# Complaining non TTOC members.



## les (Jul 24, 2006)

I just can't get my head round it. We have *NON *TTOC members complaining about the TTOC on various issues on here and in other forums. I can't think of any other club that you can get away with not paying the membership fee and yet slag that club the committee and its members off. Now I know I will get told to drop it etc but come on, Sheeshhhhhh. :roll:


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## Charlie (Dec 15, 2006)

Ah Les the controversial old git coming to the fore once more - love you Les :-*

I agree with you to be honest, ok so we want as many members as possible and I certainly encourage those that attend the meets I organise to join; but the old hard sell doesn't work in my opinion, if peeps want to join they will whatever I do or say, so I aim to let them know that it is there and the benefits of membership 

It would be churlish to insist that everyone coming to the meet was a member already and it seems in certain areas more people who attend are not members than are - my hope would be that over time those that get the benefit of the meets etc decide to join, I would certainly exert no pressure as I would not appreciate it personally.

I also now send out a flyer with every package I send out and am happy to try and support the TTOC in any way possible.

Personally I feel £35 to support the club surrounding the cars we love is something I am happy to spend, I am proud to be a member - I do also understand that not everyone necessarily feels like this and I respect their right to their opinion/feeling on the subject.

Charlie


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## tony_rigby_uk (Nov 27, 2008)

I know what your refering to.... :lol:

Granted it's abit out of order to complain to the ttoc there isn't a rep when they are non TTOC members... :lol:

but again classic case of chicken or egg... some people would rather meet and get chatty and sign up based on their experience with the rep, not just sign up online and never utilise the commity or the reps.. hense why they probably need a rep to bring in the TTOC members..

seems very similar to the NW argument a few months ago... although in the NW we were all TTOC members so the situation is abit different....

my view is if your not a paying member, then you don't vote on commity and have not right to complain or moan about anything TTOC related... after all your not a part of the TTOC..


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## mighTy Tee (Jul 10, 2002)

Well said Les.

One of the reasons I became Southern Area Rep for a 2nd time was because since the 2008 AGM there has been a renewed enthusiasm and commitment from the TTOC committee, resulting in a resurgence in local and nation meets.

The committee are all unpaid volunteers giving up their spare time to help make the TT experience so much better for TTOC (and non) members.


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## les (Jul 24, 2006)

Cheers all,
I don't mind constructive criticism from non TTOC members and suggestions are always welcome but to come on the owners club and complain about such things as reps is a bit rich when you contribute sweet FA to the club IMO. :roll: I once called such people who use the TTOC but don't pay towards its running costs "freeloaders" and was criticized for it. I make no apology and stand by it. I do tend to speak my mind, don't fussy about and shoot from the hip but those that know me know I only ever have this club at heart. 

BTW MighTy Tee, you missed off Reps being volunteers as well. :wink:


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## CamV6 (Oct 26, 2003)

Pay no attention Les. Comments like that are based on pure ignorance of what the TTOC is, what it can and cant do and why, and of the huge investment of time (for no reward other than maybe the appreciation) given by the Committee members and highly valued reps like yourself, without whivh the club simply wouldnt exist.

It is VERY disheartening to read silly misguided comments from those who no only fail to join but also fail to even offer to do something about the deficiencies they perceive, so I'm with you on this.

However, try simply to rise above it. Its basic human nature/instinct to criticise and say things. Its takes intelligence and knowledge however to understand the issues and real-world constraints our club works with.

The club, in reality, is about the community it creates. Period.


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## Mark Davies (Apr 10, 2007)

I've got to say I find it absolutely bizzare that some people think it's irrelevant whether people are members of a club when it comes to demanding a club representative!


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## les (Jul 24, 2006)

CamV6 said:


> Pay no attention Les. Comments like that are based on pure ignorance of what the TTOC is, what it can and cant do and why, and of the huge investment of time (for no reward other than maybe the appreciation) given by the Committee members and highly valued reps like yourself, without whivh the club simply wouldnt exist.
> 
> It is VERY disheartening to read silly misguided comments from those who no only fail to join but also fail to even offer to do something about the deficiencies they perceive, so I'm with you on this.
> 
> ...


I do mainly agree Cam however sometimes you have to stop biting your lip, stop turning the other cheek, ignore them and tell it as its is (rub the dogs nose in it so to speak) Who the hell do these people think they are? To me paying my subs and sitting back saying entertain me I have paid you is not an option. Money aside my philosophy is if you get something rewarding out of something give something back. Now I know some may well have done this but to winge and bitch about a club you don't belong to is out of order full stop.


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## CamV6 (Oct 26, 2003)

Chiiillll big man, 'ave a likkle smoke and relax bruv [smiley=pimp2.gif] innit. 'Nuf said


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## audimad (Jan 7, 2008)

:lol:


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## UKRPG (Oct 14, 2009)

Hi all - I just wanted to include this on here which I have also written in to the events section so apologies if you have already seen it. More than happy to take comments but I want to echoe Nem on the grounds its stick in the sand time

Cheers all  , Richard

OK all - I think this is now at a point where there is going to be no solution so heres my perspective as I agree with Nem, a line has to be drawn and people need to move on. Its a car club for people who enjoy a specific car, theres hundreds of clubs about - that said, theres issues on most as the demographic is always very varied which will cause dispute. Although that said underneath were all involved as to different levels we have a passion and a love for our cars.

I certainly see value in the statement of both sides and the issue is clouded by the set up in which anyone can be in the forum and meetings - although often run by TTOC members, are not specifically for them - the difference with this club is that in certain areas the TTOC is a seperate entity and thats where the issue seems to lie. In most clubs the owners club is the site and the forum is a club forum while here its not - the only way that could change is if there was aTTOC specific forum on the TTOC website which is another situation / kettle of fish altogether.

I am very passionate about my TT as many who know me/have met me will know and I am a TTOC member which I fully appreciate and enjoy being part of and will and do support 100% moving forward. On those grounds I have offered up my services to be a Rep to Paul and in that role would support and work with TTOC members within the Essex region along with organising and working with others to ensure regular meetings occur for TTOC members and forum members alike. As per the job I would also talk about the TTOC and discuss membership and its values to all who would like to know along with supporting other TTOC members in my region should it be required.

The TTOC is not for everyone due to various reasons which is fine in this set up and for them they just want a regular local meeting which occurs already. The forum members in Essex are a great bunch who as above love they're cars and enjoy talking and in most cases modding their cars. I've been involved personally in a number of meetings with different regions and as you would expect theres no difference in values or porpose in any. The issue seems to have started as I think people wanted "ownership" of the events and the way the meeting set up currently is its usually via the TTOC rep who in this case was not as active as many which is a real shame and more than covered in other posts however this is not necessarily right as its not a true necessity but it is the perception that has been taken and thats why this has got so heated and in some cases defensive - which to me is completely unnecessary hence I have to say I've steered clear of the conflict, rather stayed central. These meetings should and must carry on as there's some great cars and I for one will definately be involved firstly as an Essex owner but also as hopefully the rep for the area to assist and run where required but also to photo and report back to the club. Where members are involved I will act on there behalf and if people want to talk/discuss/ be involved in the TTOC I will happily work with them along with the other duties Paul has kindly covered off with me.

Were meeting Sunday in conjunction with Kent owners and expect 20+ cars which will easily be the biggest meeting of the year (as long as we can actually park!!) and it will be an excellent event which I don't think should be dominated by this subject so lets all get straightened up here, enjoy the cars we have - enjoy friendships we have made and will make through the club and get back to what this is all about.


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## Nem (Feb 14, 2005)

Totally agree Richard.

I'm going to lock this now, there really is nothing left to say on this matter


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