# Intercooler what options?



## whitettpet (Jan 4, 2010)

Iv seen a new intercooler that kinda looks like a forge twintercooler but made by a company called airtek. Any1 herd of them apparently their big on the ford scene.


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

whitettpet said:


> Iv seen a new intercooler that kinda looks like a forge twintercooler but made by a company called airtek. Any1 herd of them apparently their big on the ford scene.


This sounds interesting if it's available for the TT mk2, intercoolers are so often overlooked as a power and reliability upgrade..going to see what I can find out.
Quality and price would need to be right though.


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## McKenzie (Dec 25, 2008)

They have been developing this for a little while. I have been in touch with them myself, so far I've heard of fitment issues with other twintercooler designs they have done for other 2.0tfsi models. They did say another intercooler was being worked on and they would get in touch with me but seem to have gone quiet. They look decent and quality of the intercooler core is supposed to be high but I'm not won over just yet as there communication is a little infrequent.

There is already a vast amount of intercoolers on the market for the 2.0tfsi. I could probably count near enough 10 different companies but only around 2 in the UK, more competition in the market brings prices down which is always handy


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## robokn (Feb 21, 2006)

easy decision just get the Forge one, fits perfectly and works a treat


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

McKenzie said:


> They have been developing this for a little while. I have been in touch with them myself, so far I've heard of fitment issues with other twintercooler designs they have done for other 2.0tfsi models. They did say another intercooler was being worked on and they would get in touch with me but seem to have gone quiet. They look decent and quality of the intercooler core is supposed to be high but I'm not won over just yet as there communication is a little infrequent.
> 
> There is already a vast amount of intercoolers on the market for the 2.0tfsi. I could probably count near enough 10 different companies but only around 2 in the UK, more competition in the market brings prices down which is always handy


That seems about right McKenzie, there seems to be a better catered for market in the States for some reason. 
I would have thought that there would be some good import versions from Germany.

As for 'fits perfectly' I'm not so convinced after reading through the forge PDF, with potential rubbing of some of the hoses being the main issue. More so if you have the DSG version TT.


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## McKenzie (Dec 25, 2008)

The Forge twintercooler has always been a decent bit of kit but at a price of course. You can get complete replacement very large core intercoolers for less than a smaller addition twintercooler. The Forge piece has been around a long time and is a known quantity but seems most intercoolers require various little modifications to fit just right.

I will chase up my contact there at autospecialists and see if there has been any progress. I do like their pricing which is over £200 cheaper for their twintercooler and £170 cheaper for a complete replacement large intercooler compared to Forge!


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

McKenzie said:


> The Forge twintercooler has always been a decent bit of kit but at a price of course. You can get complete replacement very large core intercoolers for less than a smaller addition twintercooler. The Forge piece has been around a long time and is a known quantity but seems most intercoolers require various little modifications to fit just right.
> 
> I will chase up my contact there at autospecialists and see if there has been any progress. I do like their pricing which is over £200 cheaper for their twintercooler and £170 cheaper for a complete replacement large intercooler compared to Forge!


I would like to fit one if its straight forward with no chopping of body parts because I think it is a beneficial mod to do if you've had a remap plus any other engine mods.
Keep me posted if you will ?


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## McKenzie (Dec 25, 2008)

Templar said:


> I would like to fit one if its straight forward with no chopping of body parts because I think it is a beneficial mod to do if you've had a remap plus any other engine mods.
> Keep me posted if you will ?


Got some news already! Sent an email off at 6:57 and received an answer at 8:25 on a friday night! They are still developing their new intercooler which I think will be something quite special by the feeling i'm getting. They say it's going to be around the new time when they will get them finished. I will be potentially trying one out and will report back here. Since it's getting colder there won't be a panic to get a cooler on just yet so I'm happy to wait another month or so until it's all sorted.


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## SuperRS (Mar 7, 2012)

all airtec are doing is ripping off tghe forge design.

Buy forge or APR


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## McKenzie (Dec 25, 2008)

SuperRS said:


> all airtec are doing is ripping off tghe forge design.
> 
> Buy forge or APR


What a strange thing to say. An intercooler is easy to look the same as the next one! I would rather go with THS or Pro alloy instead of APR, it's far too overpriced. Does that mean Pro alloy and THS copied APR or was it the other way round? :roll:


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

McKenzie said:


> SuperRS said:
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> 
> > all airtec are doing is ripping off tghe forge design.
> ...


Very good point McKenzie ;-)

At the end of the day mods are a personal choice. For example, Some like FK grills because they're good value for money but does it mean FK are just ripping off Audi ?
Same could be said for a whole raft of tuning goodies..exhausts, wheels..even paint jobs. You pays your money and you make your choice.


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## SuperRS (Mar 7, 2012)

McKenzie said:


> SuperRS said:
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> > all airtec are doing is ripping off tghe forge design.
> ...


Well actually the THS is a inferior copy of the APR yes.

What you guys are missing is that if you shit on the companies that took the time to develop thesed products, by buying cheaper copies from other companies, people will stop developing for future VAGs!

Its widely known in the industry that parts design copying is rife.

If you are on facebook search for "vag tuning", it should come up as a group and request to join. You can ask all the companies in there, ie forge, bsh, INA, APR, Loba, if they think their products get ripped off all the time or not.

THS vs APR core has been done to death!


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## whitettpet (Jan 4, 2010)

SuperRS said:


> McKenzie said:
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> > SuperRS said:
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Completely understand where your coming from in terms of they spend money, time and resources in research and development and we should be backing them so they bring out more great products for us to use. But and this is a big but.....they make a massive mark up so don't feel for them bro....we don't run the companies in all honesty, that their problem, a bit of competition in the market is a good thing for us. I couldn't care less as long ad the quality is good on the copies. fk grill can be bought online at £8 pounds plus delivery of around £5 . have u seen what they charge online in the uk......£118. Enough said lol. iv done some research and airtec cores are actually really good in the test I have found on gti forums they seriously rate them. the core itself is not a copie it's thier own.
Nd in terms of forde twintercooler look at the price on forges website then check tt shop...... Explain that to me.


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## SuperRS (Mar 7, 2012)

whitettpet said:


> Completely understand where your coming from in terms of they spend money, time and resources in research and development and we should be backing them so they bring out more great products for us to use. But and this is a big but.....they make a massive mark up so don't feel for them bro....we don't run the companies in all honesty, that their problem, a bit of competition in the market is a good thing for us. I couldn't care less as long ad the quality is good on the copies. fk grill can be bought online at £8 pounds plus delivery of around £5 . have u seen what they charge online in the uk......£118. Enough said lol. iv done some research and airtec cores are actually really good in the test I have found on gti forums they seriously rate them. the core itself is not a copie it's thier own.
> Nd in terms of forde twintercooler look at the price on forges website then check tt shop...... Explain that to me.


You cannot compare a bit of plastic that requires no real development, to that of something mechanical.

The forge/apr is tried and tested, designed to last, work, and fit properly.

Cheap copies are usually ill fitting and poor quality.

Airtec will buy in their cores from another company, they done make them as such. Where the cores come from, I do not know.

P.S

Id go for a replacement cooler instead of a additonal one added to the nose of the car. As for the THS, also beware its really really heavy.


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## whitettpet (Jan 4, 2010)

SuperRS said:


> whitettpet said:
> 
> 
> > Completely understand where your coming from in terms of they spend money, time and resources in research and development and we should be backing them so they bring out more great products for us to use. But and this is a big but.....they make a massive mark up so don't feel for them bro....we don't run the companies in all honesty, that their problem, a bit of competition in the market is a good thing for us. I couldn't care less as long ad the quality is good on the copies. fk grill can be bought online at £8 pounds plus delivery of around £5 . have u seen what they charge online in the uk......£118. Enough said lol. iv done some research and airtec cores are actually really good in the test I have found on gti forums they seriously rate them. the core itself is not a copie it's thier own.
> ...


The core is the important part....airtec is not a random make, they have worked with fords for years.

Nd also I'm not comparing an intercooler to a grill I'm just saying, don't feel sorry for the company's because the mark up of what an item cost to selling price is huge.

one thing u said actually made me laugh ......"if we don't buy from them they will stop developing"....... that just sounds Naive. There is a need in the car market for performance parts , which has been around since like the early 1940's. what will happen is companies will be encouraged to bring out products for a cheaper price to remain competitive.

Either way if you love apr or Ths that's brilliant.... But can they justify 200 pounds difference in price?


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## SuperRS (Mar 7, 2012)

whitettpet said:


> SuperRS said:
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> > whitettpet said:
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Considering I hear the moans of the people who develop these bits, and get seriously disheartned by cheap copies of their designs and products I would say it is a real danger, and not naive at all. All that happens when companies starts price wars is that the market place gets flooded by cheap chinese tat as they continously try to undercut one another.

You get what you pay for. As for the price difference, all depends on how serious you are about tuning.


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## whitettpet (Jan 4, 2010)

SuperRS said:


> whitettpet said:
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> > SuperRS said:
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Out of curiosity what do u think they would say about it when a company manages to bring out a product that not only looks the same but brings very similar gains for 200 pounds less. Look I'd don't think we will agree..lol ...so i am going to leave it at that.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

I have total sympathy with the concept of buying from a source that developed the product. If you think about it, the originator of the concept has to do the R&D work so they have to get more for the product because they have to recover the R&D costs. Someone just copying an original just has to make a copy with very little cost or time involved.

Where intercoolers are concerned, the actual R&D involved is fairly low and basically one intercooler is much the same as another with the *same specification*. Note - the same specification! The differences between the kits supplied by Forge and the cheapies off eBay often isn't the capability of the actual intercooler, it's the fitting kit. And that's why my last 3 intercoolers have all been Forge. They just fit straight on. And Forge themselves as a company are very straightforward. I phoned up for an intercooler for my TDi and they said they'd tried it and it made no difference so they weren't selling one. I can respect that.


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

The core is the important part.... (No It's Not To Be Honest) [smiley=book2.gif] airtec is not a random make, they have worked with fords for years.

Nd also I'm not comparing an intercooler to a grill I'm just saying, don't feel sorry for the company's because the mark up of what an item cost to selling price is huge.

one thing u said actually made me laugh ......"if we don't buy from them they will stop developing"....... that just sounds Naive. There is a need in the car market for performance parts , which has been around since like the early 1940's. what will happen is companies will be encouraged to bring out products for a cheaper price to remain competitive.

Either way if you love apr or Ths that's brilliant.... But can they justify 200 pounds difference in price?[/quote] (I Agree)

Considering I hear the moans of the people who develop these bits, and get seriously disheartned by cheap copies of their designs and products I would say it is a real danger, and not naive at all. All that happens when companies starts price wars is that the market place gets flooded by cheap chinese tat as they continously try to undercut one another.

You get what you pay for. As for the price difference, all depends on how serious you are about tuning.[/quote]

*Hmmm.
Well all i can say is the manufacturers you've been in contact with have done a right mind job on you tbh (violins out time)

Airtec as pointed out earlier have been manufacturing intercoolers for fast fords for years and are not a copy cat company. I have used their products in the past and are a good all round, considered design (do some research and see for youself).

Where i can agree though is the chinese 'looky likey' imported shite which is exactly that. Cheap quality materials and designed to fool people into think they have the same product but cheaper. These are the companies i believe to be putting genuine small industries at risk.

I dont agree that because a so called premium and expensive aftermarket supplier should have the market for themselves. A lot of their componets in the tuning world, are i agree very good quality and well designed. As for their Twintercooler it simply looks like 'lets see what the bigest intercooler will fit' with regards the TT. The mounting bracketry is all wrong and looks poorly designed in my eyes and a little more 'R&D' so to speak could have resolved this. A little more thought in to the mounting rather than drilling through the front bumper bar and the need to trim parts of the bumper plastic parts doesn't do it for me. It seems to me that the twintercooler was designed a touch too big from what i've seen and would have been such an easy fix in the design stage.

Intercoolers as you are more than likely aware have been around for years and started life on aircraft. This, as a lot of engineers generally know is quite common, albeit military and space programmes are where the majority of technology leads from these days.

Hats off to small cottage companies for developing alternative products and solutions for different markets and im sure they are well aware of the competition. If the product they sell is of good quality, well thought out design and good value then they should do well.

A big selling point to me is aftersales and customer support. This i see as Priceless comodity.

I'm sorry for ranting on but some people are just too tunnel visioned and poorly informed to be valid.*


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## SuperRS (Mar 7, 2012)

Why do airtec sell two types of VAG intercooler for the same engine? One replacement, and the other a twintercooler, which is a forge concept.

Are airtec going to fully support the VAG market or is this just a chance for them to make a quick buck by looking at the compeitior products and ripping off their design.

It baffles me as to why they would "develop" two different types of intercooler for the same models.


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## wja96 (Mar 4, 2010)

SuperRS said:


> Why do airtec sell two types of VAG intercooler for the same engine? One replacement, and the other a twintercooler, which is a forge concept.


One is VW Golf specific, the other fits all other 2.0 TFSi engines.



SuperRS said:


> Are airtec going to fully support the VAG market or is this just a chance for them to make a quick buck by looking at the competitior products and ripping off their design?


Who knows? If VAG people buy their stuff then they'll possibly make more. If they don't then they'll stop.



SuperRS said:


> It baffles me as to why they would "develop" two different types of intercooler for the same models.


I don't think they have. They can fit a bigger intercooler in everything bar a Golf, so that's what they've made.


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## Templar (Mar 9, 2012)

SuperRS said:


> Why do airtec sell two types of VAG intercooler for the same engine? One replacement, and the other a twintercooler, which is a forge concept.
> 
> Are airtec going to fully support the VAG market or is this just a chance for them to make a quick buck by looking at the compeitior products and ripping off their design.
> 
> It baffles me as to why they would "develop" two different types of intercooler for the same models.


 I would say it was an improvement to a similar design which Forge supply but has a better mounting and fitment design (cannot comment on core design at this stage). This i would imagine is where Airtec may have saw a niche in the market but i doubt it. Originally derived from motorsport which before you say it, Forge has involvement in. Could Forge have copied/evolved their design from another motorsport parts manufacturer or even the Japanese tuning market, Greddy twin, triple even quad row intercoolers spring to mind (seen the quality of these bad boys) ? Who knows.

Dont get me wrong, i like Forge stuff and maybe the idea of the Twintercooler was their brainchild. I just think they left themselves open to a slightly better design. If you are paying top money you would've expected the R&D team to have done a better/tidier job on its fitment for the street modder market. After all, its for an Audi TT not a Citroen Saxo.

The Twintercooler is a bit of a marketing gimic in my eyes appearing revolutionary in its design and function. I on the otherhand think a heavy duty 'bar and plate' system with well sorted headers is better but more visually a little more difficult to see the differences to a standard type, But these can be a bit heavy.

Anyway, i think we've probably dragged this out enough and i appreciate your views and will agree to disagree on some points.

P.s If i have posted anything that has offended you in this thread, i appologise. This has simply been my opinion.


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