, turbo mounting bolts, on and on and on....

Almost done though. What's another $300. Lol.


----------



## IPG3.6

oh wow have flicked through all your trials and tribulations and well done! 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

Although it seems one thing after the other which is further compounded by "off the book" fixes. Did you have a copy of the Haynes manual or something that you can reference for future repairs? You seem really competant and awesome at forging ahead but specific guidance and going "by the book" would really benefit in the long run by saving you headaches.

I have this manual (which is Golf/Bora focused) but i bet you someone else will be able to bring a TT specific one forward.

Happy wrenching!


----------



## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> oh wow have flicked through all your trials and tribulations and well done! 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
> 
> Although it seems one thing after the other which is further compounded by "off the book" fixes. Did you have a copy of the Haynes manual or something that you can reference for future repairs? You seem really competant and awesome at forging ahead but specific guidance and going "by the book" would really benefit in the long run by saving you headaches.
> 
> I have this manual (which is Golf/Bora focused) but i bet you someone else will be able to bring a TT specific one forward.
> 
> Happy wrenching!


Thanks for the kudos. I know I need a manual, it's just that every $25 I've had for up to a year has literally went to parts. It's that insane.


----------



## scottatx

Well I have my Turbo oil feed line, Map fuel torch and E14 socket coming tomorrow, Then have all new Turbo bolts, gaskets, and another whole parts list coming soon, Probably my 120th parts list or something lol. Maybe this could be the last one. I've been reading a lot about the milky white oil and I'm praying that mine was just simply due to condensation, And after I replace the Turbo feed line and hook everything back up properly with about 10 new other bolt gaskets and parts, hopefully it will run correctly, especially when I have the timing all perfectly synced for the 1st time, and won't need to wonder anymore if the machine shop had the cams themselves correct or not.








Quick Share


Expired




linksharing.samsungcloud.com


----------



## scottatx

Morning... Please help if you have a minute. I think this is the crucial part that I have not done correctly yet, because I never knew how to set the chain and cams, and check the machine shop's work... I just ran a strip of cardboard between the crank shaft gear and the timing belt on the very bottom but I'm not sure if it did the trick, i.e, turn the flywheel/crankshaft one tooth over so that the flywheel mark is visible, when all else was spot on.

So this is what I have right now. The flywheel mark is now visible and perfectly centered where it is supposed to be, but as usual, seems like it throws everything else off slightly. Please help me nail down exactly what to do from here... I've been kind of guesstimating in the past, but I need to get it perfect this time.


----------



## scottatx

I just cranked the crank shaft by hand about 10 or 12 times, after running a doubled-up piece of cardboard through the crank gear and timing belt... I think it had the opposite affect, or something. As of now, the notches on the cam shafts themselves and the chain links are where I landed to be perfect, then you can see the crank shaft gear, and the cam gear, are off, and cannot see the flywheel notch in the hole.

So I'm thinking I need to take off the belt at this point, and rotate the crank shaft to line up to the cover, flywheel and pulley notches, and the cam shaft gear, I guess will probably line up after doing that... But just take the belt off, and line everything up, and get the belt back on... Which I think may be the easiest, by removing all of the cam bearing bolts and lifting up the exhaust shaft with gear on the end, tilt it up, lift belt off, rotate both gears individually, put belt on the edge of the gear, and lower it back down, (gotta insert the half moon gasket kit anyway). That sounds like a plan?


----------



## davebowk

In post 207 all looks good. Why did you move it another tooth after?
Are you turning the crang the correct direction?


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> In post 207 all looks good. Why did you move it another tooth after?
> Are you turning the crang the correct direction?


In Post #207, I think that was before I I ran a strip of folded cardboard through the crank gear and timing belt at the very bottom two times... one time non-folded, one time doubled up... as we discussed. I hand cranked the bottom crank shaft maybe 10 times... and that time I landed on the flywheel mark centered in the hole... and the notches on the shafts themselves, but then everything else is off to the right a hair, or more.

It gets confusing... So now... Let's say, after I ran the cardboard through... I hand cranked the bottom crank shaft again maybe 10-12 times... and landed on/set it to, the notches on the cam shafts themselves as shown, but cannot see the flywheel mark, and the crank gear and cam gear need to rotate clockwise, probably 2 teeth on the crank equals the 1 tooth shown on the cam gear...

So I'm thinking I just need to lift the belt off and set everything individually, then get the belt back on perfectly, with all marks in perfect alignment. Just trying to determine the best, easiest way to do that.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> In post 207 all looks good. Why did you move it another tooth after?
> Are you turning the crang the correct direction?


I think when I doubled-up the cardboard, because it came around to the same mark the first time I ran the cardboard through it, it produced and extra tooth result or something... I get confused, been doing this for about 11 months. Lol. Now I'm right back where I started from, the timing. But I am going to get it right this time.

I also have a Map-Pro torch and trying out extractor sockets for the turbo bolts, nothing budging so far... and all parts ordered to complete everything. Just need to get the da%# turbo bolts off.


----------



## scottatx

This should be the new marketing campaign for Audi... just one never-ending parts list...


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> In post 207 all looks good. Why did you move it another tooth after?
> Are you turning the crang the correct direction?


I think I'll leave it at this and put it all back together... I basically just microscopically adjusted the flywheel mark and notches on the crank pulley and crank cover... Then checked that with the notches on the cam shafts themselves, and the cam gear/valve cover notch... All looks pretty good actually. Now just get the belt back on, and do the other 30 things...


----------



## StuartDB

What is this nonsense about using cardboard to set the timing....

Do you have like 10 accounts in different car forums just winding people up?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> What is this nonsense about using cardboard to set the timing....
> 
> Do you have like 10 accounts in different car forums just winding people up?


Nope. You Brits sure do like to jump to conclusions and accuse me of doin' the ol' wind up, lol...

Neh, I think Dave mentioned that method to rotate the crank gear a tooth or two, it lifts up the belt and the gear turns under it... There is a video somewhere, I've seen it too. Looks like you're behind the times

Just came in from spending about 30 hours messing with the timing in all areas...


----------



## marcusclaytonhy

good info


----------



## fire88

scottatx said:


> Nope. You Brits sure do like to jump to conclusions and accuse me of doin' the ol' wind up, lol...
> 
> Neh, I think Dave mentioned that method to rotate the crank gear a tooth or two, it lifts up the belt and the gear turns under it... There is a video somewhere, I've seen it too. Looks like you're behind the times
> 
> Just came in from spending about 30 hours messing with the timing in all areas...


Once you know how to do it in right way and properly, 30 minutes is enough. it's not how much time you spend on it, it's the right knowledge.


----------



## davebowk

StuartDB said:


> What is this nonsense about using cardboard to set the timing....


Some one posted a vid doing it, looked like a good idea to move the belt 1 tooth without removing it.


----------



## StuartDB

Yeah - I understand the concept, but nearly every approach to any issue has been ham-fisted shortcuts. Stretching the belt, relying on the tensioner taking the extra pressure is another risk...


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> Once you know how to do it in right way and properly, 30 minutes is enough. it's not how much time you spend on it, it's the right knowledge.



Oh I know that's right There are a few ways that people do it... I can do it, I'm just massively OCD basically, so I end up doing things about 90 times in a row trying to get the same exact precise result. Being as I'm not a mechanic, just very mechanical... I just have to follow steps and use trial and error. It's different every time I do it. I still haven't found the exact precise repeatable process to get the belt on after you set all the marks, or move the crank shaft one tooth over, etc.

But I think that is my main issue, I think it needs to be set more precise than I have been doing it, so I am spending the time on it this time.

I need to get the top three turbo bolts off, change the turbo oil feed line, and get the timing perfect, connect everything, flush the oil/moisture, fill with oil, and I think it's will start and run correctly finally. Hopefully.


----------



## scottatx

I will get the timing right. Just a matter of time. No pun intended

I think my only remaining P.I.T.A. issue is getting the top three turbo bolts off.

I have a Bernzomatic Map-Pro torch, penetrating spray, and tried two different bolt extractors, so far nothing. The bolts are only less than 1/4" high so very hard to grip with anything. I cannot find a welder to stop by and weld nuts to the top so I am just trying it myself. So far the torch and extractor sockets do nothing. Any extreme done-deal suggestions that simply just work? I was goijng to just take off all the exhaust manifold bolts and get this over with, (changing the turbo feed line), but these three bolts need to come off to get to that line no matter what. I tried torching the bolt heads for over 30 seconds and pouring ice water on it, then extractor socket... No grip. Nothing is working.


----------



## fire88

How can you have so much time and effort to write so many long posts though. 

surprised, you are still working On the turbo bolts !

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## StuartDB

Have you helicoiled the head where you stripped the cam cap bolt holes yet?


----------



## StuartDB

I don't understand the picture, why is a chain holding an inlet manifold which weighs about 700grammes? The chain weights more than it...

There's plenty for an irwin to grip onto those exhaust manifold bolts.

This is a wind up...


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> How can you have so much time and effort to write so many long posts though.
> 
> surprised, you are still working at the turbo bolts !
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


Well... Coming back to them. I fixed and replaced about 190 things between attempts at removing them.

I don't care about anything else. And, this is my car. I need to fix it. I have been working on it like this, almost nonstop, for almost 10 months. I have sold and lost everything I own, recently got evicted, my freelance business went to nothing... I have been completely focused on this for almost a year. It's pretty crazy.

Now I just got a website project down payment, so as soon as I get this running, going to drive it for a few days, store it and fly to Bangkok, then Bali, and rent a $12 a night guest house


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> I don't understand the picture, why is a chain holding an inlet manifold which weighs about 700grammes? The chain weights more than it...
> 
> There's plenty for an irwin to grip onto those exhaust manifold bolts.
> 
> This is a wind up...



The chains are hooked to the two eyelets on either side of the engine. I raise it up and down often. What's a wind up?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Have you helicoiled the head where you stripped the cam cap bolt holes yet?


Yes I did. Had to order a tap handle, coming today, so will thread the couple of cam bearing cap holes, install half moon gasket and key-shaped gasket, torque down cam bearing bolts, seal that up.

All I really need to focus on is cracking those three turbo bolts off somehow. I have everything else ready to go instantly.


----------



## StuartDB

This whole thread dude...

Did you helicoil the stripped cam cap bolt holes yet?


I just don't believe it sorry... its either a wind up... or you're not allowed out after dark...


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> This whole thread dude...
> 
> Did you helicoil the stripped cam cap bolt holes yet?
> 
> 
> I just don't believe it sorry... its either a wind up... or you're not allowed out after dark...



I said yes... I did

Isn't that what this forum is for? Asking technical automotive questions??

lol


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> ...
> All I really need to focus on is cracking those three turbo bolts off somehow. I have everything else ready to go instantly....


As the engine isnt connected to the mounts are you also running it hanging on chains without the inlet connected?

And what does this mean?

I asked if you helicoiled the head cam caps...

You replied 'yes I did' followed by 'I will do it tomorrow'

In the 90s rival forum trolling and wind ups like this were rife.... take a photo of some beans ontop of the balancing inlet, chain rigmarole and I will believe you're there... but incompetent

Also there is only 1 eyelet not 2


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> This whole thread dude...
> 
> Did you helicoil the stripped cam cap bolt holes yet?
> 
> 
> I just don't believe it sorry... its either a wind up... or you're not allowed out after dark...



I have all the cam bearing cap bolts all done and torqued, just waiting on the half moon gasket kit coming in a couple days.

As soon as I figure out how to crack off the turbo bolts, I can quickly finish every other thing.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> As the engine isnt connected to the mounts are you also running it hanging on chains without the inlet connected?
> 
> And what does this mean?
> 
> I asked if you helicoiled the head cam caps...
> 
> You replied 'yes I did' followed by 'I will do it tomorrow'
> 
> In the 90s rival forum trolling and wind ups like this were rife.... take a photo of some beans ontop if the balancing inlet, chain rigmarole and I will believe you're there... but incompetent


I'm not running the engine.

I did coil three cam bearing bolt holes.

The word "tomorrow" is not in this thread or on this Page.

I'm not incompetent. I'm just not a frigging Audi Technician


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> As the engine isnt connected to the mounts are you also running it hanging on chains without the inlet connected?
> 
> And what does this mean?
> 
> I asked if you helicoiled the head cam caps...
> 
> You replied 'yes I did' followed by 'I will do it tomorrow'
> 
> In the 90s rival forum trolling and wind ups like this were rife.... take a photo of some beans ontop of the balancing inlet, chain rigmarole and I will believe you're there... but incompetent
> 
> Also there is only 1 eyelet not 2



Beans blowup


----------



## LesRSV

None of this makes sense anymore!


----------



## scottatx

LesRSV said:


> None of this makes sense anymore!




I'm not a mechanic. I'm just mechanical
I changed the rear main seal, thinking that that was where a gigantic leak came from.
Still a massive leak, then found a hole in the turbo oil feed line.
Have a Map-PRO torch, but cannot get the three turbo bolts off so I can replace the oil feed line.
Once I accomplish that, going to put everything back together and check the timing, make sure it's perfect.
Flush a couple quarts of oil through to remove moisture, which I hope is the only reason the oil came out milky and tan.
Fill with oil.
Start.


----------



## Charmadize

Dude, if this is for real, you’ve knacked those turbo bolts. You have to either weld them out or you have to drill them out. Cutting a slot in the top is no good, it will never come out like that.


----------



## scottatx

Charmadize said:


> Dude, if this is for real, you’ve knacked those turbo bolts. You have to either weld them out or you have to drill them out. Cutting a slot in the top is no good, it will never come out like that.



Cool thank you

Lol, why would this _not _be real? Everybody? Lol... Please tell me how one is supposed to ask technical questions on the forum? Which was created... to solve these very questions I am asking? Lol... If we all knew these details already and have done them before... there would be no need for a forum?

The turbo bolts are literally my last problem. I have the solution for every other detail right in front of me. Yes, I don't think any method of attempting to turn/crack the bolts off with a breaker bar after torching them and dousing with icewater, etc., I tried everything... I think I definitely need to find a welder that can weld nuts on to them and do it for me like that. And they don't even heat up or get red, I think they are titanium... or my torch doesn't get hot enough, but I think trying to drill them out would be almost impossible as well.


----------



## scottatx

I wonder if I have reached timing nirvana??


----------



## fire88

Did you use the wrong photo or just me? 
How can you set timing without a belt on? 

Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


----------



## scottatx

fire88 said:


> Did you use the wrong photo or just me?
> How can you set timing without a belt on?
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk





fire88 said:


> Did you use the wrong photo or just me?
> How can you set timing without a belt on?
> 
> Sent from my IN2023 using Tapatalk


Well my main objective is to get the turbo bolts off and change the oil feed line... In the meantime I am just trying to get the cam shafts positioned in there perfectly. As of now I have the notch in the flywheel hole, the notches on the crank pulley and cover behind it, and the two notches on the two cam shafts... all of that is right on the money.

I have yet to discover or complete a definitive concise step-by-step way of getting the belt on and timing correct, able to repeat the result... It is always different, I just have to F with it.

So I figured I would just line up every mark anywhere, then get the belt on. But actually the timing belt is on, just the accessory belt is off. So things are looking good. As soon as my welder neighbor gets the turbo bolts off, I can put every single detail together as fast as I can do it. One remaining obstacle.


----------



## scottatx

Need a 3rd extension cord to reach out to the car, for my neighbor to weld the three nuts on to the upper three turbo bolts to get them off, to replace the turbo oil feed line. That is happening tomorrow.

Another stupid question you will think... but have to understand that I am under extreme pressure all this time, to move the vehicle. Simple as that. And every time I think I have it all wrapped up, there is one, no, 10 more issues.

My latest issue is that I cracked a cam cap by tightening it too much. Only one I can locate is out of Canada, weeks out...

Going out right now to remove every bolt of the cam bearing caps... clean everything, tilt the exhaust cam shaft up to get the timing belt on and have perfect timing in all areas/marks, then carefully this time, put all the bolts back in the cam bearing caps, with a precise torque wrench, and not overdo it this time.

And I now I have the half moon gasket and other gasket that goes on the right side, shaped like a key, etc., so can assemble it all carefully this time and seal it up. Or so I thought.

*Question:* _Hypothetically_, what if I left this cam bearing cap off? The one circled... Isn't there enough torque to the right and left to not make much of a difference and keep it held down? In an emergency situation?

I know this sounds totally stupid, but I have to move this vehicle. Or just insert it in its place with only the two bolts on the larger end of the two pieces?

I mean, just visually looking at it, it _seems _like the intake cam shaft would be okay, if I left off the bearing cap circled in the lower pic, _hypothetically_... ?? And even come back and add a replacement... I just need to get it started and move it, emergency situation...


----------



## Tonimacaroni

Omg, you better start off wrenching on a bicycle first instead of cars. You seem to break more than you can fix.lol 
Or start writing a book, you seem pretty good at writing 😉
I wish you luck , cause you’re gonna need it


----------



## scottatx

Tonimacaroni said:


> Omg, you better start off wrenching on a bicycle first instead of cars. You seem to break more than you can fix.lol
> Or start writing a book, you seem pretty good at writing 😉
> I wish you luck , cause you’re gonna need it


Thanks... di_¢_k... lol

So I'm not used to _lightly _torquing, OMG!

Considering that I've fixed, replaced and reconnected about 300 things... I'm doing pretty good actually

Lol... So I broke _one _cam bearing cap... Oh the horrors!! 

Been working on this for almost a year, so your luck is a little late But thanks anyway... couple days to completion, hopefully.


----------



## scottatx

I may be approaching timing nirvana...

My phone battery died for all pics, but the mark in the flywheel hole is dead center, The marks on the cam shafts themselves and the 16 rollers are absolutely perfect, the marks on the crank pulley and the cover behind it are absolutely perfect...

I have the belt on, and everything is completely perfectly aligned, except for the cam gear mark against the valve cover mark. Slightly off to the left. Do I need to adjust that in any way? Or does this look good if every other mark is dead on and perfectly aligned after manually rotating the crank gear 4 times?


----------



## scottatx

Tonimacaroni said:


> Omg, you better start off wrenching on a bicycle first instead of cars. You seem to break more than you can fix.lol
> Or start writing a book, you seem pretty good at writing 😉
> I wish you luck , cause you’re gonna need it


You can answer that last question if you want to... di_¢_k


----------



## scottatx

Tonimacaroni said:


> Omg, you better start off wrenching on a bicycle first instead of cars. You seem to break more than you can fix.lol
> Or start writing a book, you seem pretty good at writing 😉
> I wish you luck , cause you’re gonna need it


Or better yet, why don't you just attempt to answer the original technical question?


----------



## scottatx

Yep, see, just rotated the crank shaft four times... and everything is completely perfect, I think... except for the cam gear being half a tooth off to the left. If I took off the belt and moved the cam gear one tooth over, the mark would be off equally to the right.

Can someone please help me with what to do in this situation? I think my timing was the main problem, so am trying to get that perfect. Then replace the turbo oil feed line, and hopefully that will have been the two major issues all along.


----------



## davebowk

I think that is correct. If it had a new chain and new belt it would probably line up better. See how it runs or check for timing codes after.
Cam caps are bored/matched with the head. make sure the new cam cap does not go tight on the cam. Maybe check with plasti gauge.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I think that is correct. If it had a new chain and new belt it would probably line up better. See how it runs or check for timing codes after.
> Cam caps are bored/matched with the head. make sure the new cam cap does not go tight on the cam. Maybe check with plasti gauge.


Thanks Dave.

Yes I just toyed with it all for about another 15 hours and it is almost impossible to get it all textbook perfectly aligned in all areas. So hopefully there is some play room on the cam shaft mark that is off slightly to the left.

I think I will leave it as is, or I could go on forever... My neighbor is going to weld nuts on to the three turbo bolts tonight, and hopefully that combined with all my penetrating spray, Map-PRO torching with icewater and all my attempts will allow them to come off. Then I plan on just pushing the turbo back, just enough to separate it and gain access to the oil feed line, change that... slide in a new turbo gasket, line it up and install the new turbo mounting bolts. Seems logical anyway...

And like I said I am aware that I am rushing, I've been working on this nonstop for _almost a year_ after all, and I need to move it by Monday... so I _have _screwed some stuff up along the way of course...

Now my last problem is the cam cap that I broke. The only one I can find is out of Canada, and I need to get this _finished_. So I wondered if putting in the cam cap as illustrated below (without the smaller piece) would be a huge issue or fall apart, etc. It would be very sturdy actually, logically... and come back and replace it in a week or two. (I took all the cam cap bolts off, cleaned and wire brushed everything, and torqued them all to 7 ft lbs, very carefully this time.)


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> Need a 3rd extension cord to reach out to the car, for my neighbor to weld the three nuts on to the upper three turbo bolts to get them off, to replace the turbo oil feed line. That is happening tomorrow.
> 
> Another stupid question you will think... but have to understand that I am under extreme pressure all this time, to move the vehicle. Simple as that. And every time I think I have it all wrapped up, there is one, no, 10 more issues.
> 
> My latest issue is that I cracked a cam cap by tightening it too much. Only one I can locate is out of Canada, weeks out...
> 
> Going out right now to remove every bolt of the cam bearing caps... clean everything, tilt the exhaust cam shaft up to get the timing belt on and have perfect timing in all areas/marks, then carefully this time, put all the bolts back in the cam bearing caps, with a precise torque wrench, and not overdo it this time.
> 
> And I now I have the half moon gasket and other gasket that goes on the right side, shaped like a key, etc., so can assemble it all carefully this time and seal it up. Or so I thought.
> 
> *Question:* _Hypothetically_, what if I left this cam bearing cap off? The one circled... Isn't there enough torque to the right and left to not make much of a difference and keep it held down? In an emergency situation?
> 
> I know this sounds totally stupid, but I have to move this vehicle. Or just insert it in its place with only the two bolts on the larger end of the two pieces?
> 
> I mean, just visually looking at it, it _seems _like the intake cam shaft would be okay, if I left off the bearing cap circled in the lower pic, _hypothetically_... ?? And even come back and add a replacement... I just need to get it started and move it, emergency situation...
> 
> View attachment 491969
> 
> 
> View attachment 491970



they are line bored you have junked the head - if you need to move the vehicle push it into a fire or a nearby river


----------



## StuartDB

Tonimacaroni said:


> Omg, you better start off wrenching on a bicycle first instead of cars. You seem to break more than you can fix.lol
> Or start writing a book, you seem pretty good at writing 😉
> I wish you luck , cause you’re gonna need it



maybe Meccano first, then Technical Lego, then a junior hacksaw and some sheet metal - I am suprised he's not lost a finger testing the Aux belt tension whilst the engine is running or strangled himself at school with his tie stuck in a lathe.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> they are line bored you have junked the head - if you need to move the vehicle push it into a fire or a nearby river


Well that's the most idiotic statement I've read on an Audi forum...

Am I supposed to know... the answers to the questions, that I am figuring out for the first time?

How did you figure out how to _rebuild an Audi TT_ for the first time?

I'm about two days away from completion actually... I guess some Brits are just snotty di_¢_ks


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> they are line bored you have junked the head - if you need to move the vehicle push it into a fire or a nearby river


No... I simply cracked a cam cap. It's a pretty f'ing common issue


----------



## StuartDB

you could probably bond it back together as it still has the complete curve. I thought it broke the edge too.

it's not a common issue though dude - that's a bit like people saying Uber drivers are dodgy - they do about 5 million rides a week in London and a handful might be iffy.

What I don't understand is how you manage to break a cam cap after already stripping the head from overtightening cam caps - what torque wrench are you using?


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> you could probably bond it back together as it still has the complete curve. I thought it broke the edge too.
> 
> it's not a common issue though dude - that's a bit like people saying Uber drivers are dodgy - they do about 5 million rides a week in London and a handful might be iffy.
> 
> What I don't understand is how you manage to break a cam cap after already stripping the head from overtightening cam caps - what torque wrench are you using?



How would I bond it back together other than tig welding it? My neighbor said that he only can weld steel... I was thinking it would be fine if I carefully just inserted it with the small half missing, with washers and bolts as illustrated... It's a technical question It's science.

*I have never done this S7i# before*

But trust me the next time someone asks me something regarding this, or I have to do it again... I will be an expert

I didn't strip "the head." I stripped a few cam bearing cap holes, which I have drilled and inserted coils into and fixed... because I am not an Audi technician

Pretty common issue actually


----------



## mcak1964

As I said this will end in tears and no, condensation was not the problem. Class!


----------



## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> As I said this will end in tears and no, condensation was not the problem. Class!


Well, who knows yet... I had a certified mechanic tell me that I left it long enough without oil in it to create enough moisture to come out as in the pics... And I also had put some SAE oil in it just to get by and test start it, not synthetic, I will fill it with all the correct fluids when it starts... I AM ON AN EXTREME BUDGET. The coolant is crystal clear, and I am 99.9% certain I did the head gasket and rear main seal correctly...

Why don't you try providing some useful information? Just once? and see how it feels?


----------



## scottatx

*PRETEND *you are in an apocalypse, you snotty Brits, LOL... Would this get you to the safety zone???? lol, for a week or something, enough time to kill all the zombies??? then replace it correctly within a week or two??

Use your friggin' imagination lol


----------



## Delta4

It's clear that the issue with the car is you, i'll encourage anybody that's willing to get stuck in but once in a blue moon you'll come across someone that should step away from the tool box and stick to what you know best, i can't take you or this thread seriously.


----------



## scottatx

Delta4 said:


> It's clear that the issue with the car is you, i'll encourage anybody that's willing to get stuck in but once in a blue moon you'll come across someone that should step away from the tool box and stick to what you know best, i can't take you or this thread seriously.



Jesus Christ.

That's why I'm asking you.

That's why this forum exists.

Try _helping _me instead of chastising me.

I've fixed and replaced about 300 things on this car. So sorry if the timing is difficult for me and the cam caps are delicate??? Seriously???

Get a grip people.

Why don't you just attempt to answer the frigging questions?


----------



## scottatx

Delta4 said:


> It's clear that the issue with the car is you, i'll encourage anybody that's willing to get stuck in but once in a blue moon you'll come across someone that should step away from the tool box and stick to what you know best, i can't take you or this thread seriously.


I literally have about two things left to resolve.


----------



## Delta4

scottatx said:


> I literally have about two things left to resolve.


Really, why should anybody waste time trying to help you, many on this forum will have forgotten more than you know yet you present a level of workmanship that most would never dream of as if it's normal, i'm not going to waste any more time using my key board for a dick head like you,


----------



## StuartDB

scottatx said:


> *PRETEND *you are in an apocalypse, you snotty Brits, LOL... Would this get you to the safety zone???? lol, for a week or something, enough time to kill all the zombies??? then replace it correctly within a week or two??
> 
> Use your friggin' imagination lol
> 
> View attachment 492022
> 
> 
> View attachment 492023
> 
> 
> View attachment 492024



You cannot replace a CAM cap - like I said the head is line bored for the cams. Meaning every single 1.8t head is different when it comes to the camshafts. All head's cams are done like this..

I broke my 1150cc 1999 GSX-F Katana cam cap's cam cover threaded bolt hole, and bought some other cam caps which obviously didn't fit... but my neighbour cut the top off my old one and put a top from another cam cap onto it. The actual bolt holes were okay and that worked out okay.

Incidentally, if you didn't undo your cams correctly sharing the tension it may have bent the cam shaft.


----------



## scottatx

scottatx said:


> I literally have about two things left to resolve.
> 
> So F you too lol





Delta4 said:


> Really, why should anybody waste time trying to help you, many on this forum will have forgotten more than you know yet you present a level of workmanship that most would never dream of as if it's normal, i'm not going to waste any more time using my key board for a dick head like you,



Lol. I've stated numerous times that I am mechanical, not a mechanic.

I specialize in Web Usability, herpetology and exotic marine life... actually. And have about 20 years of heavy industrial electronics experience. So I can rebuild completely burnt coal-fired power plant circuit boards from scratch, diode stacks, etc. I'm a triple letterman diver, assistant NAUI Scuba Instructor, I can generally build and fix anything.
*
EXCEPT AN AUDI TT ENGINE.*

That's why I am here asking questions (???)

It's not a space shuttle... I can figure it out... _with your help_.

I'm just asking questions, and replying to _you_...

So you can cut the nonsense if you'd like.

I'm trying to fix my car.

Thanks.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> You cannot replace a CAM cap - like I said the head is line bored for the cams. Meaning every single 1.8t head is different when it comes to the camshafts. All head's cams are done like this..
> 
> I broke my 1150cc 1999 GSX-F Katana cam cap's cam cover threaded bolt hole, and bought some other cam caps which obviously didn't fit... but my neighbour cut the top off my old one and put a top from another cam cap onto it. The actual bolt holes were okay and that worked out okay.
> 
> Incidentally, if you didn't undo your cams correctly sharing the tension it may have bent the cam shaft.


Thank you.

I mean.. there _are _replacements, right? Like this one...

I already had ordered and replaced one of the ones with two bolts, when I originally took the valvr cover off, one had an edge chipped off, so I just replaced it. I have replaced literally about 120 parts in the past 10 months. And plastic-welded the front bumper, matched the paint, new entire shifter stick, cables, new single mass flywheel and sport clutch, all new brake pads, rebuilt the door latches and interior mechanisms of the locks themselves... I have done all kinds of stuff. Successfully.

So I'm not an idiot, fyi lol

It's not a normal vehicle. You gotta ask stupid questions. That's how you learn.

But, excuse me if I am wrong... but there can't be an individual difference in cam caps, can there? That makes any difference? I mean, you can order the exact one you need...

All I know is that I need to get the turbo bolts off, happening tonight.

Then replace the turbo oil feed line and put everything back togethor.

If it blows up in my face. So be it. Then on to phase II I guess.


----------



## scottatx

Man I shouldn't dare ask to confirm what material the cam caps are made of huh? I must be a total idiot

I _think _aluminum... My neighbor is asking definitively so he can know if he can weld the two halves together tonight, and yes I read that a lot of people have done that before.

These are just standard questions, that even a professional welder asks... No need for any dumb comments or anything.

And even if we kow the answer to these questions, wise people _confirm _them, definitively.


----------



## silverbug

scottatx said:


> No need for any dumb comments or anything.
> 
> And even if we kow the answer to these questions, wise people _confirm _them, definitively.


Wise people also know their limitations.
Folk aren’t very inclined to help when you resort to name-calling, a lot of comments on this site are just healthy banter.
I’ve just discovered the ‘ignore’ function on this forum, am now going to test it….…


----------



## StuartDB

1st search on the Internet...











Line boring the cam journals in the head


I have been given a 2001 Passat with a 1.8 turbo (AUG) engine. The car only has 80,000 miles on it however The last owner's husband My brother-in-law) drove it with the oil light on until it shut down. It looks like the "Sludge problem/cam guide problem" got it. I am about 1/2 way into removing...




www.passatworld.com





If you managed to get a lucky near fit... it still won't fit... pretty sure these are line bored... but I am happy to be corrected. I bought cam caps too off ebay 2nd hand and they told me they would fit fine.. and they didn't, don't get me wrong they looked like they could but they were never going to be oil pressure right.. but considering you run your engine without oil, coolant or engine mounts you probably won't notice any issues...


----------



## scottatx

silverbug said:


> Wise people also know their limitations.
> Folk aren’t very inclined to help when you resort to name-calling, a lot of comments on this site are just healthy banter.
> I’ve just discovered the ‘ignore’ function on this forum, am now going to test it….…



lol, good for you.

Use it.

If someone is a di_¢_k then I will call them a di_¢_k.

I'm just trying to fix my car man

I am guilty of asking questions. So bug off... lol. Is that what they say in London??

Lol. Can we get back to the topic?

Some of you guys are hilarious.


----------



## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> 1st search on the Internet...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Line boring the cam journals in the head
> 
> 
> I have been given a 2001 Passat with a 1.8 turbo (AUG) engine. The car only has 80,000 miles on it however The last owner's husband My brother-in-law) drove it with the oil light on until it shut down. It looks like the "Sludge problem/cam guide problem" got it. I am about 1/2 way into removing...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.passatworld.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you managed to get a lucky near fit... it still won't fit... pretty sure these are line bored... but I am happy to be corrected. I bought cam caps too off ebay 2nd hand and they told me they would fit fine.. and they didn't, don't get me wrong they looked like they could but they were never going to be oil pressure right.. but considering you run your engine without oil, coolant or engine mounts you probably won't notice any issues...



I never ran the engine like that, and yes you are incorrect. You can easily replace these cam caps.

Jesus christ.

Everybody go find some YouTube video to comment on...

I'm just trying to fix my car.


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## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> 1st search on the Internet...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Line boring the cam journals in the head
> 
> 
> I have been given a 2001 Passat with a 1.8 turbo (AUG) engine. The car only has 80,000 miles on it however The last owner's husband My brother-in-law) drove it with the oil light on until it shut down. It looks like the "Sludge problem/cam guide problem" got it. I am about 1/2 way into removing...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.passatworld.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you managed to get a lucky near fit... it still won't fit... pretty sure these are line bored... but I am happy to be corrected. I bought cam caps too off ebay 2nd hand and they told me they would fit fine.. and they didn't, don't get me wrong they looked like they could but they were never going to be oil pressure right.. but considering you run your engine without oil, coolant or engine mounts you probably won't notice any issues...



"1st search on the Internet... "

I already did all of that.


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## StuartDB

Where is that ignore button?


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## StuartDB

Aha... done


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## scottatx

StuartDB said:


> Where is that ignore button?


Yeah.

Please use it.

You're wasting bytes on a server.

I'm asking serious questions trying to finish my car.


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## scottatx

Well $his#...

Welding would not take to the bolt. Useless. Tried drilling the turbo bolts out but is taking hours...

So we're regrouping and doing some research to get a better drill bit, or anything... whatever it takes...

*How do I get these damn turbo bolts off??? lol*


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## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> As I said this will end in tears and no, condensation was not the problem. Class!


I've been crying for 9 months, I could have had a baby by now...

So can you enlighten me on what you think the milky watery oil is from or do you just go around and verbalize the problem and not give your thoughts on the solution? lol


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## mcak1964

scottatx said:


> *PRETEND *you are in an apocalypse, you snotty Brits, LOL... Would this get you to the safety zone???? lol, for a week or something, enough time to kill all the zombies??? then replace it correctly within a week or two??
> 
> Use your friggin' imagination lol
> 
> 
> 
> Nice washers.........
> View attachment 492022
> 
> 
> View attachment 492023
> 
> 
> View attachment 492024


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## scottatx

Anyone have a recommendation for the perfect carbide drill bit to drill out the turbo mounting bolt heads?

My plan was to just get the correct carbide drill bit, maybe 10mm to 12mm... and drill off the turbo bolt heads, then pry apart the manifold and turbo... then I'd assume you'd see studs sticking out of one or both surfaces... then use a stud extractor and breaker bar.


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## scottatx

You're right.

What a stupid question.

People are such friggin' complete morons. Just... slobbering, blithering idiots... 

Don't even know how to put a whole Audi TT quattro engine back together or drill out solid titanium bolts... Pfft! lol...

L O S E R !!

Uuuuh... SEE ya! Wouldn't wanna BE ya!

Friggin' LOSERS with their technical questions...

Don't even reply to that guy...He has no idea what he's talking about...

It's better to interact only with Certified Mechanics that know exactly what they are doing.


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## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> Anyone have a recommendation for the perfect carbide drill bit to drill out the turbo mounting bolt heads?


This will make a mess of the bolts.

Get the bolts hot using a blowtorch or something similar and knock the remainder of the bolt head with a drift in a counter clockwise manner. 

That's how I did it when I stripped the old AF E14 bolts.


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## scottatx

Thanks, IPG...

But what happens when none of those bolts even budge? I read somewhere that it's the difference in metals, titanium to steel, etc. So I think that they are soldered on, basically.

I keep spraying it with penetrating spray, And hitting it with a map pro torch, But nothing ever budges.

What I'm looking for now, is the next solution.

What do I do? Take the manifold off, with the turbo attached? That seems like a gigantic pain in the ass...

Maybe I just take the entire head, manifold and turbo off, again, and just redo the head gasket and head bolts, And take this to a machine shop, so they can separate the Turbo from the manifold....

Because so far nobody can do it, not any professional that I have sought, Not a welder or certified mechanic, they all just give up...

I'm just going to keep working at it, with a map pro torch, But I need a serious professional definitive solution, if anybody has one.


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## davebowk

It's either drill them out using cobalt drills, keep them sharp and at a slow speed with high pressure on them using proper cutting fluid.
Start with a 4mm all the way then go to 9 or 10mm (edit) as far as the turbo flange then you can try and remove the remaining stud with an extractor tool or use an m8 tapping drill (6.5mm) and re tap the inserts or replace the inserts.
Or manifold or head off with the turbo. But then you still have to get the bolts out.
As you had a lot of emulsified oil i would remove the head and start again.


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> It's either drill them out using cobalt drills, keep them sharp and at a slow speed with high pressure on them using proper cutting fluid.
> Start with a 4mm all the way then go to 9 or 10mm (edit) as far as the turbo flange then you can try and remove the remaining stud with an extractor tool or use an m8 tapping drill (6.5mm) and re tap the inserts or replace the inserts.
> Or manifold or head off with the turbo. But then you still have to get the bolts out.
> As you had a lot of emulsified oil i would remove the head and start again.


 Yes this is what I decided and started doing right when I saw your email, thanks, so I have the head turbo and manifold all supported by the support bar, now get it to the machine shop tomorrow, Gives me the opportunity to do the head gasket absolutely perfect this time with some help, Too much trouble. and nobody in town or a professional welder or a certified mechanic or myself could get those bolts off they won't budge


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> It's either drill them out using cobalt drills, keep them sharp and at a slow speed with high pressure on them using proper cutting fluid.
> Start with a 4mm all the way then go to 9 or 10mm (edit) as far as the turbo flange then you can try and remove the remaining stud with an extractor tool or use an m8 tapping drill (6.5mm) and re tap the inserts or replace the inserts.
> Or manifold or head off with the turbo. But then you still have to get the bolts out.
> As you had a lot of emulsified oil i would remove the head and start again.


Least I'm in action now. One can only search for ways to get 3 titanium bolts off for so long before you go a little crazy...

I'm assuming I need a new head gasket and bolts... There was some white milky oil on the head gasket and you can see the little scuff I was talking about in the upper right corner...









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## scottatx

Well I have the head, turbo and manifold hoisted up with the engine support bar now, I just need to take it to the machine shop, get another head gasket and 10 bolts, And change the turbo oil feed line whenever they get the titanium bolts off.

I never do this, but I am absolutely desperate. I'm living in my car, and it's completely terrible. I've been doing this every single day and night for almost a year.

I could really use some help for the cause, if there are enthusiasts out there that won't miss it, I sure could use a donation. In my normal life I hand out $20 bills at red lights and waste all my money, Now here I am, living in a tiny sports car that's almost ruined me, because I love it so much, and I have a year's worth of blood sweat and tears and parts lists invested into it.

So anyone that might possibly be so inclined to donate to my Venmo account, that will literally get me a head gasket, 10 bolts and a Lyft to the machine shop.

No sense in chastising me. Trust me, I despise this. I'm just desperate and I need to get this accomplished. That's all there is to it.

@ScoTT-Lewis-326









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Thanks.
Scott


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## scottatx

Well I guess I shouldn't use the same bolts again... Or the head gasket... I think I might get an OEM head gasket this time because obviously the fell pro one was less than expected...

There was emusified oil all over the surface of it so I guess I will replace the whole thing, Get new bolts, and place the head firmly on top of the head gasket with the help of a friend...

Thanks


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## scottatx

Got the head out, taking it to the machine shop. I'm excited to actually clean everything again and be twice as careful while assembling everything. 

And get an OEM head gasket this time, Going to have the machine shop check everything to make sure it's flat and resurfaced, air it all out with the compressor, change the turbo oil feed line, put it all back together...

Hopefully the timing, the oil feed line, an OEM head gasket, and paying extra attention to everything this time will do the trick

What a year.









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## scottatx

Didn't mean to put up a donation link. I was completely desperate...

Now I have the head back from the machine shop and a new head gasket installed... I used some copper spray this time, And I don't think I use the proper torque sequence the 1st time I did it, and I think I missed the final 90ﾟ turn. I think the quick instructions I saw had one final plus 90, not two. So it feels totally different this time, feels strong, and like I did it correct. Noticeably different feel, so that obviously was something I screwed up on the 1st go 'round.

Now I'm just assembling everything as fast as I can, have a new timing belt and all kinds of stuff, and now I'm hung up on accessing the oil return line underneath the Turbo, so I can add the new gasket and the line itself. I didn't want to attach it when the head was off because I didn't want to kink it like I did the Turbo line...

So I've spent about eight hours on that, lol (it's not funny), so frustrating I had to walk down the street and get a beer.

My latest plan is just to hang upside down from the engine support bar, with my head on a pillow where the windshield wipers are, and access it upside down, and add the line and gasket

As soon as I get past that, I just have to attach the battery, breather box and do the timing, add oil and coolant and start it...

It started out as an exciting day, before I got hung up on this turbo return line, costing me a whole day, unbelievable.

Well, like my stepdad used to say, "Believe it!"

Any tips on how to add that line? I think what I'm doing is the only way, after you've installed everything. 

Almost there. I've been saying that every half day for 10 months.


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## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> I'm hung up on accessing the oil return line underneath the Turbo, so I can add the new gasket and the line itself.


you should be able to do this from underneath with some extensions and a universal (wobble) joint. Use 1/4" tools for easiest access. The two bolts are only torqued to like 15Nm anyway.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> you should be able to do this from underneath with some extensions and a universal (wobble) joint. Use 1/4" tools for easiest access. The two bolts are only torqued to like 15Nm anyway.


 Awesome Awesome thank you I am literally right this 2nd on my way to the auto parts store to get those 2 bulbs in some type of tool... I cannot access with a standard hexky wrench I've been trying for 2 full days.

I took the passenger axle off to access everything and it is still the most difficult thing I've ever done in my life because of the Turbo bracket. You get one thing out of order on this car cost you about a month sometimes.

As soon as I get that line connected under the Turbo all I have to do is put the axle on and the timing belt.

I'll get this line added if it's the last thing I do, I just put a lot of work into assembling things around it...

I think my final remaining burning issue is I once again let the car sit for a long time with no oil, so there's probably condensation in the interior, but I think I had a head gasket failure as well. This time I use copper spray did the full proper sequence particularly different I feel it's pretty much locked down.

So what do I do about clearing the engine interior of condensation? or do I just fill it with oil, and as long as the car starts it will burn it off and I just get an oil change soon?

I'm pretty sure all of this was due to a kink in my Turbo oil feed line, and the way I put the head gasket on the 1st time. And the timing.

So now I just need to attach that line under the Turbo in the back, fill it with oil and coolant, put the timing belt on and start it.

Everything else has been perfectly done this time hopefully. A 10 month long grueling nightmare. I'm now living in my car. I sold my soul to get this thing running.


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## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> So what do I do about clearing the engine interior of condensation? or do I just fill it with oil, and as long as the car starts it will burn it off and I just get an oil change soon?


Did your coolant ever go milky/chocolate milkshake looking indicating the coolant mixed with oil? If so my gut feeling tells me that after you've got the head skimmed, run demineralised water through the coolant system to flush out as much oil as possible. wait for the all to run clear. Pressure test the system by getting it up to temperature - _*then*_ fill up with coolant at the very end

Good luck..


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Did your coolant ever go milky/chocolate milkshake looking indicating the coolant mixed with oil? If so my gut feeling tells me that after you've got the head skimmed, run demineralised water through the coolant system to flush out as much oil as possible. wait for the all to run clear. Pressure test the system by getting it up to temperature - _*then*_ fill up with coolant at the very end
> 
> Good luck..


The coolant system has always been crystal clear. Even now there's no sign of nothing in the coolant system even the drops that come out are crystal clear, and I will flush that out with distilled water before I add my coolant mixture anyway.

I have my bad Turbo oil feed line changed and what I think is the perfect seal on the head gasket, So now just wondering if I need to clear out condensation on the engine interior somehow, or just add oil and start it.

Thank you very much for your help, walking around solving problems, getting the 2 actual bolts that go in the Oil return line underneath the Turbo and the wobble joint that you recommended.

After that I should be home free, hopefully, as long as I have the timing correct I'm pretty sure it will run like a dream.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Did your coolant ever go milky/chocolate milkshake looking indicating the coolant mixed with oil? If so my gut feeling tells me that after you've got the head skimmed, run demineralised water through the coolant system to flush out as much oil as possible. wait for the all to run clear. Pressure test the system by getting it up to temperature - _*then*_ fill up with coolant at the very end
> 
> Good luck..


Got the wobble joint and the correct bolts, and I still can't access it because of the Turbo bracket, Just dropped the gasket with a little RTV on it down somewhere, I'll have to find it, trying to position it over the bracket so I can squeeze up somehow and get the bolts threaded in... But this is impossible still because of that bracket. I think I'm going to have to take off the banjo bolt on top of the oil cooler, to release the only thing that's holding the Turbo now, and just move it up past that bracket so I can access it, and finally get this line in. From then I think I am home free.

I've spent 3 entire 12 hour days trying to get this line in, (and did a bunch of other stuff of course.)

This is the most frustrating living nightmare period of my life. And I was a commercial fisherman in Alaska for 6 years. This is more difficult than 6 winters in Alaska.

( I'm on mobile, need that app that compresses images before you share them)









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## davebowk

Put some cheap oil in of correct grade and run for 5 mins then change it for some good stuff. Filter included


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## scottatx

Well, I have what I think is the perfect seal on the head gasket, I got the timing almost perfect with a new timing new timing belt, the Cam gear factory mark is about less than a 1/2 a tooth off to the right of the mark on the valve cover, the flywheel mark is dead center.... I rotated the crank shaft about 12 times where it landed on the 2 marks without going backwards at all almost precisely all lined up to the factory marks....

Put it all back together with oil and coolant, And there's no compression, still sputters and runs like a golf cart... The flashing Orange check engine light comes on if you let it run for more than about a minute.

There are zero leaks, I've started it about 4 times and let it run for about 30 seconds each time and the oil is still crystal clear and the coolant is crystal clear.

I have new plugs, new coils, put everything back together carefully... Does this sound like another separate problem with the block and the pistons? What should I check now? the next few things I should check? what could it be?


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## IPG3.6

No compression on any of the cylinders? What's the compression tester giving you for each cylinder? absolute 0???


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> No compression on any of the cylinders? What's the compression tester giving you for each cylinder? absolute 0???


 That's my next step. I have to go down and buy a pressure tester... I just put every single thing back together perfectly, Considering the very 1st problem was the water pump and timing belt I've been thinking all this time that I had the timing off, but maybe there has been something wrong with the block and one of the cylinders all this time as well. 

I started it and drove it up the street to get out of my apartment complex after working on it for 10 months, I had to move it, There's enough compression to drive it, it's just one or more of the cylinders obviously has low compression, Just sputters and hardly goes when you hit the gas, It was an emergency, I had to drive it...

Considering I just got the head back from the machine shop again, I have a valve job and new head gasket installed, new coils and plugs... any cylinders that show low compression with the pressure tester, Would that definitely be a problem in the block and the pistons themselves? so I'd have to take the whole head off again?

The saga continues.


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## davebowk

It could be dodgy coils or anything really.
If the compression is ok then look at coils, fuel supply/pressure and things like a bad maf can cause bad running.


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> It could be dodgy coils or anything really.
> If the compression is ok then look at coils, fuel supply/pressure and things like a bad maf can cause bad running.


Yeah I have brand new Bosh coils and NGK plugs but they were sitting on my floorboard for about 6 months. And I completely rebuilt the electrical harness going over the coils.... Nobody will let me borrow a compression tester, and I just talked to a shop down the street that I've taken it to before, I'm going to go out and physically inspect everything, just clean and gap the plugs again, make sure I tightened plugs, swap the coils around, Inspect all my connections of the electrical harness and start it again... Then if it sounds the same I'm just going to emergency drive it down the street to the shop where he'll run the codes and do a compression test.

Well at least I'm determined, and finally get to see it lowered with the front tires on again, makes me remember why I'm doing all this.


----------



## scottatx

davebowk said:


> It could be dodgy coils or anything really.
> If the compression is ok then look at coils, fuel supply/pressure and things like a bad maf can cause bad running.



Well, I assembled everything and had to make an emergency drive... stopped at a shop I go to for some things... This time the Master Mechanic there heard the engine and said I have "rod knock" in cylinder 3 or 4.

So I just drained the oil, which was dark and dirty... I'm hoping that this is just due to the old watered down oil being flushed out, and any condensation that existed, because I don't think I can do the head gasket any better. As far as I'm concerned I did it perfectly, with copper spray, the correct torque sequence, it felt perfectly tightened down and made an excellent firm seal...

So I now have the oil pan off and it staged to change the connector rod bearings. So hopefully that was my oil flush to get that dirty oil out, and now change the main bearings with a new set, put back together, fill with oil and coolant and give it a try.

Anything else that is wrong, piston rings, etc., will require the head to come off again. But that knocking had just started, and the walls of the cylinders are perfectly smooth and error free, so I'm hoping that the piston rings did not get damaged, or the valves.

Approaching the finish line hopefully.

I need to find a cam bearing cap, 2nd one from the right with four screw holes. I added some washers and it is very stable but I need to replace it. I have all new motor mount bolts, everything is new, no leaks... Hopefully the oil will remain clear and it will run like it's supposed to after the connector rod bearings are changed. Fairly certain the timing is perfect.

*And hopefully the connector rod bearings have been a fundamental issue all along, causing the irritating low oil pressure beeping, which I have been to about 117 shops trying to troubleshoot. I have all new oil pressure sensors, new Bosch coils, new NGK iridium plugs, new oil pan, head and valve cover gaskets, re-wired everything... Hopefully new main bearings will resolve the oil pressure issue I've had for eight years.


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## scottatx

Could someone please identify this hose/elbow for me? The one circled in green...


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## IPG3.6

Gosh it's never ending issues in your build... 

Did you have a scan tool to help you out? That'll be helpful too now you're at this stage.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Gosh it's never ending issues in your build...
> 
> Did you have a scan tool to help you out? That'll be helpful too now you're at this stage.


Yeah it's been pretty crazy, and that's an understatement. And I mean about 5,000 times under... an understatement.

Spent the entire night putting coils in the engine mount bolt holes, so I have all new firm transmission and motor mount bolts. Fixed a coolant elbow hose leak, filled with coolant, I have the main bearing set coming in about an hour at the store across the street, Also ordered that black plastic upper oil pan, had a couple cracks in it, coming tomorrow...

About to change the oil filter, then add oil after I change the connecting rod bearings.

The power steering fluid was dirty and chocolatey, that was strange, And I just put about half new power steering fluid a few days ago, So with hardly any compressio, when I did my emergency drive, the steering whined and was very hard to turn, There're no leaks or anything, so hopefully it just needs clean fluid, And I replaced that green sensor near the passenger's side headlight, and that is leaking slightly, so I'm going to redo that with new crush washers and hopefully the power steering pump itself hasn't failed... because I'm about tapped out of money. Man, spent $900 in the past 2 days and still have a 15 item parts list that I'm getting right now.

The perfect car for OCD.

I sure hope the oil stays clear this time and the car runs correctly, that's also an understatement, lol.

Just took pictures and checked the timing. I think it is absolutely perfect.

Now all I need is a cam bearing cap, one with four holes not two...


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## davebowk

I hope you have new bolts for the big end caps and don't you think you need to sort the low oil pressure first?


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I hope you have new bolts for the big end caps and don't you think you need to sort the low oil pressure first?


Oh I've been trying to get rid of that low oil pressure beeping for 7 years.

I'm at the shop right now with the master mechanic that heard it and identified it as rod knock, He said connecting rod bearings would solve that and also affects my oil pressure so I'm just going down the line, hoping that solves my problem.

And now, I only ordered a set of 8 connecting rod bearings... now the shop said I also need the main bearing set... when I asked the auto parts store about 9 times if the 8 connecting rod bearings were all that goes in there.

Oh well, what's another few days and another $100 lol.

And now I need some big bolts on the end you say Dave


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## davebowk

Worn big ends can cause low oil pressure, but low oil pressure can cause worn big ends and everything else.
Just so you know.
You might as well replace the side thrust bearings while you're in there.


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## IPG3.6

Sounds like you have a much bigger job ahead of you Scottatx


Are you sure the rods aren't bent? 
Are the valves are seated properly (and not bent)?

Could be helpful to have a cheeky look up the rods from underneath to check on if they're bent or not. Also check thrust bearing if that's failed/dropped like in my video.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Sounds like you have a much bigger job ahead of you Scottatx
> 
> 
> Are you sure the rods aren't bent?
> Are the valves are seated properly (and not bent)?
> 
> Could be helpful to have a cheeky look up the rods from underneath to check on if they're bent or not. Also check thrust bearing if that's failed/dropped like in my video.


I took the head to machine shop... about 11 months ago They milled the bottom and replaced eight bent valves, after the water pump failed and timing belt slipped off. Long story. Since then I have replaced the rear main seal, all gaskets, turbo oil feed line... just got the head back from the machine shop again to take out the titanium turbo bolts to change the steel line...

Then made an emergency drive, stopped at a shop, master mechanic said I have "rod knock", so connecting rod bearing set coming tomorrow... going to replace those, put the oil pan back on and new baffler plate, cleaned the screen, all new Bosch fuel injectors, MAF sensor, plugs and coils, new Michelin Pilot Sport tires, brand new single-mass flywheel sport clutch...

I just did the head gasket again, Fel-Pro with copper spray and 100% correct torque sequence, felt perfect... 

The rods look normal to me... I have two separated and pushed up off to the side, ready for the new ones tomorrow. I'm not sure about anything in the head, just gotta trust the machine shop and see what happens.

*My latest questions:*
1) It actually drives fine, there is just low compression, which a master mechanic heard it running and said it was rod knock, cylinder 3 or 4, and that changing the connecting rod bearings would solve it, definitively. I am on an extreme budget, so am just changing the connecting rod bearings, and planned to try it after that. But one mechanic said that I should/need to change the main bearings too, another said that I do need to... so just going to start it after the conrod bearings and see if it runs correctly. May or may not use a compression tester before trying to start it... If that solves everything I will just be content, and come back to the rest. If still bad, I will change the main bearings, anything I can do from the bottom... If that does not get it running excellent I will come back and take the head off again and do the piston rings, etc.

Does that sound logical? Remember I am on an extreme budget, been working on this for 11 months straight, day and night. The timing is perfect, the two cylinder walls that I could see when the head was off were smooth as mirrors, perfect head gasket seal, zero binding or anything when hand-turning the crankshaft... simply low compression and rod knock, which the mechanic said was from the oil being watery/milky. 

Question is: The two middle conrod ends are low, see how I have the rods pushed up and set aside? What is the correct procedure to replace those, then crank the shaft so you can access and do the same to the other two? Which are way up high.

2) Compression tester? I'm just winging it, not the ideal sequence of events I know, but I guess I should compression test each cylinder only after I have the entire engine assembled. And if they all have the correct compression then? I assume I would then not need to change the main bearing set or the piston rings... and if the timing is correct and have full compression I assume it will start and run correctly this time, and I can mive on with my life.

3) Is there a "big picture" sequence of events/process/order of putting the oil pan back on, adding oil, etc., so that there is no condensation, and the oil does not become milky and ruin things again? One of these days I will have changed enough parts so that it starts, runs, the oil remains clear, zero leaks, etc. Trying to prevent a crucial mistake this time, if I need to flush the oil again first, anything that will make it correct and run this time...


Then I need to replace the cam bearing cap that broke, that I secured with washers very well and trust it to hold, but still will replace it.


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## scottatx

Do I need to remove the cylinder head to change the main bearings? I'm almost done with the connecting rod bearings.


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## davebowk

On some cars they can be slid inplace pushing the old one out as it goes in. look for videos on youtube. If they won't then it will be gearbox off for starters.
Isn't it about time you thought about just replacing the engine.
Did you have a badly worn bearing?


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> On some cars they can be slid inplace pushing the old one out as it goes in. look for videos on youtube. If they won't then it will be gearbox off for starters.
> Isn't it about time you thought about just replacing the engine.
> Did you have a badly worn bearing?


Couldn't find a single procedure or video about changing the main bearings on YouTube. I already have the connecting rod bearings changed and a new baffler plate, cleaned the screen and put the oil pan back on...

I'm working with about 200 bucks left until I get a new website project. I've been solely focused on this. The master mechanic that identified it as rod knock said it was for sure, definitively, the connecting rod bearings, so I changed those. I was going to see what happened and then change the main bearings if I can get to them without taking the head off. Taking the oil out and putting the pan on an off is no problem.

If It sounds the same, or still has low compression, or anything, I may just take the oil pan off again and change the main bearings and thrust washers.

At any stage I will probably do a compression test, and if after changing anything that I can access from the bottom, It still sounds the same with low compression, or after I do a compression test, if there is a problem and I need to take the head off again I will do that and change the piston rings or whatever's necessary...

I never need a new I never need a new engine cause mine was running like a Ferrari. The water pump failed and timing belt frayed and slipped a gear and I thought I was going to spend 2 days fixing that and 11 months later I just went down the rabbit hole one thing led to another and all kinds of stuff failed at once.

Now while I get a new engine when I'm too bald to wait from being done. I suppose if I royally screwed it all up I would get something and I recently learned that the engine is just the lower block not everything and is probably more affordable I think. And there could be a surfacing level issue on the top cylinder walls but I'm not sure I'm pretty sure I have a perfect head gasket seal.

Put helicoils in all the motor mountain bolt holes so all of that is perfectly firm. Going to change the power steering fluid with synthetic so it doesn't whne and we'll see what happens tomorrow, but I probably have a compression issue as well as whatever these connecting rod bearings resolve.

. I didn't see any badly worn bearing or bent rods, everything looked good up there, It kind of sounded like cylinder 4 made a hissing noise when I pushed the connecting rod up to stage it to put the bearing in it and then when you pull it back down made like a hissing noise and when you hand turn the crank you can hear a hissing maybe that is obviously a huge piston leak..


----------



## Scooterat

scottatx said:


> Couldn't find a single procedure or video about changing the main bearings on YouTube. I already have the connecting rod bearings changed and a new baffler plate, cleaned the screen and put the oil pan back on...
> 
> I'm working with about 200 bucks left until I get a new website project. I've been solely focused on this. The master mechanic that identified it as rod knock said it was for sure, definitively, the connecting rod bearings, so I changed those. I was going to see what happened and then change the main bearings if I can get to them without taking the head off. Taking the oil out and putting the pan on an off is no problem.
> 
> If It sounds the same, or still has low compression, or anything, I may just take the oil pan off again and change the main bearings and thrust washers.
> 
> At any stage I will probably do a compression test, and if after changing anything that I can access from the bottom, It still sounds the same with low compression, or after I do a compression test, if there is a problem and I need to take the head off again I will do that and change the piston rings or whatever's necessary...
> 
> I never need a new I never need a new engine cause mine was running like a Ferrari. The water pump failed and timing belt frayed and slipped a gear and I thought I was going to spend 2 days fixing that and 11 months later I just went down the rabbit hole one thing led to another and all kinds of stuff failed at once.
> 
> Now while I get a new engine when I'm too bald to wait from being done. I suppose if I royally screwed it all up I would get something and I recently learned that the engine is just the lower block not everything and is probably more affordable I think. And there could be a surfacing level issue on the top cylinder walls but I'm not sure I'm pretty sure I have a perfect head gasket seal.
> 
> Put helicoils in all the motor mountain bolt holes so all of that is perfectly firm. Going to change the power steering fluid with synthetic so it doesn't whne and we'll see what happens tomorrow, but I probably have a compression issue as well as whatever these connecting rod bearings resolve.
> 
> . I didn't see any badly worn bearing or bent rods, everything looked good up there, It kind of sounded like cylinder 4 made a hissing noise when I pushed the connecting rod up to stage it to put the bearing in it and then when you pull it back down made like a hissing noise and when you hand turn the crank you can hear a hissing maybe that is obviously a huge piston leak..


Hi just spent some time reading through this monster of a thread and IMO it would be far more economical to stop trying to repair the engine you have and look at dropping in a second hand engine.

God knows what damage has been caused from running the engine with loose cam caps, you'd need a new head if you've stripped threads for the cam caps, Being as you've broken a cam cap you would need to have it bored, not sure on US pricing but UK prices this would already be around roughly £800 from some quick googling.

There are some used running BAM engines listed for £650 on ebay, again prices might differ in the US.

I think the power steering fluid is the least of your worries at this current time.

But if you're still set on trying to rebuild your current engine, what are the questions you have now, there isn't really a specific question you've asked here.


----------



## scottatx

Scooterat said:


> Hi just spent some time reading through this monster of a thread and IMO it would be far more economical to stop trying to repair the engine you have and look at dropping in a second hand engine.
> 
> God knows what damage has been caused from running the engine with loose cam caps, you'd need a new head if you've stripped threads for the cam caps, Being as you've broken a cam cap you would need to have it bored, not sure on US pricing but UK prices this would already be around roughly £800 from some quick googling.
> 
> There are some used running BAM engines listed for £650 on ebay, again prices might differ in the US.
> 
> I think the power steering fluid is the least of your worries at this current time.
> 
> But if you're still set on trying to rebuild your current engine, what are the questions you have now, there isn't really a specific question you've asked here.


Well that's worst case scenario if nothing I do solves it, But man I have put so much money and time into this it's crazy... Because it started out as just a water pump, I thought it was going to take two days and then just went down the rabbit hole of a 100 parts to change. 

I was just gathering a big picture confirmation, or just some advice, so that was your advice, thanks

If all else fails I would definitely store it somewhere and regroup and come back to it and do something like you suggested, it's a 2001 TT quattro, AMU. Vin: TRUUT28N811039425.

I just did all the connecting rod bearings, put the oil pan back on, filled it with full synthetic oil, started it, and I can't really tell, it sounds like it runs fine, but the expected power steering leak, And one of the wires was broken to the power steering sensor so just got another plug and I'm about to replace that.

So once I have my steering back I think I'm actually going to just go for a test drive down the street.

I never read or knew or heard anyone ever mention that the cam bearing caps are so specific and one of a kind I guess, while I was putting it together... I have decades of experience in industrial micro-electronics and just technical things in general, from being raised by a Navy lieutenant stepfather, so I kind of depend on my logic sometimes, and it seemed like you can just order a new cap off Amazon or somewhere and put it in.

Oh well we'll see what happens, I have a few more sequence of events to go through.

If they all fail I will get a rebuilt engine because I think the rest is pretty darn perfect and brand new.

Not a specific question, just basically seeing if anyone agrees with me or confirms the big picture. Not the way I'd want to do it either but like I said just a gigantic year-long money pit rabbit hole, can't wait until it's over.

After I get my steering back and possibly go for a test drive, if it has low compression, I'll do a compression test on each cylinder and take it from there. It would be hell to take the head off again and change the piston rings and stuff like that, but if I have to do it I'll do it.


----------



## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> 2) Compression tester? I'm just winging it,


Test - don't guess. If you had tested you will know exactly which cylinder/rod assembly hardware to examine further. 




scottatx said:


> Question is: The two middle conrod ends are low, see how I have the rods pushed up and set aside? What is the correct procedure to replace those, then crank the shaft so you can access and do the same to the other two? Which are way up high.


Here's how to change conrod bearings and shows how you change a pair when they're at the low point and then you torque them up. Then you go ahead and crank the engine to rotate so you can access the other two. 







scottatx said:


>


Your thrust washers are hanging out. Much worse than mine were when I was investigating my dead engine!! My opinion of your bigger picture 

use a Bentley manual or ElsaWin and follow it to the T when doing the following 
Oil pan, oil pump off
Gearbox off
Remove clutch kit
Remove rear main seal
Disconnect rods and remove bearings 
Remove the crank 
You'll need to have the crank inspected for wear on the journals 
Then you work from there as per engineer's measurements. You might need oversized crank journal bearings. 
You'll need to replace the thrust washers along with all the crank bolts with new hardware
Work your way backward, follow the manual, to rebuild the bottom end and gearbox back on etc ...

OR 


replace the whole engine with a known working second hand one.
use a Bentley manual or ElsaWin and follow it to the T when installing the replacement 
Take all your new things that you've bought and keep as spares for future (timing kit, rod stuff, fluids) 
Ditch the old engine or keep it to build up one day


----------



## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Test - don't guess. If you had tested you will know exactly which cylinder/rod assembly hardware to examine further.
> 
> 
> 
> Here's how to change conrod bearings and shows how you change a pair when they're at the low point and then you torque them up. Then you go ahead and crank the engine to rotate so you can access the other two.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your thrust washers are hanging out. Much worse than mine were when I was investigating my dead engine!! My opinion of your bigger picture
> 
> use a Bentley manual or ElsaWin and follow it to the T when doing the following
> Oil pan, oil pump off
> Gearbox off
> Remove clutch kit
> Remove rear main seal
> Disconnect rods and remove bearings
> Remove the crank
> You'll need to have the crank inspected for wear on the journals
> Then you work from there as per engineer's measurements. You might need oversized crank journal bearings.
> You'll need to replace the thrust washers along with all the crank bolts with new hardware
> Work your way backward, follow the manual, to rebuild the bottom end and gearbox back on etc ...
> 
> OR
> 
> 
> replace the whole engine with a known working second hand one.
> use a Bentley manual or ElsaWin and follow it to the T when installing the replacement
> Take all your new things that you've bought and keep as spares for future (timing kit, rod stuff, fluids)
> Ditch the old engine or keep it to build up one day


Thank you, this is great information. I never wanted to or imagined that I would get to this point. I thought I was going to replace the timing belt kit with an ECS tuning water pump and timing belt kit and be done in two days.

It was running like a frigging Ferrari, so I can't imagine that I'd have to start all over, and pay attention to so many technically specific details that weren't affected... but I'm not a mechanic, maybe everything was affected. I had eight bent valves replaced and the bottom milled, and just did a very successful 2nd head gasket change. New plugs, new coils, new sensors everywhere, the main problem was the timing belt and head of course, and then the hole that I created in the turbo oil feed line which I just replaced, and all the turbo bolts, and everything everywhere, basically... Changed the rear main seal, I have a brand new $2,200 Valeo sport clutch, Diesel Geek sent me a brand new shift stick, traded for my bad one so he could research a problem and develop a product...

So I have a lot invested in this... it's the funniest thing I ever do... and kind of becomes your whole personality. I can't even imagine driving it with perfect shifting, plastic welded the whole front bumper, sealed and cleaned the convertible top, looks 10 times better...

And the main problem here is my budget. I lost everything I own and have been focused on this for a year, so now I'm just working with dollars until I get my next projects.

I just can't imagine that the water pump and timing belt going out, could destroy everything that you mentioned... crank journals, thrust washers... or is it _all_ just old? I'm just trying to fix the single items that is causing my car not to run like it used to lol. Obviously much more difficult than I imagined, but it is getting much better...

And I mean, I just looked at a few rebuilt engines online, and mine looks a 100 times better than any of them. And I'm not an idiot, I can kind of feel, and tell, do 90 hours of research sometimes to find a bolt or something, I'm not just guessing at this stuff. I'm calling up shops, getting help...

So most recently, a "master mechanic" heard my engine when I started it and definitively identified it as the conrod bearings, so that was my mission, to change those. Mission accomplished. The thrust washers... I'm not sure if they were "hanging out", those endcaps go back on, and there's tabs and go right over the thrust washers, and it can only go in one way and it all fits back together... so if they were hanging out they're not hanging anymore, right?

But this is a perfect example of my entire past year, you just do your research from trustworthy people, and you think you can identify the main part to fix the problem, then it just never is the final solution. Then you ask somebody else, and they identify it, Then you go change that then you add 20 more things to change and ask another person and do 90 more hours of research....

I didn't do a compression test yet because I'm on an emergency crucial budget until I get my next Web development projects, which I can't even think about until this amazing vehicle is operating... And if a master mechanic tells me that the conrd bearings will fix this problem then I'm just going to change the conrod bearings. Then I went back to ask some general questions, and he said that nothing I do from the bottom or any bearings has any affect on the compression, and that was my original problem that I came to them about, so everything is exactly like this scenario... just complicated and have to fight your way through it.

So now I plan on just adding some power steering fluid that I lost, after fixing the sensor, and doing a compression test. And my layman's logical mind was hoping that the next worst case scenario was just changing the piston rings or something.

Every Everything was completely perfect I can't imagine I'd have any serious problems with the gearbox or anything around it or any of that stuff, and like I said, I have about 15 years of heavy industrial electronics experience, and I didn't just take the cam caps off and rearrange them or anything... I remembered where they were, coiled stripped bolt holes, put them back on torqued them... so they should be exactly as if nothing ever happened.

So now I'm just still being pathologically optimistic, and feel like I can identify the single issue wrong, so I can get my compression back, and have a car to drive.

I just Meguier Utimate Compounded it last night. I keep it perfect on the outside to pretend like it's still runs









Quick Share


Expired




linksharing.samsungcloud.com


----------



## Scooterat

scottatx said:


> Thank you, this is great information. I never wanted to or imagined that I would get to this point. I thought I was going to replace the timing belt kit with an ECS tuning water pump and timing belt kit and be done in two days.
> 
> It was running like a frigging Ferrari, so I can't imagine that I'd have to start all over, and pay attention to so many technically specific details that weren't affected... but I'm not a mechanic, maybe everything was affected. I had eight bent valves replaced and the bottom milled, and just did a very successful 2nd head gasket change. New plugs, new coils, new sensors everywhere, the main problem was the timing belt and head of course, and then the hole that I created in the turbo oil feed line which I just replaced, and all the turbo bolts, and everything everywhere, basically... Changed the rear main seal, I have a brand new $2,200 Valeo sport clutch, Diesel Geek sent me a brand new shift stick, traded for my bad one so he could research a problem and develop a product...
> 
> So I have a lot invested in this... it's the funniest thing I ever do... and kind of becomes your whole personality. I can't even imagine driving it with perfect shifting, plastic welded the whole front bumper, sealed and cleaned the convertible top, looks 10 times better...
> 
> And the main problem here is my budget. I lost everything I own and have been focused on this for a year, so now I'm just working with dollars until I get my next projects.
> 
> I just can't imagine that the water pump and timing belt going out, could destroy everything that you mentioned... crank journals, thrust washers... or is it _all_ just old? I'm just trying to fix the single items that is causing my car not to run like it used to lol. Obviously much more difficult than I imagined, but it is getting much better...
> 
> And I mean, I just looked at a few rebuilt engines online, and mine looks a 100 times better than any of them. And I'm not an idiot, I can kind of feel, and tell, do 90 hours of research sometimes to find a bolt or something, I'm not just guessing at this stuff. I'm calling up shops, getting help...
> 
> So most recently, a "master mechanic" heard my engine when I started it and definitively identified it as the conrod bearings, so that was my mission, to change those. Mission accomplished. The thrust washers... I'm not sure if they were "hanging out", those endcaps go back on, and there's tabs and go right over the thrust washers, and it can only go in one way and it all fits back together... so if they were hanging out they're not hanging anymore, right?
> 
> But this is a perfect example of my entire past year, you just do your research from trustworthy people, and you think you can identify the main part to fix the problem, then it just never is the final solution. Then you ask somebody else, and they identify it, Then you go change that then you add 20 more things to change and ask another person and do 90 more hours of research....
> 
> I didn't do a compression test yet because I'm on an emergency crucial budget until I get my next Web development projects, which I can't even think about until this amazing vehicle is operating... And if a master mechanic tells me that the conrd bearings will fix this problem then I'm just going to change the conrod bearings. Then I went back to ask some general questions, and he said that nothing I do from the bottom or any bearings has any affect on the compression, and that was my original problem that I came to them about, so everything is exactly like this scenario... just complicated and have to fight your way through it.
> 
> So now I plan on just adding some power steering fluid that I lost, after fixing the sensor, and doing a compression test. And my layman's logical mind was hoping that the next worst case scenario was just changing the piston rings or something.
> 
> Every Everything was completely perfect I can't imagine I'd have any serious problems with the gearbox or anything around it or any of that stuff, and like I said, I have about 15 years of heavy industrial electronics experience, and I didn't just take the cam caps off and rearrange them or anything... I remembered where they were, coiled stripped bolt holes, put them back on torqued them... so they should be exactly as if nothing ever happened.
> 
> So now I'm just still being pathologically optimistic, and feel like I can identify the single issue wrong, so I can get my compression back, and have a car to drive.
> 
> I just Meguier Utimate Compounded it last night. I keep it perfect on the outside to pretend like it's still runs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quick Share
> 
> 
> Expired
> 
> 
> 
> 
> linksharing.samsungcloud.com


 "I just can't imagine that the water pump and timing belt going out, could destroy everything that you mentioned... crank journals, thrust washers... or is it _all_ just old? I'm just trying to fix the single items that is causing my car not to run like it used to lol. Obviously much more difficult than I imagined, but it is getting much better... " 

Interference engine so the engine going out of time while running is going to cause a lot of damage, Pistons hitting valves, If this happened to an engine I owned it would either be fully inspected and rebuilt in it's entirety, or I would drop in second hand engine.

It's simply not worth taking the risk of rebuilding a single element (The head in your case) of an engine that has suffered catastrophic engine failure, as unless it's been inspected, tolerances measured etc, you don't know how this has impacted other parts of the engine , engine knock as an example that applies in your situation.

You say you're on a tight budget, but you've spent an unreal amount of money on the engine already +you've got a $2k clutch sitting around.

I think you need to take a step back and think about what the easiest route to your end goal is.

Your end goal is to get the car running well and in a usable state, what's the easiest way to achieve this?

Ripping an engine apart and finding more and more problems, or dropping in an already running power plant?


----------



## scottatx

Scooterat said:


> "I just can't imagine that the water pump and timing belt going out, could destroy everything that you mentioned... crank journals, thrust washers... or is it _all_ just old? I'm just trying to fix the single items that is causing my car not to run like it used to lol. Obviously much more difficult than I imagined, but it is getting much better... "
> 
> Interference engine so the engine going out of time while running is going to cause a lot of damage, Pistons hitting valves, If this happened to an engine I owned it would either be fully inspected and rebuilt in it's entirety, or I would drop in second hand engine.
> 
> It's simply not worth taking the risk of rebuilding a single element (The head in your case) of an engine that has suffered catastrophic engine failure, as unless it's been inspected, tolerances measured etc, you don't know how this has impacted other parts of the engine , engine knock as an example that applies in your situation.
> 
> You say you're on a tight budget, but you've spent an unreal amount of money on the engine already +you've got a $2k clutch sitting around.
> 
> I think you need to take a step back and think about what the easiest route to your end goal is.
> 
> Your end goal is to get the car running well and in a usable state, what's the easiest way to achieve this?
> 
> Ripping an engine apart and finding more and more problems, or dropping in an already running power plant?


What if you have already completed plan A in that last sentence? 

Hindsight's 20/20 of course... I thought I was just installing a timing belt kit.

I already had a catastrophic engine failure in California, and a shop did a valve job, rebuilt head and there was no damage to the engine, pistons, anything like that... so this time nothing has been catastrophic. And now I've done the connecting rod bearings, new baffler recirculation plate, cleaned the screen... and it's getting 5 times better every time I do something that someone instructs me when I ask them for assistance... so it just seems like that if I changed the piston rings or something that it would finally be fixed, but I get what you're saying, of course in my position you just want to keep going and finish it and be successful... But I'm about to come to a fork in the road and will make the grand decision on what to do next. Already started researching, I looked for rebuilt block and they looked like they were found in a gutter somewhere compared to mine...

I think I'm going to try a few more things, do a compression test on each cylinder, and I guess that should tell me which direction to take next. Thanks for all your help and thoughtful information.

If I had known then what I know now, I'd probably take it to the shop, but you have to have $2k to $5k up front, and I thought I was just gonna install a new timing belt kit and be done with it. I can do that in my sleep, but all the original larger problems kept me guessing and chasing parts.

And I ask people things to verify them if I take shortcuts, I don't just thrower than together stupidly. Like I think in this thread I was concerned that 1 Pole broke off the chain tensioner and someone said that hes seeing people run them with no Poles or wouldn't broken off so it sounded like it was no problem. If I could just get the compression issue resolved I could fix the other minor stuff.

I have the timing correct just change the conrod bearings I don't think anything of that has to do with compression so I should have resolved the compression 1st but nobody mentioned any of that to me as I was getting the bent valves replaced, and doing every other thing that I've mentioned in this thread, so that would have been helpful

Anyway, this is what happens when you just have to figure things out.

And who's to say that, once I reach the end of this next phase here tonight, that I don't just take the head off and change the piston rings and everything that I need to change, and put it all back together? that would be cheaper and better than buying a new block, and still have to install everything, do the head gasket again, assemble the whole entire thing all over again...

So I can't help but optimistically think, that everything I've done is fairly certainly good work, and now I just need to use the correct diagnostic tools to identify the exact problem at this point. I understand... also, it's easy to say "just drop in a new engine", but I sold my soul and traded everything I own for the work And parts that I have already done, so we'll see what happens here very very soon!  thank you


----------



## Scooterat

scottatx said:


> What if you have already completed plan A in that last sentence?
> 
> Hindsight's 20/20 of course... I thought I was just installing a timing belt kit.
> 
> I already had a catastrophic engine failure in California, and a shop did a valve job, rebuilt head and there was no damage to the engine, pistons, anything like that... so this time nothing has been catastrophic. And now I've done the connecting rod bearings, new baffler recirculation plate, cleaned the screen... and it's getting 5 times better every time I do something that someone instructs me when I ask them for assistance... so it just seems like that if I changed the piston rings or something that it would finally be fixed, but I get what you're saying, of course in my position you just want to keep going and finish it and be successful... But I'm about to come to a fork in the road and will make the grand decision on what to do next. Already started researching, I looked for rebuilt block and they looked like they were found in a gutter somewhere compared to mine...
> 
> I think I'm going to try a few more things, do a compression test on each cylinder, and I guess that should tell me which direction to take next. Thanks for all your help and thoughtful information.
> 
> If I had known then what I know now, I'd probably take it to the shop, but you have to have $2k to $5k up front, and I thought I was just gonna install a new timing belt kit and be done with it. I can do that in my sleep, but all the original larger problems kept me guessing and chasing parts.
> 
> And I ask people things to verify them if I take shortcuts, I don't just thrower than together stupidly. Like I think in this thread I was concerned that 1 Pole broke off the chain tensioner and someone said that hes seeing people run them with no Poles or wouldn't broken off so it sounded like it was no problem. If I could just get the compression issue resolved I could fix the other minor stuff.
> 
> I have the timing correct just change the conrod bearings I don't think anything of that has to do with compression so I should have resolved the compression 1st but nobody mentioned any of that to me as I was getting the bent valves replaced, and doing every other thing that I've mentioned in this thread, so that would have been helpful
> 
> Anyway, this is what happens when you just have to figure things out.
> 
> And who's to say that, once I reach the end of this next phase here tonight, that I don't just take the head off and change the piston rings and everything that I need to change, and put it all back together? that would be cheaper and better than buying a new block, and still have to install everything, do the head gasket again, assemble the whole entire thing all over again...
> 
> So I can't help but optimistically think, that everything I've done is fairly certainly good work, and now I just need to use the correct diagnostic tools to identify the exact problem at this point. I understand... also, it's easy to say "just drop in a new engine", but I sold my soul and traded everything I own for the work And parts that I have already done, so we'll see what happens here very very soon!  thank you


Just playing devils advocate here, There are too many variables changing at once to get an accurate picture of what is going on.

How do you know you have a compression issue if you haven't compression tested it?

To do this you would need to turn the engine over which I personally wouldn't even attempt with cams that weren't bolted down.

Engines are precision machinery and every single part has to be torqued to spec and to the correct tolerance otherwise you will indefinitely damage the engine.


----------



## scottatx

Scooterat said:


> "I just can't imagine that the water pump and timing belt going out, could destroy everything that you mentioned... crank journals, thrust washers... or is it _all_ just old? I'm just trying to fix the single items that is causing my car not to run like it used to lol. Obviously much more difficult than I imagined, but it is getting much better... "
> 
> Interference engine so the engine going out of time while running is going to cause a lot of damage, Pistons hitting valves, If this happened to an engine I owned it would either be fully inspected and rebuilt in it's entirety, or I would drop in second hand engine.
> 
> It's simply not worth taking the risk of rebuilding a single element (The head in your case) of an engine that has suffered catastrophic engine failure, as unless it's been inspected, tolerances measured etc, you don't know how this has impacted other parts of the engine , engine knock as an example that applies in your situation.
> 
> You say you're on a tight budget, but you've spent an unreal amount of money on the engine already +you've got a $2k clutch sitting around.
> 
> I think you need to take a step back and think about what the easiest route to your end goal is.
> 
> Your end goal is to get the car running well and in a usable state, what's the easiest way to achieve this?
> 
> Ripping an engine apart and finding more and more problems, or dropping in an already running power plant?


I think it obviously has low compression, It sputters and when you step on the gas it just doesn't have full power, and my mechanic neighbor diagnosed it, he unplugged the fuel injectors and we cranked it over, and a little drop in the starting sound made him definitively say that it was low compression.

Then by the time I drove down the street and pulled over at a shop that I go to, you could hear the rod knock, that only started then, So fairly certain that nothing has caused catastrophic cylinder wall damage or anything major like that... Everything looked great... but I'm about to stop depending on my own logic and do a compression test and get more focused. I just got the head back from the machine shop again so I was pretty sure that I was home free if I just changed the connecting rod bearings.


----------



## scottatx

Quick question. I'm still wandering around trying to fix this. I replaced the connecting rod bearings. My next step was to do a compression test... It actually runs OK except for being at about half power, I have zero leaks, holds coolant, oil is crystal clear, zero oil goes down, Just runs rough and what appears to be low compression based on what a mechanic said in my apartments.

But I took it by German auto center and the manager listened to it for about 5 minutes and said it sounds like a "single miss" and that I should check the spark plug gaps. I have new NGK iridium plugs which I gapped, or at least double-checked the pre-gap to .032.

But then I read a quite detailed article, the guy said that .028 would be ideal for this car and plug. 

I'm trying to do anything I can... Do you think that changing the spark plug gap to .028 could magically solve all of this, and make the engine run correctly and normally again? Because the pistons looked good, everything looked good, and I don't think that I could have done that much damage to cause low compression or piston damage... I know it is not that simple and could be a number of things, I'm still just hoping for the best and doing whatever I can.

Could it be acting like low compression, and if I set the spark plug gaps to .028 solve this, and make such a difference to make it run correctly? Assuming that everything else is correct?

If not, I'm trying to get it into a shop. Just doing whatever I possibly can first.


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## B5NUT

It won't be the plug gap. These were the ones I took out of my TT. Don't think anyone had changed them in years and the gap was massive, but the engine was still running fine.


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## scottatx

Thanks, got a payment now back in action...Obviously I think, compression test next.

Another thing, some rattle or shifting/knocking coming from right of flywheel area, under battery, thought it was just a bracket loose, but maybe more?

Goes away when clutch is pressed down as shown in video: Brand new Valeo sport clutch, took off flywheel, plate, etc. when changing rear main seal.... maybe something wrong with that assembly? Or could be a line bracket, but makes specific rattle shaking noise when pressing in/out clutch pedal:

Sideways video, clutch rattle when depressed (no pun intended.) #audittmk1🏁








Scott Arthur Lewis on Instagram: "Sideways video, clutch rattle when depressed (no pun intended.) #audittmk1🏁"


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## scottatx

Loud Loud shimmy and rubbing noise coming from flywheel area I hope I didn't put the plate on wrong or something you know I was pretty darn careful....


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## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> compression test next.


Yeah this and add a leak down test to the list. Get this done pronto to determine where the low compression is and what's causing it.



scottatx said:


> Another thing, some rattle or shifting/knocking coming from right of flywheel area, under battery, thought it was just a bracket loose, but maybe more?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Scott Arthur Lewis on Instagram: "Sideways video, clutch rattle when depressed (no pun intended.) #audittmk1🏁"
> 
> 
> Scott Arthur Lewis shared a post on Instagram: "Sideways video, clutch rattle when depressed (no pun intended.) #audittmk1🏁". Follow their account to see 2617 posts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.instagram.com


Are you using a single mass flywheel? If so that's normal.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Yeah this and add a leak down test to the list. Get this done pronto to determine where the low compression is and what's causing it.
> 
> 
> Are you using a single mass flywheel? If so that's normal.


Yes brand new Valeo sport clutch single mass flywheel but it was very smooth and different, there's obviously some big shaking, rubbing noise... I took the plate and flywheel off to change the rear main seal. I'm pretty sure I put it back on right, there's only one way to do it, and torque all the nuts...

Going to remove some stuff and check my motor mount bolts, and check the timing... Then probably do a compression test right now. But other than that I'm cruising around, just did a 100 on the highway, Engine doesn't even get hot... just got this compression problem.

But there is like a shimmy and rubbing and clicking and then whenever you push the clutch in the clicking goes away but when you drive it's just a loud rubbing shimming sound...


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## scottatx

Okay... remember that I'm mechanical, but not an Audi mechanic

I put some compression additive in, just to see if it improved things and it definitely did. I'm driving around a 100 miles an hour, I can go 40 miles at 80mph, come back and the engine isn't even barely hot.

I need to just not think about any rattles or any clutch movement or anything until I perfectly coil and fix the motor mount bolts. Then do a compression test.

The timing marks are perfect, and just noticed this little cut on the belt, so looks like I'll have to do the whole timing belt all over again. Oh well. I have to lower the engine anyway and coil the passenger side motor mount bolts, so I'll just do the timing too with a brand new one and put all the covers on.

Then or at any time, do a compression test, I'll record the numbers here, but I wonder what worst case scenario is, or best case...

Right now it's just like driving a golf cart, no boost, just have to pick up speed and go, but at least it's drivable, I read it doesn't harm anything...

Which reminds me, stupid question, but how do you even know if the Turbo is working? And why does my engine say 1.8L everywhere when it's a Turbo 225 horsepower? Isn't that supposed to be a 1.8T?

So many questions. So little time😃









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## scottatx

At least it looks good😄









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## scottatx

Here's my plugs, just cleaning and checking stuff for comp test, A couple are oxidized a couple look new that should tell something.









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## magwych

scottatx said:


> Here's my plugs, just cleaning and checking stuff for comp test, A couple are oxidized a couple look new that should tell something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quick Share
> 
> 
> 1 file (3.2 MB)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> linksharing.samsungcloud.com


2nd from the right looks like it has never ignited anything. To my mind there is either no spark or the injector is not working.


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## scottatx

magwych said:


> 2nd from the right looks like it has never ignited anything. To my mind there is either no spark or the injector is not working.


Hmm. Thanks. I did replace the coil connectors with some that I bought online so I should check my crimp jobs and all the wire connections in the electrical harness. I have four new Bosch fuel injectors and those are seated good, Maybe the coil isn't even connected fully, I'll check it out


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## scottatx

magwych said:


> 2nd from the right looks like it has never ignited anything. To my mind there is either no spark or the injector is not working.


Well I took out all the fuel injectors, cleaned everything, put the fuel rail back in perfectly, took out the coils and plugs, cleaned everything, redid four connection wires in the harness and the two ground wires... Getting better with everything I do, but still running at about half power. If cylinder 3 wasn't firing at all what else could it be besides a plug or a coil? And I swapped them around, so how can I tell which cylinder isn't firing?

I guess I need to actually test each coil with a meter, or maybe one of the plugs is faulty... But feels like I'm on the right path, because I can't really foresee any cylinder damage or anything. I didn't let things get damaged like that.

So before I do a compression test, I think I need to make sure all 4 plugs and all 4 coils actually work, right? And make sure there is correct voltage coming from the connectors to the coils...


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## scottatx

Loss of power, whining noise... I also have all the symptoms of a blown Turbo, How can I check the Turbo to make sure it is working?

When I took it all apart I cleaned out the inside of the Turbo with penetrating spray, rinsed everything out with warm soapy water then rinsed it all out just hot water, let it dry completely... I tapped the spindle a few times because I was trying to tighten it but learned that you can't do that... Also had a leak in the Turbo oil feed line so that is brand new...

But I'm basically driving around except I have loss of power and a whining noise.

Waiting for a payment to continue on with this saga/nightmare.

I need to make sure the Turbo is working somehow, and do a compression test.


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## scottatx

Must. Find. Problem😫😎









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## magwych

@scottatx you have been yalking about doung a compression test since the fitst days of november. It was syggested to you bacj at tbe end of august. Do you think it moght be good idea to get on with it ?
Regarding the whine, is it in time with engine speed? You recently memtioned that the timing belt is damaged, that could be the source of the noise. If it is not replaced, that belt could also be the reason for your next rebuild ;-)


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## scottatx

magwych said:


> @scottatx you have been yalking about doung a compression test since the fitst days of november. It was syggested to you bacj at tbe end of august. Do you think it moght be good idea to get on with it ?
> Regarding the whine, is it in time with engine speed? You recently memtioned that the timing belt is damaged, that could be the source of the noise. If it is not replaced, that belt could also be the reason for your next rebuild ;-)


Just lost a bunch of information

I know. I'm just still going down the trail of variables to remove before I do the compression test. Like the last poster said cylinder 3 spark plug has never even ignited, so I just checked all that out, Still at about half power, but cruising around on the highway at 90, perfect temperatures...

Today, Tues: Coil the two 12mm mount bolt holes, get engine perfectly bolted, level, 1/2" gap on pass side. Comp test. Test coils and connectors to coils with meter. Still not even sure if the Turbo is functioning.

* Lingering issue: I left a flat red large seal/bushing off the gearbox, There is that large flat red clear one and two small round lime green ones, It was an emergency situation, and a mechanic said leave it off so I did, $50 new... Getting a payment today so moving ahead, But wonder if leaving that large flat red seal off the gearbox is affecting anything? When I took the gearbox off that red one was torn in half and useless so I just tossed it.

I guess I should pick up a new replacement Gates timing built at Advance Auto Parts since this one has that little cut in it and do that while I have the engine lowered to fix the motor mount bolts. The winding is just a big grinding rubbing winding but it's probably because the engine isn't level and secure.

Looks like I'll be living in this bowling alley parking lot for a few more days lol. But I've hand cranked the crank shaft and the timing marks lineup perfectly. I'm getting pretty good at doing the timing

Diablito III will ride again.









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## IPG3.6

scottatx said:


> Loss of power, whining noise... I also have all the symptoms of a blown Turbo,


This is the gift that keeps on giving! It is coming up to Christmas after all - your TT knows it 😉


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## scottatx

Definitely found the problem. Never let a friend try to tighten up your dogmount bolts in the middle of the night and then never check it. I knew all this had to be re-adressed but yes, sheered off, gearbox or differential (?) was rubbing and hanging and turned into a soft cloth-like substance, Is this one piece that I can replace?

So looks like I need to just jack up and level the engine and put every single dog bone and engine mount bolt in perfectly and correctly, first. Doing timing and timing belt in tandem...

Then compression test, test coils with meter

Man, glad I'm alive. I think it just got like that one out of the past 4 or 5 days. And everything I do, harness connections, etc., improves the driving, so, obviously I need to fix every single mount bolt and new timing belt and take it from there.

Embarrassing, but, just almost every week for the past 6 months has been an emergency situation. It's been pretty crazy actually. I just hope I didn't do any catastrophic or $1,000+ damage...

I probably need a new motor mount too, with the rubber part in it.









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## scottatx

Done with timing belt and engine mount bolts, car won't drive in forward or reverse, like the brakes are stuck, but probably has a lot to do with the damage in the photos above.
Guess I need to fully inspect that cylinder connecting the drive shaft to the gearbox because it got totally rubbed out and damaged....


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## auspicious_character

If you're driving around with a lose bolts from the dogbone to the gearbox you will ream out the threads..

Hello helicoil.


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## scottatx

auspicious_character said:


> If you're driving around with a lose bolts from the dogbone to the gearbox you will ream out the threads..
> 
> Hello helicoil.





auspicious_character said:


> If you're driving around with a lose bolts from the dogbone to the gearbox you will ream out the threads..
> 
> Hello helicoil.


Yes and the bolts to the subframe aren't holding even with coils so have to think of a solution.

But hopefully making the engine and driveshaft meet there, and getting all the dogbone mount bolts in securely will make the car drive forward and backward again, like the shaft isn't set into the gearbox all the way...

Or could be damage to the separator part in the photo above, bent, etc., right now I drive a few feet in either direction and car just halts like the brakes are stuck, something in that shaft/gearbox area preventing it from moving freely and driving. And right when it sounds good and drivable


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## mcak1964

Can't wait for the Christmas special....................................


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## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> Can't wait for the Christmas special....................................


Lol... Just put a jack under the gearbox which lifted the engine enough to meet the dog bone mount to the subframe... Got all bolts in securely and tight this time...

Now literally walking around looking for a jump so I can see if it drives.


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## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> Can't wait for the Christmas special....................................


This is what happens when you risk, gamble and lose every single thing that you own, along an 11 month long day and night crisis, chasing car part lists, about 20 at a time, because you love your Audi TT so much.


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## scottatx

Well got a jump and everything fixed and still have some type of drive shaft issue, from me driving around with the dogbone mount bolts out and the engine low... Going into reverse, step on the gas, and feels like the brakes are sticking, and a little banging and shifting... Put it in drive and it goes, it's just sometimes a knocking, like the shaft isn't fully in the gearbox or something like that, but I have all the engine mount bolts perfectly in place not sure what to do.

Maybe I bent that vertical cylinder piece with all the bolts in it that connect the drive shaft to the gearbox, because the outer edges were rubbing against a support bar and got totally damaged, like it was rubber rubbing against metal, you can see in the photos above...

Here's a few more...









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## scottatx

Pretty sure I have just aluminum heat shield shrapnel stuck inside of the bolts that ripped off, I'm trying to hammer them out...


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## scottatx

Great.

Went for a test drive, heard a little knocking and some squeaking from the drive shaft to gearbox area, and then all of a sudden the front wheels locked up and just came to a screeching halt. Tire smoke, black lines on the street... took about 20' or 30' to stop. Jacked it up, physical inspection, nothing different... then forced it to move in reverse, and then went forward slowly back to my parking spot... so something is jamming it up or not making contact or bent out of shape or something.


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## scottatx

Well I screwed up. I've never looked at the bottom when the engine mounts bolts had about 2 or 3" of space in them, and stripped out dog bone bolts... did damage obviously.

I put the jack under the gearbox itself and raised it up a little bit, so that the dogbone mount would meet the subframe and I could tighten all four bolts. Did that and went for a test drive and the front tires froze to a screeching halt in a fraction of a second and I skidded to a stop

Freed it by going in reverse which freed the axle then I could drive again. Now my next step was going to be take off the downpipe heat shield etc and re-seat the drive shaft into the gearbox spline... and remove all that heat shield debris shown in this photo, it gnawed everything up, but I'm pretty sure the drive shaft just isn't seated into the gearbox spline correctly. (?) 

If I jack the whole car and engine up it makes a little noise when I start it and put it into gears, but if I jack the gearbox up a little bit to meet the shaft and install the dogbone mount it gets quieter/better, but it may be catastrophic, something is loose, wrong, missing, something, maybe just not inserted correctly enough.









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## scottatx

I may have inadvertently with the things I've done made the car run 90% better... Revving it up isn't sputtering or anything, seems normal...

On jackstands right now, about to try to separate the drive shaft from the gearbox and seat it correctly, with the notch and everything, just make sure it's in there correctly and also the secret long bolt on the passenger side but I'm not sure how far to go, I'm pretty sure I just had the dog bone mount bolts loose and engine was down, so I hope that the drive shaft is simply not seated into the gearbox securely.

Whatever it was it just instantly caused the 2 front tires to seize and lock up, came to a 20' screeching halt with tire smoke and everything, Unstuck it by going in reverse then babied it back.

I was thinking the flywheel plate or something came off and flywheel, but if I jack the engine and gearbox up a little bit and start it and try to put it in drive or reverse it drives good, if I let it down it makes noises and has spots of resistance, so I think the solution is just to re-seat and put the bolts in place in the dogbone and make sure it's all level and stuff... (?) so doing that now











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## scottatx

Here's a sketch of the big round red flat washer I left out, Wonder how much that has anything to do with anything catastrophically happening like the front wheels seizing up instantly... About to find out I guess, taking it apart.









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## scottatx

Anyone care to help?

I thought I had it but then I was just about to drive 18 miles to downtown Austin, On the way out of the parking lot the same noises started happening in the drive shaft gearbox area and it starts freezing up and seizing... And then in reverse too, seizing, resistance... Then the only way I can get it unstuck and drivable is by forcing it into reverse and 1st back-and-forth like you're getting out of a mud puddle.... Then drives normally for a little bit until you hit a turn or big hill or something... Then start seizing up again and making crazy noises.

I'm guessing the only way out of this is to separate the drive shaft from the gearbox, as well as the two CV axles and the "secret" long bolt on the passenger side gearbox, and just re-seat and tighten everything, and make sure it is all tightened up... unless anybody knows anything that I am missing that could help me out of this situation, please.


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## scottatx

Definitely found the problem lol...

Coming back now to everything that I was... coming back to. New engine mount, power steering sensor, etc. 

Definitely caused some damage on my emergency test drives. Had to be done, now just going to fix it.

I need to insert the drive shaft into the transfer case correctly and perfectly, and that entails getting the dog bone mount bolted in securely and in position. 

As you can see in this little quick video the drive shaft is rattling around and there's a piece of metal rattling around in there with about quarter of it broken off. I guess I just need to separate the whole drive shaft out and inspect everything and replace anything that's broken, and correctly put it all back together.

That's a question if anybody cares to help me out... I can see the finish line at least.









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## davebowk

I think the transfer box might have to come off to fix that.


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I think the transfer box might have to come off to fix that.


 Isn't that a bearing or something, that loose piece of metal that's rattling around shown in the video? I just took all the weight off all the engine mount bolts, engine suspended on a jack, about to go one step up in bolt size and try to secure everything...

Or if I get my next payment within the next hour or two I'm just going to order a whole new engine mount and final drive seal.

But I think 80% of this is because the rubber in the engine mount has collapsed, which makes it not firm, so ends up just leaning and stripping bolts and coils...

Other than the 1/2" separation of the drive shaft from the transfer case because the engine mount bolts are stripped and I'm an idiot and live on the edge it actually runs pretty damn good.


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## davebowk

I think you need to cut your losses and buy a complete engine and gearbox. That thing is now only fit for the bin.


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## scottatx

davebowk said:


> I think you need to cut your losses and buy a complete engine and gearbox. That thing is now only fit for the bin.


So I just run out and buy a new engine and gearbox? Lol😎😃

Neh, everything is brand new. I've rebuilt every single electrical connection, the door locks, about 60 new parts...

Head gasket, everything is going great, zero leaks, oil is still crystal clear, coolant crystal clear and maintaining level. Brand new Michelin Pilot Sports tires, brand new $2,300 sport clutch, Gates racing timing belt, new shifter stick from Diesel Geek, traded him my wobbly one so he could develop a product from it...

Just have to fix this drive shaft issue, and I'm halfway there. Secure all the motor mounts correctly, with the drive shaft seated into the transfer case and see what happens and go from there🔥🔥🤓🤓


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## mcak1964

Poor car........................


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## scottatx

mcak1964 said:


> Poor car........................


Oh I agree

Getting it all fixed up though...








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I wonder what that metal ring is in the video rattling around, a bearing? Getting a new final drive seal and right side engine mount, When I have the dog bone mount on correctly it actually drives great, so hopefully the gigantic mechanical failure and danger is just from the drive shaft not being seated into the transfer case all the way.

Just trying to get it drivable and fix some stuff, then I'm gonna come back and do it all over again with all my new knowledge😎😃🤣


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## IPG3.6

that's not going to be a fun repair. look slik eyou'll need to rebuild that end of the transfer case/final drive.



https://audi.7zap.com/en/rdw/audi+tt+tts+coupe+roadster/att/2002-229/4/409-409047/



that nut #9 has a RIDICULOUS torque spec.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> that's not going to be a fun repair. look slik eyou'll need to rebuild that end of the transfer case/final drive.
> 
> 
> 
> https://audi.7zap.com/en/rdw/audi+tt+tts+coupe+roadster/att/2002-229/4/409-409047/
> 
> 
> 
> that nut #9 has a RIDICULOUS torque spec.


Thanks for the diagram.

Walked across the highway and in a hotel room, researching everything I need to fix this... Literally on my 11th month of simply trying to fix my car, lol. It's pretty frigging hilarious once you just stop and laugh about it, other than the losing everything you own and it never seems to end part.

Yes, obviously I just need to take off the exhaust, heat shield and whole drive shaft, inspect the shaft itself for damage... order a few parts and put it back together.

1) I'm guessing/assuming this is a flat bearing or something, rattling around in this video I took, the same type of bearing as a connecting rod bearing?








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2) I am guessing this is the "flex joint", which I screwed up pretty bad, and I assume probably needs to be replaced.

__
http://instagr.am/p/CnFXKIypyvb/

3) Then I imagine fixing/replacing that rattling part in the above video, inspecting the transfer case for damage, then just correctly seating the drive shaft into the transfer case, and putting it all back together correctly.

4) This engine mount is why my bolts keep stripping, so ordering a new engine mount.

__
http://instagr.am/p/CnFXSV_J_qO/

Seems pretty logical... or there could be 15 other things that I need to know which I won't understand and it will destroy everything😃

But basically, I assume, that I just need to take off the drive shaft and expect everything and fix it and buy any new parts that are broken or damaged.


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> that's not going to be a fun repair. look slik eyou'll need to rebuild that end of the transfer case/final drive.
> 
> 
> 
> https://audi.7zap.com/en/rdw/audi+tt+tts+coupe+roadster/att/2002-229/4/409-409047/
> 
> 
> 
> that nut #9 has a RIDICULOUS torque spec.


I guess the part circled in this photo here is number 4 on the diagram you posted...

The arrow is pointing to a bearing or something that's broken and just rattling around. I got all the engine mount bolts in and jacked up the engine and transfer case to try to make the drive shaft meet and seat into the transfer case, but it won't go in any farther than about a quarter of an inch gap.

I guess there's no other way around it than to remove the drive shaft altogether and inspect the end to the transfer case, and just replace any item/part that's damaged, then seat it back in and put it all together correctly...

And the number 4 on the diagram just says "See illustration" but I'm pretty sure it's the flex joint. I think in my photo it is that cloth rubber material that's frayed and damaged, and I assume obviously it should be replaced.

I guess rebuilding that end just means replacing the four or five parts there, and somehow insert it and tighten it all back up correctly.









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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> that's not going to be a fun repair. look slik eyou'll need to rebuild that end of the transfer case/final drive.
> 
> 
> 
> https://audi.7zap.com/en/rdw/audi+tt+tts+coupe+roadster/att/2002-229/4/409-409047/
> 
> 
> 
> that nut #9 has a RIDICULOUS torque spec.


If anybody has detailed experience with this, and can tell any details from the video I just posted...

One thing that's worrying me is I left the final drive seal off as outlined where it went in this image:








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But I obviously drove with the engine down too low, with stripped motor mount bolts, and the entire flex joint metal housing disintegrated, leaving the pieces around the bolts as we can see in the photos and videos above.

I'm about to go take off the muffler, heat shield, etc. to access the drive shaft, lower the subframe, tilt the sway bar, so I can remove the flex joint bolts...

Then remove the bolts necessary to separate the drive shaft from the rear differential... Then tilt the bottom of the engine forward with a scissor jack if necessary and remove the entire drive shaft.

Then hopefully I will inspect and see what is going on at the drive shaft to transfer case area, find out what that metal ring is rattling around, and maybe that circlip has simply come undone, which isn't holding the shaft into place into the transfer box.

This is my thinking anyway. Of course everything may be completely screwed, but I can order a whole new drive shaft/propeller shaft, Plan B, for $100 it looks like...


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## scottatx

Finally have the whole exhaust and heat shield off, lowered the subframe and tilted the sway bar and yep... I definitely screwed it all up😃 So I don't know what to do. I guess find the procedure in a manual and replac Or purchase a whole new propeller shaft as one unit, and install it?

The rear differential end and support bearing all seems good, it just destroyed everything on the transfer case end, because I drove with loose engine mount bolts.

And that ring that's rattling around in there, pretty sure that's just part of that piece with the 10 or so bolts on it, it just broke off. You can see the edge of it in one of the photos.

Do you just replace the flex joint, and remove and install it via the circlip? Is there just a set of things that need to be replaced? Or is this a whole other gigantic nightmare with 10 more layers than I even am aware of yet? 🤣









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## IPG3.6

Probably best to get a replacement transfer case. Doubt you'll be able to find individual parts for it. 

For the guibo you can find those online. If you use the 7zap database link you'll be able to find the PN. They attach with 3 10mm multipoint bolts to the propshaft and transfer case flange (6 all up)


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## scottatx

IPG3.6 said:


> Probably best to get a replacement transfer case. Doubt you'll be able to find individual parts for it.
> 
> For the guibo you can find those online. If you use the 7zap database link you'll be able to find the PN. They attach with 3 10mm multipoint bolts to the propshaft and transfer case flange (6 all up)


The entire transfer case would be about $150. Considering the final drive seal is $46 itself maybe that's a good option...

I have everything separated and detached, Seems like a ton of work to take the entire transfer case out, It would be about my 2nd time to do it, But I can see that the parts circled in this diagram here are the ones that need to be replaced... If you can find those parts can't you just take off all those bolts replace those parts and put the propeller shaft in there however it goes? Lol.

Trying to get the bolts off of the rear differential but I probably don't even need to. The entire propeller shaft looks great, doesn't look bent or anything, so I probably just need to address the end at the transfer case?









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This has got to be the most ridiculous, most expensive, grueling, frustrating year of my life lol


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## IPG3.6

I honestly doubt you'll be able to find those parts circled on their own.


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