# Tested a Merc E320 CDI Sport today



## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

http://thinkcar.org/?p=99

Apologies for hogging forum space when there's so many other interesting threads around at the moment! 

Cracking car though.

I'm getting old.


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)




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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

kmpowell said:


>


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

<<One interesting point I want to make about the Mercedes is that in Sport trim, it is supplied with seats upholstered in â€œArticoâ€ - a man made synthetic leather. Iâ€™d read this in the brochure and assumed that itâ€™d be necessary to spec the proper leather. After all, who wants leather substitute on a Â£40k car? I now have to eat those words - the car we borrowed has Artico and you really, really canâ€™t tell itâ€™s not real leather. An easy way to save almost a grand. Mark (the sales guy) reckons that for resale it is not an issue (and he told me this before I offered my opinion!).>>

Same as Alcantara then?

On the gearbox, did the 530d have the latest lc 'box? I hear it's pretty special.

Â£40K is just way too much for a 320cdi. 535d with lc box and sport kit and non run flats seems best paper fit. Arseometer says different i guess.

Actually at Â£40k i'd bring a late model A8 4.2 tdi into the equation. Space, pace etc.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

garyc said:


> Same as Alcantara then?


Well, Alcantara is suede substitute isn't it, not leather. Artico is more like leather than Alcantara is like suede.

On the price, I agree with you. I try and concentrate on the difference between purchase price and likely future sale price rather than just purchase price. The Merc finance figures are budgeting for the car to lose a maximum Â£20,000 over 3 years! Harsh!

The auto in the (almost brand new) 530d I tried was almost identical in operation to my 2001 330d, but 6 speed. There is a different automatic option that has a weird shaped gear lever, perhaps that's the good one.

Whatever I buy, it's looking like it'll be used, so any brand-new gearbox is going to be out of the equation. In the used market, the A6, 530d and E320 CDI seem to be similarly priced. They never have exactly the same equipment and there aren't millions of examples around, but it's hard to split them on price.

Equivalent 535ds are Â£3-5k more unless you get one with a big mileage. Of course I'd prefer a 535d on engine alone, but a low mileage car costs the same as a brand new E320 CDI Sport. It's possible to buy a well specced Spring 05 535d sport with 30k miles for Â£32k. Perhaps this is the way to go.

The 5/E/A6 saloons are big enough for my needs, but I wan't an estate. I like estates! That's why I'm not looking at the A8. TBH I prefer the A8 saloon to any of the others, and if you're prepared to go a bit older, it gets even cheaper.


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Carl, i'd go the BMW route, but have no experience of the Merc's so cannot compare.

As you say, the 535d engine is an absolute peach & i never had any issues with the Auto box in that car. Would a few extra miles on a 535d really matter greatly? as mileage is not often a deciding factor on oil burners given their expected lifespan.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

It is possible to buy fantastically specced Spring 2005 535d M Sport for Â£31-32k (before negotiation). Downside is they come with 30,000 miles. Which to be fair is not bad for a 2.5 year old car. These cars listed at Â£51,000 (today's prices).

When was your car first registered? How did its 'box compare with the performance autos you have owned?

On a BMW, by the sounds of things the run-flats would have to go. Comfort is very high on my list. That's Â£600 on new tyres, plus having to acquire a space saver.


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## raven (May 7, 2002)

I know you want an estate, but if you didn't and given the pipe and slippers comments, I would highly rate the Jag XJ. I spent the last week driving the cheapest XJ with the V6 engine and I was amazed at the quality of ride, and this didn't seem to impact the handling at all which was superb. It also feels a bit different from / more special than all the large saloons out there which I think can feel a bit "taxi-ish".

Car magazine ran a top of the range XJ not so long ago and raved about it and given the awful depreciation, you can pick up a very well spec'd car for not too much cash.


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Carlos said:


> It is possible to buy fantastically specced Spring 2005 535d M Sport for Â£31-32k (before negotiation). Downside is they come with 30,000 miles. Which to be fair is not bad for a 2.5 year old car. These cars listed at Â£51,000 (today's prices).
> 
> When was your car first registered? How did its 'box compare with the performance autos you have owned?
> 
> On a BMW, by the sounds of things the run-flats would have to go. Comfort is very high on my list. That's Â£600 on new tyres, plus having to acquire a space saver.


Carl, i'll check the dates but i know my 535d Sport was on a 55 plate so that would make it Sept/Oct 05 time. I bought as an ex Dealer Principal car so it was loaded with every option & had about 6K miles IIRC. The box was a peach both when standard & after the DMS re-map, but post map the performance was insane  Box was far better than the RS6 Tip & A8 Tip & very different from the M5 SMG, but defo the best Auto box i've ever driven.

If you find a car with the 172 style wheels (19") which alot have as this was an option on all 2005 onwards M-Sports, then it will not have runflats as no RFT was available for the 19". Can't recall if i had a space saver on that car or a repair kit.

I'd say you could negotiate at least 7-10% off a screen price & perhaps more so as being Sept i guess a good number of dealers will be over stocked with px's this month.

Good luck mate.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

W7 PMC said:


> If you find a car with the 172 style wheels (19") which *a lot have*


I wish this was the case. Hardly any used cars that I've come across in the past few weeks have this option 

My next door neighbour has them and reckons the ride is far better on non-runflat 19s than the standard 18s/runflats.

Did the gear knob look like this:










or this:










The latter is the new style box I think.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

This one catches the eye:

http://atsearch.autotrader.co.uk/www/CA ... 7294506269


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## Wondermikie (Apr 14, 2006)

Interesting review, not the result I expected TBH. The Merc auto 'box is a cracker, for definite, and the more you drive with it the better it seems.

Your BMW used car link doesn't work


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

Hmm perhaps the BMW site is session based. I've altered the link to the same car, but on autotrader. Should work ok now.


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## Wondermikie (Apr 14, 2006)

Is that one dear or is it just me?

Think I'd prefer this one http://www.mercedes-benz.motortrak.com/ ... d=13094790


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Carlos said:


> W7 PMC said:
> 
> 
> > If you find a car with the 172 style wheels (19") which *a lot have*
> ...


That's surprising, as most M-Sports when i bought mine had been specced with the 19" wheels. You're right as it was widely debated on the E60 Forums, that the 19" wheel/tyre combo was a far better ride than the 18" RFT.

Mine was as per the top picture & unless you're going to consider a very nearly new E60, that's what you'll be looking at. The lower picture is the brand new (see only introduced in the last few months) revised E60 as not only the Tranny was altered, check out the dash buttons & the front/rear lights etc as all are revised (other minor changes that i can't recall).


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## jbell (May 15, 2006)

The Merc 7 speed auto is a cracker and if it is as fast as the S320 CDi I drove, which I would assume it is then it is very fast and a good looking car


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## TJS (May 6, 2002)

Another option would be to go for the new C class estate in 320 cdi sport spec, probably Â£35k and less harsh depreciation. I looked at one at the recent Frankfurt show. The rear load space isnt much smaller than the E class and the saloon is getting very good reviews. It's a handsome looking car, profile shot at the end of the IAA thead. Not sure when it hits UK showrooms.

TJS


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## jonno (May 7, 2002)

Interesting reading thanks Carl.

I'm looking at the 535d at the mo.
Some great value to be had used currently.

"Must have" spec for me Sport, visability & media packs.
Never really considered MB due to the power defecit, might have to reconsider on the basis of your review.


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## Wondermikie (Apr 14, 2006)

TJS said:


> Another option would be to go for the new C class estate in 320 cdi sport spec, probably Â£35k and less harsh depreciation. I looked at one at the recent Frankfurt show. The rear load space isnt much smaller than the E class and the saloon is getting very good reviews. It's a handsome looking car, profile shot at the end of the IAA thead. Not sure when it hits UK showrooms.
> 
> TJS


An awesome car, looks really great.



jonno said:


> ...Never really considered MB due to the power defecit, might have to reconsider on the basis of your review.


Remember his review is of 530d not 535d. The 535d would still have noticeably more poke that the E320, although I'm not sure which I'd choose out of the two, probably still the Benz.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

Yes my 5 series comments so far are with respect to the 530d. I'm hopefully driving the 535d one lunchtime this week and so will report back.

To W7PMC, at least half the 535d M saloons on the market have the 19s, but hardly any Tourings :?


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

Wondermikie said:


> Is that one dear or is it just me?
> 
> Think I'd prefer this one http://www.mercedes-benz.motortrak.com/ ... d=13094790


The Mercs I'm looking at are all Sport spec. After the test drive I wouldn't want anything less sporty than the Sport.

I think the BMW looks pricey because to begin with it is Â£5k more expensive than the Merc (in 535d form). Also the BMWs I've looked at are very high spec - if I'm going to get a 5 I want leather, media pack, visibility pack, comfort seats and head up display. That little lot comes to Â£5k minimum, total of around Â£50k (now Â£52k) so nigh on Â£20k less after 2.5 years looks good value to me.


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## PhilJ (Sep 2, 2002)

Carlos

I borrowed an E320CDI about 4 weeks ago, for a return trip to the south of France.

Good points:-
Comfort
Image
Build Quality
Range on tank
Practicality - you can get 7 people inside if you have the flip up seats in boot
Performance - plenty quick enough for a mile muncher

Bad Points
Not the most exciting car to drive
Brakes - very grabby and not linear. Even after 2000 miles I struggled to brake consistently smoothly when in traffic. But I'm sure you would eventually get used to them

Overall
I think its a great car. Far better than a people carrier if you need to move a big family. You can drive this car all day without aches and pains. I think you would need a toy in the garage for weekends and trackdays though! Would make a great tow car!

Phil


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

TJS said:


> Another option would be to go for the new C class estate in 320 cdi sport spec, probably Â£35k and less harsh depreciation. I looked at one at the recent Frankfurt show. The rear load space isnt much smaller than the E class and the saloon is getting very good reviews. It's a handsome looking car, profile shot at the end of the IAA thead. Not sure when it hits UK showrooms.
> 
> TJS


Any pics? The saloon looks good in Sport spec. I think the C class getting such good reviews bodes well for residuals if one is considering buying new.

Carl,

I think _any_ of the cars that you are looking at are going to satisfy. What you really need to find out is what they are like for a 400 mile stint -seat comfort: true range; visibility out; switch gear etc etc.

If you are spending Â£30-Â£40K you really also need to get the one that you just plain fancy, other things being equal.

I reackon financially, they will all be much of a muchness.

Mine would still be a late (2007) model 535d sport with the LC box, with the 19"s that Paul wisely points out will ride better that RFs; and in a dark mett, with your choice of hide. Most will have the other goodies. Something tells me that as the miles stack up, the overall qualities would come forward more than all the other choices.

Get what you really want. Then justify it later. :wink:

Instinct tells me sub Â£40K is right price spot - but maybe uplift to 43ish, if the finance is conducive.

What about the Golf BTW? Bored?


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

garyc said:


> The saloon looks good in Sport spec. I think the C class getting such good reviews bodes well for residuals if one is considering buying new.


Just specced up a Sport 320CDi with the "must have" toys (for me anyway)...Â£40,300!!! 'kin ell! It's a C Class!


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

BreTT said:


> garyc said:
> 
> 
> > The saloon looks good in Sport spec. I think the C class getting such good reviews bodes well for residuals if one is considering buying new.
> ...


Why you sly little scamp. :wink: Are they available to drive yet?

7sp auto? Should be a nice package.

If one ticks all the boxes in a 330d sport, it's gonna be about the same price. So like i said much of a muchness. All down to brand preference.

Will you do OK with the 55?

Bet you thought about a C63 estate......at Â£52K before options it looks good value (well realtively) and is going to take RS4 and M3 sales fore sure. I would, although probably make the family sick. :twisted:


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

garyc said:


> Will you do OK with the 55?
> 
> Bet you thought about a C63 estate......at Â£52K before options it looks good value (well realtively) and is going to take RS4 and M3 sales fore sure. I would, although probably make the family sick. :twisted:


55 is great but I've had it almost a year now...getting itchy feet. Although I am not doing a great deal of miles (given it is used for company business), I am still around the 10 - 12k miles per annum. Vaguely considering getting something a little more sensible...but then when I start doing that, I find myself looking at the Touareg again...

The reason I read this thread was that I'd started looking at the E320CDI myself...have now also toyed with the 535d etc etc....too many options!


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

garyc said:


> Mine would still be a late (2007) model 535d sport with the LC box, with the 19"s that Paul wisely points out will ride better that RFs; and in a dark mett, with your choice of hide. Most will have the other goodies. Something tells me that as the miles stack up, the overall qualities would come forward more than all the other choices.
> 
> Get what you really want. Then justify it later. :wink:
> 
> ...


The problem with a nearly new car is the asking price. With discounts its possible to source a new one at a very similar price, makig nearly new look bad value.

For instance, I could get a new 535d to my spec (Â£52k list) for about Â£46k. To my mind it would be better to find one at 2 years old for low-mid 30s.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

garyc said:


> Mine would still be a late (2007) model 535d sport with the LC box, with the 19"s that Paul wisely points out will ride better that RFs; and in a dark mett, with your choice of hide. Most will have the other goodies. Something tells me that as the miles stack up, the overall qualities would come forward more than all the other choices.
> 
> Get what you really want. Then justify it later. :wink:
> 
> ...


The problem with a nearly new car is the asking price. With discounts its possible to source a new one at a very similar price, makig nearly new look bad value.

For instance, I could get a new 535d to my spec (Â£52k list) for about Â£46k. To my mind it would be better to find one at 2 years old for low-mid 30s.


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## Wondermikie (Apr 14, 2006)

Carlos said:


> ...That little lot comes to Â£5k minimum, total of around Â£50k (now Â£52k) so nigh on Â£20k less after 2.5 years looks good value to me.


Wow, never realised they were that expensive to start with. Makes the 3 series look cheap, no wonder they are so ubiquitous.



BreTT said:


> ...I find myself looking at the Touareg again...


Would that not be disappointing after that throbbing AMG V8?


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Wondermikie said:


> Would that not be disappointing after that throbbing AMG V8?


Went for a drive this evening...I'm cured! I'm keeping the Merc...


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## Wondermikie (Apr 14, 2006)

BreTT said:


> Wondermikie said:
> 
> 
> > Would that not be disappointing after that throbbing AMG V8?
> ...


Phew.....even a V10 TDi couldn't be as good as that Benz engine


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Carlos said:


> garyc said:
> 
> 
> > Mine would still be a late (2007) model 535d sport with the LC box, with the 19"s that Paul wisely points out will ride better that RFs; and in a dark mett, with your choice of hide. Most will have the other goodies. Something tells me that as the miles stack up, the overall qualities would come forward more than all the other choices.
> ...


But that wouldnt get you the latest LCi gearbox, which by all accounts, improves the drive even more.

E60 Facelift details + LCi gearbox and engines lowdown:

http://www.worldcarfans.com/2070115.003/New_BMW_5_Series_Facelift_in_Depth

Post march 2007.

Actually a 3.0 525d sport with 19"s makes huge sense...

EDIT;










Check out Coast to coast quotes on this thread:

http://www.tyresmoke.net/ubbthreads...rd=BMW5series&Number=1100276&page=0&fpart=all

Some deals to be had for sure.


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

Yep, read that thread the other day, there are definitely good deals to be had.

Given my buying patterns, I'm interested in first year depreciation. Even with discount a new 535d is going to depreciate around Â£10k in it's first year.

A 2-3 year old model is going to lose not much more than half that in my first year of ownership. Do I want to sacrifice Â£400+ per month just to take a new LCI car?

Not completely ruled out a newish one, but the initial catastrophic depreciation is an issue when with the best will in the world, I'm not going to be owning it when the curve flattens out...


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

...then wait until March 2008 before you change. As well as dynamic improvements, the improved quality of the LCi cars may be worth waiting for and will poss reflect in residuals, plus those of non-LCi cars looking ahead.

But maybe you should just keep your cars a little longer. :wink:


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## Carlos (May 6, 2002)

garyc said:


> But maybe you should just keep your cars a little longer. :wink:


Can't we get you on Mastermind dear? Specialist subject the bleedin' obvious? :wink:


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