# Advice on rejecting a used car



## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Dear All,

I think I already know the answer to this, but here goes anyway. I recently bought a very highly specified 2002 Mercedes S320 CDI Limo from a dealer near London. The car had three weeks of the manufacturers warranty left when I got it. I have been supplied with an extended warranty for the next eleven months or so, but it does have Ts&Cs attached.

I picked the car up on the 24th of February and on my way back to Scotland found the first problem. Since then there have been numerous others and I am now starting to lose confidence in the car. The problems have been as follows:

* Seat, window and mirror controls stopped working once the car was warmed up. Took five days to diagnose and correct. Three new door control modules required - replaced under manufacturers warranty.

* Problems with Sat Nav system - it regularly "gets lost" or the screen completely freezes and according to the MB equivalent of DIS, is turned off. Required engine to be turned off and on to come back. Still lost though - had me crusing through forests and lochs as I was heading along the A92.

* Cruise control stoppped working whilst enroute from Scotland to London. Was crusing along, cancelled it and then asked it to resume. No response. Speed limiter not working either. Required reboot of the engine again to resolve.

* Rear climate control pumps out hot air no matter what setting it is dialled to. Reboot doesn't fix this one.

* Gearbox appeared to slip out of gear whilst driving along. Is an auto and was in "D" when I pressed the loud pedal and got an impressive wail but no forward momentum. Car needed another reboot to resolve that one.

* Not entirely related, but when collecting it, rear bumper found to have a series of small scratches that were missed in the PDI. Local dealership is getting the car on Thursday to repaint the bumper and the supplying dealer will be charged for it.

The supplying dealer (near London) has taken an interest in my plight and has been sympathetic, but tells me there is nothing that they can do but they hope that I can get the problems resolved. Local dealer/servicing guys have been superb though.

Problem is that I am now losing confidence in the car. I don't feel that I can rely on it to get me to my destination with any level of certainty. There is a 30 day / 1,000 mile exchange program with the Used Approved Scheme, but I have done 4,500 miles and had it six weeks. So that appears to be out. I am going to write to MB Customer Services and see what they have to say.

Meanwhile, it is back into the dealer on Monday and Tuesday to have the latest issues investigated. That will have been eight days in the dealership in six weeks of ownership. Not happy. This car was almost Â£70k new and is only just three years old. I would not expect to be having these issues with a Used Approved vehicle.

Ideas anyone? Do you think MB will entertain me rejecting the car? :?


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## che6mw (Nov 13, 2003)

I've often found that there is some room for manouvre with any type of warranty or grace period. I've had stuff fail just a short spell out of warranty and never had a problem with it being covered by the just lapsed cover. I'd be hopeful you can expect the same here - if not from the dealership (it'll come out of their own bottom line perhaps) but from the central customer services department (I suspect costs would not be localised to a specific dealer by this route).

As regards to below - these would appear to me to be SERIOUS safety issues. Imagine if cruise control was stuck in the on position, for instance???? I'd list these as your first complaint and really make a thing of them.



> Cruise control stoppped working whilst enroute from Scotland to London. Was crusing along, cancelled it and then asked it to resume. No response. Speed limiter not working either. Required reboot of the engine again to resolve.
> 
> Gearbox appeared to slip out of gear whilst driving along. Is an auto and was in "D" when I pressed the loud pedal and got an impressive wail but no forward momentum. Car needed another reboot to resolve that one.


Mercedes are having to do a lot of back peddling at the moment to retain their customer base - they've had a lot of high profile issues with build quality and electrics, etc. I'd be very surprised if a letter to their customer services, perhaps reinforced with your previous spending history with MB (if you have one) didn't result in better action and a replacement or reimbursement of some description.

Then you can go out and buy 3 TT's (one for weekdays, one for the weekend and one for track days) and a years bus pass. Forget the limo!


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

che6mw said:


> As regards to below - these would appear to me to be SERIOUS safety issues. Imagine if cruise control was stuck in the on position, for instance???? I'd list these as your first complaint and really make a thing of them.


Thanks for that - that actually hadn't occurred to me but I will be sure to use it to make my point. This is my third MB in five years, so I certainly have history with them. This one replaced a trouble free S-Class which in turn replaced a TT that had replaced a CLK. So apart from the abberation in the middle, I've been a pretty loyal customer.

Unfortunately the TT was a non-starter when our baby came along, otherwise I might have entertained your final suggestion...


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## che6mw (Nov 13, 2003)

BreTT said:


> Thanks for that - that actually hadn't occurred to me but I will be sure to use it to make my point. This is my third MB in five years, so I certainly have history with them. This one replaced a trouble free S-Class which in turn replaced a TT that had replaced a CLK. So apart from the abberation in the middle, I've been a pretty loyal customer.
> 
> Unfortunately the TT was a non-starter when our baby came along, otherwise I might have entertained your final suggestion...


well the fact you can show you've thrown more than enough money at MB over the years can't do any harm - make sure you suggest you're so pi**ed off you won't consider buying MB again. Let us know how you get on.


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

che6mw said:


> BreTT said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for that - that actually hadn't occurred to me but I will be sure to use it to make my point. This is my third MB in five years, so I certainly have history with them. This one replaced a trouble free S-Class which in turn replaced a TT that had replaced a CLK. So apart from the abberation in the middle, I've been a pretty loyal customer.
> ...


Spoke to a dealer (who shall remain nameless) and he has advised me to "take Daimler Chrysler off at the kneecaps" and to "kick up a real stink as DC will refund your money".

Well, a goodwill gesture will go a long way. I am a MB fan, but this has stuck in the throat somewhat.


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## Jac-in-a-Box (Nov 9, 2002)

Sorry to hear of your problems Brett.

Similar situation a few years ago with an A class Jac' bought as a practical alternative to her old SL.
Numerous problems, many major, that were not quite in keeping with our percieved quality of the brand.

With persistence, eventually got to the MD of DC (UK)... sympathetic etc but effectively washed his hands of the problems suggesting it was an issue for he supplying dealer to resolve and offered the regional Merc rep to act as a mediator (waste of time as it was obvious on which side of the fence he ws sitting)

Again, much sympathy and help from the dealer initially. However, when we attempted to reject the car, and with an offer from us to put another chunk of cash into an upgraded model, it all got very heated with a good deal of verbal aggression from the MD of the supplying group.

All p*ss poor really without a decent outcome.

Good luck in finding a favourable solution - play hard on the safety related aspects of the problems.

Dave


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## The Silver Surfer (May 14, 2002)

Very sorry to hear about your car Brett. 

I would get that letter sent to MB asap, the sooner they are aware of the problems the better. Hopefully, you will get a favourable response from them. Are you going to make them aware of your wish to reject the car in your initial letter to them?

Good luck, and keep us posted with any progress.

Regards


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

The Silver Surfer said:


> Very sorry to hear about your car Brett.
> 
> I would get that letter sent to MB asap, the sooner they are aware of the problems the better. Hopefully, you will get a favourable response from them. Are you going to make them aware of your wish to reject the car in your initial letter to them?
> 
> ...


I don't really know. I am going to say I want my money back or another car of my choice to the same value as I originally spent, but I am not entirely sure whether they'll entertain that. I'll let you know...


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

sorry, had to repy seeing your sig. Why on earth did your wife say no to you buying an SL55 AMG?Im telling my fiancee he better get one (if i can get the SLK)now hes almost a lawyer. I cant help but almost crash my streetka everytime i see an SL  (the new shape though, i cant stand the old shape). They are so so so so hot! 8)


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

streetka1234 said:


> sorry, had to repy seeing your sig. Why on earth did your wife say no to you buying an SL55 AMG?Im telling my fiancee he better get one (if i can get the SLK)now hes almost a lawyer. I cant help but almost crash my streetka everytime i see an SL  (the new shape though, i cant stand the old shape). They are so so so so hot! 8)


My wife has better ideas as to how to spend money other than on petrol, unfortunately. That and the fact that the insurance is Â£2k for the AMG and Â£500 for the CDI. :?


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## IanWest (May 7, 2002)

I thought that most of the dealers were now owned directly by MB. Surely you can deal direct as they sold the car to you and cannot hide behind a franchise.


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

Why dont you just get the basic SL?Go on you know u want too! :wink: Then u could take it to a meet and have everyone oohing and ahhhing at it. Im so jelous!!!


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## dj c225 (Nov 3, 2004)

streetka1234 said:


> Why dont you just get the basic SL?Go on you know u want too! :wink: Then u could take it to a meet and have everyone oohing and ahhhing at it. Im so jelous!!!


If I read correctly and Brett has a family, there may be an issue with the SL being a 2 seater 

Also an SL350 is not as fun as the 500 or 55AMG 

Porsche 996? 4 seats!


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

i see....mmm...wot about clk convertible?u see, as i said, i go on looks...hehe i would stillbuy an sl even if it was a 1.1! :lol:


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## kmpowell (May 6, 2002)

streetka1234 said:


> u see, as i said, i go on looks


Yet you bought a streetka...... :?


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

OI!!!Well wot convertible would u have got with Â£9500? 8)


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## John C (Jul 5, 2002)

Bringing things back on topic from 'Ka'

Really sorry to hear about the Merc Brett! :? I would ask what all the options are in the first instance. I collegiate approach always seems to work well first. The old 'let's work together to sort this problem before I feel the need to take it further' approach. Not always a winner but taking this as a shared problem sometimes works.

Remember also dealers love warrantee work, they normally charge all back to MB UK to most make a tidy profit from repairs. So your dealer may like the time the S Class is with them!

In terms of contacts I know someone at MB in Milton Keynes and I could ask for his advice - he is in the Commercial Fleet side of things but he was in sales and may have some advice.

Pity Saint's old badminton partner left MB and is driving for RBR this year!


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

jacTT225 said:


> Remember also dealers love warrantee work, they normally charge all back to MB UK to most make a tidy profit from repairs. So your dealer may like the time the S Class is with them!
> 
> In terms of contacts I know someone at MB in Milton Keynes and I could ask for his advice - he is in the Commercial Fleet side of things but he was in sales and may have some advice.


Thanks John - would appreciate it if you could have a quiet word with your contact... Problem is that I have lost faith in the car now. Just had ANOTHER new problem manifest itself. If I put in context that the car has been with Mercedes for 10 out of the 40 days I've owned it, this is not a good picture... :?


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

streetka1234 said:


> Why dont you just get the basic SL?Go on you know u want too! :wink: Then u could take it to a meet and have everyone oohing and ahhhing at it. Im so jelous!!!


Nice idea but....we got rid of the TT when our son arrived because it was awkward getting his in and out of. Wife has already said that if I get another two door car we will not be using it as a family...so looks like a convertible is out of the picture....for now...


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## John C (Jul 5, 2002)

how about drowning your sorrows with a couple of mates - usual place usual time this Friday.

We are on for it!

:wink:


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

jacTT225 said:


> how about drowning your sorrows with a couple of mates - usual place usual time this Friday.
> 
> We are on for it!
> 
> :wink:


Mate????? hrm.... I might buy the boy a drink....


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

saint said:


> jacTT225 said:
> 
> 
> > how about drowning your sorrows with a couple of mates - usual place usual time this Friday.
> ...


Up yours ugly! Will need to talk to the missus but unlikely. Been away from home since Wednesday the 13th, only back yesterday...


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

Why dont you get a CLK convertible or a saab convertible?(new one though, old one is horrible)My sister (who has a A3 at the mo) is looking at getting one of these as well, and she has children. They are still quite big inside, and you also have a convertible. Ive seen heaps of them with kids!


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

streetka1234 said:


> Why dont you get a CLK convertible or a saab convertible?(new one though, old one is horrible)My sister (who has a A3 at the mo) is looking at getting one of these as well, and she has children. They are still quite big inside, and you also have a convertible. Ive seen heaps of them with kids!


Don't like the new shape CLK, so that leaves me with the old shape...the newest of which is about three years old. Unfortunately, I'm not a SAAB fan either. Good thoughts though! You're clearly a convertible fan!


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## streetka1234 (Apr 14, 2005)

Yeah, im such a poser!8) !hehe, oh how could i forget the A4 convertible......that is lovely!Get one of them! Even when i have kids :? Im gonna have to have a convertible!Though thats not gonna be for at least 10 years :!:


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Just had a call from the supplying dealer down south. My local servicing department in Edinburgh have confirmed to him (supplying dealer) that they appear to have supplied me with a rogue car. He (supplying dealer) has given me a courtesy call to inform me that they will swap the car and will be in touch to let me know what they are willing to exchange it for. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Then the negotiation really starts! [smiley=argue.gif]


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## jonno (May 7, 2002)

Sounds like progress... lets see how the negotiations go now.
Good luck!


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## che6mw (Nov 13, 2003)

Any word on this BreTT ??? How are things progressing for you?


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

che6mw said:


> Any word on this BreTT ??? How are things progressing for you?


Well, they gave me the option of swapping it for any of the cars in their group stock. Nothing took my fancy in the price bracket that I could reasonably afford. We had a little discussion about their lack of appealing stock, and (eventually) they agreed to source me a c. 18 month old E320CDI Estate with the 7 seat option, heated seats, parktronic, auto, leather. Anything other options are a bonus.


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## The Silver Surfer (May 14, 2002)

"7 seat option......"? BreTT, I thought you only had the one 'wean'!!!? Is the other half expecting quadruplets or something!!!! :lol:


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

The Silver Surfer said:


> "7 seat option......"? BreTT, I thought you only had the one 'wean'!!!? Is the other half expecting quadruplets or something!!!! :lol:


Not that I know of! She just thinks that if we are to have two estate cars (hers is a RAV4) that the other one should have the option of 7 seats. She comes from a large family and there have been occasions where we've had to take two cars.


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