# Door trim / free Bose tweak



## jmoors (Mar 24, 2007)

Hope this might be of use to future tweakers. After some very helpful advice from audiworld.com, I set about removing my speaker trim.

First off I made some trim-friendly wedges from a spatula (covered in fabric) and screwdriver (insulation tape):










Then, starting with the mid-range trim, I prised it off from the top left corner. This was for the passenger door, so for the driver door, you'd want to start top right:










It needs to flex, but take care as it's very brittle. There are six hooks holding it in. One here is obscured by my fingers:










It shows that the speaker behind is an 8cm version of the Bose 802 driver - a seriously good all-weather unit. Stick with me, there's more on the sound to follow:










In the top left, you can just see the recess for the second T20 Torx screw (the other is underneath the door handle). The door card is held on by these two screws and a series of poppers round the card edge. Next off was the grille for the bass driver:










The spatula was ideal for this. Again, top left was the place to start. You can see a tiny amount of foam/glue there. This grille is much less secure than the upper one, and a likely cause of my door rattles. I'll be improving this when it goes back on. Underneath is an impressive aluminium driver unit:










And the door minus both grilles:










Now, I seriously recommend trying this... If you've got Bose and you're underwhelmed by the bass performance, for the sake of a dab of glue, remove just one of the lower grilles. Shut the door, listen and prepare to be surprised.

The bass performance is changed beyond recognition. To understand why, look at the grille you've removed. The perforations are tiny and probably only allow for 30-50% air flow in front of the speaker...

High frequency sound waves travel more easily than low frequencies since they move a smaller quantity of air. (If you want to test this in extreme, listen to the beep of a digital watch underwater. It will be audible anywhere in the pool, whereas farting, luckily, is not :lol

With just one of the bass grilles removed, the bass sounds huge at setting 3, compared to the 8/9 where I had it previously.

So my $0.02 - Bose have put a very respectable system in the TT. I wonder if Audi have screwed it up with the trim they've used. I'm considering making a fabric grille (like hifi ones) to cover the standard one and drilling out bigger holes underneath. I'll even be able to keep the Bose logo! :lol:


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## Reaperman (Nov 3, 2006)

Good write up jmoors..... 

how are the drivers secured in their respective locations...?


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## Janitor (Jul 2, 2007)

Ooo good stuff [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Always good to read this kind of a write up with lots of piccys - please keep us posted


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## ricka (Mar 31, 2007)

I appreciate your knowledge, skills and bravery guys but that ain't for me I'm afraid! :?


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

so what's your advice? Leave the covers?
Or buy a new car?


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## jmoors (Mar 24, 2007)

Early days, but the sound difference is so night and day I won't be putting them back without some kind of mod.

Likewise, I can't leave them off either - makes the car look like an Airfix kit.

New car - you're kidding right? After the polish and TLC I've given this one? :wink:


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## modernTT (Aug 9, 2007)

Great write up!!!! Thanks for the pics too, they really give a great perspective!


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## Jace (Jun 6, 2007)

its weird because i have never had a problem with my BOSE output.
i will be the first to admitt that the acoustics are not as good as my priviouse 2006 A3 with bose buts thats down to placement of subs in the car i think.
i Prefer when they only use one powerfull sub in the boot and mid and high in the cabin. In the TT they have put subs in the doors which i think is the mistake.


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## Reaperman (Nov 3, 2006)

Jace said:


> In the TT they have put subs in the doors which i think is the mistake.


Maybe - but are they true subs

bass is non directional so they could have put them anywhere... :?


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## TTonyTT (Apr 24, 2006)

[smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Excellent piece of work - and the effort is much appreciated. The Bose's bass output is the only aspect of mine that I'm not 100% happy with.

Looking at the original spec sheet for the system (have you seen that pdf - it's here somewhere!) - the lower speaker in the front doors is described as a "20cm neodymium woofer". But in the rear left side panel (ie back "seats") is a "13cm Richbass woofer in a 9 litre custom engineered bass enclosure". I thought that was supposed to generate most of the bass for the system, and wonder whether taking off the rear side panel (is that possible?) would also improve bass performance?

Next we need someone to manufacture some better speaker covers for the front woofers ...

Excellent work again - thanks for the time & effort taken.


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## Jace (Jun 6, 2007)

Yeah i posted the PDF its on the Bose website


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## bootha2 (Oct 9, 2006)

Jmoors
Thanks - great write up and insight.

I will probably try it out myself one sunday afternoon when there is no footie on. May also consider covering with some material and drilling larger holes in the std cover.

The BOSE system sounds very clear but a low cost improvement like this sounds a no brainer

Thanks


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## markTT225 (Apr 8, 2004)

Very useful information, well done.

I've always removed the grills from my Hi-fi speakers at home for the same reason.


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## hitchbloke (Jan 28, 2007)

Love the way the fabric on your spatula matches the car interior :!:


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

did i missed something? why is everyone thanking for the pic's?

what is the solution for this problem? i didn't find it?


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## jmoors (Mar 24, 2007)

I think the thanks are for my dedication to spatula-modding.

The solution depends on how much you want to do - if I had any time off work this week, I'd be customising the grilles.

For now, I'm keeping them off until I get a chance to finish the job properly.


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## jmoors (Mar 24, 2007)

I think the thanks are for my dedication to spatula-modding.

The solution depends on how much you want to do - if I had any time off work this week, I'd be customising the grilles.

For now, I'm keeping them off until I get a chance to finish the job properly.


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

So you are saying that those clown's at Bose designed a speakersystem for a car, without a proper frontpanel?
Such a loosers over there.....ain't they?

But euhm.........what's your advice for us (car-owners with Bose) 
Should we drive without the panel's?

Sorry, i realy can't understand why so many people are trying to prove with all sort of threads that the Bose-soundsystem is fine.
It isn't. And those who think it is, never heard or owned a proper musicsystem.

Those Bose speakers and amplefier in the MK2 is the same rubbish as the home-soundsystem from Bose. 
That compagny will never fool me again with their shiny badges on the panels.

Good thing they woke up at Audi and also choosed for B&O in the A5.
Because that is a compagny that know's how to produce a proper sound.


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## Singletrack (Aug 1, 2007)

Rebel said:


> So you are saying that those clown's at Bose designed a speakersystem for a car, without a proper frontpanel?
> Such a loosers over there.....ain't they?
> 
> But euhm.........what's your advice for us (car-owners with Bose)
> ...


Unless the speakers in the A5 are active (which they are not) you are not getting the benefit of true B&O sound technology. All you are getting is the same crap as we got from Bose - badge marketing.

B&O are very good at active speaker systems. They are very good at design, ergonomics and packaging. They are perceived in the marketplace as an upmarket brand. Had they built an active speaker system for the A5 we'd be talking about a game changing approach. This is not what Audi selected. Same old, same old....shiny badges.


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## BobFat (Jul 24, 2007)

While I accept that the Sound system could have been better in the TT, I also accept that the system is being constrained because of the poor airflow for the speakers that have been installed. 6 of 1 and half a dozen of the other. So has anyone attempted this ? .....



















I bastardised others piccies, thanks for those.

The honeycomb structure (one of the strongest 'structures' in nature) provides the speaker covers with strength and rigidity. They are also of a depth to ensure rigidity is maintained should a foot kick the lower speak panel for example. As you can see I have edited out the offending air flow restriction but maintained the honeycomb structure. At least by doing this the speakers that are in place have a better chance of performing ..... and .... with a little patience this could end up looking like a cool free mod (assuming no slip-ups) , IMO.

1. Lots of patience and a sharp tool required
2. Slip of the tool = costly replacement I should think.

I'll try and get my covers off later today and have a look at this more closely. Will also allow me to objectively witness for myself if it is worth doing. I will be absolutely honest with you guys if I think the modification is worth pursuing or not.

<EDIT> I wonder if drilling is really an option ?


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

Singletrack said:


> Rebel said:
> 
> 
> > So you are saying that those clown's at Bose designed a speakersystem for a car, without a proper frontpanel?
> ...


Hello Singletrack,

Did you listen to the B&O system in a A5? I did two times. In frankfurt at the IAA and once when i visited my dealer. The sound is awesome and it will knock you off. Afterwards youre Bose will sound very poor and rubbish, trust me.
I have several components from B&O at home and they don't put their name on rubbish. Everything they produce is top-quality.

Still can't understand why BOSE produced such a crap radio-speaker system, and than also blame Audi for the quality? It's their name on speakers.


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## Arne (Dec 13, 2006)

I think the B&O in the A5 delivers some 540W - almost twice of the BOSE in the TT.

That will probabely help a little as well.... :wink:


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## Reaperman (Nov 3, 2006)

Rebel said:


> Singletrack said:
> 
> 
> > Rebel said:
> ...


Rebel
Whilst the B&O system in the A5 may sound fantastic you are not providing a fair and balanced argument here...as the cabin in the A5 is very different to the cabin in the TT - ie the sound stage and acoustics WILL be different. Equally the HU in the A5 "may" also be different which introduces another variable in the comparison....


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## Jersey Paul (Aug 1, 2007)

Not totally convinced by B&O they make fine active speakers, especially the new class D amp stuff.
Their hi-fi / source components are not too good though.
B&W speakers to me still have the edge in terms of musicality.
I think the new B&O accoustic lens technology (ALT) "adds" something.
I know the reference studio speaker for many producers is the B&W Nautilus 801.
The B&W tapered tube tweeter and Kevlar mid range drivers work really well.
I'm sure the B&O sound good within the "comprimised" space in a car interior though.
Bose/NAV - not specced on the TTS, will look at aftermarket products.


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

@Arne , indeed.

Reaperman, i think the MK2 isn't a difficult car for producing a proper sound.
If you leave the Bose-crap-sytem at the optionlist and you would take some money to a serious car-hifi specialist, you would be surprised.

Bose promised to much with their "Pilot-noice-bla-bla" or whatever they called it.
It would equalize the frequences in the sound so the enoying noice from tyres or other things would be less noticable. Yeah right.
I did several tests, and heard no difference whatsoever.

And a proper Bass-sound? They forgot it. Ofcorse there are people who don't want to hear that, but they could turn the Bass back to zero.
It's ridiculous that almost every MK2 driver has the Bass at 10. And still it's rubbish.

Those who are "defending" the Bose-crap-system should listen to the sound in some other car's with original system's. 
I think that Audi should quit with Bose, and look for a descent brand on their next future models.


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## TTSFan (Jan 10, 2008)

So I went to the sound shop today to ask a few questions and wanted to run it past you guys.

The guy recommended (for the back) a separate driver and tweeter but said I could go for the all in one speaker (with integrated tweeter).

He said he recommends a Sub (But I am not sure I really want one the sound in the normal Concert cars was good enough for me do I really need a sub?)

The smallest amp he had was a 500W amp now I am not sure if I need that much - do I?

What do you guys recommend.


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## BobFat (Jul 24, 2007)

Rebel said:


> If you leave the Bose-crap-sytem at the optionlist and you would take some money to a serious car-hifi specialist, you would be surprised.


Totally agree.

And everyone can scrap that modding idea I paintshopped. Any improvement after removing speaker grills was minimal in my opinion. Glad I tried it for myself though.


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## BobFat (Jul 24, 2007)

TTSFan said:


> The guy recommended (for the back) a separate driver and tweeter but said I could go for the all in one speaker (with integrated tweeter).


A good recommendation, providing the sound source can supply the right range frequencies to the right speakers - thus optimising the setup.



TTSFan said:


> He said he recommends a Sub (But I am not sure I really want one the sound in the normal Concert cars was good enough for me do I really need a sub?)


Sub doesnt just have to mean headbanging bass. Good sub driven properly gives you fantastic depth of low frequencies to music. Never going to replicate home hi-fi but you can do a lot better than most cars provide.



TTSFan said:


> The smallest amp he had was a 500W amp now I am not sure if I need that much - do I?


I'd know enough not to be fooled into thinking higher watts = better quality. I'd check any components recommended by searching for reviews on t'internet.


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## Janitor (Jul 2, 2007)

BobFat said:


> TTSFan said:
> 
> 
> > The smallest amp he had was a 500W amp now I am not sure if I need that much - do I?
> ...


True Neil. However, the general rule is that because lower frequencies require more moving, the sub should be double the power of the rest

Completely agree that it's certainly not all about bangin' bass boys boomin' bins bovver bootle... or anything. More that real good low end support is a vital component of a quality sound


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## TTSFan (Jan 10, 2008)

You guys rock. Thank you so much for all your advise and help.

I am going to go with the seperate driver and tweater as recommended by these guys and you guys (which are awesome) on the forum.

I just don't think I am into the sub at the moment I will make sure that whatever they put in it will be able to hook a sub easily 

How do they fit these? Do they "tap into" the cabling of the car or is there cables already ready for this? (remembering my car had a stuff up and the dealer put the Chorus headunit which he later swapped for the Concert head unit)

I am wondering if the connection at the back of the head unit needs to be changed. I remember when they swapped the head units the connection at the back was different colors (Mine was White and brown the original Concert TT was Green and white)

Where do you guys recommend they fit the Amp? I don't want them to go drilling into the body work if they dont have to!

What Drivers and Tweaters do they have in the Stock Concert TT? So I know what to get i.e. Spec's I don't want them telling me I need like 1000000000W drivers when all thats in the TT for the Concert is like 20W or something

Thank you guys ONCE AGAIN for being the advice.


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## markTT225 (Apr 8, 2004)

TTSFan said:


> You guys rock. Thank you so much for all your advise and help.
> 
> I am going to go with the seperate driver and tweater as recommended by these guys and you guys (which are awesome) on the forum.
> 
> ...


I think for a professional set-up, they should take the line-outs from the Headunit - like the Bose system does. It doesn't sound like your system at the moment utilises the Line-outs, as the 'front speakers only' set-up in the TT uses the internal amplifier in the headunit. It's a simple enough job to wire in though - they will need to obtain a mini-iso plug to go into the connector 'C' point in the back of the headunit. The Pin-out below is for the RNS-E, but as far as I know the Pin-out should be identical for all current generation Audi double-dins.










As for the amplifier location, it all depends how big it is really. The original Bose amp is quite small and is tailor made to fit in the rear boot panel. I doubt you will find a 4 channel amp that will fit in this location. There might be some space behind the passenger glove compartment though. Or perhaps mount it where the Bose sub goes, behind the LHS panel near the back seats.


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## Rebel (Feb 12, 2005)

At least he will have a better sound than those who choosed the Bose/system :lol:


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## Janitor (Jul 2, 2007)




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## BMWBig6 (Sep 10, 2007)

BobFat said:


> And everyone can scrap that modding idea I paintshopped. Any improvement after removing speaker grills was minimal in my opinion. Glad I tried it for myself though.


Are you saying that removing the grills made no noticeable improvement (contrary to the original post)? Or that your modified grills (with holes cut/drilled) made minimal difference?


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## ben.redtt (Dec 18, 2006)

. 8)


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