# Pcp quote wtf



## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Just back from Audi somewhat disappointed

TT coupe sline stronic with bits
Invoice 34k
Deposit 5k
Discount 1k
Balance 28k
Pcp 36x£605/month. Baloon 14k WTF


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## mrdemon (Apr 20, 2005)

PCP is a mugs game

most expensive way to buy a car

they do it to allow people who cannot afford to buy a expensive car to seem like they can but get screwed lol.


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## Mark. (Sep 16, 2011)

Hi, i got my TT TDi S Line Quattro for

£32,320.00 inc dealer fit bluetooth and VAT on the Road
£2000.00 Deposit
£4000.00 Dealer Contribution

£484.49 per month for 35 months, end payment of £13,768.35


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Mark. said:


> Hi, i got my TT TDi S Line Quattro for
> 
> £32,320.00 inc dealer fit bluetooth and VAT on the Road
> £2000.00 Deposit
> ...


Well done mark,think the dealer here in Scotland wasn't too interested in a sale to be honest.


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## phope (Mar 26, 2006)

See if you can speak with John Norrie, salesman, at Dundee Audi - they've been good to a few people here


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## carrock (Mar 17, 2011)

shougle said:


> Just back from Audi somewhat disappointed
> 
> TT coupe sline stronic with bits
> Invoice 34k
> ...


So, just so I'm clear- £5k deposit, borrow £28K, pay back over £21k PLUS a ballon of £14k?

That is £40,000 in total???

Unbelievable.

I borrowed £15k to buy a 2 year old TT and pay back £500/ month over 3 years........

OK it's not brand new, but it cost little more than the ballon payment on a new one.....


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## 2zeroalpha (Aug 30, 2009)

Rule of thumb, don't take dealer finance unless they have a special offer on.

Think my TTS was something like 32000 purchase, 6000 deposit and am paying 333 a month with 14k final payment.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

shougle said:


> Just back from Audi somewhat disappointed
> 
> TT coupe sline stronic with bits
> Invoice 34k
> ...


Out of interest, what was the APR on that?


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

phil3012 said:


> shougle said:
> 
> 
> > Just back from Audi somewhat disappointed
> ...


I guess it's about 11% or more. All he said was they werent doing any deals on finance on a TT at the moment


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

phope said:


> See if you can speak with John Norrie, salesman, at Dundee Audi - they've been good to a few people here


Cheers mate


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## hope88 (Mar 25, 2011)

Try shopping around using Moneysupermarket.com. I've managed to get a good package for a loan sometime ago but missus won't let me proceed


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## Jiveman (May 6, 2005)

Hi Shougle. I dont think I can give you good news but just to give you my experience over the last 3 weeks.

The deals for TT have ended 30 September when there was a £3K contribution on a 7.6 APR which meant on a PCP the interest on the lone was almost wiped out. Then I hagled on my trade in with 3 dealers before getting another £3.5K from what was initialy offered.

After saying all this to get into the deal window was difficult. The first two dealers pretended to have cars and did not, I even put a £500 deposit on one then the car suddenly became unavailable. I took things into my own hands and phoned round (deadline looming) with dealers in a 100 mile radius. I was rude on the phone and just blurted straight out "have you a TT that you can put your hands on" finaly bought one with the right spec after negotiating on phone and picked it up 2 days later.

Long way of saying there are deals, keep an eye out. The dealers will try to steer you away from the best deals but stick to your guns. Be careful sometimes you get drawn into a deal which is not what you asked for.

Wait a few weeks I cant believe there wont be another deal coming up probably for pick up before last day Decemeber.

I also agree PCP only works if there is a deal. and note the dealer makes more money on a car purchased by PCP as he receives money from finance company. This gives you a little more le way for your trade in and extras. I got the Sat nav thrown in for free for example.

Good luck you will get one just stay sharp.


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## 12snowy (Dec 4, 2009)

Buy outright with a loan and save 10% with drivethedeal.com


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## ttjm (Sep 16, 2011)

Jiveman said:


> Hi Shougle. I dont think I can give you good news but just to give you my experience over the last 3 weeks.
> 
> The deals for TT have ended 30 September when there was a £3K contribution on a 7.6 APR which meant on a PCP the interest on the lone was almost wiped out. Then I hagled on my trade in with 3 dealers before getting another £3.5K from what was initialy offered.
> 
> ...


We collect ours on this deal on monday, tdi coupe black edition. Can`t find anything on audi website anymore but have been told the deal has been extended for 18 days from the start of the month. May be worth giving these guys a try, http://www.audiondemand.co.uk/new-audi-stock/tt.
Hope this helps.


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

2zeroalpha said:


> Rule of thumb, don't take dealer finance unless they have a special offer on.
> 
> Think my TTS was something like 32000 purchase, 6000 deposit and am paying 333 a month with 14k final payment.


WOW


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Jiveman said:


> Hi Shougle. I dont think I can give you good news but just to give you my experience over the last 3 weeks.
> 
> The deals for TT have ended 30 September when there was a £3K contribution on a 7.6 APR which meant on a PCP the interest on the lone was almost wiped out. Then I hagled on my trade in with 3 dealers before getting another £3.5K from what was initialy offered.
> 
> ...


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

12snowy said:


> Buy outright with a loan and save 10% with drivethedeal.com


Contemplated this. But could not be rsed trying to sell mine


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## trev (Aug 5, 2005)

shougle said:


> phope said:
> 
> 
> > See if you can speak with John Norrie, salesman, at Dundee Audi - they've been good to a few people here
> ...


 Second that Peter


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## powerplay (Feb 8, 2008)

2zeroalpha said:


> Rule of thumb, don't take dealer finance unless they have a special offer on.
> 
> Think my TTS was something like 32000 purchase, 6000 deposit and am paying 333 a month with 14k final payment.


That's an amazing deal. so basically you're saying you've borrowed 26k at an APR of ZERO percent? Could I do that with 100k do you think? Where do I sign? :lol:

Or perhaps your 333/month is over 4 or 5 years?  :roll:

Best way to purchase any new car is with a personal loan, you won't do better. Saying that, my dealer was VERY keen to get me to use their finance when I bought my RS and actually matched my best personal loan offer of 6.7%. Over 3 years it worked out to cost about 1800, but I expect to clear the loan in 6-9 months so it won't end up costing anywhere near that. 8)


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

I've bought cars multiple different ways and PCP does work for some people.

As PCP is secured against the car, it sometimes means that you can borrow more (and thus get a more expensive car) than on a personal loan

My advise would be compare all the possible options. I had a PCP once, went to change the car and found a loan over a slightly longer term worked out cheaper, plus you get to keep the car at the end.

PCP is good that you have a guaranteed value for the car in n years, but watch the small print!

It does force you into a position though at the end of the agreement to have to do something to even keep the car, which could be more finance, possibly at a less favourable rate.

Also beware modifying the car can sometimes be against the terms of the PCP.

As mentioned earlier Audi did have some cracking deals recently, which made the actual interest paid back really low. Just keep an eye out for more coming along...


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Cheers for all your posts guys


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

Shougle, you are looking at the wrong car and hence why the figures are poor. As soon as you start adding options to a base model TT, the maths just get poorer and poorer. GFV remains around the same which tells you all those expensive options are worth next to nothing come end of agreement.

Look at the TTS models, the maths I suspect will be around the same.

Try and not order from factory, have a look on Audi used car and buy it that way. Beat the VAT hit.

I got PCP finance very cheap a few months back, 5.4% APR iirc. My RS costs less than £600pm with a smaller deposit put in also. (£2.9k which was pretty much Audi contribution from PX on my previous RS)

For £600pm you're looking at TTS and if you're lucky and everything is in your favour perhaps even an RS. For a base TT, sorry, nope, not a good deal.

Deposit as low as possible aswell.


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Mitchy said:


> Shougle, you are looking at the wrong car and hence why the figures are poor. As soon as you start adding options to a base model TT, the maths just get poorer and poorer. GFV remains around the same which tells you all those expensive options are worth next to nothing come end of agreement.
> 
> Look at the TTS models, the maths I suspect will be around the same.
> 
> ...


Cheers mitchy. Great sound advice . To be honest it's nearer the 400 mark I'm looking at


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## JASON1088 (Sep 13, 2011)

I just brought my TT 2tfsi ibis white Black edition on PCP its the 2nd time i have used this way of buying a car in the past always did finance and always lost money .The deal i got was £3k deposit plus dealer contibution over 4yrs £350 per month.What i like about PCP is after you have had the car half of the term you can part ex it in against another new car and you should have some deposit in it.Wait until open season in Febuary always some cracking deals then.Good luck i brought mine from Phil Krane at Poole Audi give him a call and see if he can help you out.


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

JASON1088 said:


> I just brought my TT 2tfsi ibis white Black edition on PCP its the 2nd time i have used this way of buying a car in the past always did finance and always lost money .The deal i got was £3k deposit plus dealer contibution over 4yrs £350 per month.What i like about PCP is after you have had the car half of the term you can part ex it in against another new car and you should have some deposit in it.Wait until open season in Febuary always some cracking deals then.Good luck i brought mine from Phil Krane at Poole Audi give him a call and see if he can help you out.


Good good Jason cheers


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

JASON1088 said:


> I just brought my TT 2tfsi ibis white Black edition on PCP its the 2nd time i have used this way of buying a car in the past always did finance and always lost money .The deal i got was £3k deposit plus dealer contibution over 4yrs £350 per month.What i like about PCP is after you have had the car half of the term you can part ex it in against another new car and you should have some deposit in it.Wait until open season in Febuary always some cracking deals then.Good luck i brought mine from Phil Krane at Poole Audi give him a call and see if he can help you out.


When I bought my car they asked me to bring identification with me. Foolishly, I forgot it on the day so I called my wife to ask her to bring it with her. After she had bought the shopping she brought me my driving license to which I used as identification.

How you can bring a car on PCP is beyond me :roll:

Sorry but come on, just read the word back. Do people actually pronounce the letter r in the word brought when used in the the context of bought 

Btw, you don't even need to go half term, you can pull out of a PCP anytime, my last RS after only 8mths. If trading in against another Audi model they usually give you a good PX so you have a deposit going onto the next car. Keeps you tied to the Audi brand though.


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## powerplay (Feb 8, 2008)

JASON1088 said:


> I just brought my TT 2tfsi ibis white Black edition on PCP its the 2nd time i have used this way of buying a car


you just brought it on a PCP - is that some kind of transporter then, like a low-loader? Had it broken down? :lol:


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## powerplay (Feb 8, 2008)

Mitchy said:


> Sorry but come on, just read the word back. Do people actually pronounce the letter r in the word brought when used in the the context of bought


LMAO. Actually mate sadly they do. A colleague of mine at work will actually say "I brought this..." when meaning to purchase. It's beyond me, must be the education system :roll: :lol:


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Now Now ladies at least he pricked up a good deal


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## JASON1088 (Sep 13, 2011)

So i can't spell brought or bought my reply was to help out a member on here not to have my grammar analysed by you lot!


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## carrock (Mar 17, 2011)

powerplay said:


> JASON1088 said:
> 
> 
> > I just brought my TT 2tfsi ibis white Black edition on PCP its the 2nd time i have used this way of buying a car
> ...


PCP is also known as Angel Dust- it's a highly addictive drug that affects one's ability to spell


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

JASON1088 said:


> So i can't spell brought or bought my reply was to help out a member on here not to have my grammar analysed by you lot!


And help you did 
Cheers


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

phil3012 said:


> I've bought cars multiple different ways and PCP does work for some people.
> 
> As PCP is secured against the car, it sometimes means that you can borrow more (and thus get a more expensive car) than on a personal loan
> 
> ...


Eyes peeled


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## Critter10 (Nov 4, 2010)

I think PCP does work, provided the deals right - as others have said. I had an experience recently, which may shed some light. I wanted to replace my wife's Golf Match with something a bit sportier. We went to the local VW dealer to see what they could do. They had a brand spanker GTi in stock, with a few extras, which we were interested in. Price was £29K+ and the best deal they could do, on a VAG PCP was £2.5K down and around £500 a month for four years. Balloon was below £9K - crazy. But they said that the VAG guys had pulled the plug on any good deals, however they also dealt with another company who were offering better deals. To cut a long story short, we got the car for £1K down, £360 a month and a balloon of £12.5K. We also walked away with a cheque for £5K for the old Golf. I was well pleased. After a couple of years or so, we'll probably kick it back and get a new one. And we should be able to get a similar deal.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

The think you have to watch with PCP is not necessarily the current deal, but what you do at the end of the term.

In Critter10's example, unless the GTi is worth more than £12.5K after the 4 years as a part exchange price, to give some equity towards the new car, either additional deposit will be required ro keep the monthly payments low, or the monthly payments will increase to compensate for the lack of deposit.

If the car is worth more than £12.5K then the deposit becomes less of an issue.

There is a risk though that if the car is only worth £12.5K and no money saved towards the next deposit, it won't be possible to buy a similar priced car on similar monthly payments. Remembering as well the RRP of a similar car will probably have increased anyway.

£1000 isn't a bad desposit to find, but when people have put much more down is when it starts to be a problem.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

There is no difference between a PCP and traditional HP if you think about it. All you have to do is put the difference in the payments in the bank every month and then you can buy the car outright at the end. The bonus of the PCP is you don't pay back the capital on the GFV, just the interest. There is nothing stopping you paying that capital to yourself and saving up to buy the car outright at the end.

The guaranteed balloon value is also just that. It's a guaranteed minimum. If the finance company's actuaries say the car will be worth x thousand pounds, chances are if will actually be worth that, so if the GFV is £9000, the real residual is probably that plus the 10% deposit on the next car. The actuaries are pretty sharp about these things, so beware a dealer telling you the residual value will be £15,000 but the GFV on the same vehicle is £9000. The finance companies know what the true over/under supply situation is and what they reckon will happen usually does. It's how they make their money after all.

High GFV's mean lower repayments, but the finance companies don't like to be too far out - Ford took an absolute bath on their GFV's when they launched their PCP product in the 1990's. They had pitched the GFV's unrealistically high to make the payments low and when the customers brought the cars back after 3 years they were worth less than the GFV so Ford Finance had to pay the dealers to make up the shortfall.

PCP's work best for people with a monthly budget from their employer for a car. You have £500/month after taxes so knock off £50/month for insurance, £50 per month for a service plan and you have £400 per month for your PCP payment. Very simple. £1000 deposit is usually paid for by the employer to help the employee out of the company car scheme and bob's your uncle.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

The big downside I find with a PCP over a HP agreement is it forces you to do something after a set time, which could alter your payments.

Sure you can normally part ex at any time, however after the set term if you want to keep the car you have to refinance at a perhaps less than favourable rate. You can't even sell the car privately without paying off the loan.

PCP works for some and not others, I've had one before and I wouldn't say never again, but not my preferred way to buy a car on finance.


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## golfmadeasy (Aug 22, 2005)

12snowy said:


> Buy outright with a loan and save 10% with drivethedeal.com


Buying outright is obviously the best way but not all have a spare £35k especially those in their twenties dont you think?

It depends on one's own individual circumstances, I would rather have a pcp/ HP loan & use the spare capital I have to make money through business dealings.


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## ChadW (May 2, 2003)

Normally I go the personal loan route, but this time Audi were offering 2 years free servicing so I made sure my car is on the fixed schedule so I at least get 2 visits to a dealer, this would have cost me more than the extra £12 pm I paying instead of going with M&S money which was the best rate at the time, so cannot argue with that.

Also they let you make additional payments to either shorten the life of the loan or reduce the monthly payments.

If I really wanted a new £30k+ car then I guess PCP makes sense but hate reading the balloon payment details on them.


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Critter10 said:


> I think PCP does work, provided the deals right - as others have said. I had an experience recently, which may shed some light. I wanted to replace my wife's Golf Match with something a bit sportier. We went to the local VW dealer to see what they could do. They had a brand spanker GTi in stock, with a few extras, which we were interested in. Price was £29K+ and the best deal they could do, on a VAG PCP was £2.5K down and around £500 a month for four years. Balloon was below £9K - crazy. But they said that the VAG guys had pulled the plug on any good deals, however they also dealt with another company who were offering better deals. To cut a long story short, we got the car for £1K down, £360 a month and a balloon of £12.5K. We also walked away with a cheque for £5K for the old Golf. I was well pleased. After a couple of years or so, we'll probably kick it back and get a new one. And we should be able to get a similar deal.


Good stuff critter


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

PCP and HP are nothing like each other - other than the fact you are paying money each month via a DD.

With PCP you are financing the "interest" only payments for a car you don't own. 
The balloon is a deferred payment for the capital or title of the car that you can then choose to own at the end of it - if you so desire.

Because you are financing the interest payments only the cost is lower.
Boil it all down to basics and PCP is and endowment Loan is a repayment mortgage.

PCP is a never ending treadmill where the only winner is the dealer/finance company. 
Its whole purpose/design is to allow people to borrow cheaper/borrow more than they could if they were paying the capital as well as the interest.


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## Critter10 (Nov 4, 2010)

Toshiba said:


> PCP and HP are nothing like each other - other than the fact you are paying money each month via a DD.
> 
> With PCP you are financing the "interest" only payments for a car you don't own.
> The balloon is a deferred payment for the capital or title of the car that you can then choose to own at the end of it - if you so desire.
> ...


I'd pretty much agree with most of the above. Where I differ is the inference that it's somehow a worse option than a route that eventually leads to you owning the vehicle. Assuming you'll always need a car of some kind, where's the benefit in ownership? It's an asset you can only realise if you stop needing a car. So for me, it comes down to the maths. If you can get a good enough deal on a PCP, and I'll grant you those are becoming fewer, then it may make sense. Yes, you are just paying the interest and never actually own the vehicle - unless you pay up on the balloon at the end. But then neither are you taking a huge depreciation hit the minute you drive out of the showroom. It'll all depend on your circumstances and the deal you can broker - whatever method of purchase or hire you may choose.


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

I tried to make no inference but its not easy to do that.

Like i say it boils down to do you want a repayment mortgage where you pay both capital and interest or do you want an endowment that's just interest payments. Or said another way if you don't want the old house analogy, do you want to rent or buy the car.

My personal opinion (which I'm sure some are bored of hearing) is buying a car on any-type of HP/PCP is an expensive way to do it. Just pay cash and be done with it. I'm not here to give the bankers an additional bonus directly from my pocket.


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Toshiba said:


> I tried to make no inference but its not easy to do that.
> 
> Like i say it boils down to do you want a repayment mortgage where you pay both capital and interest or do you want an endowment that's just interest payments. Or said another way if you don't want the old house analogy, do you want to rent or buy the car.
> 
> My personal opinion (which I'm sure some are bored of hearing) is buying a car on any-type of HP/PCP is an expensive way to do it. Just pay cash and be done with it. I'm not here to give the bankers an additional bonus directly from my pocket.


Cheers


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

Toshiba said:


> PCP and HP are nothing like each other - other than the fact you are paying money each month via a DD.
> 
> With PCP you are financing the "interest" only payments for a car you don't own.
> The balloon is a deferred payment for the capital or title of the car that you can then choose to own at the end of it - if you so desire.
> ...


PCP and HP are EXACTLY the same but for the deferred capital repayment.

In both cases you own the vehicle only when you make the last payment. HP stands for HIRE purchase. You hire the car from the finance company until you make the final payment.

If I take 1/36th of the balloon payment on a PCP and put it in the building society every month, I can afford to pay the final payment at the end of the three years.

I really don't see the problem with a financial product that allows me to pay less every month.

It's only with a personal lease that you can never own the car.

It's nothing like an endowment because you are not relying on investment products to be able to make the final payment.

I appreciate that you like to hand over a banker's draft when you purchase a car, but it's just crazy to lock that much capital up in a depreciating asset. You are paying all the depreciation up front and you have no idea what your asset will be worth at end of the ownership period.

In a PCP you know exactly what the minimum trade-in value will be.

Look at the guy in the other thread trying to trade his V6 against a TTS. The tax/fuel price situation changed and the V6 is no longer a popular option with buyers. His Audi dealer has basically told him they don't want his trade-in as politely as possible by giving him a stupidly low trade-in price. If he had taken that car on a PCP he would not be at the mercy of the dealer, he would have known the value up front. The finance company takes on that risk. My 10 plate TDi would have been valued at £9800, even with 120,000 miles on it at 4 years old, but I bought it out early as I wanted to modify it. I paid no financial penalty for buying out early with VAG Finance.

PCP is a perfectly straightforward way of financing a vehicle. People seem to have terrible trouble understanding them is all.


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

You're joking right?

Endowment and PCP are the same 100% - if you dont want the house at the end of it you can sell it and take any outstanding capital and do what you like once you've paid back the bank whats owed. 
If you want the car after the PCP completes you then have to finance 12k or whatever the balance is. You then take a loan out and pay some more interest to someone else.

HP - once its done, its done. no second loan, no additional charges.
PCP is used by people to finance a car they generally cant afford a traditional way. if people can afford 1/36 per month - then they simply pay it to start with and reduce the interest you are paying to someone else.....

If anyone really thinks the dealers are not making money on this method of sale, then you are bonkers.
The cheapest way to buy a cars is to pay it out, no 3rd party is making any money off you.

i wouldn't pay via a BD - You get charged for this "service", its simply another charge on the purchase amount for the car as far as im concerned :wink: 
The V6 - you nailed it, the dealer doesnt want the car. Easy enough to sell other ways and you'll get MUCH more for it.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

Toshiba said:


> You're joking right?
> 
> Endowment and PCP are the same 100% - if you dont want the house at the end of it you can sell it and take any outstanding capital and do what you like once you've paid back the bank whats owed.
> If you want the car after the PCP completes you then have to finance 12k or whatever the balance is. You then take a loan out and pay some more interest to someone else.
> ...


No, I'm not joking. Get a copy of a VAG Finance HP agreement and a VAG Finance PCP agreement. They are identical. The only difference is that in the PCP the final payment is significantly higher. Otherwise they are identical.

An endowment mortgage is completely different. In an endowment you pay off the interest on th money you have borrowed and some of the capital but you also invest some money in an endowment fund. The idea of the endowment fund is that some financial whizz-kid can invest the money so it earns enough interest over the term of the mortgage to cover the difference between what you have repaid and the debt you owe the lender. That's why when the financial markets crashed anyone with an endowment was looking at a shortfall in what they owed. It's totally different. You take all the risk. You can't give the house back to the mortgage lender, they repossess it.

And you've missed my point about about stashing away the 1/36th every month.

I have the car and I have the cash. That's the point. I don't have my money tied up in the car. I don't have to sell the car to get the money. I already have the money. That's a massive advantage. I have all the options. The dealer only has one. He has to take the car back. Whether he takes it back and sells me another car is up to me. That's my leverage.

Just think about it, rather than automatically close your mind to it. It does make sense.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

PCP is sligtly different from an Endowment Mortgage, with PCP you're paying interest and depreciation, with the endowment you're just paying the interest.

One thing to watch on PCP is the mileage restriction and the has to be kept to a certain standard. The GFV is only honoured as the true vale if those conditions are met. If you do more than the agreed mileage they deduct n pence per mile from the GFV. Most advetised rates in adverts are 10K or less per annum.


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

wja96 said:


> And you've missed my point about about stashing away the 1/36th every month.
> 
> Just think about it, rather than automatically close your mind to it. It does make sense.


I didn't miss the 1/36 - i mentioned it, use it to reduce the monthly payment i think i said.

My minds is not closed to it at all. I looked into PCP when i came out of the company car scheme. I viewed it as the same type of charge/cost as the VAT element i used to get every month in my payslip. I think if you are happy with a mind set of your companies gives you X and you just want to spend it and avoid the silly CO2 related tax while having the freedom to pick a car you like, then it works - its a business tool financed by someone else and you have no capital outlay for it. Not that easy to turn off if you lose your job, but equally you dont have issues when changing jobs..

I've stated my view, I'm not going to pay someone 8% for thier money or leave my money in the bank and get 2% back.
I'll save the 6% difference thanks. This is why the world is in so much money trouble, people borrowing beyond their means without consequence.

Outright Purchase, no finance taken 
Advantages:
You own the vehicle, it can't be repossessed (unless used as security for a loan)
You're not tied into agreements which may be difficult to terminate
If you are a business, as the owner of the vehicle you can claim your own capital allowances and your business does not have to be VAT registered

Disadvantages:
You pay the full price in one go from your own capital, or if you've borrowed money it will increase the overall cost 
Banks can withdraw overdrafts and loans at short notice for early repayment 
If you are a business, you cannot use tax benefits of deducting the cost of rental from your taxable income (but you can deduct the interest payable on any loan used to finance the vehicle) 
All the risk (depreciation, maintenance, etc) is taken by you. 
The cost cannot be spread to coincide with your regular income 
You are responsible for the maintenance and servicing

Leasing (i.e. contract hire, any form of monthly rental)
Advantages:
Avoids large capital outlay in one go, no need for a loan or to ask bank for overdraft
Pay over a fixed term 
Maintenance and some management services can be included if ,mileage is likely to be high 
The depreciation risk is carried by the leasing company 
Leasing companies get huge discounts from manufacturers.
Cost can be planned to match more closely with your income rate 
If a business, you can reduce your tax bill by deducting the full cost of lease rentals from taxable income 
For companies who either don't pay tax or pay at the small company rate, the 100% tax allowances of lease rental can be better than capital allowances for outright purchase

Disadvantages:
You may be locked into a medium or long-term contract which may be difficult to terminate
Businesses have to be VAT-registered to claim back VAT 
You never own the vehicle (except at the end of a 'contract purchase' scheme).
NB private buyers taking any rental/lease such as contract hire - i.e.where VAT is added to the rental - be aware the VAT rate may change during your rental term, affecting your monthly payments.

Finance Types in more detail

Contract Hire
You rent the vehicle from a lessor over an agreed period. The lessor will usually sell the vehicle as second hand when you hand it back, so the lease payments can be kept low because the full asset value does not need to be recovered by the lessor during your rental period. At the end of your lease, you either return it to the lessor or ask if an extension to the term can be offered if you need to keep it a little longer.

It is worth adding maintenance services and possibly tyres into your agreement if you expect to do high - and always try to forecast accurate mileage, as paying excess mileage charges at the end can be crippling. Some agreements can have the mileage renegotiated - usually if if under halfway though the overall term.

A Business contract hire rate is quoted excluding VAT, a Personal Contract hire rate is just the same but quoted inc' VAT. Bear in mind VAT can change during your rental term, this changing your monthly rentals. The Government is the body to announce any change in VAT.

You pay VAT on contract hire as you are paying for a rental service, you do not pay it on PCP as you are borrowing money in a PCP scenario, not paying for a vat-able service such as a vehicle rental..as you are on contract hire.

If you want an option to own the vehicle at the end you may prefer to go for contract purchase (or PCP if you are a private buyer)

Contract Purchase
Very similar to contract hire but you get the option to own the vehicle at the end by paying the balloon. The vehicle is owned by the lessor until the final payment is made at the end of the term. If you decide not to make the balloon payment the vehicle is returned to the leasing company.

Lease Purchase
A form of HP but with an obligatory (not optional) single large payment at the end of the term. Once you make that final obligatory payment the legal title of ownership transfers to you

Suitable for high-value vehicles as you take on the residual value built into the calculation. Higher residual values mean lower monthly payments but a larger sum to pay at the end. It is therefore fine for you or your business if you want to retain the vehicle as an asset at the end of the term.

For businesses, the vehicle can appear as a balance sheet item and you can write down the value against taxable profits. Once the balloon payment is made, the vehicle is yours. Some lease purchase packages also offer a maintenance package for the duration of the lease purchase agreement.

There are disadvantages to lease purchase too, including:

Balloon payment - You must have sufficient finance to afford the balloon payment at the end of the contractual period because it is not optional. In some cases it can be higher than the residual value. 
VAT not recoverable if you are a business - you can only reclaim VAT if the car is used only for business use. 
The vehicle is yours so the effects of depreciation and the costs of maintenance and disposal are risks. 
For private drivers, it may be suited to those who like no mileage tie-ins as you can set it at any level depending on how high or low you want the residual value/balloon amount to be. 
Hire Purchase
You simply borrow the cost of the vehicle (beyond any deposit you can put down), pay it off monthly and the vehicle is yours once you've made the final payment.
You are paying off the whole loan and the car is yours at the end of the term. Although monthly PCP payments are lower than HP, your overall cost will be lower with HP if you can afford to pay it each month.

Personal Contract Purchase (PCP)
PCP offers lower monthly payments as you are only paying off the amount between the purchase price (less any deposit you pay) and the final balloon figure in your agreement, you are not paying off the whole amount (as in HP deals) and you get the choice of keeping the car at the end or not.

Agreements can usually be run with anywhere between 0 - 40% of the vehicle price as a deposit.

A PCP quote will include a monthly payment, an APR %, and a final balloon payment ("guaranteed final purchase price"..or "GFV" - guaranteed final value). This is the amount you'll have to pay at the end if you want to keep the car and is the value the funder has forecast for it if your mileage forecast has been accurate (and it is clearly better to build in enough mileage allowance at the start than have to pay for excess mileage at the end!).

If you hand the car back at the end of the term instead, you have nothing further to pay (if the dealer inspecting it finds no faults requiring repair/refurbishment) but if its subsequent re-sale then realises a greater amount than the GFV figure in your agreement, you'll get that surplus which you can then use towards your next car. However, funders will have varying methodologies so please check your small print to check how your own deal will work.

You can often build in maintenance packages if you might have high mileage.

So, what am I paying off with PCP?
With PCP you are only paying off the amount which is the difference between the purchase price (less any deposit you've put down) and the GFV offered by the funder, so you are only paying interest on that difference figure, not the whole price of the car.

Surely I just need to look for a low APR rate?
Not always. Everyone is APR-sensitive but with PCP you need to look at all elements of the deal, not just the APR. 
You can have a low APR but those deals usually come with a low GFV figure too, so the difference (the gap between the purchase price and GFV) is large and that is the figure you are paying off. Get quotes with reasonable APR's and then check the GFV figures...they will vary, so you need a balance between decent APR and the lowest difference between the price for the car and GFV figure.

The optimum PCP deal is a low APR and small gap between purchase price and GFV! Look for the monthly payment and the 'total amount payable' figure to help you make your decision, never just look at the APR.

Also watch out for any additional fees i.e credit arrangement fees (at the start and/or at the end of the term), 'option to purchase' fees, and excess mileage charges (always be realistic with your mileage estimates at the beginning and build in a little leeway in case you change jobs or move house and need to do more mileage).

Clearly, the more deposit you can put down, the less you'll be needing to fund, but most PCP funders will stipulate maximum deposits, often a max' of somewhere between 30-40% of the purchase price.

What about car manufacturer finance deals?
Yes...a good source of short term PCP offers so look out for them..but again don't be sold on a deposit contribution offer or just a low APR...look at the overall deal as it may require you to pay a higher price for the car to start with and ALWAYS get an independent quote and compare the overall finance payable figures right to the end of the term, including any fees before making a decision


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## mrdemon (Apr 20, 2005)

as above

buy it out right or a get a 5 year loan from sainsburies at 6.6 %
after 3 years you then are better off than a PCP for 3 years imo and also not forced to hand the car back or try and sell it, it's prob in neg equity any way on a pcp so most people are fooked and have to hand them back, leaving them where they started with no money and no car.

any other way is fooking expensive and means you cannot really afford it but think you can .

PCP you are paying interest on a balloon you never pay off, that's very expensive and dealers are laughing all the way to the bank.

A 5 year loan you can choose what to do after 3 years, the cars yours and you will have paid more off than in a PCP so the car will prob have equity in it unlike the PCP.

ALl depends on the price of the car, the more expensive the car the more finance hurts.

I bought the TTRS cash but have a 14k mini on a 5 year loan, total cost over 5 years on 14k is not that much.

total cost on a PCP with a TTRS was 10k in interest  so no way would I do that as I cannot make 10k net on the money i had in the bank.


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## riiiiiich (Oct 22, 2011)

Yeah, my current TT I paid cash for (well not literally, but from my current account via card) second hand and will probably make sure I have enough money put aside for my next car on top of the deposit I already have in this present car. Unless I get an exceptional finance offer then I will do the same again.


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## Joe Ekins (May 4, 2011)

The most cost effective way is to buy a year old car with cash simple as.

The car has depreciated by its largest year on year margin at that point.

You can never match the interest rate on the PCP/Finance/Loan by investing the money you have so better to whack it down upfront on the car.

PCP is basically a rental scheme and not really meant for people who ever want to own the car outright.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

I disagree about not being able to get at least the same rate of return on capital as you can borrow money from Audi. My PCP was at 2.9% flat which my business can almost double if I lock the money up for 36 months in a fixed rate bond and as a business it pays no tax on interest earned on investments. Even as a private individual you can get 3-4% on a 12-18 month fixed term bond and I think there is at least one building society offering 3% flat on an instant access account.

On most other VAG cars you can get interest free credit on most models over 2 or 3 years. As the TT gets closer to renewal there will be some very good deals to be had, I'm certain.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

The other thing to watch with PCP is the cost to set-up the finance and to end it. It can add up to a few hundred pounds.

Also watch any penalties for exiting the agreement early. Even my last personal loan a few years back had 2 months interest as a penalty.

The best advice is to do your sums and look at all the options. Sometimes Audi will give you a good discount off RRP if you take their finance.

But always remember Audi Finance are always out to make money. Even 0% finance generally isn't free as you'd get a better deal (discount or part ex) if you didn't take it.

True as wja96 says you can sometimes offset the interest payment if you play the game right.

A trick I used once if take out 2 loans for the car, a manufacturer once gave me £1000 if I took out their finance. It suddenly clicked I could get a much better deal from my bank. Asked what the minimum loan to get the £1000 discount was as it was £1500. So took that on HP and the rest on a bank loan. Monthly payments worked out 6% cheaper. Only downside was the cost to take out the HP and end it, but I was still quids in.


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## riiiiiich (Oct 22, 2011)

Big Nick said:


> The most cost effective way is to buy a year old car with cash simple as.
> 
> The car has depreciated by its largest year on year margin at that point.
> 
> ...


Precisely what I did with this one. One year old and paid cash...even though the interest rate on offer was *fairly* reasonable, unless it was virtually interest-free, it was never going to be worth my while. Will do the same next time too.


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## riiiiiich (Oct 22, 2011)

wja96 said:


> I disagree about not being able to get at least the same rate of return on capital as you can borrow money from Audi. My PCP was at 2.9% flat which my business can almost double if I lock the money up for 36 months in a fixed rate bond and as a business it pays no tax on interest earned on investments. Even as a private individual you can get 3-4% on a 12-18 month fixed term bond and I think there is at least one building society offering 3% flat on an instant access account.
> 
> On most other VAG cars you can get interest free credit on most models over 2 or 3 years. As the TT gets closer to renewal there will be some very good deals to be had, I'm certain.


I'm getting about 3.2% at the moment with limited withdrawals, but I will have to keep moving it around. I might stick this in a fixed bond for next year once I have accumulated more...trying to save up a deposit for a place. And another car will come after that (we're talking several years). Let's hope nothing difficult like having a family will get in the way, I was looking forward to getting a TTRS or something


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## mrdemon (Apr 20, 2005)

wja96 said:


> I disagree about not being able to get at least the same rate of return on capital as you can borrow money from Audi. My PCP was at 2.9% flat which my business can almost double if I lock the money up for 36 months in a fixed rate bond and as a business it pays no tax on interest earned on investments..


2.9 flat is about 6% APR then it's taxed at 40% as most people who can afford a TTRS are going to be high rate tax payers.

So you need a bond at about 8.4% or an investment at the same.

a bond at 2.9% is going to leave you well out of pocket lol.

Then there is the issue no one is doing PCP that low any more, more like 8 or 9%.

My PCP quote on the TTRS was 10k in interest, I could not make 10k in interest with the money, not a hope.


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## brittan (May 18, 2007)

Just to cheer you up, don't forget that with UK inflation currently at 5% your savings in banks, building societies etc. are losing money in real terms.


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## riiiiiich (Oct 22, 2011)

Yeah, it is definitely a matter of minimising losses...not really much of an incentive to save is it?


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## weeman69 (Jul 11, 2008)

If it helps at all, I've just had an e-mail from "George" who works for the National Bank of Nigeria. Apparently they can offer significantly higher rates of return, you just have to give him your bank account number, pin & D.O.B & he'll take care of the rest!
Tempting huh? :? :?:


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## riiiiiich (Oct 22, 2011)

weeman69 said:


> If it helps at all, I've just had an e-mail from "George" who works for the National Bank of Nigeria. Apparently they can offer significantly higher rates of return, you just have to give him your bank account number, pin & D.O.B & he'll take care of the rest!
> Tempting huh? :? :?:


No thanks...I do all my business through Ouagadougou in Burkina Faso. Plus it's my favourite capital city name


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

mrdemon said:


> wja96 said:
> 
> 
> > I disagree about not being able to get at least the same rate of return on capital as you can borrow money from Audi. My PCP was at 2.9% flat which my business can almost double if I lock the money up for 36 months in a fixed rate bond and as a business it pays no tax on interest earned on investments..
> ...


1. I don't pay any income tax. I live on dividends from owning shares in limited companies.
2. The bulk of my business capital is in bonds at 5.7% flat. Or 10.4% APR if you prefer.
3. As stated, as it's a 100% business investment vehicle, there is no corporation tax on interest earned.
4. APR is a hypothetical figure which is of no relevance in this comparison as everything is based on flat rates. It's supposed to help compare compound interest over differing terms. In this case the term is the same so flat rates are directly comparable.
5. In financial terms I am up on the deal, but the cash is still locked away to obtain that rate of interest.
6. Excellent PCPs are available from all sorts of lenders, not just Audi. Most banks do them, most leasing companies do them, I have even used odd financial institutions like Hitachi for a PCP in the past.
7. £10,000 in interest is about right for 4 years at 5% flat or 3 years at 6.5%-ish flat if the balance of the loan was £50,000, so I'd say you probably couldn't cover much more than half of that as a private individual if you wanted instant access to your money, but you could probably cover 70-80% of it if you were prepared to lock it away for 18 months at a time and business owners will have no trouble covering that level of interest.

Audi finance have various lending rates for differently qualified buyers. If you don't like the interest rate, shop elsewhere or negotiate harder.

Of course, the real cost that we are all neatly neglecting is depreciation. If you pay for the car in cash, you take the full hit from day 1. If you finance it, you finance the depreciation. Over 3 years it looks like the depreciation on a new RS is about £25,000 which is enough to buy a 1.8l roadster outright. That's probably the smart move overall.


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

Wja...09 RS was £42,750 new, currently they are selling for £29-33k. In 3 and a bit months time those cars will be 3yrs old.

The above is not including any Audi discount on new. I would say those are excellent depreciation figures. Nowhere near £25k.

20% VAT came about at the start of this year so the depreciation will be a little harder 2011 on but then again, Audi have been offering very generous discounts.


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

Mitchy said:


> Wja...09 RS was £42,750 new, currently they are selling for £29-33k. In 3 and a bit months time those cars will be 3yrs old.
> 
> The above is not including any Audi discount on new. I would say those are excellent depreciation figures. Nowhere near £25k.
> 
> 20% VAT came about at the start of this year so the depreciation will be a little harder 2011 on but then again, Audi have been offering very generous discounts.


It's period time, dont rise to the bait...
PCP is the only way. I'm sure i recall a similar thread about Rumbelows and TV rental vs purchase many years ago.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

Mitchy said:


> Wja...09 RS was £42,750 new, currently they are selling for £29-33k. In 3 and a bit months time those cars will be 3yrs old.
> 
> The above is not including any Audi discount on new. I would say those are excellent depreciation figures. Nowhere near £25k.
> 
> 20% VAT came about at the start of this year so the depreciation will be a little harder 2011 on but then again, Audi have been offering very generous discounts.


Mitchy, the starting price you mention is, i'm sure, quite correct however there are very few base RS's and when it was launched there were no discounts. As yours is on a PCP you'll know exactly what Audi reckon bottom of the Market at the end of the finance will be. It's the balloon figure on your car.

I've seen at least one average-ish mileage 59 plate on here, being sold by a forum member (AbyssRS) for £29,995 that had a sticker price of over £55,000 and most TTRS's advertised have the RNS-E and option paint, which makes them £45,000 cars. Add in mag-ride and electric seats (again, very popular options) and it's a £47,000 car. 19" alloy wheels add another £1000 approximately and that's before we've added the little options like folding mirrors, rain sensors etc. Which an awful lot of these cars also have. The Recaro buckets are/were £2500 or something? It's really not hard to get to £55,000, even without mentioning Audi Exclusive things. And it's generally accepted all those options add £1000 at best to the resale.

I'm sure that even if you allow £15,000 depreciation on a £45,000 RS to £30,000 three years later, it's still eye-watering. I do take your point about discounts, but I don't usually factor discounts into depreciation figures as there is always at least one mug who paid full whack in cash when they came out and most published figures are based on list or sticker prices.

With the impending launch of the run-out RS+ model that will be the one people want used and anything else will be worth a little bit less.


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## ChinsVXR (Apr 14, 2006)

The best trade bid I have so far on my 8 month old TTRS Stronic is £35k. Listed at £53k. It's not over the top with options either and has all the essential one, 19's and Tech pack.

Be interesting to see where it is in a years time


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

wja96 said:


> Mitchy said:
> 
> 
> > Wja...09 RS was £42,750 new, currently they are selling for £29-33k. In 3 and a bit months time those cars will be 3yrs old.
> ...


To be fair, depreciation should be based on base price. I believe when looking at Glass's/Parker guide the figures are from base model cars. I know its not true for everybody but the discount offered can offset the option boxes ticked so you're paying circa base price anyway. True, you can spec an RS upto £55k but hopefully no-one in their right mind has paid a penny over £50k on an RS. They're not worth it. For me, I had a £45k figure in my head as top whack and managed to get a car for that, quite a few options ticked too although no nav.

PCP is an interesting topic, you're right, I finance my car through PCP at payments of £600pm on a favourable low interest rate, from memory below 5% APR. You'll get the usual crowd saying, oh well, you clearly cant afford the car as you never paid money for it but its a ludicrous argument, cash is not always best. (10-12% discounts on cash transactions, I think not)

Investment of the original capital is also an interesting discussion, up my way, I can buy a £60k 1 bed flat that will generate a monthly income of around £475pm. The £60k remains safe whilst the investment is generating an income. Okay, 40% taxation needs to come off that rental income, but still, the capital investment is working in your favour and over the longterm it will be appreciating in value. The same £60k ploughed into a heavily depreciating lump of metal makes no financial sense to me. There was a chap recently who paid out just over £50k for his RS and then sold it 6mths later for just shy of £40k, wow  . Had the chap PCP'd the car, he wouldn't have lost over £10k in 6mths, for example I only pay £7200pa each year. 1st year I'll beat depreciation, 2nd year it will roughly match, 3rd year, I'll lose out.

Also, who is cash rich these days? We are both 28 and work full time, both of us earning what are considered high salaries in the oil industry but yet we have nowhere near £50k in the bank to splash out on a car. High mortgage costs, astronomical childcare costs and then todays cost of living makes it nigh on impossible to have that kind of money in the bank unless you are a 50% tax earner or you were lucky enough to have property before the housing market went bonkers or you have had a windfall/inheritance. Would anyone like to guess what a 4yr old, 3yr old and a 6mth old costs to put into nursery :lol:

Anyway, it's a touchy subject, we've been here before, just whatever works out best for you personally. For us, at this point in our lives, PCP is for us. Perhaps in 15yrs time when the kids are out and the mortgage is paid then we'll be able to write a cheque for a car and not worry about depreciation but until then, I'll keep on financing my cars the way I have been doing


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

ChinsVXR said:


> The best trade bid I have so far on my 8 month old TTRS Stronic is £35k. Listed at £53k. It's not over the top with options either and has all the essential one, 19's and Tech pack.
> 
> Be interesting to see where it is in a years time


If you swap for another Audi, I guarantee you will get a trade in north of £40k :wink:

Back in June I part exchanged a 59 plate manual RS with only a handful of options for £37k against an 11 plate S-Tronic RS for £45k (£53k spec)

You just need to shop around. The above quote on your RS tells me the salesman was just not interested, it's a ludicrous price.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

Mitchy said:


> There was a chap recently who paid out just over £50k for his RS and then sold it 6mths later for just shy of £40k  Wow . Had the chap PCP'd the car, he wouldnt have lost over £10k in 6mths, I only pay £7200 for example each year. 1st year I'll beat depreciation, 2nd year it will roughly match, 3rd year, I'll lose out.


I'm not sure how on PCP it would make any difference what the guy lost.

If a car is worth £40K after 6 months, it's worth £40K no matter how he paid for it.


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## LEO-RS (Apr 13, 2009)

phil3012 said:


> Mitchy said:
> 
> 
> > There was a chap recently who paid out just over £50k for his RS and then sold it 6mths later for just shy of £40k  Wow . Had the chap PCP'd the car, he wouldnt have lost over £10k in 6mths, I only pay £7200 for example each year. 1st year I'll beat depreciation, 2nd year it will roughly match, 3rd year, I'll lose out.
> ...


You need to understand the market. Look at my own example of trading in my manual RS in for my DSG RS. Audi were that keen to keep me, they gave me top whack for my PX car whilst still giving me a good figure on sticker price of the new car. £37k for my manual RS and then it was listed for £37,995 2wks later. I suspect they sold that at a loss or at best what they paid me for it, they'll just get their margin back on the next deal by not offering good P/X on the donor car that is used against my old RS. It's a game of margins and you can work them in your favour.

Finance sales will generally give a better discount on new too.

In the case I mentioned, the chap did not PX against another Audi and hence why he was shafted with trade price. There's no way the car was worth £39k, it would have went onto the forecourt the next day at £45-46k but he allowed that particular car salesman to bend him over and shaft him hard. Had he traded in against another Audi, I suspect he would have been offered £43-£44k to go towards his next PCP deal.

For me, unless the figures are right, I wont swap, I'll simply keep the car until the figures do work out and its always done me good.

Not just a 1 off, I traded in my TT TDI for my manual RS in exactly the same way. (Bought TDI for £29k but with a £2.5k Audi contribution so £26.5k in reality and sold it for £24k 15mths later against my manual RS priced £36,995) Yes, I bought my manual RS for £36,995 and sold it for a fiver more at £37k 8mths later.

That's 3 good deals so my Audi finance experience has so far been very good. Perhaps I'll get stung on my next car, who knows.


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## Critter10 (Nov 4, 2010)

There are a few references to being able to negotiate discounts when buying a vehicle, the implied assumption being that these are not available to PCP customers - not true! I got over £2000 knocked off the list price of a GTi on a PCP. I discussed with the dealer an outright cash purchase, to see what difference that might make to the discount. It made none. Pretty obvious, really, as from the dealer's point of view he couldn't give a rat's where the money comes from as long as he gets paid. In fact he probably makes more, via commission on PCP, HP etc. I also considered VW finance, bank finance etc. as well as using my own savings.

In the end, I did my own sums (I'm an accountant), consulted a mate of mine who's a financial broker and took his advice that, taking everything into account, the PCP deal being offered was my best option. Whichever way you go involves a fair degree of crystal ball gazing, so I would say there's no 'right' option that fits every time. Each situation has to be judged on its merits. But in my opinion it would be foolish to dismiss PCP out of hand. Particularly if that notion is based on the need for ownership, remembering that unless you intend to stop driving you will always have the residual value of your car tied up and unavailable.


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## phil3012 (Jul 25, 2008)

Critter10 said:


> There are a few references to being able to negotiate discounts when buying a vehicle, the implied assumption being that these are not available to PCP customers - not true! I got over £2000 knocked off the list price of a GTi on a PCP. I discussed with the dealer an outright cash purchase, to see what difference that might make to the discount. It made none. Pretty obvious, really, as from the dealer's point of view he couldn't give a rat's where the money comes from as long as he gets paid. In fact he probably makes more, via commission on PCP, HP etc. I also considered VW finance, bank finance etc. as well as using my own savings.


Apparently you get more of a discount (or higher part ex price) if you take their finance.

The dealer makes commission out of selling you the finance and can pass some of this on to the end customer as an incentive for going with them.

At the end of the day though, they still make a profit from the finance so long term you're worse off.


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## senwar (Apr 21, 2003)

I've been intending to take finance for my car (arrives in March) and am intending to go through a proposal tomorrow based on the new finance deals on offer. This sort of secures the current deal.

However, I may want to pay for the car direct (either by selling shares or getting a p/loan) but don't want to decide till nearer the time. If I go through a proposal tomorrow, I presume I can change my mind if I decide to go a different route come February time?

For info, it seems there are some improved finance/pcp deals out there at the moment. I was called last week and my figures reduced by approximately £1500 (total payable)


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

until you come to collect the its upto you, you can alway change your mind.
I'd let the dealer know in advance you havent made your mind up how you will pay for it...


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## Dash (Oct 5, 2008)

I pay X amount a month on a personal loan for a car. The loan isn't enough to buy a new TT because, well that would be an insane loan for me. I also pay for servicing and MOT. The car is closing in on ten years and 100K miles, so I need to replace it.

When I replace it, I'll have X a month from my last car's loan budget to spend on a new one (and actually a little more as my earning power has gone up). So, I could get another loan, another second hand car for a few years until it's really past-it and reuse.

Or, I could get a brand spanking new car, preferably with servicing chucked in, and pay a similar amount - and recycle after 3 years.

I get to ponce about in a new car, and not put much effort into thinking about the long-term health of the vehicle. I don't need to worry about a recession coming along 6 months after I buy it and wiping out it's value as nobody wants a sports car.

Sure, it may cost me more when comparing assets and long term thingys, but then, if I'm just viewing it as getting a car for X a month, PCP makes a lot of sense.

I'm never going to want to keep a car for too long, as even if it still looks good in ten years, it won't be as fuel-efficient, safe and lacking in all other technological advancements (like free carbon in your engine).


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## shougle (Mar 7, 2009)

Dash said:


> I pay X amount a month on a personal loan for a car. The loan isn't enough to buy a new TT because, well that would be an insane loan for me. I also pay for servicing and MOT. The car is closing in on ten years and 100K miles, so I need to replace it.
> 
> When I replace it, I'll have X a month from my last car's loan budget to spend on a new one (and actually a little more as my earning power has gone up). So, I could get another loan, another second hand car for a few years until it's really past-it and reuse.
> 
> ...


cheers


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## TTpete (May 19, 2011)

V interesting thread, I generally buy my cars on PCP, but do so with eyes wide open. I change my cars frequently so I try and buy as cheap as possible, and with enough deposit not to go straight into negative equity on the loan. Audi PCP interest APRs, outside of the subsidised rates, are astronomically high, I have been quoted 12.5% on almost every quote on a used car, simply outrageous. Some dealers wil reduce it when challenged, others have said they cannot do that unless they refer back to Audi finance (VWFS) - now that is total BS. I would never pay more than 10% on a PCP, even that is too high really. I have an excel PCP calculator, it is amazing how much difference even 1% APR can make on a 3 or 4 year deal.

Does anyone have any inside information on what used/new car Audi offers there will be in Q1 2012? I have heard of 'Open season', but that is about March time I think. The Q4 used car offer of two years free servicing ends on Saturday, presumably it will be replaced with another offer. The Quattro season campaign brings a 7.2% APR, but he problem is finding the right car that is immediately available.


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