# 3.2 Manual vs S-Tronic DSG (which is better??)



## j600.com (Jun 30, 2005)

I've never owned an automatic before but open to the idea as i like the idea of paddle gear changing - sounds fun! But given the option (at the same price) of having a manual 3.2 TT or the DSG 3.2 TT which would you go for?? I'm sure there are pros and cons of both (does anyone know the pros and cons?) but if money was no object and they were both equally priced which is better??

I'm asking because I've narrowed my search for a new TT down to 2 cars. Both VERY similar spec and similar price.

Car 1.
AUDI TT 3.2 V6 Quattro (6 Speed Manual)
18" 10 Spoke alloy wheels, Dolpin grey, Black Nappa Leather, CD changer, Sat Nav, G.S.M, Multi function steering wheel, Cruise control.

Car 2.
AUDI TT 3.2 V6 Quattro DSG (S-Tronic)
18" Turbine alloy wheels, Condor grey, Mineral Grey Leather, CD changer, Sat Nav, G.S.M, Multi function steering wheel, Cruise control + Magnetic Ride, Bose, Xenon plus headlights, Acoustic parking.

Car 2 is £1000 more expensive than car 1, is it worth the extra £1000?


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

definately


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## Pete225 (Feb 9, 2004)

I suppose it also depends on age and mileage. :-|

But the second car has Magnetic Ride, Bose, Xenon plus headlights & Acoustic parking, which are nice toys.


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## TT_Newbie (Aug 22, 2008)

Car 2 gets my vote


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## j600.com (Jun 30, 2005)

Pete225 said:


> I suppose it also depends on age and mileage. :-|
> 
> But the second car has Magnetic Ride, Bose, Xenon plus headlights & Acoustic parking, which are nice toys.


thanks for the reply, both are fairly similar...

Car 1 (6 speed manual)
22,000 miles 2007 (56 reg)

Car 2 (DSG Auto)
17,000 miles 2006 (56 reg)


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## hooting_owl (Sep 3, 2008)

Car 2. Without any doubt.


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## jad (Apr 2, 2008)

For every day use in traffic it's DSG. 
If you get to grips on how to use the DSG and its settings _properly_, then IMHO DSG is a win win..... 
We have had DSG since 2003, now on 3rd car with it fitted.


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## j600.com (Jun 30, 2005)

are there any reasons not to have DSG? what are the 'cons' for example are they harder to sell on, more likely to have problems/faults etc.


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## Flyboyben (Apr 6, 2007)

DSG has been around for a number of years now in both DSG guise and now S-Tronic so I reckon if there were problems they would have been identified by now. I don't think I have ever read anything on here about people having technical issues with it.

I absolutely love it. For some folk only manual will do for a sports car, but i disagree as its not just an ordinary automatic


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## jammyd (Oct 11, 2008)

Having looked through this, seen the specs, price age and mileage, I would say car 2... If I could have had S-tronic on mine I would have had it without a doubt...


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## Martin L (Jan 19, 2008)

Car 2.
Mag Ride, Xenons, DSG for £1000 Bargain!


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## b19 jws (Aug 7, 2008)

car 2 all the way


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## fpp (Nov 29, 2007)

None of them, don't like the colours.

Regarding s-tronic, I wouldn't choose it, have tried and don't like it.

It takes the fun of feeling the push of the car at the moment of letting the clucth go and doesn't let you have total control of when you want the car to change gears. I know stronicers... will say you can use the manual option but usually will end up driving on d or s and won't change to manual depending on which turn you're approaching to and regarding the paddles, since they are in the steering wheel are totally useless during turns so only usefull for overtakings on a straight highway, which I admitt that's some fun, not enough though for me.

The only pros I see on the s-tronic gear change are fuel consumption and not getting totally nuts at some traffic days into big cities.

As I say, I drove a few tts with it in order to make up my mind and decided I wanted manual, obviously the extra price was also had into account, just my opinion...


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## jakeman (Jan 30, 2008)

Car 2 s'tronic and mag ride are fantastic combination with the V6 you will just love it i know i do everyday [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

J


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## Bernieddevil (Jul 9, 2008)

Car 2 mate


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## TigerDejan (Oct 29, 2008)

i would give £1000 for DSG and Magnetic Ride ... so Car 2 , no doubt.


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## mikef4uk (Jan 15, 2006)

After driving manual cars for about 36 years and refusing to even look at auto's I now own a S Tronic TTS, I see absolutely no reason whatever for ever owing a manual car again, yes the paddles can be upside down in manual mode but you can always push or pull the gear lever. magnetic ride is very good also, the ride is far better than my previous A3 T Quattro


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## andya (Jun 17, 2003)

fpp said:


> ...I know stronicers... will say you can use the manual option but usually will end up driving on d or s and won't change to manual depending on which turn you're approaching to and regarding the paddles, since they are in the steering wheel are totally useless during turns so only usefull for overtakings on a straight highway, which I admitt that's some fun, not enough though for me...


Think this is a bit of an exageration. Most 'driving' corners aren't tight enough for you to have to take your hands of the wheel and can quite easliy maintain a 10-2 position where you've got access to the paddles. Ok, tight corners and junctions might be an issue but there's always the lever...


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## sico (Feb 6, 2003)

pointless asking that question here mate, try it for yourself and see.

As you will see everyone with a DSG will vote for that and visa versa.

You will not get an unbiased opinion.


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## jammyd (Oct 11, 2008)

sico said:


> pointless asking that question here mate, try it for yourself and see.
> 
> As you will see everyone with a DSG will vote for that and visa versa.
> 
> You will not get an unbiased opinion.


I voted for the DSG... and I have not got it... the TDI did not come with the option


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## kdes24uk (May 10, 2007)

try these 3

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5EdjEE0ed ... re=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LROqVLz4z ... re=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=gmMNRQ1GJ ... re=related

Kev


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## 535dboy (Nov 26, 2007)

We have the 3.2 DSG and absolutely love it.

We were going to get the DSG anyway but our sales guy ran a 3.2 manual as his Demo and didn't much like it - found it difficult to get smooth takeways (no driving not the food !)

I'm only 33 and always assumed autos were for old people but when I bought my BMW 535d 3 years ago they only came as auto and that was an awesome auto and would pretty much do what you tell it to in manual mode. My new X5 is the same.

My 3rd toy is obviously a manual so I do remember what the 3rd pedal is for !

Back to the TT I drive ours hard when I get to drive it and I do find it does what I tell it to and gets even better the harder you use it. We did the Audi Driving Experience at Silverstone in July and being able to throw one around the track made for great fun.

Good luck !


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## FinFerNan (Feb 28, 2007)

sico said:


> pointless asking that question here mate, try it for yourself and see.
> 
> As you will see everyone with a DSG will vote for that and visa versa.
> 
> *You will not get an unbiased opinion*.


Yeah you will ................

I drive a manual car and would choose car 2 in a heartbeat.

The 3.2 benefits more from the Stronic than the 2.0T and the Stronic keeps the 3.2 below the 225g/km CO2 limit.

I have to admit to now wishing I had specced the Stronic having driven a new Scirocco with it recently.

Unbiased enough? :roll:


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## Wallsendmag (Feb 12, 2004)

You should ask Joe (TTCool) for a totally unbiased opinion of MkIIs and S-Tronic.


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## DXN (May 18, 2002)

I'm not regretting the DSG at all ( also tax is cheaper for a dsg!! pays for itself!)

Its a whole new experience for me (positive)

Fantastic - car 2 all the way

PS the Xenons with adaptive (directional steering) is great too

do it... 8)


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## garvin (May 7, 2002)

On first aquaintance the S-tronic can seem uncomfortable because it is different. However, it needs some application to learn how to use it to full effect and then the investment of time and effort is truly rewarded. I would always take an S-tronic/DSG type option when available - would love to try the new Porsche PDK system which, by all accounts, is every bit as good as the Audi system.

As an aside, a couple of months ago I had the use of a Vanquish S for a few days. Had to relearn how to use a 'flappy paddle' system that is not dual clutch. In automatic mode it was horrendous - changes seemd to take forever accompanied by an enormous clunk every time - smooth changes an impossibility - complete agricultural pile of rubbish. So, used it exclusively in manual mode which meant having to ease off the throttle on changes and, hey presto, after a little while smooth changes every time. I went from hating the damn thing at the beginning to quite liking it at the end. But on re-acquaintance with the S-tronic I realised just what a piece of tat the Vanquish box really is!! However, the Vanquish paddles are fixed but quite long and were actually a lot better to use than the ones in the TT which rotate with the steering wheel.


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## 535dboy (Nov 26, 2007)

FinFerNan said:


> The 3.2 benefits more from the Stronic than the 2.0T and the Stronic keeps the 3.2 below the 225g/km CO2 limit.


Unless you buy the vert like we did :roll: :wink:


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## brittan (May 18, 2007)

My first experience of S-Tronic was in an A3 diesel and I didn't like it. The box didn't seem to be able to decide what to do when approaching a roundabout slowly and then booting it. In hindsight that was more to do with me not knowing how to use it properly and I'm really pleased that I chose S-Tronic for my TT. Overall its just excellent - provided, as garvin says, you take the trouble to learn how to use it.
I haven't tried the Porsche PDK but I've read that the buttons on the front of the steering wheel are awkward and unnatural to use.

Criticisms of S-Tronic? Yes, I have a couple. As has been said the paddles can be hard to use if the wheel is being turned at the same time. Mind you, that may just mean that we're trying to change gear at the wrong time.
The default from using the paddles is to change gear using the stick BUT the up/down change direction is counter intuitive (IMO). It SHOULD be pull back on the stick to change up; push forward to change down. Bad Audi, bad Audi. Maybe I can swap the wires around on the switches??

I've driven several manual TTs, mostly 3.2s and the TTS, and I'd choose the S-Tronic every time. Simple as that.


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## Philimon (May 29, 2008)

garvin said:


> On first aquaintance the S-tronic can seem uncomfortable because it is different. However, it needs some application to learn how to use it to full effect ....


Not sure I agree with that, because
Want to go backwards: R
Want to go forwards: D
Want to play on B roads: S
Want to qo faster: Peddle on the right
Want to do slower: Peddle on the left.

See, its easy


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## 535dboy (Nov 26, 2007)

VicTT said:


> BUT the up/down change direction is counter intuitive (IMO). It SHOULD be pull back on the stick to change up; push forward to change down. Bad Audi, bad Audi.


Very true !

BMW have it the right way around and therefore I have never tried to use the stick to change gears as I would get it all wrong  :lol:


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## Suge_K (May 27, 2008)

Car 2 without a doubt...S-tronic and mag ride are the two best things about my car...

It takes a couple of thousand miles to fully understand the S-tronic gearbox so to drive it once on a test drive and poo poo it is evian backwards...

Better than a manual in every situation and only after said mileage do u realise...it isnt an auto...its an automated manual...

S


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## H_Potter (May 26, 2009)

Hi guys

I've just got a titty with flappy paddles. Having always driven manuals I'm finding this pretty difficult to get used to.

On the way home from work today (in sport mode) it changed down as I accelerated out of the curved slip road (fortunately managed to avoid the inevitable hedge!)

Then on the motorway it kept annoyingly "kicking down" whenever a honda or toyota avensis got out of my way and I accelerated back up to speed again.

I've been reading about a "manual mode" for the S-tronic. Is this fully manual so that it wont change gear unless I ask it to?
How do I get this mode?

Also, how much downforce does the spoiler add at say 70mph or 100mph? Does it actually do anything?! Or is it just for the hairdresser types who Audi also market this car to? :wink:

Cheers

H


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## blake83 (May 11, 2009)

Mate I believe the S-tronic will not 'hold' a gear beyond max revs i.e it will change up at redline.

My 2.0 TT s-tronic even in manual mode say in 4th if i give WOT it, will still change down to second and speed up :?

I think the manual is much more rewarding to drive hard, having driven both I enjoy both but the DSG is cool at the speed of shifts it can do and I an still put around drinking my latte without fear of having to use the stupid cup holders 

BTW - I dont know how much downforce it adds but I went for a recent trip interstate and sat at about 220-230kph (130-135mph?) it felt incredibly controlled and stable.


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## H_Potter (May 26, 2009)

Hi

Getting more used to the S-tronic now. Using "manual" mode now which is a slight improvement (ie it wont change down with the slightest throttle increase) and I'm slightly less likeky to engage in some hedge trimming.

However I do think the box is still horrible (I am clearly a "proper manual" type person!) and find it seriously annoying that "manual" mode wont let u run into the limiter and sometimmes upshifts at the same time as you so that you inadvertantly go up 2 gears when ur trying to accelerate full tilt! Ruddy Useless!!!

And I don't really appreciate what all the journos have been banging on about this box's smoothness. Yes it is a rapid change and it is very smooth when upshifting at max acceleration. But when driving normally, it's horrible! I can easily change more smoothly in normal drivng with a manual.

And then theres the 2T engine! Good engine, but it just doesn't suit the car! Belongs in a hot hatch I reckon. Soo quiet to the point that u constantly have to look at the rev counter and gear display to know what gear ur in and lacking in high end. Pull out to overtake, loads of midrange thump then.... uh oh, this car isn't half as fast as I thought! Better pull back in again!

And then theres the traction issues. The traction control is probably the best I've ever used (ESP element far too intrusive for me tho) but I prefer to drive with it off. The front wheel drive is nowhere near as good as the quattro on my S3 and certainly doesnt seem to be as good as the journos go on about. Could it be my (useless in the wet) Conti Sport Contact 2s?

And last but certainly not least, this car simply has too much health and safety! Why do I have to press the ESP off button for an eternity whenever I start the engine before it goes off? Why does the dashboard have to tell me in writing AND symbol form that I have pressed the ESP off button? Why does the car need to tell me every time I start the engine that the passenger airbag is on? Of course it's on! Its an Audi! And I didn't switch it off with the ignition key in the dashboard! And even if I did, it would tell me that I've done it!!!!!!!!!! :evil:

This car really has made me quite angry quite often and I genuinely amn't that sort of person.

However, there is at least I aspect of this car that has put a grin on my face! "Full bore upshifts"! bbbbrrrrrrrrrmmm POP! bbbbrrrrrrrrrmmm POP!  
Oh and the launch control's a bit of a laugh too!

H


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## brittan (May 18, 2007)

Glad you are getting used to the S-Tronic. It does take a while to learn how the box is controlled but once you have done that its much easier and more rewarding to be able to get the best out of it.

For example, now you know that its not fully manual when you want to change up at the red line just let the box do it for you and that avoids the double up-change. Alternatively you can just short shift.

As far as smoothness is concerned in normal driving then if you can change more smoothly every time then there may be a problem with the box. In "gentle" driving I find the changes (from a smooth point of view) are all but imperceptible.

Ah, traction. Until recently more or less the only time I've seen the TC light flashing was exiting a slow corner on a track. Mines had a little tweaking which means its much easier now to light up the TC but its just a matter of re-learning how much throttle to give it in different conditions; no big deal. You say "The front wheel drive is nowhere near as good as the quattro on my S3" You weren't seriously expecting it to be as good as quattro, were you??
And you mention journos opinion a couple of times. Did you drive the car before you bought one?

I have some more Health & Safety information too. Although you can turn off ESP the Audi H&S chip doesn't really like that and so when you exceed a preset speed (I think it may be 70kph) it turns it back on for you.
May be worth a read of the relevant section of the manual as details of how this aspect operates are different on 2.0 and 3.2 cars.

Anyway, to cheer yourself up just go out and do a few a few full bore upshifts: bbbbrrrrrrrrrmmm POP! bbbbrrrrrrrrrmmm POP!


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## triplefan (Sep 3, 2008)

Car 2, probably worth the grand more just with the lower mileage, add in the other bits and it looks even better


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## garvin (May 7, 2002)

H_Potter said:


> Having always driven manuals I'm finding this pretty difficult to get used to.


Yes, tis true. But like most things in life you have to put the effort in to reap the rewards. It isn't a mnual so why expect it to behave like one? It's a hybrid between a manual and an automatic so it requires a different driving style to get the best out of it. When the techniques have been mastered then it is, IMHO, superior to both a fully manual and automatic. There is no doubt that it can change gear much, much faster than any human can manage so it benefits acceleration quite perceptibly. As for driving a car into the limiter - WTF is all that about :? In manual mode it behaves very closely to a fully manual transmission except that it won't let the engine either over or under rev - but nobody does that with a fully manual gearbox anyway .............. or do they!!

There are lots of threads on here with debates between those who love the S-Tronic and those who hate it. I tend to think that a lot of the detractors are just not prepared to learn new driving styles/techniques to reap the rewards of the S-tronic type transmission and, therefore, never really enjoy the technology to the full. That really is their loss and they comfort themselves by criticising a more advanced technology rather then accepting their own limitations.

So, if you can't, or don't want to, adapt then that's fine - just don't blame the superior technology and get rid of the thing and go back to the tried, tested and safe world that requires third pedal. BTW, you may have noticed that Porsche have now taken up this type of technology ....... and Nissan with the GTR - they haven't done this because it is inferior to a fully manual transmission, quite the opposite!


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