# The future of 4x4s...



## Kell (May 28, 2002)

As my continued dilemma for a new motor continues, one of the things that has occured to us is that a 4x4 would be nice.

Doesn't really matter which one, but what are people's thoughts on the future of the species?

Priced off the road within a couple of years? Or will all the fuss die down?

Whichever car we get next, it will have to last us a good three or four years - until the loan is paid off - so I don't want to buy a 4x4 only to find that the tax suddenly ramps up to Â£2,000 a year and then it becomes worthless. :?


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## Leg (Jan 11, 2006)

Is it not more the case that uneconomical cars are being priced out rather than 4x4s specifically?

If my assumption is correct then surely the TT 3.2, RS4, M3, M5 etc owners/owners to be will suffer more than 4x4 2.0Tdi owners?

Or is there some tax specifically on 4x4s regardless of engine that I am unaware of?

I vowed a long time ago to never let the taxman tax me out of my two vices so the b*stard can do what he likes to tax cars and wine/beer/whiskey but Ill not back down!!!

buy with your heart Kell, screw what the brain says m8.


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## Toshiba (Jul 8, 2004)

I cant see it dying down, plus once the activists have had their pound of flesh from 4x4s they will simply move onto the next thing. People carriers maybe?


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## GW1970 (Jul 4, 2005)

Do they have a future - yes. I am a fan - no.

Really a large estate will have more interior space, better dynamics and lower running costs.

They certainly seem to have a purpose - generally inconsiderate school mums taking their brood to nursery. And safer? I'm not so sure, more likely roll, go through/over a barrier, heavier - more likely to kill pedestrians.

I could be persuaded by a Porsche Cayenne Turbo S though. :wink:

In reality - get an estate if you need the space.


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## justtin (May 6, 2002)

Use this http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/ to work out what's going to be hit by taxes. Group G is the one they hit now.

A X3 can be a lower category (and thus less tax, Richmond resident parking charges etc.) than a 3 series depending on spec.

The 4x4 thing is lack of understanding by the public fueled by an ignorant media. Nothing new there then.


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## shao_khan (May 7, 2002)

I think go for it. I like the drive of the Cayenne (for a big car) and I love the RR Sport as it is just a good all round car - they ar easy to get kids in, easy for kids to get in (as long as it has steps) lots of space and I found mine loved it because they could see shed loads on their way to nursery.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Seems pretty certain that the Exchequer will make a lucrative (and therefore costly to 4*4 owners) example out of said vehicles over the next few years.

Appropriate or in appropriate, right or wrong, it will be a useful distraction and scapegoat whilst the Chancellor screws evryone else over.


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## garyc (May 7, 2002)

Seems pretty certain that the Exchequer will make a lucrative (and therefore costly to 4*4 owners) example out of said vehicles over the next few years.

Appropriate or in appropriate, right or wrong, it will be a useful distraction and scapegoat whilst the Chancellor screws evryone else over.


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## digimeisTTer (Apr 27, 2004)

Kell said:


> one of the things that has occured to us is that a 4x4 would be nice.


 :roll: :roll: Go and lie down the pair of you and ponder why you have arrived at this juncture?


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## Teehee (May 22, 2005)

Have you looked at the new S-Max? Forget the stigma and go and see the car in person. Hugely practical. Thats definately my wife's next car.


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

The 4x4 debate will get interesting & the motoring press do think the larger off/soft roaders are going to get hammered in the near future, hence why they think that prices will freefall, however how will this pan out for 4x4 cars such as the Audi Quattro range??

I know my RS4 is top banded currently at Â£300 :evil: but that's due purely to it's emissions & nothing to do with it's mode of traction. If they slap a blanket 4x4 tax on anything driven as such, it could become painful.


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

Well, I may as well say that we're looking at a Toerag tomorrow.

3.0 V6 TDi

I've always liked them and now they're down to around 20k they seem like a good buy.

Cayennes are also getting to that price point, but I'm not sure I could live with the looks and I've no idea about the running costs. But I'd imagine a 4.5 V8 would be more expensive to run and Porsche servicing would be (I'd imagine, but I've not investigated) more expensive than VW.

What we really want is the new shape B7 A4 TDi. But the only problem with ours and therefore that, is the rear space.

So then we started looking at the A6, but felt they were too exppensive. Still might be, but that's a possibilty.

So then looked at Passats and they would seem to fulfil the needs, but would be bought with head and not heart. :?

In the search for the Passat, we then realised that Toerags were getting to an affordable price and as we've always liked them, figured it may well be worth a look.

However, as you've already highlighted, the mpg and other associated running costs may mean it's not great for us. Could live with those, but not if they suddenly become villified even more.

For the record, we do occasionally need 4wd, but it's not a major consideration. Which is part of the reason why we wanted to go Audi.


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## W7 PMC (May 6, 2002)

Kell said:


> Well, I may as well say that we're looking at a Toerag tomorrow.
> 
> 3.0 V6 TDi
> 
> ...


Nice choice, i do like the VW & they're certainly well priced at the moment.


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## jbell (May 15, 2006)

Toerags are great cars, a friend has a 2.5 TDi in blue with Cream Cricket Leather, nav, privacy glass etc.

Great drive and good economy especially on a run 30mpg+ at 80 on CC. Comfy and very spacious, his kids love it as they can see everything.

Servicing can be a problem as VW were only letting 'Luxury' Dealers sell and service them, not sure where they stand now on that.

Would be my preference over the Cayenne in 5.0 V10 TDi form :twisted: .


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

jbell said:


> Toerags are great cars, a friend has a 2.5 TDi in blue with Cream Cricket Leather, nav, privacy glass etc.
> 
> Great drive and good economy especially on a run 30mpg+ at 80 on CC. Comfy and very spacious, his kids love it as they can see everything.
> 
> ...


I'd love the V10, but they get under 20mpg. Oh, and we can't afford one. :roll:


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## shao_khan (May 7, 2002)

I didnt realise that the V10s were sub Â£30k though. 750Nm torque....

I see VW customer services has just been outsourced, cant make it any worse I guess.


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

shao_khan said:


> I didnt realise that the V10s were sub Â£30k though. 750Nm torque....


I know. That is an awesome engine.


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## ag (Sep 12, 2002)

I think that you will find that Gordon Brown is a clever politician who will manipulate the media like never before. He will instigate a backlash against anything that is seen as a "luxury" item and is therefore an item that exceeds a description of fit for the purpose for which it is used, as opposed to for which it was intended, will become heavily penalised.

He is aware that cars are an emotive subject both with purchasers and manufacturers, suppliers and Unions so he will attempt to distance himself from any reforms. The cost to purchase and run larger vehicles will increase through "back door" taxes, for instance taxes on the recycling of the steel and plastic etc. i.e. Taxes that don't concern only the motorist, but where the motorist will be the most heavily burdened.

In the short term 4x4s and other larger vehicles will have a stay of execution, certainly for those already on the road, longer term there will enevitably be additional taxes on the purchase and running of them. If I was in charge of Ford, I'd be wanting to off-load Land Rover and Jaguar about now. Oh, they are.


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Kell said:


> shao_khan said:
> 
> 
> > I didnt realise that the V10s were sub Â£30k though. 750Nm torque....
> ...


Feedback on the Touareg Forum is that the 5.0 V10 is very nose heavy compared with the 3.0 V6 TDI. I've driven the 2.5 TDI and the 3.0 TDI and they are worlds apart. A 3.0 in Altitude spec would do very nicely. I'd miss the V8 burble from the CLK....I suppose I could always look at the 4.2 V8... 

Actually driving the Touareg was a great experience - it doesn't feel anywhere near as big on the roads as it clearly is. I was very impressed but just couldn't get the right deal at the time. Will probably look again after the summer.


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## jbell (May 15, 2006)

Kell said:


> jbell said:
> 
> 
> > Toerags are great cars, a friend has a 2.5 TDi in blue with Cream Cricket Leather, nav, privacy glass etc.
> ...


You might be suprised http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/168666.htm unless it is a typo


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## Kell (May 28, 2002)

BreTT said:


> Kell said:
> 
> 
> > shao_khan said:
> ...


I did ask the question on the myTreg forum and that's how I got to the 3.0 TDi.

The reason I asked is that the 2.5 TDis are now under 20k (but a mate of mine has one and says it's underpowered) as are the big petrol versions. This would be our main car, so don't want the mpg to be ridiculously low, but think we could live with the 3.0 TDi figure of around 28mpg (given that our A4 is about 33 or so).


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## BreTT (Oct 30, 2002)

Kell said:


> BreTT said:
> 
> 
> > Kell said:
> ...


As I said, my experience of driving them were they were like chalk and cheese. The 3.0 TDI is definitely the way to go IMHO. I like the idea of the 4.2 V8 but with a realistic consumption probably around the 17mpg mark it makes my CLK look positively frugal at around 22mpg.


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