# Building a 'puter



## christtopher (May 7, 2002)

It always seems like I'm the one asking the questions, but you guys are just such a great resource that I get my answers every time...now that i've buttered you up, down to the questions...

I wanna buy a bespoke computer, or build it myself.

Question #1 -Can anyone recommend someone that builds bespoke computers at reasonable prices or the best place to get my parts from?

The reason it has to be bespoke is because I don't need a super fast processor or flashy graphics card or shed loads of memory, but I do need as much disk space as possible! Â ;D Â ...oh an a LAN port....and it needs to be cheap (am I being optimistic at Â£150!? - I'm using ebay as my benchmark here!)

Ebay, love it or hate it has lots of high-spec computers, with high-spec prices. Â if you look for something a little less powerful, the HDD is too small. Â I guess I could upgrade it myself, but thats not as 'cost effective'!!

Your advice, as always will help me out enormously! Â


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

Â£150 - lol - forget Ebay

Can I recommend going for one of the dinky space save pcs? Shuttle PCs are great for pc use - good on looks - very small - and certainly don't look like the normal PC. It will do all you want.
Shuttle PCs come as a box partly made up - all the buyer has to do it install a hard drive - cd or dvd drive - floppy drive - cpu & ram. everything else is in the box. Couple the Shuttle with a good looking Samsung LCD Monitor and a wireless keyboard mouse set and you have a stylish and practicle PC. AND it takes up no room at all.
On board components of the Shuttle include - Firewire - LAN - USB - Sound - Graphix so plenty of expansion.

With regards to cpu/hd etc - AMD offer decent value - pick a cpu for Â£40 or so - RAM - 512 MB Â£60 - HD 60/80/120gb all under Â£100 for a good drive no Seagate/IBM/Maxtor - only go for Western Digital. DVD/CD-RW combi drives are only Â£60.
Shuttles can be bought barebones for just under Â£200 so it ain't and expensive venture.

I am currently building my 4th Shuttle this month, this one is for my wee sis - Total package price for her is Â£750 but that was going top of the range.

I'll post some pics etc of the system and others if you are interested.


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## phil (May 7, 2002)

> for a good drive no Seagate/IBM/Maxtor - only go for Western Digital.


Why's that then? I use all three of those with no problems whatsover.


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## woracle (Nov 10, 2002)

You are not gonna get much for for 150, your best bet is to get a 2nd hand one with good enough CPU and graphics to run Windows, and then add a bigger hard disk. Hard disks are as cheap as chips, and dead easy to add.

Or try one of those computer fairs. To build one, with new parts, even crap ones is cutting it fine. 150 is no go ( maybe possible without a monitor).


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## christtopher (May 7, 2002)

> Â£150 - lol - forget Ebay


I was refering to this in particular:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 2732272942

The sort of thing I want, 2 days to go and only Â£117

I forgot to say that I'm not interested in a monitor/keyboard/mouse just the base unit.

I'll give shuttle a look though, thanks.


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

Buy it if you want - its your dosh afterall. But you are buying someone elses castoffs. The seller even shows that he does not properly know what he is selling -

Mitsumi CD-R - dose not need drivers for windows 98 or XP and is it a cd-rw or just a cd-rom drive? Even if its a cd wirte drive (not rw) it just needs software - no drivers.
Mainboard drivers etc - you will need them esp if something goes wrong!!


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

> for a good drive no Seagate/IBM/Maxtor - only go for Western Digital.
> 
> Why's that then? I use all three of those with no problems whatsover.


Seagate - great scsi drives not great ide drives - always a cheap alternative. High failure rates
Maxtor - I have not used a Maxtor drive yet that has not failed within a year......horrible things....and they make a lot of noise.
IBM - how the mighty have fallen - great drives a few years back - then IBM lost moeny and sold off the HD side of their business. Company now IBM/Hitachi - drives are improving but nowhere near as good as they should be


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

Images of a Shuttle PC -

http://www.shuttle.com/new/images/produ ... sn41g2.jpg

Prices range from Â£150 for AMD to Â£240 for top range Intel/AMD.

Â£150 for new Shuttle
Â£45 for AMD Athlon XP+ 1700
Â£30 256MB DDR Kingston Ram
Â£70 Western Digital 80GB JB Drive 7200RPM

If you already have a PC get the cd drive/floppy etc and transplant.


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## christtopher (May 7, 2002)

I have to admit, they do look very cool!


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## phil (May 7, 2002)

> Seagate - great scsi drives not great ide drives - always a cheap alternative. High failure rates
> Maxtor - I have not used a Maxtor drive yet that has not failed within a year......horrible things....and they make a lot of noise.
> IBM - how the mighty have fallen - great drives a few years back - then IBM lost moeny and sold off the HD side of their business. Company now IBM/Hitachi - drives are improving but nowhere near as good as they should be


maybe. I can't quote you any figures to prove otherwise. I actually work for IBM's storage group, although not in HD manufacturing. The company sold off the HD division because the competition's too stiff, frankly, and isn't profitable. Same reason we don't make many home PCs any more. Also the reason the likes of Compaq and Dell are trying to leave that market and increase their market share in mid-range servers. 
Anyway, I could bang on about this for ages, but I can't be arsed. 
IDE drives in general are built to a lesser standard than they used to be, which is why hardware RAID is readily available for IDE nowdays. SCSI drives now monitor themselves for errors and will flag a warning if failure is imminent.


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## phil (May 7, 2002)

Sorry about hijacking the thread there. I reckon you could get a system for Â£150 but it won't be easy and will involve 2nd hand kit. You want a lot of storage, which is now under Â£1 per gigabyte. I'd call 'a lot' 100 GB or more, so left with Â£50, you could scrape together a PII/Athlon system with PC133 RAM. You won't be able to buy that new though.
If you're interested I've got an old P133 which is gathering dust....


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

P133 - erk - EDO Ram - Poss 2gb HD limit in bios certainly no way a new HD should be used as new HDs can burt rate of 100/133/150 mbs - old mobos used ATA33 and slower.


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## Dubcat (Jun 10, 2002)

Mr. D - if you want this pc for playing mp3's (im cross referencing to your other thread) then you should take a look at www.mini-itx.com or www.linitx.co.uk (or is that .com too?). You could get a low powered ITX system - remember the prices you see there INCLUDE the CPU! Some of the ITX pc's can be run with passive cooling too so if the box is going to sit in your living room this is pretty cool (pun fully intentional).

If you want more from your pc then I would go for the new Shuttle SN45 that is coming out in the near future - it will give you 400mhz front side bus with AMD processor. If you want the intel route (pentium) then there are now canterwood chipset shuttle boxes out (SN61G2?) that give you 800mhz front side bus. If performance aint critical take a serious look at mini-itx - its cheap and cheerful, uses MUCH less power than amd/intel, and needs less cooling.

P.


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

LOL - Phottoniq - now who is going to extreme....hehe.

800 FSB with 800 FSB Cpus Only - all others either 400 or 533 FSB.
The AMD @400 yeah not bad but the opteron is still a while away - and if hes looking @ a pc for Â£117 is way beyond what even I would recommend.

[smiley=thumbsup.gif]


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## phil (May 7, 2002)

And remember, if you use linux, you won't need as fast a processor anyway 

The P133's got a 330 MB drive in it  I should really just chuck it out.


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

Why don't you run linux on it and use it as a hardware firewall for a home network 
Or send it to charity - there is one which accepts old PCs - they send them off to Africa to help with education there.


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## christtopher (May 7, 2002)

> Or send it to charity - there is one which accepts old PCs - they send them off to Africa to help with education there.


Surely they wouldn't appreciate his 330MB of porn? 

Thanks for the advice guys. I'm evidently looking at something which is *way* down in the pecking order of PCs. Forgive my sins!


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

I am sure they love porn as much as the next Lord V.

With regards to prices etc - not everyone has to have top of the range kit, but, I have spent so many hours fixing PCs that people have bought 2nd hand that buying new nearly always has worked out more cost effective, even in a short period of time eg: 2 months.
Hope you find what you are looking for.....


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## Dubcat (Jun 10, 2002)

> LOL - Phottoniq - now who is going to extreme....hehe.
> 
> 800 FSB with 800 FSB Cpus Only - all others either 400 or 533 FSB.
> The AMD @400 yeah not bad but the opteron is still a while away - and if hes looking @ a pc for Â£117 is way beyond what even I would recommend.
> ...


If you are going to blow your budget then blow it right! 

I think the answer to his challenge is definitely mini-itx. Small, cheap, and very very quiet.

I really want to build one of the Ammo Box pc's that are highlighted near the top of mini-itx.com at the moment. Those guys are in the UK - the ammo box's only cost a fiver!

So:

Motherboard+graphics+sound = 70 - 105 pounds
case = 5 pounds

you are WELL within your budgets - especially if you steal components from your old pc.

phoTToniq


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## phil (May 7, 2002)

> Why don't you run linux on it and use it as a hardware firewall for a home network


I used to do that on another PC (a P2) but in the end I got rid of it because I only ever use 2 PCs at home (my PC and my work laptop). 
I got fed up with having to manually open ports for online gaming. 
I couldn't do it with the new one because I'd need a new adsl modem (no USB.....) and it's not worth it.
Plus I live in a flat and it would just take up space.


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## newcasTTle (Nov 29, 2002)

> Why don't you run linux on it and use it as a hardware firewall for a home network Â
> Or send it to charity - there is one which accepts old PCs - they send them off to Africa to help with education there.


very slight hijack here, but i was considering doing this with an old pc - is there a good site you can recommend with instruction on how to set this up?


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## saint (Dec 6, 2002)

There are a lot of linux help sites out there - just do a web search - or if you are interested I have a few online books to help with linux etc.


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## newcasTTle (Nov 29, 2002)

thanks - i'll have a look around - i am currently running a dual boot w98se/linux machine, but the latest version of mandrake (9.0) seems to have screwed up the broadband access and i haven't been able to sort it out yet - might go back to suse :-/


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